Post: #101

This idea of the deathbed conversion is just an extreme version of the general fetish of what one might call the "is that all there is?" moment.

An image that seems to be worshiped by a great many men is that of a man at the end (or sometimes in the midst) of an arc of a complex and successful enterprise suddenly stopping dead in his tracks and asking himself, "Is this really all there is? Is it / was it all really worth it"?

An example might be an athlete who has just won yet another championship ring; a businessman who has worked half his life to build a company and amass a fortune; a player who has devoted a good portion of his time to enjoying "empty" sex with a variety of desirable females.

At some moment, perhaps in the back of a limo or in his bedroom after yet another slut has left, he is supposed to suddenly be seized with this feeling -- the sacred "is this all there is" realization. It is almost universally taken to be the expression of some profound insight about life, a time in which, if only for an instant, the Truth stands revealed.

It is nothing of the sort. It is a moment of idiocy, weakness, thoughtlessness and ingratitude -- nothing more, nothing less. And it means nothing -- less than nothing.

Post: #102

(04-16-2014 02:44 PM)Cunnilinguist Wrote:  What exactly is a man of "real substance"?

This is one good example





and this is another

Post: #103

(04-15-2014 03:32 PM)cardguy Wrote:  @spokepoker - if you make it a fine bourbon then that pretty much sums me up.

I am not negative. I fucking love being single. I just thought it was an interesting fact about myself worth sharing.

My life is kick ass and I wish I could live to a be billion years old. There is so much shit I want to get done. But shit involving relationships with women is not a big part of how I frame my outlook on life.

No negativity here. No hamstering either. Just different values. Different people.

The only depression you see in my posts are those drummed into you by the blue pill brainwashing of the media about what constitutes happiness and a successful life :-)

Yeah, you sound just 100% happy with every major part of your life:

(04-15-2014 03:36 PM)cardguy Wrote:  I suppose humans are social animals. And the day I don't have to spend 8 hours a day trapped in an office with people - I may consider looking for other people to share my life with.

As it is - the part about being social with other people? I get my fill of that by about 10:30am most mornings.

For such a voracious reader and your stated interest in philosophy, I find it surprising that you'd use such poor logic. For most straight males, fucking a guy is more than just "unappealing."

(04-15-2014 04:17 PM)cardguy Wrote:  @Bill - no - I am not just going to try something that seems unappealing just for the hell of it. Sorry.

Why don't I try being gay as well - just to see what it is like? :-)

For as introvert/introspective as you claim to be, I think you should look a little further within yourself to see if you're truly what you claim.

Post: #104

(04-16-2014 02:53 PM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  This idea of the deathbed conversion is just an extreme version of the general fetish of what one might call the "is that all there is?" moment.

An image that seems to be worshiped by a great many men is that of a man at the end (or sometimes in the midst) of an arc of a complex and successful enterprise suddenly stopping dead in his tracks and asking himself, "Is this really all there is? Is it / was it all really worth it"?

An example might be an athlete who has just won yet another championship ring; a businessman who has worked half his life to build a company and amass a fortune; a player who has devoted a good portion of his time to enjoying "empty" sex with a variety of desirable females.

At some moment, perhaps in the back of a limo or in his bedroom after yet another slut has left, he is supposed to suddenly be seized with this feeling -- the sacred "is this all there is" realization. It is almost universally taken to be the expression of some profound insight about life, a time in which, if only for an instant, the Truth stands revealed.

It is nothing of the sort. It is a moment of idiocy, weakness, thoughtlessness and ingratitude -- nothing more, nothing less. And it means nothing -- less than nothing.

I do find such confessions of weakness and of existential dispair to be interesting cause it's from a guy who has seen both sides of the fence. Some emo loser spewing into his diary about how life is so hard because he got an infection from his new lip piercing is one thing but hearing such sentiments from someone who's had a chance to stand on the summit is quite interesting - and it seems to be a recurring thing with many successfuly, worldy men through out history. Even if it is to be dismissed as something unworthy of them it is at least worth studying why it has happened to so many men of great ability.

