Post: #1

I'm east asian and I come from a relatively conservative family. (No sex out of LTRs). I've started learning about game this year. There have been quite a few opportunities to have sex with a woman but each time, each time, half way to one of our apartments (or something equivalent), I backed out. Here I list them half of them out (not many by your standards):

- Once I invited a girl to my apartment, she asked me to be her boyfriend. I don't know why but there was an instinctual fear. I didn't want to be in a relationship (with her). I stopped replying to her for a week. Next week when I texted her again she was gone.

- Once taking 2 girls to their apartment after chatting them up on the bus (on a very late night, looked like they were out but couldn't pick a guy up, I'd have to do). I figured out they were obvious sluts (though hot), when one said "How many girls have you been with? 50?"... One was intoxicated, the other one started talking about relationships... I stopped wanting to fuck them. Had to wake up in 3 hours so I left them.

- Once I picked up a girl at a party. I had a few drinks, she was sober. We were going to her apartment. Things were getting a bit heavy. My drink started to wear off and started asking myself "I just want to fuck her once and forget about her" and started feeling guilty, and left... The look on her face... On the way home I felt guilty anyway. She texted me saying a bunch of stuff, and that she was a busy woman, but what it really meant was she felt I wasted her time, and I did.

- There was my barista who gives me lots of IOIs but I've never made a move - I didn't want to ruin my barista-customer relationship; I like having her make my coffee.

- There was my uncle's friend's cousin. I can tell she might not have minded just sex but I was worried about the consequences of having my family social circle learning about it, which is quite conservative...

I'm hung up on something and I don't know how to get over it. How did you first do it? How should I approach things?

Post: #2

You obviously have a desire to bang these chicks, I think you're frightened to make a decisive move.

You've got to accept that you ultimately do want to get laid, and you're not going to do that unless you just go for it. And don't feel bad about banging some chick without an intention to make a relationship, chicks who bang you quickly know what they're doing. A lot of bitches just wanna fuck anyhow.

Realize that the feelings of regret for not making a move are much worse and long-lasting than those you'll feel if a girl rebuffs your advances.

Post: #3

Dick goes in vagina.

Fear is the mind killer.

I say never be complete, I say stop being perfect, let...let's evolve, let the chips fall where they may.

Where women embrace gossip and conversation, men embrace action and philosophy.

This is Sparta.

I'd rather die living than live dying.

Post: #4

are you a Virgin? not confident in your ability to perform? insecure about penis size?

doesn't sound like the conservative family thing is what's bothering you.. if it's the things I stated above.. fuck that and just jump.. these will be the first of many and a learn experience. every chick can't be "the one". and if she is "the one". you'd damn well better be ready to handle that ass. she won't ease up on you because of you "love" for her

Post: #5

(12-07-2013 11:13 PM)Mr. Butterworth Wrote:  are you a Virgin? not confident in your ability to perform? insecure about penis size?

doesn't sound like the conservative family thing is what's bothering you.. if it's the things I stated above.. fuck that and just jump.. these will be the first of many and a learn experience. every chick can't be "the one". and if she is "the one". you'd damn well better be ready to handle that ass. she won't ease up on you because of you "love" for her

I was in an LTR with a no sex before marriage girl, my sexual experiences only consisted oral sex, fingering (grinding doesn't count does it).

I don't think I'd be willing to do oral on a girl who I barely know, and I think you're right - not being confident to satisfy a girl without oral.

Thanks for your advice.

Post: #6

Push full-steam ahead for the chicks outside your social circle. (The ones you listed except for uncle's friend's cousin and the barista.)
Gaming within your social circle can get awkward — it's best to take a step outside of that, based on the circumstances you describe.

Post: #7

cut the fear

Post: #8

I just broke up with my girlfriend of 7 months this week, and the girls that I've met were ready to hookup and I just didn't make that move. I'm not ready to start kissing.

Maybe you have a similar emotion, but obviously different circumstances.

I have a question. What are your intentions with women and dating?

