Play-Off season is here. Thats when I begin watching Nba.

Westbrook needs to GTFO. Tonight was a perfect example of why (I hope) he does not win the MVP. Even though I have money on it because I knew he would come out like a mad man this year to prove himself, performances like these (which are not that infrequent) just irk the hell out of me. "Record performing night"... naw... record amount of shit. Just jacking up trash left and right. Not my style of basketball at all.

He is a special and great talent, 100% a beast, but nobody really gives a fuck about a loaded up stat sheet while still taking a fat L like that. The man took almost 50 shots, that is Kobe territory; but the things is if Kobe is jacking up that many shots, 90% of the time his team is getting the W, somehow, some way. Garbage from 3 point line tonight as well when his team was pulling it close to within 5 points late the man bricks two wide open 3-point shots.

People now talking about his historic night of a 50 point tribble double when Harden did the exact same thing (very quietly) during the season.

Call me salty but I hate bummy players that just load up the stats. All is useless if you don't win. You gotta fucking win. The NBA is the one league where one player can literally tilt the tables towards a W. Lebron James has proven this for nearly a decade now. Without Lebron, the Cavs are a lottery team. I am sure OKC is a lottery team as well mins Westbrook but he should be showing up a bit better and commanding things to a point where wins are close. It is only game 2 but considering he had to do all this and his team still falls short I am not sure if they will even get a game. Maybe I am wrong, who knows.

Harden should get the MVP as his team is that much better (with his help of course).

/Rant

With one exception, every year since 1980 the MVP has gone to the "featured scorer" on one of the three teams with the best record.

The one exception MVP went to Steve Nash, is still widely criticized, and the Suns had the 4th best record.

This year, the three best records were the Warriors, Spurs, and Rockets. So, that means, by historical standards, either Harden or Leonard should win. I'm inclined to give the MVP to Kawaii after reading about (on five thirty eight) the huge amount of easy baskets the Rockets gave up because Harden was complaining about officiating.

(04-20-2017 12:08 AM)kosko Wrote:  Westbrook needs to GTFO. Tonight was a perfect example of why (I hope) he does not win the MVP. Even though I have money on it because I knew he would come out like a mad man this year to prove himself, performances like these (which are not that infrequent) just irk the hell out of me. "Record performing night"... naw... record amount of shit. Just jacking up trash left and right. Not my style of basketball at all.

He is a special and great talent, 100% a beast, but nobody really gives a fuck about a loaded up stat sheet while still taking a fat L like that. The man took almost 50 shots, that is Kobe territory; but the things is if Kobe is jacking up that many shots, 90% of the time his team is getting the W, somehow, some way. Garbage from 3 point line tonight as well when his team was pulling it close to within 5 points late the man bricks two wide open 3-point shots.

People now talking about his historic night of a 50 point tribble double when Harden did the exact same thing (very quietly) during the season.

Call me salty but I hate bummy players that just load up the stats. All is useless if you don't win. You gotta fucking win. The NBA is the one league where one player can literally tilt the tables towards a W. Lebron James has proven this for nearly a decade now. Without Lebron, the Cavs are a lottery team. I am sure OKC is a lottery team as well mins Westbrook but he should be showing up a bit better and commanding things to a point where wins are close. It is only game 2 but considering he had to do all this and his team still falls short I am not sure if they will even get a game. Maybe I am wrong, who knows.

Harden should get the MVP as his team is that much better (with his help of course).

/Rant

He has low basketball IQ. In the final minutes he has a much better chance of getting points by driving and getting fouled or freeing up a teammate when he gets doubled than by taking a hero shot 3.

Yet he still does it over and over again. I know he nailed that ridiculous buzzer beater on the night he broke the record, but the other 9/10 shots he took at the final buzzer aren't being talked about... Because he missed them.

While I respect you guys' opinions', I would tend to disagree. One way to gauge whether or not a player is MVP quality or not is considering win/loss ratio of his team if you removed him from the roster.