And if life is meant to be immersing oneself in the material world and learning from experiences then surely being on the edge of death is the ultimate experience - and it's the one experience that is unavoidable and brings low everyone from the most unworthy to the mighteist. Mentally avoiding it and paying it no heed does nothing to change that.

Post: #105

@ Icarus

I believing being immersed closely with the now is the greatest spirituality there is.

I was in the ocean at dawn today fighting choppy waters, watching seals and dolphins, and spending time with a good friend.

I felt more at one with the universe those moments than I ever will reading about old
men's thoughts that died long ago and treat introspection and musings like over indulging pornography.

I never fully believe I will live until next year. Starting to age has kept me grounded in mortality, a handful of years is nothing now when it used to be forever. I strive to be in the present.

Post: #106

@Aneroid ocean - lol - my life really is kick ass.

If you gave me a billion pounds - do you know what I would do tomorrow?

The exact same thing I was going to do anyway. Go out for a pizza, drink some bourbon, read some books and hang with my best buddy who is visiting for Easter.

That there is my perfect day - and luckily for me - it is affordable and pretty easy to achieve.

A wealthy guy can have anything he wants. A rich guy already has everything he wants.

I'm rich as fuck baby. And if you think that is weird - you should check out how Warren Buffett spends his average day as well. He says he spends most of the week playing online Bridge.

Post: #107

As for my boring office job. I love it. Every day I get paid to read books and shoot the breeze with people.

It is quite fun figuring out how to cram 20 minutes actual work into an 8 hour day.

Post: #108

Cardguy, you said in another thread ("Anyone got a belly that won't go away?" thread) that you were in the "hookers, titty bars and porn stage of my life now."

Yet you are only 32? Surely that's too young to give up and just go for P4P isn't it? Heck, I think most on here would agree that 32 would be heading towards your peak years.

What gives?

Post: #109

I dunno' - it was about 4 years ago that I 'found myself'. Until that point I thought I did want to do the whole marriage and kids thing.

But then I woke up and realised that is was a belief I had swallowed without ever questioning.

It is funny - when I was a kid I used to hate romantic plot lines in films - because they were so predictable and boring.

And I have never wanted girlfriend - except for a bout of oneitis I had at uni when I was 19.

So - whilst people may think I'm in denial now about my true wishes. The truth is that when I used to think differently I was actually in denial of how I truly felt. And it took me a lot of time and thinking to realise that.

So - that was back I was 28. I am 32 now. I am not 'giving up' - I have just chosen a different way. As such - my lifestyle now is more congruent with somebody who genuinely doesn't give a shit about impressing women - than it is with somebody who is trying his hardest to look good.

Post: #110

@Cardguy, how much international travel have you done?

Post: #111

(04-16-2014 03:16 PM)Wutang Wrote:  And if life is meant to be immersing oneself in the material world and learning from experiences then surely being on the edge of death is the ultimate experience - and it's the one experience that is unavoidable and brings low everyone from the most unworthy to the mighteist. Mentally avoiding it and paying it no heed does nothing to change that.

What does something being an "ultimate experience" even mean? It's an empty phrase. Being on the edge of death is "ultimate" only in the literal sense of being the last experience. It has no privileged status whatsoever.

To think that this experience is something of great importance is a literary idea in the corny tradition of "last words". People who live lives made mostly of words give far too much weight to this sort of linguistic sentimentality. Most last words and deathbed chatter are merely a species of nonsense, because the vital forces are usually long gone. So please stop and examine this wretched cliche.

Yes, dying is an unavoidable experience. So is taking a shit. The inevitability of an experience does not endow it with any special grandeur or significance.

Death brings no one "low". It simply ends a life. To say that it "brings low everyone" is mere rhetoric that serves to romanticize the event and exaggerate its meanings.

Most people rightly do not dwell on death since there is absolutely no reason to do so; they are not thereby "mentally avoiding it". The only people that "think" about death a great deal are goth girls and maybe a mortician on a good day. Memento mori (remember that you will die) is nothing more than an insipid literary conceit, the kind of bogus profundity trotted out by those who have nothing of substance or interest to offer. It is a favorite canard of charlatans and priests the world over. It need never detain a serious man who thinks for himself.

