Post: #1

Hello,
First post after reading here as a guest for almost 6 months.
Im a 20 years old guy curently living in Israel.
I was borned in Belarus and my parents migrated to Israel when i was 2 years old. Exept my family, all my other family live in Belarus till today. Last time I visited belarus I was about 15. Recentley I was thinking of changing my life completely and move to Belarus.

Ill give some facts:
1. I finished one of the best from school. but still didnt go to university because i dont see how it will help me. I do not want to have a regular job.
2. Droped out of the army. On purpose. (thank god).
3. I know to speak Russian. Problem is I dont have Russian accent.
4. I do not have Belarussian citizenship, but I can get one.
5. I dont like it in Israel. I dont like the rude people, culture, cost of living. I just dont see myself grow up in this nervous country.
6. I make my living out of the internet. I built the biggest plastic surgeries website in Israel. Currently making about 800$\month from businesses buying ad spaces. Another 200$ from AdSense. Got some ideas to expand . Im also have few clients of local SEO. I DO NOT WANNA WORK AN OFFICE BOARING 9-5 JOB. been there, done that, wanted to kill myself.
7. Grils. Girls are thought here in Israel. If i have luck I can pull out a 7 in Israeli scale which is like 5 in FSU scale. Funny thing is the hottest girls in Israel are Russian decent. Every chick in here thinks shes special, and having an american attitude. getting laid in the 2 first meets? good joke.
8. I have in my bank account about 15K$. Thats very few for starting new life. My parents pretty stable tho, they can help me in the beginning.
9. The biggest advantage is that avarage salary in Belarus is about 250$ in Brest, where i was borned (Its near Poland). If i can make 1000$ month I should be living pretty goodt here, arent I?
10. It is so hard to break apart of my family. BIG disatvantage
11. Same apartment in Raanana (IL) - 500K$, in Brest (BLR) - 80K$. I actually thinking of saving and buy several houses in Belarus as an investment.
12. Im fully aware of the political and economical situation in Belarus.


But Im just a kid that want to be happier. Im pretty much depressed right now in Israel, Im felling thats not my place. But my family really like it in Israel, they were so angry when i left army. I dont know what to do. Im only 20 years old young adult with no real life expirience.

What would you do?

Post: #2

(09-22-2013 01:01 PM)ceowannabe Wrote:  But Im just a kid that want to be happier. Im pretty much depressed right now in Israel, Im felling thats not my place. But my family really like it in Israel, they were so angry when i left army. I dont know what to do. Im only 20 years old young adult with no real life expirience.

What would you do?

My situation had some similariities in that I never felt at home in the US, and when I visited Western Europe in the 1980s ( pre internet, people were much more humble and nice) I felt more at home there than in the fast-paced USA. I am all Western European blood.

I think some people's personalities simply do not fit well in whatever country they end up in.

This is even more likely when you are first generation ( as you are) or second ( as I am.) People's values change a lot
in the first generation when the new country is very different from their country of origin.

I would speculate that your parents were very impressed with the possibility of gaining wealth and security in Israel,
compared to the dysfunctional economy in Belarus. But the you grew up with the wealth all around you, and it doesn't seem like the solution to everything if girls are bitchy and you can't have a decent social life as a result.

So your viewpoint is substantially different from theirs and they are not going to be able to understand your ideas. Physical comfort ( food, shelter) may mean everything to them and you seem ungrateful from their point of view.

But the same reason they are comfortable is the reason you take it for granted. You will find it easier to understand your parents as you get older and see more people in the world and the different ways they adapt to things and value things.

One could liken it to planting a palm tree in Oregon where it doesn't get very cold, but it is also not the optimal area for a palm tree to grow.

If you are already wealthy enough to live on your own in Belarus and will be nailing 8-9 Slavic hotties, then it sure sounds like it's at least worth a trip.

One thing to realize is that when you first "move" to another country, you are really just visiting. It may become a move-- but only time can tell that.

I thought I was moving to Ukraine, but getting bullied by dimwits there made me realize the place was not for me-- I wanted to deal with the ambitious creativity of educated Californians, not the backwards suspiciousness of people in an an old, unfortunate country.

So you don't have to have it in your mind you are absolutely moving forever. You really don't know, or you shouldn't if you are keeping an open mind.

