Post: #1

Well, not quite red pill, but a pretty differently toned article from them:

http://www.slate.com/articles/double_x/d...ction.html

Post: #2

And it's a woman who wrote the article, this will get interesting. I expect a twitter war.

Question is: shall we help slate?

Post: #3

damn, I can't even read the comments they're being written so fast.



In the end it will just be written off as another piece that is horrible and sexist.

It is the sign of a child to take no responsibility for one's actions. University girls are children plain and simple.

Its childish to believe that you can get blackout drunk, have meltdowns and vomit every weekend and never have anything bad happen. Whether it be robbery, rape, doing dumb shit that gets you arrested, fucking questionable girls if it happens while shitshow drunk its for the most part preventable.

Post: #4

Honestly the article is fairly blue pill overall but with a decent amount of common sense mixed in, which to me is a fairly reasonable standard for public discourse to hold itself too.

Post: #5

Honestly, writers like her don't know have the faintest clue of what it's like to be a man.

While it's good that she's putting some responsibility on college girls, she's still relying upon the stock image of a sexual predator lurking in bars to pickup drunk girls.

We all know the truth - drunk girls don't just walk home with any old guy out of a bar. Just like, contrary to popular opinion, sluts don't sleep around indiscriminately. Even if she's intoxicated you have to attract her first, and often do other stuff like gain some rapport.

In other words, the writer does know anything about game.

And notice that she implicitly accepts that some college guys will be charged with rape despite not having any such intentions: "If I had a son, I would tell him that it’s in his self-interest not to be the drunken frat boy who finds himself accused of raping a drunken classmate."

What does that mean? She's basically admitting a kid who gets drunk and had sex could find himself with a rape charge simply because the girl was *also* drunk.

Post: #6

I smell solipsism. She has a daughter going to college next year.

It never means anything until it affects them personally.

Post: #7

So the counter torrent begins.

http://www.salon.com/2013/10/16/blaming_...e_apology/

Quote:There is, of course, a lot to be said about Yoffe’s “this is not rape apologia” rape apologia, but let’s start with this: Our culture is not, and has never been, “reluctant” to tell women to stop doing things. In fact, people build entire careers around it.

And yet this false idea, that women’s behavior is the real reason they are victimized — and that we live in a society that does a poor job of policing such behavior — is regularly used to blame sexual violence on the “problem” of young women today.

...

Yoffe has plenty of good data to support her argument that binge drinking on college campuses isn’t healthy. The over-consumption of alcohol can literally kill people. What it can’t do, however, is make a woman responsible for a crime committed against her.

“We are failing to let women know that when they render themselves defenseless, terrible things can be done to them,” Yoffe frets. She is wrong. There isn’t some vacuum of “truth-telling” about the dangers women face on a daily basis, simply because they are women. Our culture is swimming with examples of women — in movies, television and real life — who are “punished” for their “bad choices” with sexual violence. “Bad choices” include wearing a short skirt, staying out too late, getting too drunk, trusting too much. The list of reasons that Americans believe women deserve rape is long.

And, contrary to what Yoffe believes, most young women can easily recall the day they got “the talk” or otherwise learned about protecting themselves in a dangerous world. Women are taught early and often that their basic biology makes them a target.

But what’s not being said or taught, and what Yoffe only mentions in the final paragraph of a piece spent blaming women and girls for drinking themselves into victimhood, is what men and boys can do stop rape. First and foremost, they can not rape.

Thunderf00t actually addressed this point in one of his recent videos. The "Tell your sons not to rape" meme is stupid; it's like saying, "Well, I SHOULD be able to walk down this dark alley in the bad part of the city at 2AM and not get mugged, so YOU need to tell your sons and fathers to not rob." Yes, everyone should raise their children so that they don't commit crimes. But some people don't. Or some people ignore how they were raised for various reasons. What are you going to do then? You SHOULD be doing everything in your power to not be a victim, and for me that means NOT walking down that alley at 2AM even though I love night walks and being awake at night. And for women it can mean not getting shitfaced drunk in a place full of strangers. I don't think its victim blaming to tell women to take care of themselves as much as possible.

Post: #8

Hundreds of years in the future, humans will look back and laugh about that point in history when female writers for different online magazines were arguing about whether or not females should be held accountable for their drunken antics.

Post: #9

The rage to the article reminds me of this:

Quote:The end game of feminism is to make it impossible for a female to do any wrong, absolving her from all responsibility for her actions, no matter how reprehensible. The fact that a human being has a vagina will soon mean that she can not make a bad decision about anything. Punishing or criticizing a woman for her life choices will be abolished.

http://www.rooshv.com/the-end-game-of-feminism

Post: #10

Did they disable the comments? I can't see any.

