Post: #1

i am running a sidebusiness, that by the end of the year or early 2015, it will allow me to finally and permanently leave my scientist job; and with it, the jungle of office politics.

I have certain technical questions i need help with:

#1. Do anybody knows of a good, versatile, hard drive cloning device? Has anybody use the Kanguru cloning device before? or anything similar? I need something like that, but also have the versatility of COOLMAX cloning Adapter

#2. Is there a Kanguru like device for charging computer batteries-- something that is versatile enough to charge various kinds of batteries types and sizes(hp, dell, mac, toshiba, etc) while they are not attached to the computer; the same way the Kanguru cloning device can clone the HD without it being inserted into the computer. A version of that for computer batteries that can charge 14 or 30 batteries at a time.

This will be a godsend. I can shave off 2 to 3 days from my turnover time of 2 to 3 weeks. Allowing me to pump out more volume... Multitasking the battery charging and cloning is disruptive to my work momentum. I basically have to create a stack of computers to charge batteries and clone HDs.

QUICK BACKGROUND ON THE BUSINESS:

My side business is computer refurbishing/sale and it generates in pure profit around $5,000 to $8,000 per 2weeks to 3 wks interval. That is based on a turnover of 50 to 100 computers every 2 to 3 weeks.

The profit margin is around 100% to 150%.

Something like this HP elite notebook, i am selling it for $180... i acquired the product parts, etc for nothing more than $35. I am shipping out a total of 42 of those Elite HP by the end of this week. I like to do batch sales.



I obtained various used computers, and computer parts, from hospitals, recycling centers, government agencies, schools, Dell or HP warehouses, etc... at $25 to $35 range per computer...i then take them apart to test and salvage functional parts of the computer(SATA harddrives, solid states hardrives, from 40GB to 160 GB range, motherboards, memory chips btw 2gb to 4gb, chargers, batteries, functional heat sinks, CMOS batteries, computer cameras, digitizers, screens, etc...

Basically, I cannibalizes the used computers, take out all functional parts, categorizes and sort them out. I then use the functional parts to custom built re-furbished computers, clean and polish them spanking new, and sell them just below the competitors price on amazon, ebay, or ship them overseas to china, egypt or pakistan. After shipping, labour, parts, etc has been factored in, the profit margin is around 100% to 150% for me.

This is my sidebusiness..... (my regular job is being a super scientist extra-ordinaire. hehehe)

As a one man army, in addition to doing my regular scientist job, i only have time enough to only clear around 50 to 100 computers maximum per 2 to 3 weeks, depending on the level of technical difficulties i encounter per batch of computer/computer parts. I am in the process of scaling the business using an assembly line model that employs a bunch of university students(with strong preference for background in engineering, computer science and IT concentrations). To work on different, specific function in the computer disassembling and reassembling process. Of course, i will pay them beer money. I already found a warehouse-like structure close-by to a technical/engineering university, also in promixity to postal office.

With proper scaling of the business, i can see myself doing 4 to 5 times the current volume that i am doing right now. I promise to do a datasheet for RVF community when everything is set and smooth sailing.

Anyways, when i look at the workflow process of my business, the choke point is charging the computer batteries and the cloning the harddrives.

Currently, i clone the harddrives in an exponential manner, i.e, clone one and then use both to clone 2 HDs, then use the four of them to clone 4 HDs.. etc. The ratio is still 1:1. It takes roughly 10 to 15 minutes to clone each harddrive. You try to multitask, but this adds up. Especially, since i have to install the newly cloned harddrive, and load up the Acronis software whenever i am turning a newly cloned harddrive into a master harddrive for cloning new ones. This eat up my time, disrupt work momentum, despite multi-tasking. That is why i need those equipments, especially, if i am going to be having teams of university students working for me... and paying them by the hour.

