Post: #26

Just my humble opinion, but people getting sick have bad/weak/compromised immune systems - which is 80% the state of your gut health and bacteria composition. You can have the healthiest diet in the world, but if your gut bacteria is all screwed up from antibiotics or other medications, you're still going to have a compromised immune system and poor health.

In most cases, you just need to heal your gut. Go check out the links I provided to the Free the Animal blog regarding Resistant Starch.

Also check out the fermented foods and bone broth threads here.

Bone Broths full of gelatin, collagen, and other substances help heal compromised gut linings, naturally fermented vegetables provides beneficial bacteria, and resistant starch feeds those beneficial bacterias.

Post: #27

For those who claim the paleo diet is a fad diet…go to a natural history museum and look at what humans ate. They started with the fattiest and most nutrient-dense parts of meat they could find--marrow, organ meats, and fat-dense parts. Lean parts such as breasts were junk meat.

Think about what you crave--delicious, melt in your mouth marbled red meat. High fat, high protein. I don't EVER crave a big spinach salad sprinkled with low-fat dressing and some chopped up vegetables (although I eat asparagus cooked in bacon fat as an accessory to my steak). If we craved the OPPOSITE of what is actually healthy for us, we would be the sole species on earth that is true for. Can you imagine our genes saying "vegetables are healthy for you, but you should eat meat", and have to self-control for that? Cats get fat from grain-heavy diets and thrive on meat-heavy diets. Dogs too. I'm not saying our diets should be similar to cats or dogs, I'm just saying if you switch a dog from the crap that you find in the grocery store to a high-quality meat-based food, you will notice a huge difference in energy levels, health, etc--just like humans.

Guys, do a little more research before you call paleo a fad diet. Diet is like religion for a lot of people (maybe even worse in terms of zealotry)--they've grown up with it a certain way and don't believe it should be any other way. I would hate to see guys on this board posting topics about how they can't get big on a diet consisting of protein shakes, vegetables, and soy.

Post: #28

(03-06-2014 10:36 PM)apoclater Wrote:  Guys, do a little more research before you call paleo a fad diet. Diet is like religion for a lot of people (maybe even worse in terms of zealotry)--they've grown up with it a certain way and don't believe it should be any other way. I would hate to see guys on this board posting topics about how they can't get big on a diet consisting of protein shakes, vegetables, and soy.

The funny thing is you are also suffering from the same kind of zealotry. One can argue that grains and carbs from the agricultural revolution is what really allowed civilization to take off. Without the energy from sources of wheat, rice, corn, potatoes etc, many civilizations would have failed to thrive. You can't have huge populations relying on hunter/gatherer tactics to support massive cities. This high fat, high protein diet is prevalent among the eskimos, a short, hypothyroid, infertile small people living in the arctic. It's hard to conclude what is actually optimal....but it is proven that humans can live off a variety of different diets.

From my time studying nutrition and diet the only thing that has really made sense is to get nutrition from a variety of different sources and to find out how many food calories you need to fuel you. Eat what you crave, not too much, not too little. My 2 cents.

Post: #29

Quote:One can argue that grains and carbs from the agricultural revolution is what really allowed civilization to take off. Without the energy from sources of wheat, rice, corn, potatoes etc, many civilizations would have failed to thrive.

Those are the food sources of the betas in civilizations. Thriving betas enabled civilizations.

The alphas (royalties, warriors etc.) didn't eat much of those. They ate the best foods the tribe / kingdom had to offer.

Post: #30

Two Identical Twins Go on Diets

One goes low fat high carb, the other goes high fat low carb.

Both were miserable. However high carb diet beat out the other in mental and physical performance.

Only a study of one case, but gives one something to think about.

Post: #31

(03-06-2014 11:12 PM)NFallin Wrote:  Two Identical Twins Go on Diets

One goes low fat high carb, the other goes high fat low carb.

Both were miserable. However high carb diet beat out the other in mental and physical performance.

Only a study of one case, but gives one something to think about.

It's useless, you can't get a proper assessment without providing a detailed macros/micros/fibre/total calories/food choice/daily activities/sleep pattern/previous fitness and mental ability under calorie deficit report.