Are you going to sit here with a straight face and tell me the Thunder would hold a higher seed than the Rockets if neither man suited up all year?

Secondly, with all due respect to the greatness of Harden the Houston lineup is rich with playmakers who can create their own shots. I present to you Patrick Beverly, Trevor Ariza, Eric Gordon (bench) Lou Williams (bench). All those players have contributed in the 2-0 lead the Rockets currently enjoy. Beverly in particular has been a killer in this series when Harden was either ineffective (Game 2 1st half) or on the bench. Westbrook hasn't enjoyed that type of security, as his team let a double digit lead evaporate late 3rd quarter last night on their way to collapsing. I also recall a couple of Russ' wide open dimes that were blown at the rim by Enis Kantor & Taj Gibson. Outside of Victor Oladipo who on that squad can create their own offense?

On the subject of shot selection, I tend to agree that Westbrook settles for jumpers a little too much in some key situations however, that is facet of his game that has improved. A lot of times, with players as dynamic as he is you have 4 other guys standing around waiting for him to create something for himself or them. This creates a less movement and jams open lanes.
As a coach, you never want your star launching 35+ shots but keep in mind this team was originally constructed for Durant to be main scorer with Westbrook playing a complimentary role. One of the areas OKC will have to address in the off season is that consistent 2nd & 3rd contributor to spell Westbrook.

As for the Kobe taking more shots equating to more wins for the Lakers? Quite the contrary when you look at his last few seasons. Take a look at his last 4 seasons when they didn't post better than 45 wins. Kobe's FGA steadily climbed after the championship years but the win % didn't follow. Especially during the post-Shaq seasons/Pre-Gasol when he was in a similar position as a one-man show.

With all that being said, I wouldn't lose sleep if Harden wins MVP. I just believe you have to take into account the whole picture.

Playoffs MVP is a much more meaningful award in my opinion. I don't understand the fuss behind season MVP.

(04-20-2017 11:37 AM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  Are you going to sit here with a straight face and tell me the Thunder would hold a higher seed than the Rockets if neither man suited up all year?

You are assuming either team would make the playoffs without Russell or James. While possible, that does not seem likely.

Either guy has a great case for winning it. I could care less which one gets it and I am a Rockets and Spurs fan.

(04-20-2017 07:24 AM)Nascimento Wrote:  

(04-20-2017 12:08 AM)kosko Wrote:  Westbrook needs to GTFO. Tonight was a perfect example of why (I hope) he does not win the MVP. Even though I have money on it because I knew he would come out like a mad man this year to prove himself, performances like these (which are not that infrequent) just irk the hell out of me. "Record performing night"... naw... record amount of shit. Just jacking up trash left and right. Not my style of basketball at all.

He is a special and great talent, 100% a beast, but nobody really gives a fuck about a loaded up stat sheet while still taking a fat L like that. The man took almost 50 shots, that is Kobe territory; but the things is if Kobe is jacking up that many shots, 90% of the time his team is getting the W, somehow, some way. Garbage from 3 point line tonight as well when his team was pulling it close to within 5 points late the man bricks two wide open 3-point shots.

People now talking about his historic night of a 50 point tribble double when Harden did the exact same thing (very quietly) during the season.

Call me salty but I hate bummy players that just load up the stats. All is useless if you don't win. You gotta fucking win. The NBA is the one league where one player can literally tilt the tables towards a W. Lebron James has proven this for nearly a decade now. Without Lebron, the Cavs are a lottery team. I am sure OKC is a lottery team as well mins Westbrook but he should be showing up a bit better and commanding things to a point where wins are close. It is only game 2 but considering he had to do all this and his team still falls short I am not sure if they will even get a game. Maybe I am wrong, who knows.

Harden should get the MVP as his team is that much better (with his help of course).

