Post: #1

I just got dragged on a weeks holiday to Malta by my family. Which I didn't particularly enjoy - at least compared to staying at home and doing my own thing.

Anyway - whilst I was out there I asked my brother (who has traveled to about 30 different countries) what he enjoyed about most about his round the world trips.

He gave me a surprising succinct answer.

Daydreaming.

He explained that ultimately - when you are traveling you enter a mellow world of daydreaming where you ask questions and notice things that you would usually overlook or not be bothered about.

In that sense - traveling gives you a new way of looking at things. And makes the everyday feel fresh and new. But only in an unfocused and random way. Which doesn't really build to anything greater. It is almost as if time slows down when you enter into such a frame of mind. And you just allow yourself to get lost in the simple passage of time itself.

It is the sort of dawdling thinking which I associate with stoners.

I definitely experience some of that when I am abroad. It is like having a hangover - but without the headache (or in my case - dread and paranoia). But ultimately I would rather make more productive use of my time. I would rather read a book than spend the day daydreaming and feeling mellow.

I am not trying to start a hate thread - since I respect the fact that everyone has their own opinions. Instead - I just wanted to write the above in the hopes of hearing from others about what it is they enjoy most about traveling? Since I am genuinely curious.

I should finish by adding that with globalisation - I feel that most of Europe is pretty identical in feel these days. I am just wondering if the impact of globalisation has weakened some of the reasons people used to give for wanting to travel?

The reason I mention it - is that the 'daydreaming' state of mind is one which you will enter into in any foreign country. And as such - being abroad in any country feels remarkably similar to being abroad in a different country.

It is as if the human mind splits the world into three places - my home, my country and abroad.

Post: #2

Your first sentence said it all. I stopped reading...

Post: #3

Relevant: Traveling to the third world is great and also it sucks

Quote:There are three things you can focus on when you’re on a trip:

1) The Place. Exploring a place’s famous sights, natural wonders, history, and modern highlights.

2) The People. Getting to know the modern culture and the mindset of the people; developing a better understanding of what it’s like to live there by asking questions, visiting residential areas, and socializing with locals.

3) Yourself. Being hedonistic, focusing on eating, drinking, reading, and relaxing.

In any place in the world, someone who’s easily fascinated can achieve #1, someone who’s bravely outgoing can achieve #2, and if you have a high budget, you can make #3 happen almost anywhere.

IMO cardguy, you only scratched #3 on this small list. You don't need to travel to smoke a pipe and daydream. But you do need to travel to experience firsthand how lucky we are to have been born into such an incredibly fortunate situation, while simultaneously recognizing how we don't have our priorities straight in spite of being so wealthy (see healthcare, education, gender roles, manners/socialization, etc. in the US).

Post: #4

Interesting post. My reasons for traveling (whenever I get the chance and whenever I can afford to) are more tangible. I'm on the east coast, and although there are indeed mountains over here, I live in a place where accessing them would be a hassle. I recently got back from living in LA for a few months -- and fuck the Walk of Fame, Hollywood and Vine -- my favorite part was driving around and being engulfed by the mountainous skylines. Pretty cool stuff.

Additionally, traveling for me is novelty -- As a kid without much money, finding the time and the option to spend my time elsewhere than my mundane home is always a pleasure.

-R

Post: #5

Cardguy, you'll probably like this:
http://earlyretirementextreme.com/travel...broad.html
http://earlyretirementextreme.com/travel...th-it.html
http://earlyretirementextreme.com/somebo...to-me.html

While I love travelling, I can't help but agree with that article in many respects.

Post: #6

Will check out the links.

Cheers!

Post: #7

(05-07-2014 02:43 PM)cardguy Wrote:  I should finish by adding that with globalisation - I feel that most of Europe is pretty identical in feel these days. I am just wondering if the impact of globalisation has weakened some of the reasons people used to give for wanting to travel?

You just have to look for more destinations off the beaten path. My first overseas trip was to western Europe on my 18th birthday and I was a little taken aback. There were so many tour guides and people to hold your hand along the way, I didn't want any of that shit.

Now I travel to places most of my friends have never heard of. It has become somewhat of a game within itself to search for places uncorrupted by tourism.

Post: #8

Yeah - I know going round Europe is not really traveling.

But it is still surprising how similar everywhere is.

As an Englishman - it is like being in England but with better weather.

Post: #9

Cardguy - 'I would rather read a book than spend the day daydreaming and feeling mellow.'

You can do both.

My favourite part of travel is the 'boredom', the 'doing nothing'. I revel in it.

I hate sightseeing and the pressure that when you're abroad you constantly need to be doing/seeing something.

'Your true traveller finds boredom rather agreeable than painful. It is the symbol of his liberty - his excessive freedom. He accepts his boredom, when it comes, not merely philosophically, but almost with pleasure.'