Post: #9

(12-07-2013 09:17 PM)chickenchaser Wrote:  I'm east asian and I come from a relatively conservative family. (No sex out of LTRs). I've started learning about game this year. There have been quite a few opportunities to have sex with a woman but each time, each time, half way to one of our apartments (or something equivalent), I backed out. Here I list them half of them out (not many by your standards):

- Once I invited a girl to my apartment, she asked me to be her boyfriend. I don't know why but there was an instinctual fear. I didn't want to be in a relationship (with her). I stopped replying to her for a week. Next week when I texted her again she was gone.

- Once taking 2 girls to their apartment after chatting them up on the bus (on a very late night, looked like they were out but couldn't pick a guy up, I'd have to do). I figured out they were obvious sluts (though hot), when one said "How many girls have you been with? 50?"... One was intoxicated, the other one started talking about relationships... I stopped wanting to fuck them. Had to wake up in 3 hours so I left them.

- Once I picked up a girl at a party. I had a few drinks, she was sober. We were going to her apartment. Things were getting a bit heavy. My drink started to wear off and started asking myself "I just want to fuck her once and forget about her" and started feeling guilty, and left... The look on her face... On the way home I felt guilty anyway. She texted me saying a bunch of stuff, and that she was a busy woman, but what it really meant was she felt I wasted her time, and I did.

- There was my barista who gives me lots of IOIs but I've never made a move - I didn't want to ruin my barista-customer relationship; I like having her make my coffee.

- There was my uncle's friend's cousin. I can tell she might not have minded just sex but I was worried about the consequences of having my family social circle learning about it, which is quite conservative...

I'm hung up on something and I don't know how to get over it. How did you first do it? How should I approach things?

I get the sense that Chicken_Ch is trolling us.

Even though the outlined scenarios seem quasi-plausible, they just do NOT seem like the kinds of feelings that guys have. I don't buy it. Whether Chicken_Ch supposedly comes from a amorphous conservative culture or NOT... makes little to no sense to me.

Maybe you can provide some additional details, such as how old you are, and which country exactly you are in and have you traveled? Your profile list Australia. Are these relationships with girls of the same culture in all cases, and if you are in Australia, then wouldn't that be within a city with a east Asian enclave? Can you explain in order that we know from where you are coming and more about the circumstances of such seemingly unlikely circumstances?

Post: #10

@ JJG - Depends. I know some ppl who were very religious that took time to break out of their ways. Not sure how they got out of it eventually (maybe American college system), but ppl like that do exist at a young age while exposure to new experiences & spheres created breakthroughs.

Post: #11

(12-16-2013 01:36 AM)yb13 Wrote:  @ JJG - Depends. I know some ppl who were very religious that took time to break out of their ways. Not sure how they got out of it eventually (maybe American college system), but ppl like that do exist at a young age while exposure to new experiences & spheres created breakthroughs.

YB---- You may be correct.

I would NOT want to squelch a genuine male poster with a genuine question; however, I found the content of OP's various low number of posts on RVF to be totally weird, including his recent intervention in response to my post in another thread.

/thread-29946-...#pid605170

You may be correct, ultimately, that OP is genuine... and maybe we should allow him to explain a bit so we understand the circumstances. I cannot disagree with giving a guy the benefit of the doubt ... especially, if he can provide some understandable and plausible explanation.

Post: #12

(12-16-2013 01:31 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  I get the sense that Chicken_Ch is trolling us.

Even though the outlined scenarios seem quasi-plausible, they just do NOT seem like the kinds of feelings that guys have. I don't buy it. Whether Chicken_Ch supposedly comes from a amorphous conservative culture or NOT... makes little to no sense to me.

Maybe you can provide some additional details, such as how old you are, and which country exactly you are in and have you traveled? Your profile list Australia. Are these relationships with girls of the same culture in all cases, and if you are in Australia, then wouldn't that be within a city with a east Asian enclave? Can you explain in order that we know from where you are coming and more about the circumstances of such seemingly unlikely circumstances?