Any suggestions with regards to versatile equipment for batch cloning HDs and batch charging of computer batteries?

regards,

Nemencine

p.s. the plan is to scale the business successfully, see how things go when i run it fulltime using my saved vacation time from my current regular job; if things go well, call it quit at my regular 9 to 5. step on the accelerator, expand my rolodex and go nuts. I promise to do a datasheet on how i got started, how i set it up, and how i scale it; in the future. But for now, i cannot put the horse before the cart. I still need to scale this side business and turn it into a full-time business.

Post: #2

You can just do it with a PC that has multiple SATA ports. You can buy an a PCI express-type card that will expand your number of ports too.

Clonezilla instructions

Post: #3

What are you cloning to blank computers? Have you considered network boot? Setup one copy, have everyone connect to it and clone themselves simultaneously. Setup a couple of such local hotspots and you should be golden. Or go the old school route and boot from cd or thumb drives. Them things are dirt cheap and you can have hundreds of them.

Post: #4

(07-01-2014 06:00 PM)Nemencine Wrote:  #2. Is there a Kanguru like device for charging computer batteries-- something that is versatile enough to charge various kinds of batteries types and sizes(hp, dell, mac, toshiba, etc) while they are not attached to the computer; the same way the Kanguru cloning device can clone the HD without it being inserted into the computer. A version of that for computer batteries that can charge 14 or 30 batteries at a time.

I haven't seen anything like this and it may be hard to find. Some of the newer batteries in laptops are a bit more complicated than before (like the Mac batteries) and they communicate with the laptop.

There are laptop bulk chargers like this one:

http://www.alibaba.com/product-detail/FY...5.html?s=p

But it is basically a large case for multiple laptops being charged at once. If you have quite a few spare laptops that you can put the batteries into this may be of some use.

Post: #5

Dude, netboot. Like the every night restores they do in uni libraries

Post: #6

ON HD imaging/cloning aspect:

one-two, jersey, and calihunter.

a world of thanks on the netbooting and clonezilla idea. i am already doing the thumb drives and cd,... i want it faster... from the look of it, the netbooting and clonezilla will do the trick. I will test them out this weekend.

My training at the university isnt computer science/engineering, as such, i am self-learning as much as i can as i go along.

Again, world of thanks. You really have no idea what this mean to me.

ON STACKED BATTERY CHARGING:

Gingruito.

Thanks for the genuine effort. I appreciate it. I havent seen anything like what i was describing either. I guess i will have to stick to stacking the computers and using them to charge the batteries. ( i imagine that in the factory setting where they actually manufactured these batteries(for laptops, phones, etc.) they must have ways of charging and testing them en masse without first having to stick them into a computer. anyways....

thanks everybody for your help. at least, i solve one problem(the mass HD cloning).... i guess i will just have to manage the other.

regards,

Nemencine

Post: #7

Speaking of scavenging old computers, some of them may come with Microsoft Windows and/or Office preinstalled. It is probably an older version, but in some parts of the world online office is not an option. If you get that sticker on the bottom with the serial code, it may be worth a lot more than the $35 you paid for the hardware.

Post: #8

16 channel battery charger

16 Channel Battery Charger for Dell HP Acer

Post: #9

ms224, that is the shite! That is the kind of thing i am looking for charging the stack of computer batteries for my business.

I swear, it never ceases to amaze me the range and depth of talent/experience at RVF. Within 48 hours, my technical problems were solved! Just like that! I didnt even need to pay a consultation fee!

you all deserve a cheque! All of you: ms224, one-two, Gringuito, calihunter, and jersey. You lads rock; and i owe you all a serious debt of gratitude.

and from the deep bottom of my heart, i express my sincerest thanks.

To all of you:


regards,

Nemencine

(07-04-2014 12:42 PM)ms224 Wrote:  16 channel battery charger

16 Channel Battery Charger for Dell HP Acer

Post: #10

If you incorporate, let us know.

I bet some of us would be interested in investing in your business.