Post: #32

The point is getting people to question the restriction/exclusion of certain maconutrients, or certain type of foods. Obsessing over what is and what isn't optimal nutrition, is energy better spent elsewhere.

Post: #33

(03-07-2014 12:03 AM)NFallin Wrote:  The point is getting people to question the restriction/exclusion of certain maconutrients, or certain type of foods. Obsessing over what is and what isn't optimal nutrition, is energy better spent elsewhere.

What's wrong with the pursuit of peak health?

The problem here is not created by the restriction or exclusion of macros and foods, the problem is not following the instructions properly. A good paleo diet has precise macro guidelines that work very well for people that actually follow it.

Primal Blueprint for example, .7g-1g of protein per lb of lean body mass, 100-150g of carbs, fat making up the remainder maintenance calories. Different guidelines are given for gaining and losing weight.

The problems show up when you try any effective diet or training routine without actually following its guidelines. It's like when skinny guys complain about eating a lot and not being able to gain weight or the overweight saying they don't eat a lot and still can't lose weight.

The answer is simple, track precisely what you're doing, compare it with the actual guidelines and you'll see where the problem is, that's the only want to make calculated adjustments. The obsessive fiddling only comes up when you try to play it by ear when you haven't fully grasped the system.

Post: #34

You know, this paleo nonsense needs to be put to rest.

Could it have been that high carb diets are what brought us out from being grunters and animals to the humans we see today? Maybe a diet that is well rounded in all of the proteins, carbs, vitamins, minerals, etc you can get is the most optimum.

Humans used to eat insects too. With the exception of guys in SEA, are you paleohacks going to start doing that as well?

Post: #35

(03-07-2014 12:44 PM)frenchie Wrote:  You know, this paleo nonsense needs to be put to rest.

Could it have been that high carb diets are what brought us out from being grunters and animals to the humans we see today? Maybe a diet that is well rounded in all of the proteins, carbs, vitamins, minerals, etc you can get is the most optimum.

Humans used to eat insects too. With the exception of guys in SEA, are you paleohacks going to start doing that as well?

There is a lot of hype about insects being the food of the future as we continue to think of ways to sustain the growth of the human population.

I would also agree that carbohydrates like wheat allowed a boom of human growth... to be able to sustain 7 billion people.

But when you look at the individual... a high fat/moderate protein diet is optimum.

Post: #36

(03-06-2014 10:36 PM)apoclater Wrote:  For those who claim the paleo diet is a fad diet…go to a natural history museum and look at what humans ate. They started with the fattiest and most nutrient-dense parts of meat they could find--marrow, organ meats, and fat-dense parts. Lean parts such as breasts were junk meat.

Think about what you crave--delicious, melt in your mouth marbled red meat. High fat, high protein. I don't EVER crave a big spinach salad sprinkled with low-fat dressing and some chopped up vegetables (although I eat asparagus cooked in bacon fat as an accessory to my steak). If we craved the OPPOSITE of what is actually healthy for us, we would be the sole species on earth that is true for. Can you imagine our genes saying "vegetables are healthy for you, but you should eat meat", and have to self-control for that? Cats get fat from grain-heavy diets and thrive on meat-heavy diets. Dogs too. I'm not saying our diets should be similar to cats or dogs, I'm just saying if you switch a dog from the crap that you find in the grocery store to a high-quality meat-based food, you will notice a huge difference in energy levels, health, etc--just like humans.

Guys, do a little more research before you call paleo a fad diet. Diet is like religion for a lot of people (maybe even worse in terms of zealotry)--they've grown up with it a certain way and don't believe it should be any other way. I would hate to see guys on this board posting topics about how they can't get big on a diet consisting of protein shakes, vegetables, and soy.

Go skin and prep a Bison and report back on how great your Paleo is....

It's all cute and nice when you can drive to the grocery store and buy a bag of chicken breast and some steaks.

Humans quickly ditched the Paleo style diet when they figured out they could use their brains to figure out complex growing systems that would give then more calories for less work. Agriculture was born and you had a surge of human population as a result. After that time little animals such as chickens, fish, lambs, goats, rabbits, ducks, pigs*, etc were all favorited for to ease of taking care of them.

Humans always take the path of least resistance. Our we lazy? I wouldn't say that, but we are just more efficient. We would of never ditched Paleo for agriculture if Paleo gave more benefits (of calories) and was easier.