(12-16-2013 02:26 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  

(12-16-2013 01:36 AM)yb13 Wrote:  @ JJG - Depends. I know some ppl who were very religious that took time to break out of their ways. Not sure how they got out of it eventually (maybe American college system), but ppl like that do exist at a young age while exposure to new experiences & spheres created breakthroughs.

YB---- You may be correct.

I would NOT want to squelch a genuine male poster with a genuine question; however, I found the content of OP's various low number of posts on RVF to be totally weird, including his recent intervention in response to my post in another thread.

/thread-29946-...#pid605170

You may be correct, ultimately, that OP is genuine... and maybe we should allow him to explain a bit so we understand the circumstances. I cannot disagree with giving a guy the benefit of the doubt ... especially, if he can provide some understandable and plausible explanation.

My response to your post: It was very terse. I didn't mean it to be sarcastic or humorous. I was in the same situation and feeling frustrated, but didn't want to tell my life story as you were replying to someone else so I deleted it and left a very terse reply. I genuine want to know how one could deal with such situations. I didn't intend for it to sound sarcastic or humorous.

And to your questions:

I turn 24 this month, recently graduated from university. I live in Sydney, Australia.

I was born in Hong Kong. Moved here with mum and step-father when I was in primary school. I speak english fluently, more fluent than my native Cantonese.

I've got around a dozen relatives in Australia, all from Hong Kong, too.

Countries I've been:

Australia
Hong Kong
South Korea
Taiwan
Malaysia
Singapore
China

My mother had divorced my father, and took me and my brother to Australia after marrying my step-father. My father killed himself a couple of years later.

Quote:- Once I invited a girl to my apartment, she asked me to be her boyfriend. I don't know why but there was an instinctual fear. I didn't want to be in a relationship (with her). I stopped replying to her for a week. Next week when I texted her again she was gone.

I met this girl on a nightride bus home from clubbing. 34 year old, born in Australia, lives in Petersham, has italian parents. Studying to be pilates teacher but is unemployed. Physical appearance I'd say a 5 max. We met twice. She 'forgot' her date the third. Exchanged some messages over the next weeks, asked me to be her boyfriend out of the blue. I said it was too fast. 2 weeks later I moved to a new place and invited her to my apartment. She said yes + a bunch of stuff. I don't know why but I got scared and didn't reply to her for a week.

I realise there are contradictions in this longer story with the two line version I posted earlier.

I still have her texts on my phone.

Quote:- Once taking 2 girls to their apartment after chatting them up on the bus (on a very late night, looked like they were out but couldn't pick a guy up, I'd have to do). I figured out they were obvious sluts (though hot), when one said "How many girls have you been with? 50?"... One was intoxicated, the other one started talking about relationships... I stopped wanting to fuck them. Had to wake up in 3 hours so I left them.

I met them on the bus on the way home from clubbing (yeah I know its the same as above, dno what's with the bus thing.). They were either japanese or korean background, born in Australia. They were 6 & 7's. The 'intoxicated' one was high from ecstasy. I got off at their stop and was walking them home. They started to talk about sex and relationships with me. On the bus I was attracted to them. Off the bus I was not. They were around 20 or 21.

I have photos of us together on the bus.

Quote:- Once I picked up a girl at a party. I had a few drinks, she was sober. We were going to her apartment. Things were getting a bit heavy. My drink started to wear off and started asking myself "I just want to fuck her once and forget about her" and started feeling guilty, and left... The look on her face... On the way home I felt guilty anyway. She texted me saying a bunch of stuff, and that she was a busy woman, but what it really meant was she felt I wasted her time, and I did.

She's Chinese background. Works in Westpac. Born here. I met her on one of those meetup.com things. She seems book smart. She offered me her number from the meetup and I asked her out for dinner a few days later. At dinner we talked about finance & stocks & investments but my hand was doing a lot more, feeling her legs, etc. Left the place with my arm around her. On the train, more of the same, (was reading job ads off seek.com.au and then whispering them in a dirty manner into her ear. that was fun.). Got off at her station. Half way on the stairs up I couldn't bring myself to keep going, and told her I was going home. A few days later, she texted me saying she was a busy woman and won't have time to talk to me after I texted her saying let's just be friends because I enjoyed talking stocks with her. She was 27. I don't know how to rate her. medium boobs/ass for an asian, looks mildly attractive with makeup, got a tummy if I feel for it but otherwise not visible.