Post: #11

You probably already know this, but often, if the mobo went bad, it can be fixed by simply replacing bad capacitors. Train a guy how to do that and you can probably improve your motherboad reutilization ratio by quite a bit.

Post: #12

(07-04-2014 01:11 PM)Nemencine Wrote:  ms224, that is the shite! That is the kind of thing i am looking for charging the stack of computer batteries for my business.

I swear, it never ceases to amaze me the range and depth of talent/experience at RVF. Within 48 hours, my technical problems were solved! Just like that! I didnt even need to pay a consultation fee!

you all deserve a cheque! All of you: ms224, one-two, Gringuito, calihunter, and jersey. You lads rock; and i owe you all a serious debt of gratitude.

and from the deep bottom of my heart, i express my sincerest thanks.

To all of you:


regards,

Nemencine

(07-04-2014 12:42 PM)ms224 Wrote:  16 channel battery charger

16 Channel Battery Charger for Dell HP Acer

You said you are self taught were did you learn your skill set? Diy, ,online tutorials, just curios I run a basic repair business mostly through word of mouth references.

What are some of the tools you use ex( Sets etc

Post: #13

We have a Kanguru at work, although mostly used to wipe hard drives securely, I have used it to clone before. It's fairly easy to use, but being a cheapskate unless you need to do 10 drives at once or something I'd avoid the expense. There are standalone SATA cloners on Newegg that are easily less than $100 while the Kanguru is well over $1500 I believe (we lease it).

EDIT: Holy shit 5 grand, but yep that's the same model we just got in.

A sub $100 model from Newegg:


Although if you can get it up and running, PXE booting and imaging over a Gigabit network could be faster than the drive cloners, especially since it saves you from removing the drives on all of them. I would recommend using a solid state drive with a great read speed on your imaging server so multi-cloning could be done quickly.


I have actually considered trying this out myself with our new company as well. I did it years ago but quit because the margins sucked and dealing with eBay buyers is a PITA. Now local buyers would be great since it'd be easier to charge more.

Post: #14

@Redthumb and DJ-MATT

Thanks for the inquiries and the suggestions. I will do a detailed datasheet at another point in time. From how to get started, cold calling, resources, networking with clients, and scaling the business, etc. The purpose of this thread is to address technical issues pertaining to my business. I dont want to drop a datasheet on the business until i have successfully scaled it up(i am in the middle of that right now).

That been said, given your interest in this. I will address a couple of things:

On the issues of, (1) local buyers versus online buyers and, (2) profit margins.

Local buyers and shipping to developing worlds/third world countries are your best bet for the FATTEST margins. Online has really good margins too. That is why i am puzzled by the comment of DJ-Matt about online margins sucking for him.

The best way to get really fat margins is to cold-called like a motherfucker hospitals, schools, recycling centers, etc. and network like crazy to get the used computers straight from them. This is how you get the FATTEST margins. The other alternative, is a good, strategic internet auctions(check below for example) ....but these have reduced margins...the margin is still good, dont get me wrong... but they tend to be less than 100% to 150% profit margin that i like.

Let me give you a quick example of my recent experience(this month, actually) :

I recently engaged in internet auction for Dell Latitude 2110 series. A school district was auctioning them off.(i have blocked the name of the school.) They have a total of 210(4 sets of roughly 50) of those computers with 160GB hdd, 2gb memory, onboard video, etc. you know, the works.


First things, first. I make sure the computer i am buying is selling like hotcakes. There is zero point stacking up on slow moving inventory.

I called up the school and talk to the IT lad in charge and scheduled a meeting. I was able to come and inspect the computers physically. I found them satisfactory. I dont buy unless i check the goods first. So i decide to enter the bidding fray. Of course, you waited till the last possible seconds before outbidding everybody as the highest bidder-- by placing your bid a couple of $100s above the last lad. again, take a look:





Now, look at the price for those 52 Dell 2110. The total cost is $2,856. (always bid a couple of hundreds above the last highest bidder at the last possible seconds)

That translates into $55 per refurbished Dell 2110 with 160GB, 2gb memory, onboard camera, wifi, battery, charger, etc. you know, the works.