To me this is such a stupid subject and the fact that the campuses and society in general have formed this "if she was drunk, her giving consent is irrelevant" attitude is just another victory for feminism. I don't think many guys here will advocate you being totally sober and her being totally smashed as an honorable move but the reality is that most of these "sexual assaults" happen when both the guy and the girl are drunk. If they are both drunk why is it that he is 'raping' her? Why is her consent in that circumstance irrelevant? Why is there no responsibility for her getting drunk? Why isn't she raping him? Simple logic would say if both the consenting adults are drunk then no sexual assault took place but obviously playing the rape card allows feminists and women to enjoy their victim status.

I read the counter to the article and that did allow comments. Most of them were arguing that this is victim-blaming, and a girl should be able to get drunk if she wants to, or that not drinking doesn't reduce the chances of rape for a woman. I think someone should bomb them with Tuth's Rape Tourette's article.

Post: #11

Was the woman in this story drunk too?

http://www.nydailynews.com/news/national...-1.1487092

Sex caught on tape, goes viral, she says it's rape.

Post: #12

(10-16-2013 10:59 AM)Cattle Rustler Wrote:  And it's a woman who wrote the article, this will get interesting. I expect a twitter war.

Question is: shall we help slate?

Time to get the popcorn ready & sit back to watch the femcunts devour 1 of their own. How dare a femcunt express logic & common sense! How dare she suggest women accept responsibility for their life choices! Poor broad is in for it

Post: #13

Quote:Question is: shall we help slate?

Would they help us if we were attacked?

Post: #14

(10-16-2013 06:36 PM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:Question is: shall we help slate?

Would they help us if we were attacked?

Lets help Slate because the enemy of my "fenemy" is my friend.

Post: #15

Nothing we can do anyway. She's being hammered on all the major blogs and the Twitter attack is intense. If she was just the focus of a small attack via a couple blogs then maybe we could white knight for her.

Post: #16

I can't imagine white knighting for her would actually help her anyway. The manosphere stepping in would do a couple of things: 1. Associate her in the eyes of her antagonists with the people they love to hate the most, and 2. undermine whatever feminist cred she still has, which is the only thing that puts her in the debate in the first place.

But we could turn her to the dark side. She'll be ripe for it soon enough. Converted feminists would be powerful allies.

Post: #17

This article and the reaction to it tell you all you need to know about where things are and where they're headed.

The article is not "red pill". It takes for granted the demented feminist mythology about the infinite numbers of "predators" that are always out there, seeking to "rape" helpless women at every opportunity, in every town, college campus etc.

It meekly attempts to suggest that females who get drunk put themselves (unintentionally) at the mercy of these predatory hordes, and therefore they should consider not getting drunk quite as much.

And this merest suggestion is savagely shouted down as an unthinkable heresy. Not the smallest deviation from the party line can be permitted at any time.

If anyone still thinks feminism isn't going from strength to strength in the wider culture, think again.

Post: #18

(10-16-2013 07:52 PM)JackDavey Wrote:  But we could turn her to the dark side. She'll be ripe for it soon enough. Converted feminists would be powerful allies.

Not bloody likely. She's taking a beating for giving some very basic common sense advice everyone knows but some refuse to acknowledge for political reasons. Hell, with numbers like "almost 20 percent of college women will become victims" she's obviously lumping morning-after regret with actual rape. She just seems like a deeply blue pilled person who happens not to be a 100% orthodox feminist, and now is paying for it because the cult does not tolerate heretical divergence from the doctrine. The absolutely best we can hope for is both her and Slate standing by that article, but I doubt even that could happen.

I'm actually surprised Slate published this, as it was to be expected a large and extremely vocal part of its readership would go ballistic over it (maybe it's a case of any publicity is good publicity? I really don't know how offending one of their target demographics would help them at all). Pushing the "Women are NEVER responsible for their actions and advicing women on how to lower their risk of being raped is telling them they deserve to be raped if they do otherwise" mantra is one of the main focuses of feminism in the last few years, the entire Slutwalk movement was supposedly about that (it was actually about trying to reduce the stigma against sluttiness, but they needed another, not tremendously frivolous sounding motivation).