Post: #112

Personally I've been in many STRs (a few months long at most) but no LTR. Some of those girls called me their BF, but I don't think I've ever treated any of them as my GF. It's not because I'm some kind of super alpha, but they were young and always told me about their travelling or working overseas plans, and the moment I heard that (i.e I'm just an option to them, not a priority), I mentally put an expiry date on the relationship and emotionally checked out. Technically I've never introduced any of them to my parents (there was one who stalked my parents and introduced herself lol) and have never moved in with one, so I can claim to never have had a GF myself.

I know lots of guys around my age (31) or a bit younger who have never had a GF for various reasons. I don't think it's weird, if you consider that young women these days are not into any serious commitment. They'd rather waste no more youth and fertility on serious BFs or potential husbands as necessary.

I'm still old school deep down and would like to have a serious relationship with a young attractive feminine woman, but I live in Australia, such women don't really exist here. I've even tried looking for one at the churches, found none. All young women are raised to go for travels, studies, careers and avoid serious relationships at all costs, and I don't have the power to sway them against the tide of society. After a while, I rather enjoy living on my own with the occasional STR & flings. I can cook, clean and take care of myself much better than any woman I know, and I prefer male company much more, so other than sex (and partner dancing which is a hobby of mine), I really don't need women for anything.

Post: #113

(04-16-2014 06:03 PM)Steve9 Wrote:  @Cardguy, how much international travel have you done?

^^^
This is the key here. I grew up in England and it can run its course very quickly. There is a dearth of sunlight and a pessimistic vibe to the country that can seep in and become lodged over time. There is a depressing energy that can sweep many Brits and I felt it myself growing up there. Luckily, having been subjected to travel all my life from a wee tot, I knew life didn't begin and end with a piss up and noshing a vindaloo curry every Friday night.

Cardguy may need to travel and experience different cultures (from a non tourist perspective). This means no resorts.

90 plus percent of the time, people think life is bland and limited cos they have not been exposed.

Post: #114

(04-16-2014 11:03 PM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  Most people rightly do not dwell on death since there is absolutely no reason to do so

I completely disagree with you.

In my experience, most people think about death, at least indirectly. All religions emerge to alleviate the spiritual pain that comes with the realization that one's life is finite. Since everyone is religious in one way or another (non-theistic religions are still religions), then everyone is indeed concerned about death. Or, to rephrase it, everyone is concerned about the finiteness of life.

Steve Jobs used to say "death is the best invention of life" for a reason. Steve Jobs built a business empire because 1) he was extremely lucky, 2) he was extremely talented at motivating and manipulating other people. I would say that Apple engineers are the cathedral-builders of the 21st century. The way Steve Jobs created a cult out of consumer electronics and the way he "sacralized" technology will one day be a chapter in a book on late 20th century, early 21st century religion. Apple stores are modern temples.

Great leaders acquire power because power is given to them by the masses. Why does this happen? Because great leaders are able to remove spiritual pain from the masses. It's a trade: I give you power if you take away my spiritual pain. That is what people like Lenin, Hitler, and Gandhi did. They acquired power by giving meaning to people's finite lives.

Post: #115

(04-16-2014 03:42 PM)cardguy Wrote:  @Aneroid ocean - lol - my life really is kick ass.

If you gave me a billion pounds - do you know what I would do tomorrow?

The exact same thing I was going to do anyway.

Man...

Sure you may be "rich" because you enjoy what you're doing, but if you've never experienced anything more than that, how can you say that you wouldn't live a different life?

The idea of...

More money
More women
More travel
etc etc...

...appeals to most people. Could it be that you've become so comfortable within your life that you have "hamsterized" those ideas to be things which wouldn't add to your life?

Or perhaps you've tried - and failed - so you stick to something easy, like reading books all day?

Disclaimer: This isn't a dig in any way - food for thought. I enjoy your posts nonetheless.

Post: #116

(04-16-2014 03:44 PM)cardguy Wrote:  As for my boring office job. I love it. Every day I get paid to read books and shoot the breeze with people.

It is quite fun figuring out how to cram 20 minutes actual work into an 8 hour day.

How do you get away with reading books at work?

