Post: #1

Any thoughts on girls who are distant and you don't know if they like you but keep accepting dates. Also when you try to hold their hand they go "no". I'm running in the same problem as I did a couple of years ago, would like to know how to proceed differently this time.

Post: #2

You did not provide enough information about what kind of dates you're doing; are those expensive dinner dates? Who's paying?
But anyway if you want to do another date, I'd suggest making it very different from any previous dates - for example, by saying something like "this is our last date, as it is clear to me that we're not compatible with each others", and keep yourself very distant. Either she'd try to soften it up and trying to escalate, or she'll say it is ok, at which moment you should say goodbye and forget about her.

Post: #3

(02-05-2011 11:36 PM)oldnemesis Wrote:  You did not provide enough information about what kind of dates you're doing; are those expensive dinner dates? Who's paying?
But anyway if you want to do another date, I'd suggest making it very different from any previous dates - for example, by saying something like "this is our last date, as it is clear to me that we're not compatible with each others", and keep yourself very distant. Either she'd try to soften it up and trying to escalate, or she'll say it is ok, at which moment you should say goodbye and forget about her.

I paid every time.

The first date was just for coffee to scope out what kind of person she is and the second date was for hookah(Where I tried to get her hand and said at the same time "here, take my hand", before going into the hookah place while walking). We went to eat some California pizza kitchen before the hookah. She is fresh off the boat from china.

She is always putting me in first place, making sure I eat the most, making sure I'm not too cold, how my day went and etc.

She rarely touches me on dates and just stares at me during the dates and asks me questions. At the hookah place our faces were literally touching each other when we were talking. Are Chinese girls very distant? I sit right next to her all the time with elbows touching and she is cool with that.

I don't want to write a book, and I know that if she isn't putting out then dump her. I have so far gone out twice with her and willing to go a couple of more dates if she'll put out. She has the type of qualities that I am looking for long term. Yes, I'm also trying to find something on the side so my mind won't be on her all the time.

I ran into the same exact problem with a Filipino girl several years ago. Do I just need to give her more time to get used to me before I start the physical stuff?

Post: #4

You could be dealing with a classic dinner whore case. It IS more common, I feel, with FOBs (from anywhere really).

At this point, I would press the envelope physically and eject if you don't see any results. To paraphrase Roosh, you don't really get to know a chick until you try to bang her.

Post: #5

(02-06-2011 12:19 AM)Tuthmosis Wrote:  You could be dealing with a classic dinner whore case. It IS more common, I feel, with FOBs (from anywhere really).

At this point, I would press the envelope physically and eject if you don't see any results. To paraphrase Roosh, you don't really get to know a chick until you try to bang her.

Maybe, maybe not. She texted me while I was in route to her place if I could come later so she can eat at home because I told her it was going to be hookah. The eating was totally my idea.

Post: #6

I could tell you a lot right now, but you'll have to figure this one out on your own bro. That's besides the point. You shouldn't be dating just one girl in the first place, when she is distant you should be seeing girl B.

Post: #7

(02-06-2011 03:04 AM)Feo Wrote:  I could tell you a lot right now, but you'll have to figure this one out on your own bro. That's besides the point. You shouldn't be dating just one girl in the first place, when she is distant you should be seeing girl B.

That's what I'm figuring too. If I'm going to fuck up then I'm going to fuck up. The best lessons are learned through first hand experience. I'm trying to date some girls on the side but nothing is coming up. I'm starting to figure out that I'm only going to be successful if I'm chasing several women because otherwise my emotions are tied up in one woman.

Post: #8

With girls that are seemingly distant, I've found that you have to be bold and simply call them on it. Ask her why she is so distant. When she told you no, when you tried to hold her hand, ask her why she said that. You have to go about asking in a way that's not whiny tho.

I've noticed that with aloof/distant girls, its not really the right move to try to match their "distance" with more distance.....she'll just forget about you. The best move would be to go hard at her in terms of talkin to her and telling her what's on your mind while trying to get into her head, and then just stopping contact cold turkey if she doesn't respond to that. Tell her that you like her but that you feel like she's too distant for whatever reason and that you don't want to waste your time with a girl that's just on the fence about u.

