Post: #26

(05-05-2014 04:58 AM)funkyzeit Wrote:  Game is about knowing the modern mentality of dating scene. Once you have the knowledge, no woman will have power over you unless you choose to give some of it to her just for the sake of successful long term stuff.

Game in my opinion has went beyond the scope of attraction stages, DHVs, negs and LMR - in the beginning it was just that: a guideline on how to get laid. And there is nothing modern about it - it would have worked in the 17th century in France among the promiscuous aristocracy just as well as among the tradional 1930s girls in the Midwest.

Game as I see it encompasses much more: hypergamy, Apex Fallacy, female solipism, female lying and rationalization hamster, males being the true romantics, females being the realists and the more instinct driven, Alpha Widows, War Widows, female innate desire to submit to a strong man, Dark Triad attraction of women, female optimization of the sexual market value and sexual market place, female psychological life stages, females confusing sexual access with relationship access (A male Alpha 9 banging a 6 will not make her commit to him) etc.

Those are the areas that modern psychology does not touch with a ten-foot-pole, because then it would have to embrace healthy masculinity and the Elite certainly wants to avoid that!

Game teaches us that females are indeed lovely creatures, but only when living within the frame of a strong sane Alpha male - otherwise her innate base natures wreak even worse havoc on society than male innate natures. Unfortunately feminism destroyes all sane female social borders while erecting new ones for men.

Post: #27

Females have always had the ability to empower themselves over men, men have gone to war over women and still to this day they murder other human beings because of this power.

It is essentially what women have and what men want, a market place. The problem being is the 80-20 rule and frustration.

If you have two groups of men and women of equal size the men expect to get with the women on a like-for-like basis, but when this does not work out you get frustration and that breeds desperation.

How big an ego would a man have if he were guaranteed at least 10 women taking an interest in him sexually on the night he goes out?

The ability to pick and choose gives you the power which is why fame beats game but you cannot compare a Hollywood star, hell even a D list celebrity to a normal man with game. Women want these men, men want to be these men with fame and power because its an easy way to get laid.

Women may be empowered but they're always chasing and to me that isn't having power at all, they're subject to the whims of the market place too but they're so ignorant of this fact they go on blissfully unaware and without shame.

Show me a woman with shame and Ill show you a dog that doesn't lick its own arse.

Post: #28

Women want you to believe that they are doing you favor by giving you sex. The truth is they want it just as much. Problem is they have an expiration date ...a countdown timer. You're doing them a favor by extending their shelf life. Once you learn that simple truth you'll find yourself acting different towards them.

Post: #29

Good discussion all around but I disagree with one premise in the OP.

Quote:The essence of Game is that we (men) as suppose to "learn" how to "become" the kind of men that get sex from women.

No, the essence of game is learning how to manipulate women. Some guys advocate "changing" yourself, but it's only to the extent you can manipulate women better.

That said, it is true a man spends a large amount of time on these broads so it is a waste in a very real sense.

Post: #30

Exactly, even if Game is about rigging the system, learning to manipulate women, the amount of time and effort required to effectively do so is already very high and only getting worse. As one of the guys I was helping said, this is like a second job. Then once he started becoming successful he realized it only took more energy and time because now he had to find the time and energy to fuck and spend time talking to and dating the women. He no longer had to time for his personal projects or his friends. Interestingly, he has since closed all of his dating accounts and dumped most of the women. And this is a good looking guy.

The point I keep trying to make with all of my posts is that the true cost of women in America is simply too high regardless of how you are getting them: game, money, or fame. And unless we FIRST collectively acknowledge this then we will do nothing to change it.

Post: #31

Instead of thinking of game as an individual rework in order to bed women (thus pedestalizing them), I'd like to think of bedding women as a side effect of going through personal development as a man.

Post: #32

(05-05-2014 09:57 AM)Nomad77 Wrote:  Exactly, even if Game is about rigging the system, learning to manipulate women, the amount of time and effort required to effectively do so is already very high and only getting worse. As one of the guys I was helping said, this is like a second job. Then once he started becoming successful he realized it only took more energy and time because now he had to find the time and energy to fuck and spend time talking to and dating the women. He no longer had to time for his personal projects or his friends. Interestingly, he has since closed all of his dating accounts and dumped most of the women. And this is a good looking guy.

The point I keep trying to make with all of my posts is that the true cost of women in America is simply too high regardless of how you are getting them: game, money, or fame. And unless we FIRST collectively acknowledge this then we will do nothing to change it.

Yes. Long ago, I stopped doing regular approaches and just started to rely solely on my dance floor game.

Why? Because I wanted my time back. Plus, I really enjoyed dancing. Even if I didn't get laid, I always have a good night out when I go dancing.