- Aldous Huxley

Post: #10

(05-07-2014 02:43 PM)cardguy Wrote:  It is the sort of dawdling thinking which I associate with stoners.

I definitely experience some of that when I am abroad. It is like having a hangover - but without the headache (or in my case - dread and paranoia). But ultimately I would rather make more productive use of my time. I would rather read a book than spend the day daydreaming and feeling mellow.

Lots to say on this topic. But let's start with this quote above, since I think it's the crux of your beliefs.

Why exactly do you consider reading a book productive? Reading a book is consumption, not output. You finish a book - you may have enjoyed it and learned something but you still haven't produced anything.

Why is the book superior to watching a news bulletin, Game of Thrones or a football match?

On what basis do you consider the intellectual pleasure you derive from a book superior to the sensual pleasures of the physical world?

Post: #11

For me, it's a way to live life more vividly. It heightens my senses, satiates more curiosity, pushes me out of my comfort zone, forces me to socialize and talk to strangers more, to learn a bit of a new language, see new landscapes, new foods, new smells. Experience a different type of people to contrast my own country about, gives me some perspective. Even little things aren't taken for granted and even the mundane feels fresh and invigorating. Coming home with interesting stories and life experiences, new people you met that you may or may not visit again but who you won't forget.

One of my favorite thing is seeing how a place measures up against my expectations. Sometimes you get what you expected, sometimes a place surprises you. I love the surprises.

Post: #12

Go to the Himalayas and tell me travel is a waste of time...

I did a 1 year RTW trip once and I felt I was the most productive I have ever been, I read the most books I have ever read and I kept a small journal for app/website/business ideas. I was also in the best shape of my life. Having an extra 8-10 hours a day really frees you up.

If you want to stifle self improvement of body and mind the fastest way is to work a typical 9-5 job.

Post: #13

Travel is amazing, it's a great education. It also (if done correctly, and a family holiday isn't good for this) makes you push your boundaries. Going to Poland and Lithuania on my own was nerve wracking, yet fulfilling. Can't wait to get out to EE again.

Post: #14

I spent most of last year living in Asia. It was a wonderful experience, even if I didn't achieve my prime objective of finding a long term female.

I'm now back home, but I feel a lot different inside. I'm a lot calmer and I'm no longer bothered by first world problems (noisy neighbours, traffic etc.). I sold my TV when I went travelling and I haven't bought a new one - as a result I have a lot more time on my hands. And I have a lifetime of memories experienced in just one year. Tropical storms, Chinese car accidents, beautiful ladies, sweatshop clothing factories, super busy trains, Asian universities, weird bugs, horribly disfigured beggars... I really did see everything last year.

Post: #15

Travelling does a lot of things for a person, or at least it does for me. Some of them have been covered above, the sense that you are free to do as much or as little as you want, focus on resting, walking, eating, or any range of activities from simple pleasures to outright hedonism. It opens the mind by forcing you to go outside your boundaries and comfort zone, experience new cultures, sights, people, realities, and in those ways it can really inspire some creativity as well.

In addition it really lets you escape from your everyday life, even if only briefly. I know some people are travelling constantly as part of their job or if they have the wealth to do so, but for 99% of the world we're in a fixed-location. Some may have more exciting jobs than others, and I certainly don't hate my own, but we still see the same faces, same places, eat the same foods, and fall into the same routines. You can take a week off, but it's still a week off within the routine. If you take time off and go halfway across the world however, it's an escape and almost a liberation, no matter how brief or long.

In my own example, I've been abroad a couple of times in recent years, it was free but it was also part of a group through my job and our schedules were mostly dictated. So this year I'm taking 9 weeks off to go across Russia and visit several countries in Asia. I've just got this urge to live in different worlds for that time, do things I never get the chance to do here, and forget where I've come from. I know I'm coming back, but for that 9 weeks I'll have not one care in the world.

And as some others above suggested, it really mellows you out when you get back. After releasing yourself from the routine back home, and often seeing countries that do things differently, the smallest problems stop being worth bothering about.

The memories last a lifetime too, and when I'm old, tired and sipping on a beer, I'll remember the good times I had in foreign lands.

Post: #16

Because life is not meant to be lived in one place.

Post: #17

Cardguy, I often wonder if you're just trolling the forum. A lot of your threads openly question the entire purpose of this place! Haha.

Post: #18

sssshhh! Teedub - I'm in enough trouble as it is! :-)

Thanks for the responses above. I'll be honest and say I have definitely noticed a calm come over me after getting out the country and breaking my routine for the past week.

I don't enjoy putting my life on hold for a week - but it definitely feels like something my subconscious has benefited from the experience. It is like the feeling you get after a good nights sleep.

As always - I am not trolling the forum. I am just trying to get to the fundamental basis of a lot of the topics discussed.