But it sounds like you know Israel isn't a good fit, so it certainly is a good idea to visit another place. Maybe you can plan flexibly enough so that you can choose to either stay in the new location or go to Israel again for staging another visit/move somewhere else.

It is best to do this while you are under 30 as usually one such as you, smart enough to start an internet business, builds up advantages in your home location so that it becomes harder and harder to leave it behind.

I make 2-3x as much in the USA as I could make anywhere else without several years of building up business.

Post: #3

-

Are you an Israeli citizen? Where can you travel to freely?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_requir...i_citizens

Where would you go? What would you do?

It sounds like the only option you are considering is Belarus.

Do you want to leave Israel to escape or to find opportunities?

Don't run away from your problems.

When you go abroad to run away from your problems you are leaving while looking backwards with regret. This can result in you heading in the wrong direction and digging yourself into a bigger hole somewhere else.

Run towards opportunities.

Your situation in Israel might suck but going abroad won't necessarily improve that. IMHO you need to identify a very specific opportunity and reason why you are going abroad in the first place. You need to identify an opportunity and pursue it.

People will definitely disagree with me on this point, arguing that travel is a means and ends unto itself. While they are not wrong, I am an extremely results-oriented person who likes to do things for an explicitly defined purpose with a very specific goal in mind.


Ultimately it sounds like you have deep underlying issues that you need to confront back in Israel.

I'm not sure if an internet forum is going to give you the answers you need because none of us know your full situation - especially because this is your first post.

---

If you DO decide you want to go abroad, I'd look into something like this:

Make a list and try to be as objective as possible in making a decision.

1. Goal Setting

List the specific income goals and life experiences you want to accomplish in a 6 month or 12 month timeframe

-Reach 2K USD monthly in 6 months, 5K USD monthly in 12 months

-Date a Russian model

-Improve English/Russian/Spanish



2. Countries you're interested in going to

-Belarus

-Ukraine

-Russia

-Poland

-Colombia

-Thailand

-Philippines

There are lots of data sheets available about all of these spots on this forum.

3. Plan out a budget and backup plan

What if you fail? What if you run out of money?

You're right, $15K is not a giant cushion of savings. It's also not terrible for a 20 year old.

You mentioned that you can find uber cheap rentals in that second tier city and probably also date some hot Slavic chicks. Belarus probably has that going for it.

However, you mentioned that you are looking for new life experiences. You were born and partially raised in Belarus. I assume you also have Belorussian parents, which explains why you speak Russian today.

Is it really going to be a big life change and life experience to go to Belarus?

Is it possible you would have a more dramatic and life-changing experience by going to a place like Thailand or Colombia?

Just my two cents.

This is what I can tell you for sure though:

Don't run away from your problems.

Run towards opportunities.

-

Post: #4

(09-22-2013 01:25 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  My situation had some similariities in that I never felt at home in the US, and when I visited Western Europe in the 1980s ( pre internet, people were much more humble and nice) I felt more at home there than in the fast-paced USA. I am all Western European blood.

I think some people's personalities simply do not fit well in whatever country they end up in.

This is even more likely when you are first generation ( as you are) or second ( as I am.) People's values change a lot
in the first generation when the new country is very different from their country of origin.

I would speculate that your parents were very impressed with the possibility of gaining wealth and security in Israel,
compared to the dysfunctional economy in Belarus. But the you grew up with the wealth all around you, and it doesn't seem like the solution to everything if girls are bitchy and you can't have a decent social life as a result.

So your viewpoint is substantially different from theirs and they are not going to be able to understand your ideas. Physical comfort ( food, shelter) may mean everything to them and you seem ungrateful from their point of view.

But the same reason they are comfortable is the reason you take it for granted. You will find it easier to understand your parents as you get older and see more people in the world and the different ways they adapt to things and value things.

One could liken it to planting a palm tree in Oregon where it doesn't get very cold, but it is also not the optimal area for a palm tree to grow.

If you are already wealthy enough to live on your own in Belarus and will be nailing 8-9 Slavic hotties, then it sure sounds like it's at least worth a trip.

One thing to realize is that when you first "move" to another country, you are really just visiting. It may become a move-- but only time can tell that.

I thought I was moving to Ukraine, but getting bullied by dimwits there made me realize the place was not for me-- I wanted to deal with the ambitious creativity of educated Californians, not the backwards suspiciousness of people in an an old, unfortunate country.