So you're saying that if you had a billion pounds in the bank you'd still go to work?

Post: #117

Great thread everyone.

My thoughts on the subject are that as men we should pursue whatever it is that we want with ease - that's it. If cardguy truly enjoys the life he lives, then he needs to live the fuck out of it and read all the books he wants.

On the flip side, I never wanted to be in a relationship. Ever. I thought it was terrible. Even before finding game I knew that my value was much more than the girls I was dating, and that I could have options. There was no reason for me to lock one girl up. If she didn't like it, she could leave. No one's making her stay around. However I am now in an LTR with a great girl, becuase I chose to be in this relationship. I screened her for a few months, she climbed the GF ladder, and now she's my main bitch.

I'm not in a relationship because...

...I'm scared she would leave.
...I was pressured to "man up."
...I didn't have options.

I'm in a relationship because I enjoy the time I spend with this girl and want to make it a permanent thing. ALSO (as CMQ mentioned earlier), she is respectful of the time I wish to spend by myself or with my friends. That's part of being a man - being able to pursue what you want unfettered, no matter what it is.

Post: #118

Let me answer some questions that were sent my way.

I haven't traveled much - since I don't enjoy it. Nevertheless here are the places I have been to in the past decade:

FRANCE, ITALY, POLAND, CZECH REPUBLIC, DENMARK, IRELAND, MALTA, GERMANY AND HOLLAND. I am surprised it is that many places since I hate going abroad. I would have Spain in there as well - but I manged to wiggle out of a stag weekend in Spain. For one of my best buddies as well - yikes!

How do I get away with reading books at work? I work in a small office which is in a secure area for the government. Nobody is allowed in that room apart from the people who work there - as such we can do what we want.

Is my life kick ass? Yes. If I was rich - what would I do differently? Quit my job. Does that mean I hate my job? Nope - I love my job. I just hate getting out of bed in the morning. The sound of my alarm clock is the most terrifying sound in the world to me.

GETTING UP IN THE MORNING IS THE ONLY THING I HATE ABOUT MY LIFE.

I love my job - because I get to read books all day. Which means - I would still quit my job if I could since it is more fun reading books at home than at work - what with the bourbon I have in my house and so on.

Only very smart people come to be very rich. And those people tend not to blow money on crazy excessive lifestyles - since the best things in life are pretty much free. If you are smart enough to spot them.

I calculated how much money you - in effect - earn by simply being smart. Check out my calculations here:

/thread-34799-...#pid694968

As for the type of people who become rich and blow all their money on drugs, travel, champagne and hookers. They tend to be people who are not smart - but instead people who inherited their money - or won the lottery.

And besides - most of the above are pretty cheap these days - the world has flattened out. What was once the preserve of the rich - is now available to most people quite cheaply these days.

As for the idea - that all the above is some rationalisation on my half to hide how unhappy I am? That is an impossible question to answer since you will say I am lying either way.

Anyway - I am the world's leading expert in my chosen field (magic - I have studied about 10,000 books in this field) - so I am very happy with my progress in life. In fact I have been a bit sad recently - since I met the goals I was aiming for at 30 - that I hoped to reach when I was perhaps 60 or 70.

So - the above is all true - and I just wanted to lay down that fact in the clearest of terms since it is unfair for people to label people such as myself with different values and goals as being secretly unhappy when in fact I am the happiest and most content person I have ever met.

If you opened your mind - you could probably learn a thing or two about real happiness from some of the things I have written on here.

Anyway - no hate intended. I am on this forum just like the rest of you to share interesting information and learn from other guys. It is not a competition - and if it is. It is one in which we are all on the same side.

Post: #119

Have been to Sweden as well. I knew I had forgotten one other country!

Post: #120

(04-17-2014 11:36 AM)cardguy Wrote:  Let me answer some questions that were sent my way.

I haven't traveled much - since I don't enjoy it. Nevertheless here are the places I have been to in the past decade:

FRANCE, ITALY, POLAND, CZECH REPUBLIC, DENMARK, IRELAND, MALTA, GERMANY AND HOLLAND.