After I started doing that I started getting much hotter women even if not as many bangs.

I always tell guys here, "Find a niche, get a bitch." A few hours per week spent on game is really all a man needs.

Post: #33

(05-05-2014 12:07 PM)Samseau Wrote:  Why? Because I wanted my time back. Plus, I really enjoyed dancing. Even if I didn't get laid, I always have a good night out when I go dancing.

This is basically the only way to go nowadays: game as a side-effect of or rider on a leisure activity that you would be doing anyway for its intrinsic benefits.

It also gives you plausible deniability which is really important for setting an initial baseline of comfort.

Post: #34

I'd call it The paradox of Life and how it empowers nobody.

Post: #35

Finding a niche that works for you can definitely help and at least you won't feel like you are selling yourself like a cheap car salesman as much

http://www.rooshv.com/how-to-be-a-good-clown (LOL)

Post: #36

After taking some more red pills I feel you now Nomad77. You are right as long as we do everything for them to get some pussy, we are fucked. I am wondering about a lot of posts in this forum and on the blogs were men still say that women are in reality lovely poor creatures who can't help themselves.

It's that old con trick. Let the other person feel superior to you, give him the feeling that he is in control, exploit and control him in the meantime.
I feel sorry for us men since it seems that the pussy is the new god we slave for. And we have been manipulated into that thinking since we were helpless little creatures.

I don't know if am the only one but I would actually like to see mankind conquer space and new dimensions and for us to invent all kinds of amazing things and to explore live and to have adventures.

We will not ever be able to this if we only live to satisfy insatiable female needs.

This is only my humble opinion. Maybe you guys are not so much into exploration, adventures and science as I am.

Post: #37

If the energy men have put into getting pussy was used for advancement of mankind we would be flying among the stars by now.

The sum total of Game is us learning how to sell our dicks to women. They are the customers, and as they say in business, the customers is always right. Unfortunately, we us, the customer is becoming more and more picky while the supply of available dicks keeps increasing.

We are winning some individual battles (the top players) and losing the war (the rest of men).

Post: #38

(05-05-2014 11:53 AM)Hyperflux Wrote:  Instead of thinking of game as an individual rework in order to bed women (thus pedestalizing them), I'd like to think of bedding women as a side effect of going through personal development as a man.

That's was my conclusion to learning game. After a while, game evolves into lifestyle design which naturally puts women as a fruit not the root to one's being.

I started to learn game in my late 20s so I had already travelled and learnt that women in non-Anglo countries are a pleasure to be around. I had also experienced my value beginning to rise at 25, the age when women start to feel their shorter shelf life and the increasing population of younger women who are interested in the men whom they've been hitherto ignoring/ cuckolding.

I did however catch myself putting a type of woman whom I was never interested in before on a pedestal: the RSD 'turbo girl'. I realised that studying and practising game made me eager for some tangible results to validate the effort and time I was investing. That's where the paradox of the OP lies in my opinion.

Game stopped me following the majority of my friends who got married between 27-30, on the eve of when their values would have peaked because it coincided with the age when women begin to be keen to sell their stocks in the dating market. Men getting married to women with more sexual experience is a recipe for disaster.

Post: #39

@No.6 It you want to know the truth (the real red pill) ask yourself this question: what would you have done if you had grown up in the some remote location outside of modern society and women? How would you have spent your energy "bettering" yourself? Did it every occur to you that almost every aspect of what you consider to be bettering yourself is either directly or indirectly related to making yourself more appealing to women?

No you don't and this is called social conditioning. Your friends have also bought into a different version of social condition. You are both playing to the beat of a female drummer - just a different one. You have decided to become a "lover" instead of a "provider" but either way both you AND your friends are still serving women. You are fucking them and your friends are feeding them.

Something to think about

And just for the record, I have been both.

Social conditioning is the sociological process of training individuals in a society to respond in a manner generally approved by the society in general and peer groups within society. (Wikepedia)

Post: #40

(06-07-2014 09:16 AM)Nomad77 Wrote:  @No.6 It you want to know the truth (the real red pill) ask yourself this question: what would you have done if you had grown up in the some remote location outside of modern society and women? How would you have spent your energy "bettering" yourself? Did it every occur to you that almost every aspect of what you consider to be bettering yourself is either directly or indirectly related to making yourself more appealing to women?

That is exactly true. We must not forget that we are a complementary species. Yes - men are the creative force and yes we can become highly concentrated on science, adventure, travel, business etc., but many of our motivations are initially based on being also appealing to women. Rightly so - we would not survive as a species otherwise!

Post: #41

So you say man has to be a slave to woman because otherwise we would not survive? Come on man.

So how did the humans in the middle east survive who put their women under burkas and never let them go out of the house alone?