Humans have more in common with horses then dogs or cats. Dogs an cats are carnivores and if you look at their teeth, they are designed to rip flesh. They exert less energy to attain energy from meat because they can easily rip and break it down themselves. A human meanwhile only has 4 carnivore tearing teeth, while we have at least 16 flat crushers for crushing down grains and ruffage, are teeth look more like horses versus a cougar. If we were designed to eat meat in high amounts are teeth would of evolved to reflect that instead of us ester ting large amounts of energy just to derive the calories from our meat through labour and prep.

It's still less work to grind grains into flour.. By hand.. With a mill then it is to skin, dress, and prep large animal flesh. Think of why we loved fishing.. A fish can be scaled and gutted in as little as 20 minutes, you can grill it in the same amount of time and eat it. It was easy to preserve and close to the flat lying area near water where humans lived.

Paleo is a fad.

Post: #37

(03-07-2014 01:23 PM)kosko Wrote:  Go skin and prep a Bison and report back on how great your Paleo is....

No one on a Paleo diet is saying you have to hunt and kill animals...

Quote:Humans always take the path of least resistance. Our we lazy? I wouldn't say that, but we are just more efficient. We would of never ditched Paleo for agriculture if Paleo gave more benefits (of calories) and was easier.

Paleo isn't easier... grains and other ruffage is easier. But grains (and the knowledge of making bread) wasn't around when the body adapted to a more "paleo" way of living... I think the earliest existence is around Egpytian times.

Quote:Humans have more in common with horses then dogs or cats. Dogs an cats are carnivores and if you look at their teeth, they are designed to rip flesh. They exert less energy to attain energy from meat because they can easily rip and break it down themselves. A human meanwhile only has 4 carnivore tearing teeth, while we have at least 16 flat crushers for crushing down grains and ruffage, are teeth look more like horses versus a cougar. If we were designed to eat meat in high amounts are teeth would of evolved to reflect that instead of us ester ting large amounts of energy just to derive the calories from our meat through labour and prep.

We also have hands... with opposable thumbs. Dogs and cats need to tear their food apart with their teeth... whereas we have more "tools."

Post: #38

Do you get grass fed beef and free range pasture chicken and eggs? How about wild fish?

Are you eating lots of root vegetables? How about garlic and onions?

'Paleo' isn't for everyone but what is beneficial to most is not consuming processed dairy, sugar and processed flours.

Don't be afraid to eat white rice. Or high quality corn tortillas as a carb source.

Don't be afraid to eat an apple a day or some grapes either.

Very strict low card paleo is more for obese people who really need to lose the weight and or fighters trying to make weight.

Everybody is different too.

You can go to 23andme.com get your DNA results and plug them in gene genie and it can give you a better idea of what foods are right for you.

Vitamin c crystals (absorbic acid) and vitamin d drops (I take about 10,000 iu a day) can also work wonders for keeping your Immune system strong.

You don't have to go meat crazy on paleo. You can easily maintain one clean sourced meat meal a day and still see good results.

Try incorporating a raw spinach salad with fresh garlic too. Stuff like that.

Green tea as well.

I actually stopped getting sick on paleo. Where as when I ate dairy and bread I would get colds and sore throats a lot.

Post: #39

The problem with paleo is people in different regions consumed different foods. No one group ate the same things. We are all different. While Eskimos thrived on raw fish and fat, people in the Caribbean thrived on roots and fruits only eating wild game once in a while or when they were fortunate enough to get a kill. Where is your blood from? How do you feel after you eat certain foods? Take a log 30 minutes after, an hour after, two hours after and so on.

Post: #40

Fad/not a fad, whether or not humans are designed to eat a certain food group based on our teeth/digestive structures are all irrelevant.

Basically all of modern whole foods have been selectively bred to be the way they are right now, barely resembling what they were originally. Their rate of evolution has been manipulated and massively accelerated by humans. On the other hand, human evolution stood still in comparison during that time frame.

Diets are just a means to an end, if it delivers a specific result you want, go for it. It will work well as long as the macro/micro/fibre/food choice/calorie intake:activity level are within reasonable ranges, the rest is just about preference.