Post: #1

This ought to make heads explode:

Quote:Step Up in the Club

A new movement tries to enlist bartenders and bouncers to protect women from sexual aggression.

By Jake Blumgart

Anyone who frequents bars or clubs is familiar with the wide variety of creeps who inflict themselves upon the female population. The guy who tries to grind up on every woman on the dance floor; the cocky, insistent jerk who won’t stop coming over, no matter how uninterested—or scared—the women he’s approaching are; the man who sidles up to the drunkest girl in the room.

The bartender and the bouncer notice these guys too. “That’s a normal day at work,” my friend Candace, a bartender in Philadelphia, told me. When Candace sees a guy talking intensely in a female customer’s ear, she’ll often ask the woman whether she’s OK, and if she’s not, Candace will order the guy to scoot down the bar and find himself another stool. Feminist activists across the country are trying to ensure that more bars have someone like Candace serving the shots. While universities are attempting to promote the idea of “bystander intervention”—that is, the notion that the best hope of curbing campus sexual assault is to convince peers to look out for each other at parties, in the dorms, and in bars—a growing number of activists are focused on enlisting bartenders and bouncers to take some responsibility for protecting their customers.

And their customers need it. A recent study, “ ‘Blurred Lines?’ Sexual Aggression and Barroom Culture,” found that the drunkenness of the target (usually a woman), not the perpetrator, heightens the persistence and invasiveness of harassing behavior, and that “staff are unlikely to act as guardians because sexual harassment and sexism are integral to bar culture.”

Apart from the actual aggression itself, “the biggest problem with sexual aggression is that nobody intervenes,” says Dr. Kathryn Graham, one of the lead researchers behind the study. “We saw lots of instances where the bar staff could see it, but they just didn’t think it was anything for them to intervene in. We saw women complaining to bar staff and they still didn’t do anything.”

In response to this dynamic, several programs have cropped up to train bar and club employees on how to step in. Longtime activists Lauren Taylor and Zosia Sztykowski recently formed the Safe Bars program in Washington, D.C. Just as bartenders are taught to identify customers who have had too much to drink and shouldn’t be allowed to drive, Safe Bars hopes to get bouncers and bartenders to recognize creepers and step in to prevent sexual aggression. During a recent training session, they asked the assembled bouncers to think back on all the sexually inappropriate behaviors they have seen in bars and clubs—the bouncers recalled seeing guys pin women against the wall in dark corners and were very familiar with the man who tries to get his female companion drunk without drinking much himself.

Taylor and Sztykowski then placed the staffers’ scenarios in context, explaining to the bouncers that these aren’t just one-off incidents, but part of a culture in which a staggeringly high proportion of women have been sexually assaulted. They talked about the age of greatest vulnerability, and the role of alcohol in these attacks. Their goal is to make sure that the bar staffers walk away understanding that something is deeply wrong in America’s drinking culture—too many assume that a woman in a bar is open to the advances of the jerks around her—and that it’s their responsibility to create a safe space at work.

As for the interventions themselves, “It’s pretty simple, straightforward stuff,” says Taylor. Stuff like asking the woman whether she’s OK, and offering her assistance if it looks like she needs it; talking to the guy and telling him that his behavior isn’t cool, distracting him with conversation, pressuring his friends to get him out of there, or kicking him out. “It’s just hard to do, for a lot of people, but what you actually need to say or do is not rocket science,” Taylor says.

The importance of staff to general bar safety has been pretty definitively established. Before the “ ‘Blurred Lines?’ ” study, Graham led a study on all types of barroom violence, which concluded by highlighting the “important role of staff in controlling aggression and preventing escalation to more severe and injurious forms of aggression.” Another Graham study found that a lax environment greatly enhances the threat of violence. “Although the aggressive-prone patron might arrive with no specific aggressive act planned,” she wrote, “the permissive environment might stimulate him or her to act on the opportunity for aggression if one arises.”

The Boston Area Rape Crisis Center, or BARCC, was one of the first organizations to champion staff-level training to combat sexual aggression. “We developed this training program, which is aimed at setting up an environment that decreases the support for sexually aggressive or sexually abusive behavior,” says Gina Scaramella, executive director of BARCC. “We explain acquaintance sexual assault and what’s going on with alcohol. When you present the data to people who are really experienced they say, oh, yeah, I’ve seen that happening. But until you give people a way of doing something, it’s hard for them to think about how they would intervene.”

“I was certainly aware of the issue, but it was pointed out to me in much clearer terms in the training that we got,” says Lee Zazofsky, owner of the Paradise Rock Club and several other venues in Boston.

BARCC gets a lot of community feedback about problem establishments too, often the same businesses again and again where women report being harassed and assaulted. But the trainings are voluntary, so only conscientious owners and managers sign up. Those who need the trainings the most are the least likely to get it.

Plenty of bartenders, like Candace, combat the overwhelming tide of barroom horribleness without training. My friend Meredith, who bartends in North Carolina, puts napkins over the drinks of women who go to the bathroom, pours fake shots for those who are being pressured into drinking heavily, and sometimes has the barback drive women home. But victim-blaming runs deep in America, and enough bartenders and bouncers refrain from intervening that a few of my other female friends were surprised by the very topic of this article. They had never even thought of the bartender as a potential ally.

