Post: #251

(11-03-2015 12:59 PM)MatineeMan Wrote:  Hazaer Wrote:

How much would the 'exotic' factor be in Newcastle considering the current state of diversity there?



Newcastle is considered the provincial capital of the North East region of England and has its own growing international airport.

Like every modern western city I've been to, any girl of value cares more about the exotic wallet and charismatic style (game) of the man, rather than the exotic features per se.

Come to think of it, yeah its true.. Am deciding on a trip to northern UK, how would Newcastle compare with other places like Leeds and Glasgow which have also been frequently thrown up in the forum for the guy who is not of the 'Geordie shore' type?

Post: #252

(11-04-2015 02:59 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

(11-03-2015 12:59 PM)MatineeMan Wrote:  Hazaer Wrote:

How much would the 'exotic' factor be in Newcastle considering the current state of diversity there?



Newcastle is considered the provincial capital of the North East region of England and has its own growing international airport.

Like every modern western city I've been to, any girl of value cares more about the exotic wallet and charismatic style (game) of the man, rather than the exotic features per se.

Come to think of it, yeah its true.. Am deciding on a trip to northern UK, how would Newcastle compare with other places like Leeds and Glasgow which have also been frequently thrown up in the forum for the guy who is not of the 'Geordie shore' type?

Geordie Shore originated from and shoots in Newcastle. I've never been there but I'm guessing it wouldn't be ideal if you don't have the looks for that type of scene.

Post: #253

I didn't like Glasgow when I went, it's overly cold and the scotts are next level wasted at night, some looking for fights, it can be a really rough place at the worst of times. Leeds and Newcastle are both good choices it's up to you at the end of the day, feel free to drop me a message if you decide to stop by Newcastle, I travel a lot though so there's always a chance I won't be around or work has me by the balls and I can't do shit anyway.

Post: #254

Some of the posts about the Chav girls have been really interesting to me.

For ages, i'd been confused about this.
I often see GORGEOUS chav girls kissing guys who look like complete losers. Not particularly good looking, just wearing cheap sports clothes, no job or money, no real personality/game etc etc.
They punch so far out of their league and it fries my brain! I wonder if they know how lucky they are.
'How do they do it!!' I wonder.
You even sometimes see it on the Jeremy Kyle show! Some really pretty 17 year old girl going out with a 35 year old alcoholic who's never worked and has a few teeth missing!

You never ever see any hot chavs girls with 'normal' guys. Not even for a 'hookup'.
It's like they're not attracted to you unless they can tell from your dress/the way you speak/the way you carry yourself etc, that you are 'one of them' and you come from a broken home, have no money, like to drink/smoke all day etc.

Like someone else in this thread mentioned, you need to be in their class. These girls don't even seem to really go to bars and stuff.
You can't really get near them.
They hang around on their estate letting all of the lucky male Chavs take turns on them, or getting high round someone house etc.
This breaks my heart, because I honestly see so many hot chavs fairly close to the area where I live.




--------------

(10-23-2015 01:50 PM)CrashBangWallop Wrote:  Most girls in England are easy.

If..and this is a big if...you are seem like you belong in their class.

I have pretty much zero luck with the skanky proletarian commoners, for instance.

(10-24-2015 05:25 AM)zatara Wrote:  

(10-23-2015 01:50 PM)CrashBangWallop Wrote:  Most girls in England are easy.

If..and this is a big if...you are seem like you belong in their class.

I have pretty much zero luck with the skanky proletarian commoners, for instance.

This has been my experience across the other class conscious English speaking countries too: its extremely hard to game lower-class girls in Ireland/Australia/S.Africa if you've got an upper-middle class accent. And middle class and upwards girls will largely be massively snobby with working class guys - though this is a bit less pronounced in Oz.

Not to be said it can't be done, but most people do stick to their own class. It applies across countries too - if you're gaming some chavvy British girl and she finds out you're a well educated barrister in a different country good luck, she won't like that.

Note for non-Anglo cultures: class isn't directly related to money; people like professional soccer plays have shedloads of money, but are nearly all lower class due to their parents' occupations and the schools they went to. Lots of 'artists' or writers can be poverty stricken, but can come from good educational/cultural backgrounds so retain their parents' class. A lot of Americans seem to conflate class to personal finances, wrongly.

