Post: #1

There are already a couple threads about this but I think this is an important subject for travelers/expats and info becomes outdated fast. I recently stumbled upon Xpatulator.com and their rankings are interesting to say the least. You expect Switzerland to be expensive but Angola or Nigeria? Some of the cheapest cities in the world are in Texas. One thing that caught my attention is Budapest apparently had a dramatic fall in COL and is now one of the cheapest cities in the world. Can anyone of the board verify this? Seems like it could be a opportunity for those looking to buy a pad in central Europe.

Post: #2

Texas is dirt cheap thanks to our "business friendly" laws and endless land. You can rent an efficiency apartment in a nice area for $500 dollars in Dallas, it's even cheaper in South Texas. The bad part? Our retarded politicians.

In regards to Budapest, the country uses its own currency and had some problems recently. It had to be bailed out by the IMF and it sort of took a Greece-like pattern, thus prices are cheap. The "forint" had to be devalued. I'm not sure how cheap prices are, but now is the time to get deals.

Post: #3

(07-25-2013 04:18 AM)Cattle Rustler Wrote:  Texas is dirt cheap thanks to our "business friendly" laws and endless land. You can rent an efficiency apartment in a nice area for $500 dollars in Dallas, it's even cheaper in South Texas. The bad part? Our retarded politicians.

In regards to Budapest, the country uses its own currency and had some problems recently. It had to be bailed out by the IMF and it sort of took a Greece-like pattern, thus prices are cheap. The "forint" had to be devalued. I'm not sure how cheap prices are, but now is the time to get deals.

So I did a little looking of my own, and I'm wondering how good the deals really are. Most property for sale looks as run down as the value. Services targeted towards expats upcharge heavily for location-independence and good english. It doesn't really look "that cheap" when you consider opportunity cost but in two years I'm starting my career at 75/80k a year and I would consider these oppurtunities "investment grade"- it's unlikely the property you buy will ever be worth any less, and if that does happen, then you have a damn fine place to live in a cheap country far from Americunts.


EDIT I was in Prague this last weekend at it has steadily been one of the best VALUE city for expats (english and lax CZ laws being no small boons) but it seems to be taking a climb in price. Anyone in Prague/can confirm?

Post: #4

2012 Mercer Worldwide Cost of Living Survey:

http://www.romandie.com/news/pdf/PDF_Etu...120906.pdf

Granted, these ratings aren't really 100% accurate, but it does at least provide a general guideline.

As a side note, Tbilisi, Tashkent, Minsk and Bishkek are the cheapest cities in the FSU, and amazingly the less visited. Personally, being in a place where everything is dirt cheap adds to my travel pleasures.

In the 2013 survey, Moscow is now on 2nd position.

Post: #5

Cattle: Yea, I read about Hungary's financial woes. The country doesn't seem to be as much of a basket case as Greece though, there is economic potential there. I have heard a lot of good things about Budapest and the location is phenomenal for travel. The word around here is that it's a cheaper, larger, livelier version of Vienna. I think I might take a train there this weekend and see for myself.

Post: #6

This website has been listed before on here but I think it does a great job. I especially like being able to compare cities.

http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/

Who would have thought Bangkok is more expensive than Krakow. Looks like rent is more expensive in Bangkok.

Post: #7

Per numbeo.

Crazy in Poland the median disposable income is around 800 bucks.
Kazakhstan is 650 usd
Wow Tashkent is around 300 dollars.

Very interesting.

Post: #8

Numbeo seems to be way off. Says average wages in places like Cali Colombia are $275 a month...

That is absurd because right above it, it says average rent in a 1Br is $264...

So I guess they live on $11 a month.

That's why I wish there were ways to get legit info on all this stuff.

It's tough though because we all have varying tastes. For example if I went to Cali again, I am not staying in Granada. Too far away, I could deal with an estrato 5, don't think 6 is necessary there. Hell maybe even a 4 spot, but below that it's too grimey.

Good numbers are tough to find.

Post: #9

I was just in Budapest. Ridiculously cheap. I was popping bottles of champagne at the top club with Qwest on here for $15-17/bottle. This is retail, at the supposed best club.