Don't do this too early tho cause it will make you look desperate. After about a month or so should be long enough depending how much you've seen her and interacted with her during that time.

If she opens up after giving her some real talk, cool, that's what u wanted. But if her response or actions are not to your liking after talkin to her, drop her cold.

Dropping her cold does 2 things: shows that your a man of your word that really doesn't have time to fuck around with bullshit women. and it gives her time to chew on what u said and think about the opportunity she missed to be down with u.

She'll eventually hit u back at some point if she really did like u but was just fronting.

Post: #9

Yea I've noticed that too. Trying to pull the distance crap with a girl that isn't too interested is not going to work.

I thought about Feo's response and the last time this happened was 3 years ago and I wasn't able to figure it out back then and now.

My best plan so far is start to gradually get more physical while keep going on dates with her. She will let me know if I'm going too fast.

Post: #10

Well she might just be different.... some girls arent like the 95% rest, Im seeying one like that now.. and there really is no perfect answer to it, but I agree that distance + distance = bad idea.. but still Id say old scholl push/pull always is solid.. show interest.. stay away let her wonder..

In my experience its close to impossible to figure out, and since you seem to really like her, just take it easy and see what happens, she is probably just freaked about liking you..

I like theIVth response, seems solid..

Post: #11

My last serious girlfriend was cold and distant (that's why she's an ex now) Like the advice mentioned above, it wasn't until I banged her that I realized this and got to the bottom of it. Wasn't into cuddling or physical affection, some girls are just like that. She had some fucked up experiences growing up, as the majority of girls do, and each girl deals with it differently.

Post: #12

(02-06-2011 12:06 AM)wolf Wrote:  She is fresh off the boat from china.

So she's not Americanized chick; that's a different story.

Quote:She is always putting me in first place, making sure I eat the most, making sure I'm not too cold, how my day went and etc.

That's part of Asian culture, and as she's just fresh of the boat from China, it is understandable.

Quote:She rarely touches me on dates and just stares at me during the dates and asks me questions. At the hookah place our faces were literally touching each other when we were talking. Are Chinese girls very distant?

It is a very different culture, which teaches them to suppress their emotions - especially in a public place. How does she behave when you're in private, and nobody could see you? They're not distant, but they definitely are more shy than your typical white American chick, and will likely to put up more . She also may be a virgin.

Quote:I ran into the same exact problem with a Filipino girl several years ago. Do I just need to give her more time to get used to me before I start the physical stuff?

There are two ways to handle it. First one is just to plow through her resistance; grab her hand, and don't let her remove it. This is how most Asian guys do.
Second way is a nice Western style, doing it slow through a few months of dating, meeting her parents, etc.
Both methods work. First method will get you laid faster; second may be more beneficial if you're looking on her as long-term candidate.

Do you enjoy hanging out with her per se? Think about it this way: if you knew there would be no sex ever, would you still go to dates with her? If the answer is yes, then take the slow route. There is much more women you can have sex with than those whose company you would truly enjoy. If the answer is no, go the first route.

Post: #13

(02-08-2011 12:19 AM)oldnemesis Wrote:  

(02-06-2011 12:06 AM)wolf Wrote:  She is fresh off the boat from china.

So she's not Americanized chick; that's a different story.

Quote:She is always putting me in first place, making sure I eat the most, making sure I'm not too cold, how my day went and etc.

That's part of Asian culture, and as she's just fresh of the boat from China, it is understandable.

Quote:She rarely touches me on dates and just stares at me during the dates and asks me questions. At the hookah place our faces were literally touching each other when we were talking. Are Chinese girls very distant?

It is a very different culture, which teaches them to suppress their emotions - especially in a public place. How does she behave when you're in private, and nobody could see you? They're not distant, but they definitely are more shy than your typical white American chick, and will likely to put up more . She also may be a virgin.