Post: #2

Soon there will be undercover cops formerly from prostitution stings working in bars on sexual harrassment dragnets.

Post: #3

Girls' Bar Rule #342: If the guy is a creep, it's harassment. If he's charismatic and attractive, it's flirting.

Shit, gonna tweet that.

Post: #4

Will the staff also be stepping in to prevent gullible betas from buying drinks for women who are clearly not interested in them beyond their wallet?

Post: #5

Typical.

Bars are places where people go to find sex and make bad decisions. Rather than not be whores who spend all their nights in bars, women aim to change the nature of bars themselves.

Then when guys are forced to act prudish in a fucking saloon, women will go around bitching about men not hitting on them.

Maybe the feminist sickness is just another one of a society's ways of cannibalizing itself for population control

(04-02-2014 08:19 PM)Van Zan Wrote:  Will the staff also be stepping in to prevent gullible betas from buying drinks for women who are clearly not interested in them beyond their wallet?

And when fat wildabeasts seduce drunk guys who wouldn't buy them a mcdonald's cheeseburger if they were sober?

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #6

What's funny about these sort of things is they're blatantly demonstrating the truism that women aren't adults, can't take care of themselves, and are unfit to be held responsible for their actions. The sane, logical response to this fact is to restrict female behavior and to make a man (husband, father, etc.) partially or fully responsible for her. Nearly every functional society in history has done some variation of this. Our decadent, dysfunctional society instead wants to turn the whole world into a giant supervised "play date" in which women can do virtually anything short of serious crimes without consequences or judgement.

Post: #7

Damn! I'm going to need a new trick! Pulling a girl in and "whispering" in her ear was somewhat my go-to move. Although the only bars I've been in were ones where there are no bouncers

Post: #8

What's going to happen is that bartenders and their lackeys are going to mistake kidding around for "harassing" and piss everyone off. These people are often megalomaniacs and will become the real problem.

This happened to me and some buddies.

Me and two friends were out with two girls we knew when we were in college. One of the guys and I used to do these ridiculous imitations of some girls all of us knew (you had to be there). We liked to push these impressions well past the breaking point, so as we kept on doing our impressions, the girls we were with kept saying "Stop!! Stop!! You guys are terrible!!!"

Well, this meathead (bouncer?) overheard them and didn't understand the context or know we were all friends. So he starts chest-thumping to the girls: "Are these guys giving you a hard time?" Everyone was like "WTF? We're all friends from college." We even thought he might have been kidding. He wasn't and stood there like a macho asshole.

So we left. And we were really angry. We never went back -- and we were sure to tell everyone on campus never to go.

And what was the reason we gave everyone? "Don't go because the staff harasses you."

Post: #9

This is a conspiracy by Silicon Valley nerds to make sure the only way anyone meets each other anymore is through NSA approved apps.

Post: #10

Quote:Apart from the actual aggression itself, “the biggest problem with sexual aggression is that nobody intervenes,” says Dr. Kathryn Graham, one of the lead researchers behind the study. “We saw lots of instances where the bar staff could see it, but they just didn’t think it was anything for them to intervene in. We saw women complaining to bar staff and they still didn’t do anything.”

A picture of Kathryn Graham:



WNB.


You have to ask yourself, what is her motivation? What deep seated psychological scares are driving this women's activism? Why is she so against men approaching pretty women? Why is she choosing this for her life's work?

Post: #11

Any bar or club that starts a policy like this will be shuttering it's doors quite quickly.

Women BARELY if AT ALL spend money out.

You know who buys the $10,000 tables and shots at the bar? Men.

Good luck with this policy.

Post: #12

^^^^
Yuck. I don't want to ask or know anything about this man-cunt.

Also, will this carry over to gay bars? If the bigger homo is pestering the littler homo will someone intervene?

Post: #13

(04-02-2014 08:39 PM)Christian McQueen Wrote:  Any bar or club that starts a policy like this will be shuttering it's doors quite quickly.

Women BARELY if AT ALL spend money out.

You know who buys the $10,000 tables and shots at the bar? Men.

Good luck with this policy.

QUOTED FOR TRUTH!

Post: #14

(04-02-2014 07:30 PM)Dusty Wrote:  This ought to make heads explode:

The bouncers recalled seeing guys pin women against the wall in dark corners and were very familiar with the man who tries to get his female companion drunk without drinking much himself.

THATS ME the difference being I don’t have to try to get girls drunk. They do that themselves with encouragement from their girl friends. If anything I tell them to relax a bit on the drinking least they end up vomiting latter on...

Post: #15

(04-02-2014 08:39 PM)Christian McQueen Wrote:  Any bar or club that starts a policy like this will be shuttering it's doors quite quickly.

Women BARELY if AT ALL spend money out.

You know who buys the $10,000 tables and shots at the bar? Men.

Good luck with this policy.