Post: #255

(04-07-2016 12:19 PM)subterfuge Wrote:  Some of the posts about the Chav girls have been really interesting to me.

For ages, i'd been confused about this.
I often see GORGEOUS chav girls kissing guys who look like complete losers. Not particularly good looking, just wearing cheap sports clothes, no job or money, no real personality/game etc etc.
They punch so far out of their league and it fries my brain! I wonder if they know how lucky they are.
'How do they do it!!' I wonder.
You even sometimes see it on the Jeremy Kyle show! Some really pretty 17 year old girl going out with a 35 year old alcoholic who's never worked and has a few teeth missing!

You never ever see any hot chavs girls with 'normal' guys. Not even for a 'hookup'.
It's like they're not attracted to you unless they can tell from your dress/the way you speak/the way you carry yourself etc, that you are 'one of them' and you come from a broken home, have no money, like to drink/smoke all day etc.

Like someone else in this thread mentioned, you need to be in their class. These girls don't even seem to really go to bars and stuff.
You can't really get near them.
They hang around on their estate letting all of the lucky male Chavs take turns on them, or getting high round someone house etc.
This breaks my heart, because I honestly see so many hot chavs fairly close to the area where I live.




--------------

(10-23-2015 01:50 PM)CrashBangWallop Wrote:  Most girls in England are easy.

If..and this is a big if...you are seem like you belong in their class.

I have pretty much zero luck with the skanky proletarian commoners, for instance.

(10-24-2015 05:25 AM)zatara Wrote:  

(10-23-2015 01:50 PM)CrashBangWallop Wrote:  Most girls in England are easy.

If..and this is a big if...you are seem like you belong in their class.

I have pretty much zero luck with the skanky proletarian commoners, for instance.

This has been my experience across the other class conscious English speaking countries too: its extremely hard to game lower-class girls in Ireland/Australia/S.Africa if you've got an upper-middle class accent. And middle class and upwards girls will largely be massively snobby with working class guys - though this is a bit less pronounced in Oz.

Not to be said it can't be done, but most people do stick to their own class. It applies across countries too - if you're gaming some chavvy British girl and she finds out you're a well educated barrister in a different country good luck, she won't like that.

Note for non-Anglo cultures: class isn't directly related to money; people like professional soccer plays have shedloads of money, but are nearly all lower class due to their parents' occupations and the schools they went to. Lots of 'artists' or writers can be poverty stricken, but can come from good educational/cultural backgrounds so retain their parents' class. A lot of Americans seem to conflate class to personal finances, wrongly.

I worked in London for a while and was lucky enough to work with a group of men and women who I mostly liked. I have a white collar profession. A few of the guys and I became mates pretty quickly. We would often go out and game women, hard.

When I moved back to Sydney, two blokes and one of their mates came to visit me as part of a "see Australia" trip. All three had upper middle class accents. One of them boarded at Dulwich College, but I can't remember where the other two went. Suffice to say that whenever they open their mouths they sound similar. Im not talking Prince Charles posh, but they're almost there.

When I invited them to my work for Friday night drinks, the girls adored them. Their accents went down an absolute treat. I introduced them to the secretaries and admin staff too who at the time were on about 35K a year and as dumb as door knobs. The very same can be said for every girl I introduced them to and every girl they met, if I am to believe them on the latter point. Obviously, their accent became a central point of discussion because they were keen to see whether or not it would serve as a real point of difference.

We took girls back to their hotel rooms in both Melbourne and Sydney. I witnessed them bang good looking girls from Sydney's poorer suburbs who obviously came from working class backgrounds and bang Melbourne girls who were from a Southern European background and had jobs like "beauty therapist" and "sales manager".

Women like to marry up and in my experience they think much higher of themselves than they actually present. As such they believe they have a real chance of nabbing a man of higher social status even when they're nothing more than a "Shazza from the 'burbs". Indeed, very good looking women believe they are entitled to a Prince Charming who could be a fashion model and happens to have 2M in the bank, irrespective of where she comes from, what school she went to, whether or not she has a good job and whether or not her parents are rich.

To suggest having a posh accent stops you from having one night stands with good looking working class women, as you do, is mind boggling.