Quote:I ran into the same exact problem with a Filipino girl several years ago. Do I just need to give her more time to get used to me before I start the physical stuff?

There are two ways to handle it. First one is just to plow through her resistance; grab her hand, and don't let her remove it. This is how most Asian guys do.
Second way is a nice Western style, doing it slow through a few months of dating, meeting her parents, etc.
Both methods work. First method will get you laid faster; second may be more beneficial if you're looking on her as long-term candidate.

Do you enjoy hanging out with her per se? Think about it this way: if you knew there would be no sex ever, would you still go to dates with her? If the answer is yes, then take the slow route. There is much more women you can have sex with than those whose company you would truly enjoy. If the answer is no, go the first route.

The thing that bugs me is she is closer to me when there are other people around. When we are totally alone she keeps her distance. I want her for long-term. With girls that I usually took months with their attraction grew over time and they are the ones that initiated something. I was just shy and they left. I'm not going to plow but I'll be somewhere in the middle between plow and nice western style.

Post: #14

Chinese and most SEA girls in general tend to be more conservative in public. There is a whole lot of Face issues.

Basic explination of face is twofold.

One facet is mianzi- this refers to ones standing in the community. For example honesty and moral integrity.

The second is Lian- which refers to ones ability to preform in the community.

The second is usually reserved for business, for example the loss of face caused by backing out of a deal that was previously agreed on. The first one is the issue in relationships with chinese girls in particular. Most native chinese people are not big on PDA　of any form. For example, ive been long term semi seriously with a chick who will still not hug me or kiss me in public, after 2 years. It has to do with the whole "good girl" mentality. Woman who smoke in china usually dont do so in public on the off chance someone will recognize them or people will think them a "bad girl" Its hard to break through this kind of traditional shield without practice. Its all about being smooth as hell and dont give them a chance to think. For example, when im out with a Chinese girl, i deliberately lead them over high step ups or downs and always offer my hand to them to assist, and if they take it, i dont let go, and if they try to pull away i just pull them closer. Be a gentleman, but give her shit for it. Open doors and tease her for walking so slowing. Get her home with some excuse.

For example there was this one chick i spent some time on, lets call her H. I was introduced to her at a beach party got her number and asked her out a few times. Over listening to her bullshit for a few times out, i found out she liked watching movies from the Rome period, so i went out and DLed the HBO Rome series. That gave me the excuse to get her home. Nothing happened the first few times i got her home, but i was constantly escalating, forcing her to stop me, and when she did, i would get up off the sofa, and leave here there for a few min while i went and folded laundry or something in the other room, then come back, chat with her for a bit, have some fun and escalate again. We did a a few sleep overs in my bed and getting shut down, and i left in the morning for work and she cleaned my place by the time i got home (I LOVE　Asian girls just b/c of that) Over the course of the outside dating i ran the game i explained above, and later while H was talking bullshit later she was something like "you know, you are my friend," while holding my hand, so i immediately dropped her hand and she reached for mine, held it tightly and said something like "thats not exactly what i mean, i mean something more speical then that." I banged H not long after that night, on a night where later she apologized for being so horny that day. A bit of a read, and not a shining example of how to run perfect game on traditional girls, but it was recent and i hit most of the high points.

The whole point is with traditional girls you need to be aggressive. Make them force you to stop, and then ignore them for a while. Make them feel safe, and keep pushing the limits while in private, but be at least halfway a gentlemen in public so they dont lose face. You need to have them trust you, and make them feel that there is no way anyone will find out what happens with alone with you, and actually pay attention to their bullshit. Make them understand without saying it that they will have to eventually fuck you to keep you interested in spending time with them. Traditional girls are a lot of work, but it is totally worth the pay off in the end as long as you dont pick up some 19 year old girl who has no idea what she wants. Its just a lot more persistence, and not walking away as quickly as i would with a white chick.

Post: #15

(02-12-2011 02:37 AM)AlphaQup2nite Wrote:  Chinese and most SEA girls in general tend to be more conservative in public. There is a whole lot of Face issues.

