Post: #26

The seasonings in the sauce make a huge difference. I always put cheese on the dough first, then the sauce and toppings, with more cheese. You can also season the pizza dough, my mom used to make me rosemary and pepperoni pizza bread and then put whatever I wanted on it like a normal pizza.

Just play with as many combos as you want to figure out what you like.

Post: #27

I just completed my second attempt at a pizza sauce (the pizza I made was a simple margarita). This is more or less the only proper cooking I have attempted in my life. I didn't follow a recipe this time. Just wanted to prepare a simple tomato sauce (from tinned plummed tomatoes and tomato puree) and add seasoning to see how it turns out.

The results were pretty dreadful. And tasted very similar to a tinned pizza sauce I have used in the past.

I feel I'm back at square one. None of the seasonings I used (such as chilli powder, paprika and fennel seeds) tasted good to me in the final product.

Anyone got any suggestions for seasonings which are essential to a good sauce? I know it is subjective and all...

Post: #28

onions, garlic, basil, oregano, rosemary off the top of my head. Adding some robust olive oil, accents the flavor well imo.

Post: #29

Post: #30

(05-04-2013 05:45 PM)cardguy Wrote:  I just completed my second attempt at a pizza sauce (the pizza I made was a simple margarita). This is more or less the only proper cooking I have attempted in my life. I didn't follow a recipe this time. Just wanted to prepare a simple tomato sauce (from tinned plummed tomatoes and tomato puree) and add seasoning to see how it turns out.

The results were pretty dreadful. And tasted very similar to a tinned pizza sauce I have used in the past.

I feel I'm back at square one. None of the seasonings I used (such as chilli powder, paprika and fennel seeds) tasted good to me in the final product.

Anyone got any suggestions for seasonings which are essential to a good sauce? I know it is subjective and all...

Tomato sauce isn't just tomato.

If you go through soups in a supermarket you'll see some with tomato-style ingredients. The key to a sauce is finding what you like and grinding them down so they're actually part of the sauce and not just lumped into it.

Having a grinder, blender and a big pot for cooking them in helps.

Tomatoes on their own taste like crap for me. I add all sorts of things to the mix and I learned it from a type of soup I had years ago. Forgot the name but I might remember it sometime.

Post: #31

As it happens. I love tomatoes. But - you make some good points.

I am just trying to find a simple recipe that tastes good. So - that I no longer have to put up with the crap served up by supermarkets.

Post: #32

A couple friends and I did homemade pizza last week for the first time, it turned out good. We just used pizza tomato paste, nothing special, though me and another friend did a white pizza where u just put garlic and oil on as substitute for the tomato sauce.

Post: #33

I LOVE cooking and pizza as well (actually had some Ham/Pineapple pizza last night)-I made a DANK pizza for a Ukrainian chick in DC last December.

It's a great date idea if you can cook for a girl. She got hollered at by Salvadorenos in Columbia Heights, so I offered to cook for her when she hit me up and was REALLY upset.

We hit up Whole Foods, walked around perusing the place and checking out the things to eat. This is something I LOVE doing with a girl, plays on the whole boyfriend/provider thing well, and you can pick out what you want to cook and the wine to go with it.

We picked out the tomato sauce, some mushrooms and peppers for toppings, a brown rice crust (if I believe correctly?), and feta, mozzarella, and goat cheese. (I already had olive oil and a bunch of spices at home-which to me, spices are EVERYTHING when it comes to cooking). When I cook I get this zen like feeling, I love it. I heated up the sauce, threw in Oregano, Basil, Rosemary, some Italian seasoning. Olive oil-ed up the crust, put on the sauce, and the cheese on top, peppers- and some drizzle of Sriracha and Honey to top it all. We were already drinking some nice Pinot Grigio to compliment it. I like a thick crust, but this was one was VERY thin and full of sauce and cheese-but it was AMAZING. She loved it and we had a great time afterwards. It was about 50 bucks for everything and the wine (I had already known/been hanging out with her though).