I also realise in the shorter version there are some events I didn't mention.

I deleted our texts because I felt ashamed I wanted to be friends with a woman after reading rooshv forums and other manosphere blogs.

Quote:- There was my barista who gives me lots of IOIs but I've never made a move - I didn't want to ruin my barista-customer relationship; I like having her make my coffee.

She's got a chinese sounding name and looks east asian too. Of course those IOIs are just guesses but she started chatting to me more and one day she told me she had nothing to do weekend and asked me what I was doing. I'm guessing she wanted me to ask her out, but I didn't. She looks 28, slightly more attractive than the above girl.

Quote:- There was my uncle's friend's cousin. I can tell she might not have minded just sex but I was worried about the consequences of having my family social circle learning about it, which is quite conservative...

She found me on facebook (somehow) after we had a dinner (with family). Went out with her 3 times, didn't physically escalate beyond touching because of reasons stated above. After that I feel she just got bored, and I was bored too. Haven't talked to her since.

What else can I tell you?

Post: #13

Chicken_Ch:

I do appreciate your response to concerns that I had raised in my previous posts, and your extra details regarding you and the situations that you had outlined in your first post.

I take back my accusation (stated suspicion) that you are a troll.

Currently, I am in my 40s, and when I was in my 20s, I had a lot of awkward interactions with women, even after I had sex with other women. Some of my awkward situations were similar to the ones that you describe, and in my case some of the awkward situations came from my having changes in my mood - which is similar to what you are describing.

Actually, sometimes awkward interactions also took place in my 30s and in recent times, so age and experience does NOT always immune us from having awkward situations with women.

Certainly, I act better and have a more clear vision about what I want to do, after I have been through a particular kind of situation, and it can even be helpful to learn from other guys regarding their experiences with women, in order that you may better know how you want to act or react in a certain possible situation that develop.

I have even had disagreements with some guys in this forum about whether a guy should bang a girl in a given situation, and each of us will sometimes chose NOT to bang girls and then later we may or may NOT have buyer’s remorse about that decision NOT to bang.
In other words guys are going to have different opinions about when to bang and when NOT to bang; however, even from your self-description, it sounds as if you want to bang women but you lose your comfort level, when you get close to being in such a situation that a bang may take place – and possibly you are being too selective with these girls, especially, if your purpose is to bang them, and several of them have seemed ready and willing to bang you.

Sometimes, also, it sounds as if you are self-sabotaging some of the situations (burning your bridges). Also, you may already realize that girls frequently are even more emotional than guys and become very finicky about what they want to do or NOT, especially if they have NOT banged you, yet. I find it is a little bit harder to burn bridges with girls that I had already banged, but also NOT impossible because sometimes the girl will just become turned off by the guy (it has happened to me several times, even with girls who I have already banged).

It sounds as if you are able to build situations in which some girls are attracted to you, so in that regard, maybe you just need to be very physical with those girls in order to continue to build up the attraction, and even if you do NOT bang the girl in the first few dates in which you are very physical with the girl, if you do NOT burn bridges with those girls, then sooner or later, you are going to build up the physicality to banging one or more of those girls. With practice, building up the physicality and comfort will likely get easier, and you should be able to bang various girls more quickly and with less effort and less psychological barriers.

Even though alcohol and drugs are NOT necessary to bang girls, sometimes these kinds of accessories can help guys and girls to get over some inhibitions that each may have…. a matter of making the interaction fun and comfortable.

So, Chicken_Ch, at this time, do you have any girls lined up, in which you can experiment with this physical escalation matter and to work towards banging them? If not, you will need to work on getting girls into such a situation to begin the experiment to work towards banging a few girls... maybe set a goal for yourself to bang a girl within the next month or two.. whatever is comfortable for you. You do NOT want to wait too long though b/c the 20s were a great time for me for banging girls - girls are receptive, and generally your hormone levels should be sufficiently high in order to have both motivation and stamina...