So you don't have to have it in your mind you are absolutely moving forever. You really don't know, or you shouldn't if you are keeping an open mind.

But it sounds like you know Israel isn't a good fit, so it certainly is a good idea to visit another place. Maybe you can plan flexibly enough so that you can choose to either stay in the new location or go to Israel again for staging another visit/move somewhere else.

It is best to do this while you are under 30 as usually one such as you, smart enough to start an internet business, builds up advantages in your home location so that it becomes harder and harder to leave it behind.

I make 2-3x as much in the USA as I could make anywhere else without several years of building up business.

Of course I will visit before I move, it would be sillt not to. Actually i talked to my grandma about that and planning to visit on 5-6 months from now.

But generally, youre so right. Actually all my best friends serving in the army right now. So yes, since I 18 its hard for me socially than before, but im ok. but i do not want to leave because of childish reasons as "that bitch dont like me" or "all my friends gone, im alone". Its beyond that.
I get what your saying.
Im accepting that I am part of a new generation. I had everything i wanted as a child. But im not spoiled tho. I worked as a PHP developer in startup company and made my choice - I prefer to earn less, but i do not want to be a modern slave. I think i have the skills for not having a regular job. I earned about 4K$\month and I quit my job after 8 months. I work really hard on my business and never asked for a penny from them (I rent my own appartment, buy food, paying bills).

I think youre right - Im in the right age of making drastic moves.

Post: #5

You're young, whatever you do isn't final. Go out and explore that world!

Belarus is supposed to be pretty nice!

Post: #6

(09-22-2013 01:51 PM)youngmobileglobal Wrote:  -

Are you an Israeli citizen? Where can you travel to freely?
Yes. My father is Jew.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Visa_requir...i_citizens

Where would you go? What would you do?
Live life to the fullest.
It sounds like the only option you are considering is Belarus.
I got relatives there, low cost of living (relatively rich), can get citizenship. Can speak the language. Perfect for me I think. Why not?
Do you want to leave Israel to escape or to find opportunities?
Both.
Don't run away from your problems.
Why not?
When you go abroad to run away from your problems you are leaving while looking backwards with regret. This can result in you heading in the wrong direction and digging yourself into a bigger hole somewhere else.
My problems in here are:
1)The society in Israel that I know are militaristic. All they talk about is "We got strong army" "we should kill all muslims" "Jews are elite, all the rest are garbage". Its getting anoying. I almost got brainwashed in school as the rest.

2)Israel is very expensive country to live in. VERY.
My ideal and my current business is locstion independent. All I need is internet connection and my phone. I will earn the same in Israel as in Belarus. My money in Belarus worth more.

3) I dont like haters. But i just hate the mindset of Israelis. Go kill some arabs, Get degree (60% got degress, most of them are useless) get marry with stupid Rabbi, Pay high taxes, Get morgage, worship your women, die poor.

4) I just dont like the girls in here. The only girls i dated got Russian decent.

IT IS NOT EVEN A PROBLEMS, JUSR MY THOUGHTS.. Im doing pretty good actually. Most Israelis in my age do not have a penny because thier not getting paid in army. They can Visit theyre girlfriends very rarely. and having the worst time of their lifes (Theyll keep serving because they afraid of Israeli society to judge them for being a "coward")

Run towards opportunities.

Your situation in Israel might suck but going abroad won't necessarily improve that. IMHO you need to identify a very specific opportunity and reason why you are going abroad in the first place. You need to identify an opportunity and pursue it.
I dont understand.
People will definitely disagree with me on this point, arguing that travel is a means and ends unto itself. While they are not wrong, I am an extremely results-oriented person who likes to do things for an explicitly defined purpose with a very specific goal in mind.


Ultimately it sounds like you have deep underlying issues that you need to confront back in Israel.
I dont know.. I just feeling not :part of the group". Thats all.
I'm not sure if an internet forum is going to give you the answers you need because none of us know your full situation - especially because this is your first post.
I know. But I appriciate the members here.
---

If you DO decide you want to go abroad, I'd look into something like this:

Make a list and try to be as objective as possible in making a decision.
Only one objective - Family. Theres nothing bonding me here.
1. Goal Setting

List the specific income goals and life experiences you want to accomplish in a 6 month or 12 month timeframe

-Reach 2K USD monthly in 6 months, 5K USD monthly in 12 months

-Date a Russian model

-Improve English/Russian/Spanish

I always to that. kind of TO DO list

2. Countries you're interested in going to

-Belarus

-Ukraine

-Russia

-Poland

-Colombia

-Thailand

-Philippines

There are lots of data sheets available about all of these spots on this forum.