Cardguy, I would say youve traveled a shit ton, compared to the majority of the world's population. That's not a bad list at all.

Post: #121

Cardguy, so if you had 6 month to live you would stay at home at read all the time? if so you are really in a zen mode.

Post: #122

Yeah - I would. I would keep posting on here too. I don't take life too seriously.

I think most people are concerned about appearing to have fun (and be cool) than actually having fun.

This one of my hobby horses. People who live their life just so it will look good on Facebook.

Fuck that shit.

/thread-21040-...#pid438468

Post: #123

(04-16-2014 11:03 PM)The Lizard of Oz Wrote:  

(04-16-2014 03:16 PM)Wutang Wrote:  And if life is meant to be immersing oneself in the material world and learning from experiences then surely being on the edge of death is the ultimate experience - and it's the one experience that is unavoidable and brings low everyone from the most unworthy to the mighteist. Mentally avoiding it and paying it no heed does nothing to change that.

What does something being an "ultimate experience" even mean? It's an empty phrase. Being on the edge of death is "ultimate" only in the literal sense of being the last experience. It has no privileged status whatsoever.

To think that this experience is something of great importance is a literary idea in the corny tradition of "last words". People who live lives made mostly of words give far too much weight to this sort of linguistic sentimentality. Most last words and deathbed chatter are merely a species of nonsense, because the vital forces are usually long gone. So please stop and examine this wretched cliche.

Yes, dying is an unavoidable experience. So is taking a shit. The inevitability of an experience does not endow it with any special grandeur or significance.

Death brings no one "low". It simply ends a life. To say that it "brings low everyone" is mere rhetoric that serves to romanticize the event and exaggerate its meanings.

Most people rightly do not dwell on death since there is absolutely no reason to do so; they are not thereby "mentally avoiding it". The only people that "think" about death a great deal are goth girls and maybe a mortician on a good day. Memento mori (remember that you will die) is nothing more than an insipid literary conceit, the kind of bogus profundity trotted out by those who have nothing of substance or interest to offer. It is a favorite canard of charlatans and priests the world over. It need never detain a serious man who thinks for himself.

I think the fact that it's the LAST experience you'll ever have does indeed make it signficant - it's what make it unique compared to every other experience, with being born perhaps the only other one that can comapre.

I remember you previously mentioning that the laments of someone who is in their last days or otherwise weakened mentally or spirtually is something not worth looking at simply because it's from someone who is weak. Conversely, you could say that the words of someone who is currently at the pinncale of success is not worth listening to since it's bred out of someone going through fair weather conditions that will pass inevitiably - kind of like listening to a hot chick in her early 20s at the height of her feminine powers reasoning about life - a view that most people here would say is completely out of touch of what actually goes on in life. Now, I actually don't think that but I do think it's good to listen to people on both sides of the fence (a better mental imagery might be that of someone on top of the hill and someone at the bottom) in order to understand the full range of human experience - that's all I'm really saying is that all parts of life are worth studying, not just the moments of triumph.

And yes I do realize that lamenting over life and death is one of the biggest cliches found in all forms of art from all cultures that have ever existed but remember that things become cliches precisely because there is a grain of truth in them and because they relate to human experience. A million songs and poems about love and sex hasn't yet gotten people sick of hearing songs and poems about love and sex.

Post: #124

(04-17-2014 04:13 PM)Wutang Wrote:  I think the fact that it's the LAST experience you'll ever have does indeed make it significant - it's what make it unique compared to every other experience, with being born perhaps the only other one that can compare.

A passage from Ernst Jünger's Eumeswil:

Quote:At times I see them as if I were walking through the streets of Pompeii before the eruption of Vesuvius. This is one of the historian’s delights and, even more, his sorrow. If we see someone doing something for the last time, even just eating a piece of bread, this activity becomes wondrously profound. We participate in the transmutation of the ephemeral into the sacramental. We have inklings of eras during which such a sight was an everyday occurrence.

Post: #125

This thread has made me see that the one thing cardguy needs in his life IS a wild, crazy girlfriend who he falls madly in love with who can actually show him there's a whole lot more to life than what his existence now. Ironic how he thinks thats the one thing he does NOT need.