Last weekend this girl got pissed off and kicked four girls out of our section. She just stood up and yelled `if you are going to be in here drinking these guys booze at least act like you are going to put out instead of sitting there texting all night!`

Post: #16

^ Bravo. I would shake that girl's hand.

Or try to bang her.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #17

It's like I've been preaching all along: Until white knighting becomes this dangerous, it won't stop and, in fact, proliferate.

   

Post: #18

It sounds like it is a movement and not a law, but fuck that is a lot of responsibility to put on a person who is busting his ass working a job to then have to do creep control.

I wonder if there would be any legal nonsense, some victim basic bitch sues a bar because some guy creeped on her.

This is the problem when people are not productive, they just start making up nonsense.

Post: #19

@Tuthmosis ^^^

I've always thought the same thing and have said so repeatedly. The shaming needs to be focused on simps and manginas, who are the catalysts and enablers of what we might call the "feminist occupying regime". Shaming sluts does little good if the mentality enabling them is allowed to persist.

Any system of power and control relies on minions, servants, informers, drones, spies, and worker-bees to carry out its purposes. The system thrives on rats and sellouts. We need to look at these white knights, manginas, and simps as basically snitches and informers. They'll stab you in the back in the blink of an eye, no questions asked.

They need to know the meaning of shame, ridicule, and marginalization. They need to know that their behavior will bring scorn and true, negative consequences. Until then, nothing will change.

Post: #20

(04-02-2014 09:42 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  @Tuthmosis ^^^

I've always thought the same thing and have said so repeatedly. The shaming needs to be focused on simps and manginas, who are the catalysts and enablers of what we might call the "feminist occupying regime". Shaming sluts does little good if the mentality enabling them is allowed to persist.

Any system of power and control relies on minions, servants, informers, drones, spies, and worker-bees to carry out its purposes. The system thrives on rats and sellouts. We need to look at these white knights, manginas, and simps as basically snitches and informers. They'll stab you in the back in the blink of an eye, no questions asked.

They need to know the meaning of shame, ridicule, and marginalization. They need to know that their behavior will bring scorn and true, negative consequences. Until then, nothing will change.

This reminds me of a quote from the book shantaram:

Quote:"The world is being run by one million evil men, ten million stupid men, and a hundred million cowards.

The evil men are the power - the rich men, and the politicians, and the fanatics of religion - whose decisions rule the world, and set it on its course of greed and destruction. There are only one million of them, the truly evil men, in the whole world. The very rich and the very powerful, whose decisions really count.

The stupid men, who number ten million, are the soldiers and the policemen who enforce the rule of the evil men. They are the standing armies of twelve key countries, and the police forces of those and twenty more. In total, there are only ten million of them with any real power or consequence. They are often brave, but they are stupid, too, because they give their lives for governments and causes that use their flesh and blood as mere chess pieces. Those governments always betray them or let them down or abandon them, in the long run. Nations neglect no men more shamefully than the heroes of their wars.

And the hundred million cowards, they are the bureaucrats and paper shufflers and pen-pushers who permit the rule of the evil men, and look the other way. They are the head of this department, and the secretary of that committee, and the president of that association. They are managers, and officials, and mayors, and officers of the court. They always defend themselves by saying that they are just following orders, or just doing their job, and it's nothing personal, and if they don't do it, someone else surely will. They are the hundred million cowards who know what is going on, but say nothing, while they sign the paper that puts one man before the firing squad, or condemns one million men to the slower death of a famine.

The world is run by one million evil men, ten million stupid men, and a hundred million cowards. The rest of us, all six billion of us, do pretty much what we are told!

This formula - the one million, the ten million, the hundred million - this is the real truth of all politics. Marx was wrong. It is not a question of classes, because all the classes are in the hands of this tiny few. This set of numbers is the cause of empire and rebellion. This is the formula that has generated our civilisations for the last ten thousand years. This built the pyramids. This launched the crusades. This put the world at war, and this formula has the power to impose the peace."

Post: #21

Women Ruin Everything: Season 2014 Episode 49

(04-02-2014 08:24 PM)L M McCoy Wrote:  Damn! I'm going to need a new trick! Pulling a girl in and "whispering" in her ear was somewhat my go-to move.

That's my only move. Every bar here plays too fucking loud music, we can't hear shit if we don't get close and talk into each other's ears.

Post: #22

The guy who wrote the article:

Post: #23

(04-02-2014 09:42 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  Any system of power and control relies on minions, servants, informers, drones, spies, and worker-bees to carry out its purposes. The system thrives on rats and sellouts. We need to look at these white knights, manginas, and simps as basically snitches and informers.

So true.

You have this beast sitting in her faculty chair in London Ontario cock-blocking across bars and nightclubs throughout North America through a network of useful idiots.



All because she's pissed off and psychologically damaged by being born ugly, and no guy ever hit on her or looked at her with admiration, so she's going to ruin it for everyone else - all with the help of useful idiots.

Post: #24

(04-02-2014 09:58 PM)Roosh Wrote:  The guy who wrote the article:

Post: #25