Post: #256

I never suggested anything about being upper-middle class completely preventing someone from having one night stands with working class women. Nothing in game is absolute in that manner. I said it does, however, make things significantly harder. Women may say they like to marry up, but in general that's not what they're looking for from a one night stand. If you take a working class male and an upper-middle class male of roughly equal game/looks and put them chatting to a working class English speaking female she'll almost always go for her peer, the working class male.

Working class Brits/Aussies etc with game have far more aggressive game and less reserved social mannerisms than upper-middle class men with game. My PopPsych101 take on that is working class people tend to either not care for, or be unaware of, many of the unwritten social norms and expectations that keep things more civil/reserved amongst those of higher status. So they can be far more YOLO/aggressive with their game. If you don't believe me try going to both Magaluf and Val d'Isère on drinking holidays. You'll find a similar UK dominated nationality mix, a similar level of drinking, and a similar age profile in both, but two rather different game environments.

Marriage statistics do also bear this out in the long-term. Across the Anglosphere marriage within social class is far, far more common than marrying outside of it. Despite any "Prince Charming" illusions girls may have.

My point was, in general, if you're say a graduate educated white collar professional you're going to have a far, far easier time chatting up girls with at least undergrad degrees who are from either your social class or close to it. Your intelligence, education, cultural reference points etc are far more aligned - which just makes everything so much easier. If there's a choice between two girls of equal attractiveness, one working class and one middle class, its almost always better to go for the one you have more in common with - both for getting laid odds and general conversational enjoyment. The same with choosing what venue to go to - a working class or middle class nightclub. etc etc

Post: #257

@wilberforceeggmont I should have mentioned that I was specifically talking about UK chav girls.
Your story about brits in Australia makes sense to me and doesn't surprise me.
But trying to even meet a UK chav girl is a task in itself as they're often just hanging around their estate getting drunk/high/banged in someones house who they know and who is in their 'circle'. And if you happen to see a hot one walking down he street, unless you are wearing the the right clothes, are walking with a swagger, look a bit violent etc, then you won't be getting anything out of them.

Post: #258

I'm utterly bemused by this thread. Firstly why bother seeking out a 'chav girl'? Chances are she is loose as fuck, unhealthy, unattractive and has a bunch of STD's from a host of loser boyfriends... Secondly, if you live in London, why are you looking to the traveling north on weekend expeditions for women, when you could jump on a flight to EE for what would probably be a substantially cheaper, and better weekend? Just bizarre.

Post: #259

This chav lives about 5 mins from me: I fancy her big time! But I can see from facebook that all of her friends and guys she's seemingly fucking are big time chavs who are always in and out of prison / wasters etc
http://postimg.org/image/56qe7lax9/

Lots of them are hot like that.

I also read an interesting thread about pulling chavs here:
http://www.bluelight.org/vb/archive/inde...99519.html

I think it's hard for people not from the UK to understand it, but some of the people in that thread do a good job of explaining how they really are a unique group of people! It's a whole sub-culture that really can't be infiltrated!
Feels wrong to be jealous of broke male chavs!! lol - but they get so much sex it's crazy

From what i've read, The best chance a 'regular' guy has is to approach them at night in parks and stuff (not if other male chavs are there, though!), try to chat to them, and offer them cocaine/drink. Other than that, you need to be in 'their world'!

Post: #260

(04-11-2016 04:47 AM)subterfuge Wrote:  This chav lives about 5 mins from me: I fancy her big time! But I can see from facebook that all of her friends and guys she's seemingly fucking are big time chavs who are always in and out of prison / wasters etc
http://postimg.org/image/56qe7lax9/

Lots of them are hot like that.

I also read an interesting thread about pulling chavs here:
http://www.bluelight.org/vb/archive/inde...99519.html

I think it's hard for people not from the UK to understand it, but some of the people in that thread do a good job of explaining how they really are a unique group of people! It's a whole sub-culture that really can't be infiltrated!
Feels wrong to be jealous of broke male chavs!! lol - but they get so much sex it's crazy

This sounds like the bogans that we have in Australia. Some of them look ok, but most are obese and fully tatted up and hanging out with fellow bogans. Cant really have a meaningful conversation with any of them though.

Post: #261

(04-11-2016 04:47 AM)subterfuge Wrote:  This chav lives about 5 mins from me: I fancy her big time! But I can see from facebook that all of her friends and guys she's seemingly fucking are big time chavs who are always in and out of prison / wasters etc
http://postimg.org/image/56qe7lax9/

Lots of them are hot like that.