It was funny though cause she had not much of ANY idea that it would actually come out well and LOVED it. To see a girl think, 'Oh he's gonna cook something' and kinda being like 'Eh...okay' to then seeing you can REALLY cook something is priceless. Its a VERY nice skill to add to your repertoire and stand out from others. Play to your strengths.

Allrecipes.com is always a decent place to check out info or get ideas for things to cook or try out

Post: #34

I hate it when I see food threads on RVF, because I instantly know I can't just let shit be without getting involved.

There are many different kinds of bread with sauce and cheese on top. Most of them are not Pizza.

Pizza is Pizza. It's a dish. This is not 'nam, this is pizza. There are rules.

When you're talking about pizza, you're talking about Pizza Napoletana. Most people probably wouldn't like traditional Pizza Napoletana, but I love it. The crust is not crispy; it's incredibly soft. The middle of the pizza is borderline soupy. The flavors are incredible. Here are the basic guidelines:

-Your dough must have a high water content. It's a very wet dough.
-It must be cooked at 800F, minimum. Traditionally done in a woodburning oven, but you can do this on home ovens, which I'll explain.
-The tomato sauce is simply canned tomatoes run through a food mill. It is not cooked
-The mozzarella is low moisture. You simply can't get mozzarella here like what they use in Naples. The best American brand however is Bel Gioso
-A few leaves of basil are scattered over the top for Margherita
-A swirl of olive oil goes over the top.

This is a traditional Pizza Margherita. It looks like this:


Whatever you think is the best pizza you've had, or the "style" of pizza you prefer, believe me when I say this is the best pizza in the world.

Before I get into a dickswinging contest, let me say that my info on pizza comes from a pizzaiolo that worked in the best pizzeria in Naples. You can ask 1000 people in Italy where the best pizza comes from; they will say Naples. You can ask 1000 people in Naples where the best pizza comes from, they'll tell you the restaurant where my friend worked.

Now, to make pizza like this takes years, and it would take pages upon pages to detail the process. There's a guy that has gotten this shit down as good as anyone could from home so I'll just link his website. If you want to learn to make the best pizza, take some time and check it out: http://www.varasanos.com/PizzaRecipe.htm

I haven't tasted his pizza, but after watching his methods and knowing how my friend makes pizza I can say that he's much closer than even some of the best pizzerias in NY.

In his blog you'll see he recommends taking off the oven lock and running his cleaning cycle which gets the oven hot enough. This isn't necessary IMO. A good alternative is buying a solid baking stone or even terra cotta tile will work, setting it about 18 inches away from the broiler on your oven, and run your broiler for 20 minutes to get it piping fucking hot. Turn the broiler off but keep the oven on full blast and slip your pizza in and this is the best way to emulate a wood burning oven.

Any other questions hit me up.

Post: #35

Pizza was originally invented in turkey wasn't it?

Post: #36

People have been baking bread for thousands of years. Who knows who decided to form a disk and put toppings on; we'll never know. Much of Italian cuisine is Greek in origin, who they themselves were heavily influenced by the Persians.

Everyone associates Italian food with tomatoes, but tomatoes didn't even hit europe until the 1500s. Even then it was used mostly for ornaments as many early breeds of tomatoes were unpalatable or even poisonous. As far as anyone can tell, tomatoes weren't really used in Italian cooking until the 1700s. One of my favorite ways to make pizza is without tomato sauce and to brush the crust with cream. Top it with fennel sausage and mushrooms; that's a very authentic pizza pie and it's fucking awesome.

Post: #37

I was in Rome recently. The bases on the pizzas were very good - but nowhere really did any with a great sauce (the most important part for me). Still - they were nice pizzas. But I have had better in England.

Will definitely try out Naples one day. Although I think New York would a be a good place to check out as well.