Post: #10

(07-25-2013 10:54 AM)WestCoast Wrote:  Numbeo seems to be way off. Says average wages in places like Cali Colombia are $275 a month...

That is absurd because right above it, it says average rent in a 1Br is $264...

So I guess they live on $11 a month.

$275 a month is the legal minimum wage in Colombia. If by "average" the mean "median" then that's probably right. Many people make less than this doing under-the table jobs.

Many people struggle. But you're not paying your entire salary to live on your own. You live with your family. Many people can share a bedroom. I've seen 5 people share a bedroom with 3 beds. Sucks but what are you gonna do when you're a single mom with 4 kids and no real skills?

Post: #11

@slubu damn bro you're seriously killin it out in EE I have no doubt that's your future after the stories + cash flow being cheap

@sonosway sure it may be accurate from a local perspective but we're looking for more "player budgets" so to speak. I doubt anyone on here wants to go to Colombia and live on $300 a month. Shit anyone can do that but that would also be stupid ha.

Basically how can I use numbeo to help? Can't based on that Cali sheet.

Post: #12

(07-25-2013 10:54 AM)WestCoast Wrote:  Numbeo seems to be way off

I compared some cities I know, and find it good and mostly accurate.

Some comparisons are funny, like the price of a bus ticket in Rio that is 600% higher than in Minsk.

Post: #13

^ so how do I use it though?

I am not about to live in Cali for $300 a month. Or even $1000 for that matter

The real big cities are legit: NYC, Tokyo, etc.

But doesn't work well on the tier 2-3 it seems

Post: #14

(07-25-2013 11:32 AM)WestCoast Wrote:  ^ so how do I use it though?

http://www.numbeo.com/cost-of-living/comparison.jsp

Post: #15

@westcoast
You use Numbeo by using some general knowledge. I know to live the lifestyle I want in Bangkok cost around $3,000 per month.

I can see Krakow or Manila has about the same expenses I can assume I would be spending $3,000 again to live the lifestyle I want.

I think it is extremely helpful to give you a general idea about the cost of living. I am not sure why any cares about the median salary as I am not going to be partaking in the local economy to make money. I only care about how much shit cost.

Post: #16

So you just use it for items and rent?

Because even the rent in Cali is not $250. I have used the site before but again seems tier 1 useful.

I checked bogota it seemed more reasonable, but basically has to be a tier 1 city

Post: #17

(07-25-2013 05:31 AM)Prosal Wrote:  2012 Mercer Worldwide Cost of Living Survey:

http://www.romandie.com/news/pdf/PDF_Etu...120906.pdf

That sheet has San Francisco as being cheaper than Bangkok and Bogota.

Post: #18

You can see at the bottom of the list on the comparison chart how many people have updated the info over the past 18 months. Cali has 22 people vs Bangkok 173. Obviously the bigger the sample size the more likely it is to be accurate.

Post: #19

^ exactly so tier 1 generally is accurate the rest is a wash.

Problem is I am not interested in tier one, I want tier 2 info.

Post: #20

(07-25-2013 11:43 AM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  That sheet has San Francisco as being cheaper than Bangkok and Bogota.

It is a survey for expatriates, so it does make sense. BKK is rather expensive if you want to live by western standarts. For example, wine is 2 or 3 times more expensive than in Paris.

As I said, this kind of survey just provides a general guideline.

"[i]Mercer's 2013 Cost of Living Survey is one of the world’s most comprehensive, and is designed to help multinational companies and governments determine compensation allowances for their expatriate employees. New York is used as the base city, and all cities are compared against it. Currency movements are measured against the US dollar.

The survey covers 214 cities across five continents and measures the comparative cost of over 200 items in each location, including housing, transportation, food, clothing, household goods, and entertainment.

The difference in cost for these items can be dramatic. For example the cost of a cup of coffee in Managua, Nicaragua is $1.54 compared to $8.29 in Moscow; a fast food hamburger meal is $3.62 in Kolkata (Calcutta), India, versus $13.49 in Caracas, and a cinema ticket is $5.91 in Johannesburg compared to $20.10 in London. These are but a few examples of the thousands of comparisons to be found in Mercer’s full report that aid employers in setting cost of living and other expatriate allowances.