Now, how much does one Dell 2110 with 160GB, 2gb, etcetera goes for on amazon or ebay? (since we are strictly talking about online profit margins here.)

The price on amazon is $179.00 for refurbished Dell 2110 with those kinds of specifications.

How much does refurbished Dell 2110 with those specs sell for on ebay? take a look for yourself. Price range from $110 to $269 per 1 refurbished Dell 2110 with those kinds of specifications.

Naturally, i simply undercut all the competition by selling the Dell 2110 for $100 per computer.

I chose this specific computer because it sells like hotcakes. This is usually my first and primary consideration before anything else.There is zero point in stacking up non-selling inventory. I like fast moving inventory.

Anyways, out of the total of 52 Dells, only 48 were good to go. At $55 per Dell for 48 computers = $2,640.

Like i said, I will undercut all the competition at $100 per Dell 2110. Which translates into $100 x 48 = $4,800.

Gross profit margin = $4,800 -- $2,640 = $2,160.

It took about 10 hours to sort through all of them and upload OS and make sure everything is fine. Check and double check again. This translates into $10 x 10 = $100 for labour cost.

Shipment is $10 per computer = $10 X 48 = $480. ready for shipment.

Bubble wraps, ducttapes, miscellaneous, etc, for 100 computers cost = $89.00. for 48 computers cost roughly $45.00.

Net profit margin on 48 computers = $2,160 -- ($100 + $480 + $45) = $1,535.

And $1,535 is 59% gain on the cost of $2,592 it takes to buy those used computers.

The reason why i dont have between 100% to 150% gain is because i went through internet auction. The original bidding started at $500 for all those 52 computers, that means, the original cost for me would have been $500 / 48 = $10.42 per computer. ...That means the total cost(including labour, etc) for 48 computer would have been $1125... and the profit margin with selling each computer for $100 would have been $4,800 -- $1125 = $3,674.

That is 141% return on $2,592 initial cost of the computers.

That is the difference between internet auction and face-to-face networking/cold-calling. Between making a 59% profit versus 141% profit. Between making $1,535 versus making $3,674 in roughly 1.5 weeks.

These kind of margin(+141% or $3,674) is only possible through face-to-face networking that bypasses internet auction. That is why cold-calling is critical. Networking is critical. It makes all the difference between a 59% profit gain versus a 141% profit gain.

Remember, all the work to get ready 48 computers was done within 4 days.(i work full time as a scientist, i dont have enough time; otherwise, i could just finish all that within a day.)

[again, i will do a very detailed datasheet in the future. this is something i just cobbled together right now to address the issues of profit margins: Online versus Local & Overseas. Also, to highlight the big difference that networking versus internet auction has on your bottomline.]

regards,

Nemencine

Post: #15

+1 !!!!!

Now I see what my problem was back in the day, I didn't plan as well as you and was buying lower cost computers, hence a really low margin. I think the price per at auction was $30 and I only got $75 since they were older machines.

Post: #16

Looks like I'm going to get another go at this for free, just had a business I work with give me 16 old Dell Desktops. They're missing HDDs but I can acquire some 80GBs cheap and sell them for $$$.

Post: #17

Only seen this thread now. Great hustling skills man. I love these stories.

Post: #18

These Dells all have XP license stickers, yuck! Does anyone know how much MS charges for W7 if you're an OEM system builder? Might be worth the hassle to sign up.

Post: #19

(07-24-2014 07:08 PM)Nemencine Wrote:  It took about 10 hours to sort through all of them and upload OS and make sure everything is fine. Check and double check again. This translates into $10 x 10 = $100 for labour cost.

Awesome side business! Any updates??? Agree on the face to face networking bringing fatter margins than online, you can use negotiating tactics that simply aren't available in an online auction.