So maybe you want to describe some plans that you have regarding approaching girls in the coming weeks, and if you do NOT have any plans, then consider making some and attempting to follow through with the plans.

Post: #14

Don't be scared of the P. it doesn't bite.... unless she has crabs.

Post: #15

(12-16-2013 05:32 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  So, Chicken_Ch, at this time, do you have any girls lined up, in which you can experiment with this physical escalation matter and to work towards banging them? If not, you will need to work on getting girls into such a situation to begin the experiment to work towards banging a few girls... maybe set a goal for yourself to bang a girl within the next month or two.. whatever is comfortable for you. You do NOT want to wait too long though b/c the 20s were a great time for me for banging girls - girls are receptive, and generally your hormone levels should be sufficiently high in order to have both motivation and stamina...


So maybe you want to describe some plans that you have regarding approaching girls in the coming weeks, and if you do NOT have any plans, then consider making some and attempting to follow through with the plans.

Met this girl at this post-graduation lunch my friend's sister invited me to. I didn't think I'd be attracted to any of her friends(My friend's sister is a 3, though she could be a 5 if she fixed her posture and learned to makeup...). I think this "I'm better than you" attitude helped. Swapped seats with my friend's sister to sit next to this girl I realised was cute (a 6/7). Chatted a bit with her then I went:

Me: "You have a boyfriend?"
Her: "no... haha"
Me: "I can take you on a date" (using my low voice)
Her: "What day?"
Me: "Tuesday"
Her: "What about Thursday".
Me: *hesitates because I had something on, I was trying to remember what*
Her: "Ok Tuesday".

Arranged where just now using text. Meeting up with her tomorrow night 6.45.

She's chinese, got permanent resident here.

Post: #16

(12-16-2013 06:54 AM)chickenchaser Wrote:  

(12-16-2013 05:32 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  So, Chicken_Ch, at this time, do you have any girls lined up, in which you can experiment with this physical escalation matter and to work towards banging them? If not, you will need to work on getting girls into such a situation to begin the experiment to work towards banging a few girls... maybe set a goal for yourself to bang a girl within the next month or two.. whatever is comfortable for you. You do NOT want to wait too long though b/c the 20s were a great time for me for banging girls - girls are receptive, and generally your hormone levels should be sufficiently high in order to have both motivation and stamina...


So maybe you want to describe some plans that you have regarding approaching girls in the coming weeks, and if you do NOT have any plans, then consider making some and attempting to follow through with the plans.

Met this girl at this post-graduation lunch my friend's sister invited me to. I didn't think I'd be attracted to any of her friends(My friend's sister is a 3, though she could be a 5 if she fixed her posture and learned to makeup...). I think this "I'm better than you" attitude helped. Swapped seats with my friend's sister to sit next to this girl I realised was cute (a 6/7). Chatted a bit with her then I went:

Me: "You have a boyfriend?"
Her: "no... haha"
Me: "I can take you on a date" (using my low voice)
Her: "What day?"
Me: "Tuesday"
Her: "What about Thursday".
Me: *hesitates because I had something on, I was trying to remember what*
Her: "Ok Tuesday".

Arranged where just now using text. Meeting up with her tomorrow night 6.45.

She's chinese, got permanent resident here.

Sounds like you handled the asking her out part fairly well, so where are you going take her for your "date" and what you gonna do?

Do you have a place to take her to bang her? and how you gonna get her there? well sometimes banging can be o.k. just outside or in a car or in a bathroom or a hallway... depending on chemistry and flow.

Post: #17

(12-16-2013 07:08 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  Sounds like you handled the asking her out part fairly well, so where are you going take her for your "date" and what you gonna do?

Do you have a place to take her to bang her? and how you gonna get her there? well sometimes banging can be o.k. just outside or in a car or in a bathroom or a hallway... depending on chemistry and flow.