I also read an interesting thread about pulling chavs here:
http://www.bluelight.org/vb/archive/inde...99519.html

I think it's hard for people not from the UK to understand it, but some of the people in that thread do a good job of explaining how they really are a unique group of people! It's a whole sub-culture that really can't be infiltrated!
Feels wrong to be jealous of broke male chavs!! lol - but they get so much sex it's crazy

From what i've read, The best chance a 'regular' guy has is to approach them at night in parks and stuff (not if other male chavs are there, though!), try to chat to them, and offer them cocaine/drink. Other than that, you need to be in 'their world'!

If you ever find yourself being jealous of chavs...slap yourself and stop.

Post: #262

(10-24-2015 05:25 AM)zatara Wrote:  [quote='CrashBangWallop' pid='1135617' dateline='1445626224']


This sounds like the bogans that we have in Australia. Some of them look ok, but most are obese and fully tatted up and hanging out with fellow bogans. Cant really have a meaningful conversation with any of them though.

Absolutely.
I think i've heard people compare UK chavs to Aussie Bogans before. Probably not too dissimilar.
And of course you can't have a meaningful conversation with them, but then I don't think anyone would want too. I kind of hate them as they are so 'rough' and their accents grate on me etc, but yeah, some of them (like the one in the pic i posted) are sexy!

PS - THIS is the poster boy for what a UK chav looks like.
This guy has probably been boning chavs every day from the age of 12 or something! It's crazy how they all look so similar. Even their faces!!!
https://uk.news.yahoo.com/shameless-dad-...11757.html

Post: #263

Will Leeds or Nottingham be good this period (that the students are out of town) for 3 days?

Post: #264

(12-23-2016 09:23 PM)apolis Wrote:  Will Leeds or Nottingham be good this period (that the students are out of town) for 3 days?

Without students, they will both be a lot drier than usual. I'd either say wait until the holidays finish, or go to Leeds if you have to go soon.


Going back to the accent/class thing, wilberforceeggmont your anecdote is simply completely irrelevant. You are telling us a story about how English guys with slightly posh accents can get laid in a Commonwealth country? Yeah that proves nothing, what was being discussed was whether people inside the UK can smash easily with chicks from a different class.

As with most things, women look upwards for sexual partners. This includes class. The only exception would be working class woman and upper class man (in the UK upper class means at least millionaire or at least a part of the aristocracy, with a very post accent).

Also, the range of people who are middle-class is very broad. Lower middle-class can often have regional accents, but upper-middle class will almost always have a slightly 'posh accent'.

Tl;dr don't worry about class, just go for the bang.

Post: #265

(04-11-2016 04:47 AM)subterfuge Wrote:  This chav lives about 5 mins from me: I fancy her big time! But I can see from facebook that all of her friends and guys she's seemingly fucking are big time chavs who are always in and out of prison / wasters etc
http://postimg.org/image/56qe7lax9/

Lots of them are hot like that.

Wouldn't touch it with yours mate.

Post: #266

(04-11-2016 09:28 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  

(04-11-2016 04:47 AM)subterfuge Wrote:  This chav lives about 5 mins from me: I fancy her big time! But I can see from facebook that all of her friends and guys she's seemingly fucking are big time chavs who are always in and out of prison / wasters etc
http://postimg.org/image/56qe7lax9/

Lots of them are hot like that.

I also read an interesting thread about pulling chavs here:
http://www.bluelight.org/vb/archive/inde...99519.html

I think it's hard for people not from the UK to understand it, but some of the people in that thread do a good job of explaining how they really are a unique group of people! It's a whole sub-culture that really can't be infiltrated!
Feels wrong to be jealous of broke male chavs!! lol - but they get so much sex it's crazy

This sounds like the bogans that we have in Australia. Some of them look ok, but most are obese and fully tatted up and hanging out with fellow bogans. Cant really have a meaningful conversation with any of them though.

The closest American equivalent is termed 'white trash.' From
urban dictionary, I've chosen the third definition for conceptual and cultural concision:

Quote:Slang term for white people that [proto-typically] live in a trailer park. With low incomes that spend their tax returns on things like big screen TV's instead of clothes for their kids. These people tend to be mouthy and fight frequently. Generally, these people are uneducated and have little concern for personal hygiene. To see these people at their best watch [the] Jerry Springer [Show].