Mercer produces individual cost of living and rental accommodation cost reports for each city surveyed.

The cost of expatriate housing is typically the biggest expense for employers, and it plays an important part in determining the rankings. The Russian capital of Moscow follows Luanda as the second most expensive city because of high costs for rental accommodation and imported goods and services commonly purchased by expatriates commanding a premium. A luxury two bedroom unfurnished apartment rental for one month in Moscow is $4,600 a month or 14 times as much than Karachi. Rounding out the top five most expensive cities for expatriate living, which also have pricey rental accommodations, are Tokyo, the Chad city Ndjamena, and Singapore."

Post: #21

Its really important to know where money goes when calculating these figures.

A lot of expats might report very high food bills but then when you examine the numbers they might be spending a good portion of it eating lots of imported cheese in Asia or Sushi in the Ukraine. As a rule if you are willing to eat the local cuisine, food abroad is not expensive.

Then there is rent. For instance I live in Mexico and I visit websites with other Americans living here citing their rent numbers and it makes my head fucking explode because it seems way to high. Then I look at what they are getting and its gated neighborhoods with mostly other gringos who have an irrational fear of living in middle class Mexican neighborhoods. So naturally you have to examine what type of neighborhood/housing these expats are citing for their figures.

Local watering holes: Many expats only drink in expat bars or very upscale joints because they refuse to associate with locals unless the locals are at the top of the food chain. The city I live in Mexico has a wide variety of places to drink and without question some of the most fun times I have had here were in bars where beers are under a dollar/locals drink/do lines til they forget their own name. Conversely the upper scale joints never leave me feeling I got my moneys worth. As usual when someone cites an entertainment budget for a city I have trouble accepting 1000 dollars as the threshold especially if it eclipses a local professional’s salary.

Finally women/families: I am a bachelor and I suspect until I reach grey hair on my balls stage I doubt I will feel the need to take in a female roommate. I will also never have children. That said many expats give and give in these matters. They give their wife a salary, help out her family and send their kids to expensive international schools. Often they may hire maids, chaffers, baby sitters and gardeners to help create a comfortable family life(don’t believe me read through some of these guys expenses they run the gamut from 500- 5000 a month for the same city/country). BTW knowing how to pamper your family as an expatriate is great if you want that and can afford it but for the purposes of men here (who generally subscribe to a bachelor lifestyle) it does little to get an idea of what the cost of living abroad may be for someone like themselves.

I guess all I am getting at is really think critical about the numbers citied as living expenses by expat websites and when in doubt turn to a RVF member for believable figures.

Post: #22

@bacon... Yes, I like that "when in doubt turn to a RVF member for believable figures."

I've been researching the cheapest places to live in the world from the perspective of "I'm down to my last $1000 dollars and I have got to get out of the U.S. NOW"... "Where am I going?"... "Where will $1000 buy me a new start?"... One answer is Nicaragua where you can rent a one bedroom tin roof dwelling with running water and electricity for as little as 70 bucks a month. I just met someone who bought a house in Boaco for four grand. I met another American guy who started a restaurant in Masaya for $250. I love five star, but one star is my life blood, my base survival mode of game.

I would love to read more on the forum about the best places to live on under $500 bucks a month. One star living is never easy, but if you had to do it, where would you do it and why?

Post: #23

Not to sound like an expert,but in Cuba, even in Havana , one can rent a 1 bdr for about 250 USD and if you eat carefuly local food, you'll be ok under 500USD/per month. Booze and cigs are super cheap too and girls love foreigners.
USA is not expensive either.. there are many places you can get a studio under 450 USD.

Post: #24

is there any post of the cost of living per month that had to affront some members of the fórum during their visits? would be very useful!

Post: #25

International schools are a waste of money.Most aren't good at all. They have teachers who come and go and its all show. They just want money.
My friend who lived in Ukraine was a teacher at one and his kid could attend free but he refused. He rathr send him to a private Ukrainian school. Thats what parents should do. Much cheaper than an international school.