I don't know. We both live half an hour from the meeting place in the CBD. but her place is an hour from mine.

Taking her to this bar restaurant. Going to not be too hungry and share some food and drinks. Make some conversation and just physically escalate as much as she can take it (of course with some push-pulling involved).

Was thinking at the end I'd just go something like "Come with me." and lead her hand, all the way down to the station, onto the train, off the station and into my place. If she asks where I'd just say my apartment. I'd estimate 2.5% chance of that happening smoothly.

No idea how she'd respond after that, never got that far. I suppose if she says she has work the next day I'll reply saying I'll pay for her taxi ride home...

I haven't banged *for real* yet so not sure I'd like my first time to be in a bathroom or hallway. That seems like the perfect place for awkward moments to appear...

I don't drive.

EDIT: If there was no kiss in the restaurant maybe we'll go to the park for a walk and go for it there.... HMM gives me ideas.

Post: #18

Logistics are against you on this one

Post: #19

(12-16-2013 11:35 AM)Remington Wrote:  Logistics are against you on this one

You were right.

Took her to the bar-restaurant.

Being my flirty self. Her english wasn't flawless - at least 1/3 of my jokes were missed. I tried to do the amplify-to-absurdity thing once, it got so absurd I couldn't imagine any more absurdity and she kept gobbling it up like I was telling her something new...until I gave up and said I was messing with her.

The meal was $50 and she offered split with a $20 note and I gladly obliged, and took it.

Bounced her around to various spots along the harbour.

Rapport level: Arm around her at times. Mostly hand holding with interlocking fingers.

At one point we went to look at a christmas tree I went for the kiss but she said "not now".

Tried to take her to my apartment but couldn't even get to the ticket machine. Went to wait for her bus instead. She missed the first one so she could sit with me a bit more. I remember roosh's advice "just keep going" so, with a kiss in mind I sat with her for the bus, even though I realised it was a bit of a beta move. I kept selling her how cool my apartment was and just before the bus came she said "I'm not going there!" (Logistics are against me on this one...). During the wait touched her leg a bit and touched her boob also but that was more accidental. The bus came and I went for a kiss again. All I got was a peck on the lips + a hug (It's a lot for a first date for a pair of chinese people, you westerners are lucky....get them for greetings with friends........). I noticed near the end of the night she wasn't able to hold my eye contact for more than a second.

Throughout the last half of the night she tried to figure out how many partners I had but I kept dodging the question. She guessed I had 15 before (haha, love that). She wouldn't let it go for many minutes even after I bounced places and changed topics. In the end I told her it was "less than 15" but no exact number. Not sure if that was a good move, thought I didn't want to appear too much of a player. She also accused me (in a playful way) of being a player and I said "not that much of one".

at first she said she hadn't had any man before but then she said it was two, the first one was for a while with a dude she grew up with but she realised she saw him as a brother. (didn't let her talk about this for more than half a minute. bounced to another place.)

I've got no idea what to do next. Told her all my best stories. Took her to the restaurant I had the most luck with. Gave her the best views of the city. (And yes she loved it all).

If there was one thing I achieved this date - I never held hands with a girl for this long even with my previous girlfriends, though I've had better kiss closes before on a date (especially ones I'd actually count).

She's been to many places around the world with her parents, I'm guessing her parents are loaded. She uses iphone. She's not good at telling stories and sees herself as a logical person (her hobby in high school was programming which she stopped doing, she said it was because she was supposed to be a girl).

Do you have any advice? Should I text her after the date? How long the wait? Should I ask her out again, and to what kind of place?

The million dollar question: What can I do to make her fall in love with me? How do I dangle her between anxiety and comfort, assuming its possible?

(of course, I don't mind nexting the girl. Her girl game isn't good enough for me to have feelings for her at this point in time.)

Post: #20

Try to get her to come directly to your place. I guess that is asking a lot since she is relying on public transportation. But really, I would focus on women in your area just for the sake of logistics.

I guess the asian women I have dated are all westernized because they all like to kiss and to fuck.