What happened on Jerry Springer today? Oh, the usual. Some White trash ho beat down her white trash boo because he was getting freaky wid the white trash neighbor who is married to her father.

Post: #267

Just to take it away from Chavs, which are kind of irrelevant to any man with options, Northerners seem easier than Home Counties

Post: #268

(12-26-2016 06:03 AM)Que enspastic Wrote:  Just to take it away from Chavs, which are kind of irrelevant to any man with options, Northerners seem easier than Home Counties

I have banged a few British girls in London, but all of them were from the South. I have met 'Northerners', but have not seen this 'easiness' being converted into action. Most of them, proudly claim they come from the North, but when it comes to get into action, they flake. Maybe they are 'southernized' or 'Londonized'.

I have been to Liverpool and Birmingham, but was with my ex. Been solo in Manchester and Edinburgh this summer and could not even date due to flakiness.

The questions is are Northerners accessible to outsiders-non British or bang their own Chavs-Northerners? That definitely needs to be answered by an outsider.

Post: #269

I am in York right now and coming back to UK after good few years of travel reintegration is hitting me like a culture shock. Currently swimming with landwhales who are getting more stuffed up as the holiday season comes to a close.

The northern girls are either a 6-7.5 naive dim country lass with decent style but zero self confidence who would be skeptical of your intention. they generally date way below their average sometimes shockingly ugly but blokes from their social circle. The other type of northen girls is the Geordie shore wannabes who are a notch below the southern TOWIE wannabes. They are 7.5s who with make up and embarrasingly put together slutty outfits can be a English 9 meaning if you have travelled to East Europe, Balkans or any other half decent place you would struggle to find them as hot as they find themselves. Having said that these girls are beyond easy once you crack the code and give them what they want which is a confident playaa with style and rudeboy vibes.

I think more than half of Northern white Englishmen are bald by their 30s and style is not their forte. However the good looking well dressed men are embarrasingly chasing 40 yr old fat bad teethed milfs in clubs and putting every bird on a pedastal. They adhere to a strict a-hole-is-a-hole policy and life has never been better if you are slightly chubby generic mediocre looking blue eyed English bird in a nightclub.

After Zagreb, Poznan, Krakov this is some reality check for me. I remember being 21 running after these same birds and finding immense satisfaction in banging few of them. Right now I am holding a pint in a club corner looking at the drama unfold waiting to be naturalised so that I can again find energy and motivation in swimming with the landwhales !

Post: #270

(12-26-2016 07:18 AM)NapoleonDynamighty Wrote:  I am in York right now and coming back to UK after good few years of travel reintegration is hitting me like a culture shock. Currently swimming with landwhales who are getting more stuffed up as the holiday season comes to a close.

The northern girls are either a 6-7.5 naive dim country lass with decent style but zero self confidence who would be skeptical of your intention. they generally date way below their average sometimes shockingly ugly but blokes from their social circle. The other type of northen girls is the Geordie shore wannabes who are a notch below the southern TOWIE wannabes. They are 7.5s who with make up and embarrasingly put together slutty outfits can be a English 9 meaning if you have travelled to East Europe, Balkans or any other half decent place you would struggle to find them as hot as they find themselves. Having said that these girls are beyond easy once you crack the code and give them what they want which is a confident playaa with style and rudeboy vibes.

I think more than half of Northern white Englishmen are bald by their 30s and style is not their forte. However the good looking well dressed men are embarrasingly chasing 40 yr old fat bad teethed milfs in clubs and putting every bird on a pedastal. They adhere to a strict a-hole-is-a-hole policy and life has never been better if you are slightly chubby generic mediocre looking blue eyed English bird in a nightclub.

After Zagreb, Poznan, Krakov this is some reality check for me. I remember being 21 running after these same birds and finding immense satisfaction in banging few of them. Right now I am holding a pint in a club corner looking at the drama unfold waiting to be naturalised so that I can again find energy and motivation in swimming with the landwhales !

NapoleonDynamighty What is your take on a Black American traveling to the UK?
From the reaction I got from UK girls I met in Berlin I am thinking I would do well there. I met a few that were hot and definitely not chavs!!

I am also loving that English accent, not that cockney shit but more like Elizabeth Hurley. Does that mean I like posh chicks?