3. Plan out a budget and backup plan

What if you fail? What if you run out of money?

You're right, $15K is not a giant cushion of savings. It's also not terrible for a 20 year old.

You mentioned that you can find uber cheap rentals in that second tier city and probably also date some hot Slavic chicks. Belarus probably has that going for it.

However, you mentioned that you are looking for new life experiences. You were born and partially raised in Belarus. I assume you also have Belorussian parents, which explains why you speak Russian today.
My mom is Belarussian, Yes. My dad half Belarusian half Italian.
Is it really going to be a big life change and life experience to go to Belarus?
Hell yes
Is it possible you would have a more dramatic and life-changing experience by going to a place like Thailand or Colombia?
Maybe. I would like travel to Brazil or Thailand. Not to live. i wouldnt feel "part of the group" as in Israel. Plus, the language issue.
Just my two cents.

This is what I can tell you for sure though:

Don't run away from your problems.
Why not?
Run towards opportunities.
Always.
-

Post: #7

OP its good that you speak Russian but you be better of going to Russia since Israelis don't need visas there.
Point I Want to make... the entitlement princess mentality you are dealing with is very similar to the JAP(Jewish American princess) mentality in NYC. The FSU immigrants also develop it but I am pretty sure you could find good ones if you looked. After all 1 in 4 Israelis are from the FSU. In Belarus, you most likely will have to keep hidden that your Jewish. Also if you do buy a home to live there I would advise against dumping money int REAL estate. Most FSU real estate is a big bubble environment.Being a landlord sucks as you have little recourse.But buying property in a country people want to leave is not the greatest thing to do lol. There isn't the same amount of foreign investment as in Russia to prop up the economy.
BTW....I have heard of Belorussians getting Russian passports, check on it!

Post: #8

From what I understand, Belarus is easily the most repressive country in Europe and is ruled by a dictator. Many of the freedoms you enjoy in Israel probably don't exist in Belarus. You would also probably find many aspects of daily life inefficient and bureaucratic. The government is said to have a heavy hand in the everyday lives of its citizens. Even with knowing the language, could you find yourself happy in a society that repressed? Something to really think about.

Post: #9

(09-22-2013 03:42 PM)Hencredible Casanova Wrote:  From what I understand, Belarus is easily the most repressive country in Europe and is ruled by a dictator. Many of the freedoms you enjoy in Israel probably don't exist in Belarus. You would also probably find many aspects of daily life inefficient and bureaucratic. The government is said to have a heavy hand in the everyday lives of its citizens. Even with knowing the language, could you find yourself happy in a society that repressed? Something to really think about.

I know that. I may sound selfish, and maybe I am - But this is good for me.
I make my money outside of Belarus which makes me relatively rich. probably ill have to pay extra texes - Thats all. I really dont care of politics.
Im in my own bubble.



I thinking of moving there, and go to University there to make friends (Just for fun, im not caring of the useless degree).

Maybe someone of you will know:
1. Can i get accepted?
2. do you think this is a good idea?

Post: #10

(09-23-2013 09:57 AM)ceowannabe Wrote:  

(09-22-2013 03:42 PM)Hencredible Casanova Wrote:  From what I understand, Belarus is easily the most repressive country in Europe and is ruled by a dictator. Many of the freedoms you enjoy in Israel probably don't exist in Belarus. You would also probably find many aspects of daily life inefficient and bureaucratic. The government is said to have a heavy hand in the everyday lives of its citizens. Even with knowing the language, could you find yourself happy in a society that repressed? Something to really think about.

I know that. I may sound selfish, and maybe I am - But this is good for me.
I make my money outside of Belarus which makes me relatively rich. probably ill have to pay extra texes - Thats all. I really dont care of politics.
Im in my own bubble.



I thinking of moving there, and go to University there to make friends (Just for fun, im not caring of the useless degree).

Maybe someone of you will know:
1. Can i get accepted?
2. do you think this is a good idea?

Why don't you move to the US? You would probably like it here. By the way, I'm also Russian (came to the US in 95 with my family) but left recently mostly for the same reasons that you described in regards to Israel.