I am not saying the solution is to lock women up but I am not going to be a slave for their luscious life either.

Post: #42

The modern Western man, including all of us with the tightest Game, for all intent and purposes are becoming slaves to women. That is exactly what I am saying But no we do not need to be slaves to survive. We were not slaves 20 years ago but we will be 20 years from now.

And if you doubt this, just ask yourself this question? Who is changing to please whom?

Post: #43

I don't even necessarily like to refer to this whole thing as "game." I guess yeah, "game" in the sense that you are consciously doing things that you hope will get you laid, but I don't think it's underhanded. Our fathers and their fathers, and their fathers before them were doing pretty much all the same things we are, except it was ingrained. It was innate. They didn't have to think about it, they just did it. Somewhere down the line, our gender got pussified, and women have taken full control of the dating world. The stuff that we use on them are, no surprise, classically masculine moves that women respond to on a subconscious, biological level.

Game just teaches you how to be masculine, how to be a dominant male in a world where it's becoming increasingly rare to be so.

Empowering women is kissing their ass all over social media, accepting the role of a friend despite you wanting more, doing things for them in the hopes that she'll take you out of the friend zone, etc -- that's what empowers women. Not game.

Post: #44

I am also not saying that it's not cool for you guys to life for the woman and worship her, if you do it out of your free will, from a free red pill mind, I might do that too if there isn't anything better out here. In my opinion though most men are just so caught up in all that conditioning and manipulation that they don't see how much they do for women without getting anything back. They think they do it for themselves but in the end it serves the women and the men turn miserable.

I might exagerate with the words like slaves and worship etc but it's real.

Quote:We were not slaves 20 years ago but we will be 20 years from now.

You sure? I think the ancient greeks might have had free or equal men. I don't think it's possible to compare our situation now to anything in the past, though.

So instead of focusing on 20 years ago or 20 years from now we should look at the now itself. How is our situation as men? Are we being exploited? Are we being played against each other? Who reaps the benefits?

Post: #45

Personally, I feel that in the last ten years I have been kissing women asses in America or as Roosh said, being a good clown. I didn't feel like that before then.

Post: #46

(05-05-2014 09:57 AM)Nomad77 Wrote:  Exactly, even if Game is about rigging the system, learning to manipulate women, the amount of time and effort required to effectively do so is already very high and only getting worse. As one of the guys I was helping said, this is like a second job. Then once he started becoming successful he realized it only took more energy and time because now he had to find the time and energy to fuck and spend time talking to and dating the women. He no longer had to time for his personal projects or his friends. Interestingly, he has since closed all of his dating accounts and dumped most of the women. And this is a good looking guy.

The point I keep trying to make with all of my posts is that the true cost of women in America is simply too high regardless of how you are getting them: game, money, or fame. And unless we FIRST collectively acknowledge this then we will do nothing to change it.

It isn't about rigging the system. And I disagree withyour original premise, because I believe nothing much has changed, as has been illustrated here earlier: a minority of the men(Alphas), are fucking the majority of the women. That will never change, I believe.

Game, so called 'red pill' thinking etc, is not rigging the system. My experience and understanding of it is that it is knowledge that helps males achieve their biological purpose with more ease by showing men how to operate within women's thinking, rather than expecting women to operate within men's thinking.

Societies used to operate in ways that were more conducive to men and women fucking(yes, I know it's a generalisation), but nowadays it's a little harder. Game is the Salmon swimming up the river of celibacy.

Post: #47

Isn't it possible to just look at this as the pressures of evolution?

There's definitely a bit of a contradiction in the manosphere. It goes something like this:

Women are hypergamous sluts--> therefore you need game --> discover RVF --> make self improvements --> become a better man

Wait, what was the problem again? Something just forced you to improve yourself.

I think one needs to distinguish between what is good/bad for oneself, and what is good/bad for civilization as a whole.

This probably deserves it's own thread, but I think the the real problem is masculinity shaming. Maybe one can consider that a subset of feminism; I'm not sure. But it sure seems that on a certain level heterosexual males are now made to feel ashamed of their own sexuality. Our feminized culture is so sick, it's now doing to regular guys what it used to do to gays.

Post: #48

That's a good analogy about gays and regular guys.

Post: #49

It really hit me after I read CH's article on "eye-fucking" and tried it. I felt so alive afterwards, and I realized there was a whole side to myself I had been heavily conditioned to be ashamed of, and had suppressed.

Post: #50

(06-07-2014 02:12 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  It really hit me after I read CH's article on "eye-fucking" and tried it. I felt so alive afterwards, and I realized there was a whole side to myself I had been heavily conditioned to be ashamed of, and had suppressed.

Link?