BTW, in an article about this whole scandal (I'd link to it but don't have enough posts here to do that) I came across this little thing I found shocking even from a Feministing author :

Quote:laughs off a woman who had been raped by her husband as “prim, punctilious, punitive” because her story doesn’t sound like a Law & Order plot

I had read that article in the past, I remembered it because of how completely crazy that letter was. Here, I looked it up for your viewing displeasure:

Quote:Dear Prudence,
My husband is kind, supportive, funny, generous, smart, and loving. However, I feel like I must divorce him. Six years ago, when we were in our early 20s and had just fallen in love, after a night of partying and drinking, he woke me up in the middle of the night and started to have sex with me. I was dozing and still drunk and, yes, I took my panties off myself. But when I realized that it was not OK for him to make advances on me in my state, I pushed him away and ran out. He later felt so bad he wanted to turn himself in for rape. I was very confused and thought at times that I was overreacting and at others that I was raped. We painfully worked through this, but the incident made my husband very reluctant about having sex. This led to an agreement that he shouldn't be afraid of coming close to me in similar situations as long as he asked my consent. This made us feel better and I felt secure again. However, we just found ourselves in a very similar situation. After coming back from a friend’s wine tasting we went to bed and he started to kiss me. I liked it and went along, only to wake up in the morning and remember only half of it. Now I am in the same painful spot I was before and I can’t fathom how he could have ignored our agreement. Should I just drop it or am I right about feeling abused?

—Confused

Yofre rightly tells her that drunken sex with her husband that she didn't resist is perfectly normal and not at all abuse, let alone rape. But this person, somebody who writes for a supposedly serious feminist website, disagrees with that. WHAT IN THE FUCK. Is there no limit to these people's madness?

Post: #19

(10-16-2013 10:30 PM)Porteño Wrote:  WHAT IN THE FUCK. Is there no limit to these people's madness?

There is no limit to the amount of ugly, disaffected, and bitter women in America.

Post: #20

I was reading the paper today and some chick got sexually assaulted in one of the nicest parts of Vancouver.

I read further and it turns out this defenseless young woman 'accidentally mistook' a beat up black minivan for a taxi late one friday night.

Its a horrible thing to have happened, but she must have been BEYOND wasted.




Girls shouldn't watch their drinking to protect themselves against bad decision making/situations such as this, but also because of the well being of everyone around them. If you go out with a group of >3 young women there is a 90% chance one of them is either going to have a meltdown, start vomiting, or do something stupid so that it will affect every one else's night.

Ive had guy friends puke and shit, but they usually are capable of determining when they've drank too much, or in the very least holding themselves together.

Post: #21

I wonder if their response to the article is the 'shaming' behavior that they tell us doesn't work.

Post: #22

(10-17-2013 01:10 AM)WesternCancer Wrote:  If you go out with a group of >3 young women there is a 90% chance one of them is either going to have a meltdown, start vomiting, or do something stupid so that it will affect every one else's night.

Then that particular female combination of solipsism and narcissism kicks in, where women fail to show any concern for the friend who is ruining *their* night, and abandon her to the wolves. Men can always be blamed for whatever consequences befall their friend as long as they get to flirt and dance a little longer.

Female friendships are toxic.

Post: #23

This article is not red pill. Taking precautions isn't particularly red pill. And Yoffe quotes those bogus feminist studies claiming that large minorities of women are sexually assaulted. This is not within 1,000 miles of red pill.

Post: #24

The article isn't red pill at all. It sits there and takes these women's revisions of history as being factually true. She quotes one girl who says something like "he had the reputation that if you were drunk around him, he was going to have sex with you".

What the fuck is that? If that's even remotely true and it's a legitimate concern, why is she hanging around him drinking? But this writer just throws that in there as if it's the gospel truth.

Meanwhile the rest of the article paints this picture like every man is a potential rapist ESPECIALLY if he's your classmate.

I would bet my life that the majority of these cases are all out lies and revisions of history that omits key occurrences where the girls INTENTIONALLY get fucked up so they can absolve themselves of any responsibility. You hear it all the time about other things. "Oh I didn't mean to tell her that Sarah was talking about her, I was drunk" "Oh I can't believe I kissed the guy my friend likes, I was drunk" But when these whores go sleep with some guy and they feel depressed and guilty from drinking too much the next day and their little friends are trying to validate their own sluttiness, they project on these girls that they've actually been **GASP** RAPED!!!! And of course there is no better story to convince yourself of than going from being some drunken bar slut to a victim turned heroine for standing up for herself against her calculating and evil attacker!

Post: #25

There's no attempt at all in this article to take into account the perspective of men.

The implicit assumption in all of this is that if a girl is drunk, you aren't supposed to have sex with her, even if she consents.

There's no attempt to address the issue of female choice while drunk. Men are treated like subhumans yet again.