Basic explination of face is twofold.

One facet is mianzi- this refers to ones standing in the community. For example honesty and moral integrity.

The second is Lian- which refers to ones ability to preform in the community.

The second is usually reserved for business, for example the loss of face caused by backing out of a deal that was previously agreed on. The first one is the issue in relationships with chinese girls in particular. Most native chinese people are not big on PDA　of any form. For example, ive been long term semi seriously with a chick who will still not hug me or kiss me in public, after 2 years. It has to do with the whole "good girl" mentality. Woman who smoke in china usually dont do so in public on the off chance someone will recognize them or people will think them a "bad girl" Its hard to break through this kind of traditional shield without practice. Its all about being smooth as hell and dont give them a chance to think. For example, when im out with a Chinese girl, i deliberately lead them over high step ups or downs and always offer my hand to them to assist, and if they take it, i dont let go, and if they try to pull away i just pull them closer. Be a gentleman, but give her shit for it. Open doors and tease her for walking so slowing. Get her home with some excuse.

For example there was this one chick i spent some time on, lets call her H. I was introduced to her at a beach party got her number and asked her out a few times. Over listening to her bullshit for a few times out, i found out she liked watching movies from the Rome period, so i went out and DLed the HBO Rome series. That gave me the excuse to get her home. Nothing happened the first few times i got her home, but i was constantly escalating, forcing her to stop me, and when she did, i would get up off the sofa, and leave here there for a few min while i went and folded laundry or something in the other room, then come back, chat with her for a bit, have some fun and escalate again. We did a a few sleep overs in my bed and getting shut down, and i left in the morning for work and she cleaned my place by the time i got home (I LOVE　Asian girls just b/c of that) Over the course of the outside dating i ran the game i explained above, and later while H was talking bullshit later she was something like "you know, you are my friend," while holding my hand, so i immediately dropped her hand and she reached for mine, held it tightly and said something like "thats not exactly what i mean, i mean something more speical then that." I banged H not long after that night, on a night where later she apologized for being so horny that day. A bit of a read, and not a shining example of how to run perfect game on traditional girls, but it was recent and i hit most of the high points.

The whole point is with traditional girls you need to be aggressive. Make them force you to stop, and then ignore them for a while. Make them feel safe, and keep pushing the limits while in private, but be at least halfway a gentlemen in public so they dont lose face. You need to have them trust you, and make them feel that there is no way anyone will find out what happens with alone with you, and actually pay attention to their bullshit. Make them understand without saying it that they will have to eventually fuck you to keep you interested in spending time with them. Traditional girls are a lot of work, but it is totally worth the pay off in the end as long as you dont pick up some 19 year old girl who has no idea what she wants. Its just a lot more persistence, and not walking away as quickly as i would with a white chick.

Thanks for the advice, I'll re-read it to make sure I get it. I did try kissing her, she backed out( I then acted as if nothing happened and she did too), I'll keep trying till I get it.

Post: #16

For me, with a significant number of chicks, it was harder to kiss then then it was to fuck them, and for reference, ive been in china for over 10 years. You might want to go the purely physical route without kissing, start with a shoulder massage and such. But you will be blown out in public every time, even if she is your wife (from what friends tell me)

Post: #17

(02-12-2011 05:48 AM)AlphaQup2nite Wrote:  For me, with a significant number of chicks, it was harder to kiss then then it was to fuck them, and for reference, ive been in china for over 10 years. You might want to go the purely physical route without kissing, start with a shoulder massage and such. But you will be blown out in public every time, even if she is your wife (from what friends tell me)

AHAHAHA. My friend and I were just joking about that a couple of days ago. The fact that I'm shy and don't usually kiss girls with their clothes on. I kinda have to kiss her with her on top of me naked.

This doesn't sound such a bad idea, she usually lets my hands wonder around her body, I got it only slapped away once. I'll try kissing her a couple more times and if it's a no go I'll go for the bang. Even if it doesn't work out with her this advice is very useful, I have a hard on specifically for Chinese chicks.