Post: #38

(05-05-2013 01:23 PM)thedude3737 Wrote:  Now, to make pizza like this takes years, and it would take pages upon pages to detail the process. There's a guy that has gotten this shit down as good as anyone could from home so I'll just link his website. If you want to learn to make the best pizza, take some time and check it out: http://www.varasanos.com/PizzaRecipe.htm

When I found Varasano's New York Pizza Dough recipe a few years ago, I got into a fix where I had to try to make good pizza at home. I wasn't willing to go through the extreme measures of hacking my oven and potentially causing lots of other problems down the line, so I kept playing around with the dough recipe and finally came upon one that works fairly well for most people's home ovens.

There's Peter Reihnhart's Pizza Dough Recipe which worked fairly well, until I found something totally different that didn't involve much kneading.

Here, I came upon a recipe that only involves a food processor and makes the closest dough to a New York Style pizza I've been able to make at home here in California. Check it out, here at Serious Eats.

If any of you guys are ever in New York, you should do yourself a favor and try out every slice they have at Artichoke Basille's Pizza. It's fucking delicious stuff.

Post: #39

Rome is a very different style. I didn't have any good pizza there either. In fact, I didn't have any good pizza in Italy, but I didn't go to Naples or Campania.

Italian food is hyper regional. Each region has its specialty. When other regions try to emulate dishes that aren't their specialty the result can be disastrous. The best fresh pasta and bolognese sauce comes from Emilia Romagna. You want wild boar and fresh shelling beans, go to Tuscany. For risotto go to Veneto or Friuli. Truffles go to Piedmont. Spicier Italian food, go to Calabria, Sicily, or Sardegna. Bread, Mozzarella, Pizza, go to Campania.

Roman food in general tends to be heavier, greasier, and meat-laden. As far as culinary destinations go in Italy, it wouldn't be my #1, although I'm a big fan of the famous amatriciana

Post: #40

(05-05-2013 11:07 PM)thedude3737 Wrote:  People have been baking bread for thousands of years. Who knows who decided to form a disk and put toppings on; we'll never know. Much of Italian cuisine is Greek in origin, who they themselves were heavily influenced by the Persians.

Everyone associates Italian food with tomatoes, but tomatoes didn't even hit europe until the 1500s. Even then it was used mostly for ornaments as many early breeds of tomatoes were unpalatable or even poisonous. As far as anyone can tell, tomatoes weren't really used in Italian cooking until the 1700s. One of my favorite ways to make pizza is without tomato sauce and to brush the crust with cream. Top it with fennel sausage and mushrooms; that's a very authentic pizza pie and it's fucking awesome.

Wiki actually says it's Greek in origin. Figures. My girl told me that it was Turkish, she's Turkish. They seem to think that the Greek stole just about everything from them
I also prefer most of my Italian food with other main ingredients other than tomato. For example I prefer white pizzas. And with pasta I prefer an alfredo or pesto over a tomato sauce, though I will put tomatoes on my white pizza and in my pesto pasta.

But to Cardguy, I would suggest throwing some toppings on there to give it a little more flavor, then you could maybe look past the sauce.

Post: #41

Those Pizza Lab links are great. Really useful stuff.

http://slice.seriouseats.com/archives/20...pizza.html

Post: #42

This tomato sauce recipe has gotten alot of hype on the internet. And it couldn't be any simpler...

http://smittenkitchen.com/blog/2010/01/t...nd-onions/

My next plan is to make this - and just add some italian seasoning, salt and pepper. In future when I make it - I may see if some sugar is useful as well.

My requirements are different to most. Since I am lazy and am looking for something simple. Also - I am happy with the supermarket plain bases you can buy. Waitrose - here in the UK - stock some nice ones which are specially imported from restaurants in Naples. To me - I am happy using them as opposed to making up fresh ones myself. Also - Sainsburys stock plain bases. Which whilst less fancy - are still okay for my requirements.