Regarding the mass battery charging issue, have you found any satisfactory solution? Is the 16 channel box good for multiple battery interfaces, or just a single type? I have some ideas and will gladly share if it's still an issue.

Lastly, are you considering the 10 hours to sort through OS's at $10/hour your only labor expense? How about the time to pack/label/ship/go to the store for bubble wrap, etc?

Post: #20

Things are fine, and thanks for asking, I appreciate that. I am about to get my hands on 160GB SATA HDD, Western Digital, model WD1600HLFS; all 233 of them at a price of $11 a piece. This stuff goes for nothing less than $50 on ebay. Most of the HDD will go into building refurbished computers i want to sell in Ghana, Africa(a new deal i just got.)

You are bloody right; face to face is definitely better with regards to negotiations. Not just in getting cheaper deals, but also in selling the finished products. For example, this Ghana, Africa new deal i just got was done through face to face negotiation through contacts, handshakes, football(soccer) discussion, and over eating a spicy Ghanaians food called waakye. I can eat any food from any continent, and any country on this planet. my stomach is steel. The human connection cannot be done on ebay or amazon. You need that interpersonal connection to close deals with egyptians or ghanaian or pakistanis etc. This new ghana deal is going to be massive, bulk sales: i am talking $6,000 at a clip. The fact is, i cannot move that much volume over ebay or amazon in such a short period of time. Nothing beats networking. Also, i cold-called like a motherfucker. I believe i can cold-called barack obama to sell you air force one! Hahaha. okay, maybe i am exaggerating a little there with regards to air force one.

When you think about it, it is all application of game principles, really. That is all there is to it.

The 16 battery charger is what i am looking for. However, if you have any other ideas, let me know. I had to give major props to ms224 for helping find it. +1 rep to him for that. I was surprised.

The 10 hours and labour cost covers everything. everything. including the wrapping, cleaning, removing stickers, and sometimes the repainting of the computers(sanding, priming, topcoat, etc.) cottonswab, rustoleum, pexi bond glue, etc. I cannot go into all that detail right now-- it will be too long. I will do a detailed, exhaustive datasheet later because you want to cover everything, even small things like repairing chips and dents on your computer. To dealing with jackarse customers on ebay vs amazon.

That was just a back of the envelope micro-datasheet to specifically address DJ-Matt questions.

regards,

Nemencine

(08-14-2014 09:51 AM)Engineer Wrote:  Awesome side business! Any updates??? Agree on the face to face networking bringing fatter margins than online, you can use negotiating tactics that simply aren't available in an online auction.

Regarding the mass battery charging issue, have you found any satisfactory solution? Is the 16 channel box good for multiple battery interfaces, or just a single type? I have some ideas and will gladly share if it's still an issue.

Lastly, are you considering the 10 hours to sort through OS's at $10/hour your only labor expense? How about the time to pack/label/ship/go to the store for bubble wrap, etc?

Post: #21

I didn't mention it in this thread yet, but my go-to bargain center is the local state surplus office (I live in the capital so that's a requirement for you!) which has LCD monitors cheap and the occasional EXCELLENT deal. I bought a few Cisco routers for $25 that flipped on eBay for $200 easily.

Lately it's been great for parts though, the machines I got without HDDs inside, drives for them can be had at SS for $4 for 40 GB, $8 for 80 and I'm assuming $16 for 160 though I haven't run across those yet. Memory, keyboards/mice, servers (bargain always), and laser printers (under $30!).

State surplus offices handle things differently by state, I remember in Louisiana they just auctioned things off, which was a great way to buy a whole pallet of computers for $300-500. And the casual looky loos that normally drive prices up on single computers, wouldn't bid since they don't need a ton of them and it keeps the price down.

Post: #22

If you could make this a scalable business that would be impressive. I've heard the expression "Hardware is the new software" meaning hardware itself is cheap & more disposable than ever.