In answer to an earlier question. I agree that reading a book is not particularly productive. It is just that I am a big reader - and I enjoy working through a book over spending a day chilling out and not experiencing anything concrete that I can put my finger on. I find diffuse and sensuous pleasures a little boring. But I guess there are no right or wrong answers when it comes to preferences like this.

I should add that whilst I enjoy my job. I do get sick of seeing the same faces every day - year after year. And spending time out of the country definitely helps get rid of that stress. Even more so than just spending time on holiday at home.

The other funny thing is this. I seem to have a poor memory when it comes to the mundane everyday stuff. As such - I struggle to think of anything I did when I think about years like 2010, 2011, 2012 and so on. Yet - invariably - the only thing I can ever recall with absolute clarity are my trips abroad on holiday.

So - there is a definite benefit there. But - for me - it is a small benefit, which only makes itself known years later...

Post: #19

@Handsome Creepy Eel - those are great links. I am going through them now - really interesting stuff. Manages to put into words a lot of things I struggled to do. The comments below the articles are great as well.

As for travel - I am reminded of a quote by Carl von Clausewitz.

"That while the purpose of war is to serve a political end, the true nature of war is to serve itself."

This can be applied to travel.

The purpose of travel may be to expand your mind or experience new cultures. But the true nature of travel too often consists of hanging around airports, traveling in cabs and buses, and being surrounded by other travelers in search of an authentic experience.

It seems a lot of people start to see traveling as an end in itself. Constantly on the move for the next beach, next monument, next group of people to hang out with. Without ever really asking what it is they are looking for.

And it's Bono - in three, two, one...

Post: #20

funny...when billionaire entrepreneurs like richard branson are asked what their biggest piece of advice is to the young hustlers out there, they recommend travel. and as much as you can while you're still young.

as someone who feels like he's traveled plenty already, i've always wondered if i've been doing something wrong?

there MUST be ways of traveling that really do open your mind up, allows you to see opportunities, connect dots, detect patterns that others cannot...

Post: #21

Cardguy, you seem to enjoy constantly being contrarian and taking jabs at the forum's values. It begs the question...why are you here?

While traveling CAN come at the expense of personal development(particularly financially), I'm not sure how you can even begin to question the value of it, especially here.

Pleasure and foreign exotic women are justification enough. But I seem to remember you preferring porn to the real thing anyways...

Post: #22

I am not a contrarian.

My favourite writer - Peter Hitchens - is often accused of being a contrarian as well.

Recently he put together a nice rebuttal which analysed why people make such accusations:

Quote:The people who make these accusations do so because they themselves hold opinions for reasons of conformity and convenience, rather than out of conviction.

Quote:If this is your approach to the world, then you will think everyone else is up to the same thing. If you yourself don’t hold your views out of conviction, but only out of conformity, you will be angry with the person who breaches that conformity.

He is making you look like a conformist by doing so.

And while many are ready to conform, few like to admit they are doing so.

Post: #23

You'd rather read a book than travel.

You'd rather read a book than have sex.

You'd rather read a book than lift weights.

Honestly, I don't know why you're on this forum.

Post: #24

(05-07-2014 10:10 PM)cardguy Wrote:  I am not a contrarian.

My favourite writer - Peter Hitchens - is often accused of being a contrarian as well.

Recently he put together a nice rebuttal which analysed why people make such accusations:

Quote:The people who make these accusations do so because they themselves hold opinions for reasons of conformity and convenience, rather than out of conviction.

Quote:If this is your approach to the world, then you will think everyone else is up to the same thing. If you yourself don’t hold your views out of conviction, but only out of conformity, you will be angry with the person who breaches that conformity.

He is making you look like a conformist by doing so.

And while many are ready to conform, few like to admit they are doing so.

And there you go donning the philosopher's cape again. There are other boards for that gibberish.

I misspoke, we(yes the collective and conformist we) are not on this site due to common values but rather common interests, interests which you self-admittedly don't have.

I ask you again, if you don't like to travel or bang broads, then why are you here?

Post: #25

I think the design and layout of this board is excellent.

For instance - I like that the board is split into five main sections - and not the dozens of sections that a lot of other manosphere forums are split into.

But more importantly - I think this board has an excellent mix of different personalities and genuinely smart people. Every few minutes on this forum - I read a bit of writing which makes me wish I had written that. To me that is a nice feeling to have and makes me think I am in the right place...

Lastly - whilst I am a pretty MGTOW frame of mind - I find some of those MGTOW forums to be a bit too MRM focused and a bit boring. Over here there seems to be more curiosity about exploring new ideas...

And yeah - I do like banging broads. I just like hookers and porn as well. They are not mutually exclusive - I just prefer not to slum with the sort of chicks that other guys would rack up as another notch.