Will I have any exotic value in or outside of London? Should I just stick to London and write off the rest of the country?

As a Black American will I get a pass and be more successful by being direct and aggressive or should I just play it like I do when talking typical American girls?

Post: #271

Quote:NapoleonDynamighty What is your take on a Black American traveling to the UK?
From the reaction I got from UK girls I met in Berlin I am thinking I would do well there. I met a few that were hot and definitely not chavs!!

I am also loving that English accent, not that cockney shit but more like Elizabeth Hurley. Does that mean I like posh chicks?

Will I have any exotic value in or outside of London? Should I just stick to London and write off the rest of the country?

As a Black American will I get a pass and be more successful by being direct and aggressive or should I just play it like I do when talking typical American girls?

The further away you go from London the more exotic factor you will have. Also the smaller the city in general the more exotic factor you will have.

I imagine even in the big cities outside of London such as Birmingham/Manchester you're exotic factor will still be high.

The UK is easy to rack notches up as long as you have good game/logistics etc. If you're in the top 10-20% of men you can do very well here,and having "exotic factor" would only help with that I imagine.

On being direct/aggressive it depends what type of game you do. For night game/online game i would say being direct/aggressive is the best way to go as women here especially in the big cities get alot of attention through these avenues so as a result have limited attention spans.

Post: #272

(12-26-2016 09:00 AM)tylerdurden1993 Wrote:  

Quote:NapoleonDynamighty What is your take on a Black American traveling to the UK?
From the reaction I got from UK girls I met in Berlin I am thinking I would do well there. I met a few that were hot and definitely not chavs!!

I am also loving that English accent, not that cockney shit but more like Elizabeth Hurley. Does that mean I like posh chicks?

Will I have any exotic value in or outside of London? Should I just stick to London and write off the rest of the country?

As a Black American will I get a pass and be more successful by being direct and aggressive or should I just play it like I do when talking typical American girls?

The further away you go from London the more exotic factor you will have. Also the smaller the city in general the more exotic factor you will have.

I imagine even in the big cities outside of London such as Birmingham/Manchester you're exotic factor will still be high.

The UK is easy to rack notches up as long as you have good game/logistics etc. If you're in the top 10-20% of men you can do very well here,and having "exotic factor" would only help with that I imagine.

On being direct/aggressive it depends what type of game you do. For night game/online game i would say being direct/aggressive is the best way to go as women here especially in the big cities get alot of attention through these avenues so as a result have limited attention spans.

Its funny you mentioned Manchester. I ran across this forum for African guys and they all swear Manchester is a for black mans pussy paradise. They kept saying Manchester is full of white women that will move a black man into their house. They will then cook and clean for that man. All has to do in return is lay the pipe 2 to 3 times a night to keep them satisfied. LOL my guess is these women cant be more 5 and 6s at best.

Would I be right in assuming London probably has the best looking girls in the UK? I am also guessing London has a widest range of girls as far as ethnicity. I assume the numbers in London are better than anywhere else in UK right?

If I am right on all the counts I think London would be my best bet overall. All the girls I met so far that were digging me and the feeling was mutual were all from London. Once chick was trying to get me to come to Ibiza with her!!!

Post: #273

Ogunn you might want to give Liverpool a try too. A Nigerian friend of mine says he kills it up there.

Post: #274

(12-26-2016 02:16 PM)Ethan Hunt Wrote:  Ogunn you might want to give Liverpool a try too. A Nigerian friend of mine says he kills it up there.

Ok so it looks like I should hit London, Manchester and Liverpool.

If run across girls with accents that are so strong I can barely understand them (ex Geordi Shore). I will assume they are chavs and next them!

Post: #275

(12-26-2016 02:41 PM)Ogunn Wrote:  

(12-26-2016 02:16 PM)Ethan Hunt Wrote:  Ogunn you might want to give Liverpool a try too. A Nigerian friend of mine says he kills it up there.

Ok so it looks like I should hit London, Manchester and Liverpool.

If run across girls with accents that are so strong I can barely understand them (ex Geordi Shore). I will assume they are chavs and next them!

Pretty much everyone up North has an awful accent unfortunately. Anything up to and partially including the upper-middle class is going to sound like nails on a chalkboard. Don't let it make you rule girls out though. Just get drunk enough that you don't notice it at the time and then kick them out sharpish in the morning.