It is not perfect - but then again I don't have a pizza oven. I am just looking for something which is much better than the ready made pizzas I usually heat up from supermarkets. I will save the special pizzas for when I visit my favourite pizza restaurants.

Post: #43

(05-06-2013 02:02 AM)InternationPlayboy Wrote:  Wiki actually says it's Greek in origin. Figures. My girl told me that it was Turkish, she's Turkish. They seem to think that the Greek stole just about everything from them

Hah, typical. My dad was raised in Turkey. Turks and Greeks definitely exchanged a lot of food and culture, but pizza is not one of them. Italians have been making some form of pizza for hundreds of years, while the Greco-Turkish conflict happened in the early 1900s...

Post: #44

(05-06-2013 10:28 AM)cardguy Wrote:  This tomato sauce recipe has gotten alot of hype on the internet. And it couldn't be any simpler...

http://smittenkitchen.com/blog/2010/01/t...nd-onions/

My next plan is to make this - and just add some italian seasoning, salt and pepper. In future when I make it - I may see if some sugar is useful as well.

My requirements are different to most. Since I am lazy and am looking for something simple. Also - I am happy with the supermarket plain bases you can buy. Waitrose - here in the UK - stock some nice ones which are specially imported from restaurants in Naples. To me - I am happy using them as opposed to making up fresh ones myself. Also - Sainsburys stock plain bases. Which whilst less fancy - are still okay for my requirements.

It is not perfect - but then again I don't have a pizza oven. I am just looking for something which is much better than the ready made pizzas I usually heat up from supermarkets. I will save the special pizzas for when I visit my favourite pizza restaurants.

That's a tomato sauce for pasta. It's a very classic pasta sauce typical of northern italian cooking, and it is delicious.

I'm tellin ya, for pizza, try taking really good quality canned tomatoes; they don't have to be san marzano, give em a rinse under water, drain them well, and puree them with a blender or better yet, a food mill. Add a little salt. It's the only pizza sauce you'll need. If you want to add herbs, add fresh. A classically made pizza marinara is tomato sauce, fresh oregano, sliced garlic, and olive oil. No cheese. It's pretty great.

Post: #45

Okay - I will try your approach as well - since it sounds simple enough. Although I will need to get hold of a blender.

The reason I am going to try the pasta sauce on the pizza - is that it is the same sauce that the Pizza Labs guy recommends:

http://slice.seriouseats.com/archives/20...ecipe.html

http://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2010/...sauce.html

[EDIT] Above is the pizza sauce I will try - which was inspired by the pasta sauce mentioned earlier.

Post: #46

(05-06-2013 12:25 PM)thedude3737 Wrote:  

(05-06-2013 10:28 AM)cardguy Wrote:  This tomato sauce recipe has gotten alot of hype on the internet. And it couldn't be any simpler...

http://smittenkitchen.com/blog/2010/01/t...nd-onions/

My next plan is to make this - and just add some italian seasoning, salt and pepper. In future when I make it - I may see if some sugar is useful as well.

My requirements are different to most. Since I am lazy and am looking for something simple. Also - I am happy with the supermarket plain bases you can buy. Waitrose - here in the UK - stock some nice ones which are specially imported from restaurants in Naples. To me - I am happy using them as opposed to making up fresh ones myself. Also - Sainsburys stock plain bases. Which whilst less fancy - are still okay for my requirements.

It is not perfect - but then again I don't have a pizza oven. I am just looking for something which is much better than the ready made pizzas I usually heat up from supermarkets. I will save the special pizzas for when I visit my favourite pizza restaurants.

That's a tomato sauce for pasta. It's a very classic pasta sauce typical of northern italian cooking, and it is delicious.

I'm tellin ya, for pizza, try taking really good quality canned tomatoes; they don't have to be san marzano, give em a rinse under water, drain them well, and puree them with a blender or better yet, a food mill. Add a little salt. It's the only pizza sauce you'll need. If you want to add herbs, add fresh. A classically made pizza marinara is tomato sauce, fresh oregano, sliced garlic, and olive oil. No cheese. It's pretty great.