Post: #18

Well give me some more back ground on this chick and i can build an MO for you that would make a good guide.

Specifically, social-economic background
is she adamant that she is a virgin
education level
is she from a village or a big city
and what is she doing there and are family or family friends close by.

Chinese chicks are kinda my specialty.

The thing about being shy is its kinda like shooting yourself in the foot. You need to come off as almost too full of yourself. You need to be aggressive and pushy as the more traditional they are, the more they need to be led, as Chinese girls are quite submissive.

Post: #19

(02-12-2011 06:10 AM)AlphaQup2nite Wrote:  Well give me some more back ground on this chick and i can build an MO for you that would make a good guide.

Specifically, social-economic background
is she adamant that she is a virgin
education level
is she from a village or a big city
and what is she doing there and are family or family friends close by.

Chinese chicks are kinda my specialty.

The thing about being shy is its kinda like shooting yourself in the foot. You need to come off as almost too full of yourself. You need to be aggressive and pushy as the more traditional they are, the more they need to be led, as Chinese girls are quite submissive.

Parents back in China working for her to come here and be in school. She's working on her masters. Comes from the big city. She got a lot of friends here.

I'm pretty shy only around one-on-one with girls. But get me in front of other people and I start to break out the jokes. I'm guessing it's all up to her because I'm doing most of the work, she never calls, doesn't text back sometime and just shows up.

Post: #20

good asian girls will never set up anything. You need to take charge. I have a sweet ass dongbei girl (the best chinese imo) who ive been nailing for almost 2 years, and she still wont call me to set anything up, and only calls if i neglect her for like 3 months.

Ill be honest, chinese girls are terrible to date/try to get them out, and the sex isnt anything to write home about. The one on one shyness is killing you tho. Its better to be shy in public then in private with these kinda girls.

Post: #21

(02-13-2011 03:06 AM)AlphaQup2nite Wrote:  good asian girls will never set up anything. You need to take charge. I have a sweet ass dongbei girl (the best chinese imo) who ive been nailing for almost 2 years, and she still wont call me to set anything up, and only calls if i neglect her for like 3 months.

Ill be honest, chinese girls are terrible to date/try to get them out, and the sex isnt anything to write home about. The one on one shyness is killing you tho. Its better to be shy in public then in private with these kinda girls.

That's what I figured. I'm okay with taking charge, in fact I need more experience in that. I think she like it too. Before when I called her she mumbled into the phone, I did too because of my inexperience talking on the phone. Now she talks clearly on the phone, as do I.

I found your advice helpful. If you have a need to give me some tips feel free to PM me any time.

Post: #22

AlphaQup2nite, have a question for you. Is "face" concept limited to SE Asia, or it is the same/similar through the whole Asia, including Korea and Japan? What about Philippines?

Post: #23

The close to the mother root of modern chinese language the country, the more it influences them. I am aware of it having a large role in Japanese interactions, at least more traditional, less so in korea, but still strong overtones. Less so in the Thai peninsula and SEA islands.
But then again it varies by culture. For example, in japan, there isnt that much of a stigma against being a prostitute, while having a job dealing with the deceased would be something shameful (undertaker)

Face as it is can be summed up as one's conformity with Confucius's theories on social and personal ethics. Every SEA country is experiencing a breakaway movement of the young people, but really i don't deal with those idiots for many reasons. The simpler way to say it is the more traditional a woman's upbringing in asia, the more face matters to her. With younger generations being less inclined to worry about it.

Face as a concept is an ideal opposite of americanized and western thinking, of personal freedom. It is a "care about what others think" and "do as expected."

Post: #24

Alpha..great write up. To add to that I'd say that in bed you get out what you put in. I love submissive girls for that reason..

Wolf, I suggest when you do finally get her into bed (and you will), give her little orders to follow. Tell her where to put her legs, how to move her tongue, when to put her hair up... She will love you for it.