I'm actually surprised there is still much profit in this, but I hadn't considered the developing world customer base. And yes, I agree dealing with USA customers over eBay plus the ridiculous fees from eBay & PayPal combined is discouraging.

But how do you ensure payment by some snake in Ghana or some other third world shithole with no recourse?

Post: #23

(08-26-2014 12:52 PM)Jack198 Wrote:  If you could make this a scalable business that would be impressive. I've heard the expression "Hardware is the new software" meaning hardware itself is cheap & more disposable than ever.

That is what i am right in the middle of now. Hence i am shopping around for a suitable database software.

(08-26-2014 12:52 PM)Jack198 Wrote:  I'm actually surprised there is still much profit in this, but I hadn't considered the developing world customer base. And yes, I agree dealing with USA customers over eBay plus the ridiculous fees from eBay & PayPal combined is discouraging.

But how do you ensure payment by some snake in Ghana or some other third world shithole with no recourse?

Shipping to a 3rd world countries gives you the FATTEST margins, of course, you can still make decent amount online as i illustrated here.

How to avoid being scammed by a snake in Ghana? I follow these two patterns:

Pattern A:

Nemencine inside country X -------> Hand over the finished products to Buyer in country X after being paid -----> the Buyer then ship the finished product to his 3rd world country. This is how my Egyptian deal works.

Pattern B:

Nemencine inside country X -----> ship the finished product to 3rd world country(only and only after being paid by agents of Buyer inside country X) -----> Product gets to Buyer in his 3rd world country. This is how my Ghana deal works. My Ghanaian buyer travels back and forth a lot; i get paid by him or his agents here inside country X, before i ship over the finished products to his Ghana address.


Another advantage that 3rd world country have is this: To sell products online, i have to have my ear to the ground and see what is selling hot, otherwise, you will stack up stagnant inventory which will tie up your capital. With 3rd world countries, they just tell me what they want/need, i simply find it for them. I dont have to conduct any market research, they do that already for me. They find the customers in their own countries, etc. I am just the lad over here making sure their products is ready and operational by the expected date.

Post: #24

...

Post: #25

(08-26-2014 08:23 PM)Nemencine Wrote:  

(08-26-2014 12:52 PM)Jack198 Wrote:  If you could make this a scalable business that would be impressive. I've heard the expression "Hardware is the new software" meaning hardware itself is cheap & more disposable than ever.

That is what i am right in the middle of now. Hence i am shopping around for a suitable database software.

(08-26-2014 12:52 PM)Jack198 Wrote:  I'm actually surprised there is still much profit in this, but I hadn't considered the developing world customer base. And yes, I agree dealing with USA customers over eBay plus the ridiculous fees from eBay & PayPal combined is discouraging.

But how do you ensure payment by some snake in Ghana or some other third world shithole with no recourse?

Shipping to a 3rd world countries gives you the FATTEST margins, of course, you can still make decent amount online as i illustrated here.

How to avoid being scammed by a snake in Ghana? I follow these two patterns:

Pattern A:

Nemencine inside country X -------> Hand over the finished products to Buyer in country X after being paid -----> the Buyer then ship the finished product to his 3rd world country. This is how my Egyptian deal works.

Pattern B:

Nemencine inside country X -----> ship the finished product to 3rd world country(only and only after being paid by agents of Buyer inside country X) -----> Product gets to Buyer in his 3rd world country. This is how my Ghana deal works. My Ghanaian buyer travels back and forth a lot; i get paid by him or his agents here inside country X, before i ship over the finished products to his Ghana address.


Another advantage that 3rd world country have is this: To sell products online, i have to have my ear to the ground and see what is selling hot, otherwise, you will stack up stagnant inventory which will tie up your capital. With 3rd world countries, they just tell me what they want/need, i simply find it for them. I dont have to conduct any market research, they do that already for me. They find the customers in their own countries, etc. I am just the lad over here making sure their products is ready and operational by the expected date.

Do you always ship your refurbished laptops with an OS? That part could get expensive. Unless you found a workaround