Do you heat up this sauce in a pan or just apply it straight to the pizza?

Post: #47

I see a lot of people hit up the ingredients, but I'd just like to add in my experience a pizza stone makes a HUGE difference.

I heat it up real hot in the oven, around 500 degrees and then drop the pizza on it. This lets the bottom crust get nice and crisp quickly while the heat in the cooks the pizza.

Works even better if you have a propane grill outside. Toss the burners on Med/High-High, put the stone on, let it get really hot for 10-15 mins, toss the pizza on, close the top and let it just bake in there for 5-10 mins.

Heres the stone I use if you want to see what i'm talking about.
http://www.amazon.com/Old-Stone-Oven-446...izza+stone

Just one note .. if you go with a stone they need to be broken in, first few times might be a little sticky. I don't wash it with soap or water, just scrape it off and let it sizzle in the over for a little bit.

Post: #48

(05-06-2013 01:52 PM)cardguy Wrote:  Do you heat up this sauce in a pan or just apply it straight to the pizza?

Apply straight to the pizza

Post: #49

Cheers! thedude3737,

I am going to try your idea next since it is so simple.

Will update this thread later in the week.

Post: #50

(05-05-2013 01:23 PM)thedude3737 Wrote:  I hate it when I see food threads on RVF, because I instantly know I can't just let shit be without getting involved.

There are many different kinds of bread with sauce and cheese on top. Most of them are not Pizza.

Pizza is Pizza. It's a dish. This is not 'nam, this is pizza. There are rules.

When you're talking about pizza, you're talking about Pizza Napoletana. Most people probably wouldn't like traditional Pizza Napoletana, but I love it. The crust is not crispy; it's incredibly soft. The middle of the pizza is borderline soupy. The flavors are incredible. Here are the basic guidelines:

-Your dough must have a high water content. It's a very wet dough.
-It must be cooked at 800F, minimum. Traditionally done in a woodburning oven, but you can do this on home ovens, which I'll explain.
-The tomato sauce is simply canned tomatoes run through a food mill. It is not cooked
-The mozzarella is low moisture. You simply can't get mozzarella here like what they use in Naples. The best American brand however is Bel Gioso
-A few leaves of basil are scattered over the top for Margherita
-A swirl of olive oil goes over the top.

This is a traditional Pizza Margherita. It looks like this:


Whatever you think is the best pizza you've had, or the "style" of pizza you prefer, believe me when I say this is the best pizza in the world.

Before I get into a dickswinging contest, let me say that my info on pizza comes from a pizzaiolo that worked in the best pizzeria in Naples. You can ask 1000 people in Italy where the best pizza comes from; they will say Naples. You can ask 1000 people in Naples where the best pizza comes from, they'll tell you the restaurant where my friend worked.

Now, to make pizza like this takes years, and it would take pages upon pages to detail the process. There's a guy that has gotten this shit down as good as anyone could from home so I'll just link his website. If you want to learn to make the best pizza, take some time and check it out: http://www.varasanos.com/PizzaRecipe.htm

I haven't tasted his pizza, but after watching his methods and knowing how my friend makes pizza I can say that he's much closer than even some of the best pizzerias in NY.

In his blog you'll see he recommends taking off the oven lock and running his cleaning cycle which gets the oven hot enough. This isn't necessary IMO. A good alternative is buying a solid baking stone or even terra cotta tile will work, setting it about 18 inches away from the broiler on your oven, and run your broiler for 20 minutes to get it piping fucking hot. Turn the broiler off but keep the oven on full blast and slip your pizza in and this is the best way to emulate a wood burning oven.

Any other questions hit me up.

I was just watching something on Naples and they showed a traditional pizza restaurant. The pizzas looked like the one in your pic. They made it just like you explained.