/Rant

He has low basketball IQ. In the final minutes he has a much better chance of getting points by driving and getting fouled or freeing up a teammate when he gets doubled than by taking a hero shot 3.

Yet he still does it over and over again. I know he nailed that ridiculous buzzer beater on the night he broke the record, but the other 9/10 shots he took at the final buzzer aren't being talked about... Because he missed them.

This current generation is all about the 3 pointer. 2 points isn't sexy enough. Each guy between Steph, James, Russell, etc etc. is constantly trying to one up each other on the nastiest splash at the most clutch time.

Sound fundamental basketball, however has not changed. The Cavs did not win by the 3 pointer last year. Lebron would never be against a dirty 2 pointer if he knew he could get the ball back again with enough time, defense, and effort.

Taking the easy shot requires alot of faith and trust. Maturity as well.

(04-20-2017 11:54 AM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(04-20-2017 11:37 AM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  Are you going to sit here with a straight face and tell me the Thunder would hold a higher seed than the Rockets if neither man suited up all year?

You are assuming either team would make the playoffs without Russell or James. While possible, that does not seem likely.

Either guy has a great case for winning it. I could care less which one gets it and I am a Rockets and Spurs fan.

I'm not assuming either squad would qualify for the playoffs in the rough and tumble Western Conference.

However, if you gave me a choice of starting lineups minus Harden and Westbrook-I wouldn't hesitate to choose the Houston's.

(04-20-2017 12:01 PM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  

(04-20-2017 11:54 AM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(04-20-2017 11:37 AM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  Are you going to sit here with a straight face and tell me the Thunder would hold a higher seed than the Rockets if neither man suited up all year?

You are assuming either team would make the playoffs without Russell or James. While possible, that does not seem likely.

Either guy has a great case for winning it. I could care less which one gets it and I am a Rockets and Spurs fan.

I'm not assuming either squad would qualify for the playoffs in the rough and tumble Western Conference.

However, if you gave me a choice of starting lineups minus Harden and Westbrook-I wouldn't hesitate to choose the Houston's.

Bro, unless one of them suddenly came into his own, I just cannot see how this team could make the playoffs without James. If he torn his ACL tomorrow, they would be swept quickly.

Houston may have the better supporting cast, but both of these teams are at a high risk of not getting past the second round, because they only have 1 superstar each. Most NBA history shows that you need a minimum of 2 to win a championship. Cavs have 2-3 depending on your views, Warriors have 3-4. Even Chicago has 2 with Wade and Butler and they are giving the Celts the business right now.

Either way, Russell and James have performed miracles to get both their teams this far. Both are very deserving of the award.

So as a Spurs fan, would you agree that Leonard is a dark horse for the MVP award?

(04-20-2017 12:33 PM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  So as a Spurs fan, would you agree that Leonard is a dark horse for the MVP award?

Nope. Harden or Westbrook. There can only be one between these two in my mind.

Wanna talk about supporting casts? Even if they are old, the Spurs has two other old superstars and a deep bench. They also have one of the best coaches to ever coach the game in history. OKC nor Houston has that. You could make a strong argument that the Spurs could still make the playoffs without Leonard.

Any streams for tonights games?

(04-20-2017 02:03 PM)nomadbrah Wrote:  Any streams for tonights games?

https://www.reddit.com/r/nbastreams/

Updated with quality streams every night

(04-20-2017 01:16 PM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(04-20-2017 12:33 PM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  So as a Spurs fan, would you agree that Leonard is a dark horse for the MVP award?

Nope. Harden or Westbrook. There can only be one between these two in my mind.

Wanna talk about supporting casts? Even if they are old, the Spurs has two other old superstars and a deep bench. They also have one of the best coaches to ever coach the game in history. OKC nor Houston has that. You could make a strong argument that the Spurs could still make the playoffs without Leonard.

Agreed. Although Leonard isn't a MVP candidate he is THE BEST two way player in the league. No need for MVP when you have that. If he doesn't make All-NBA first team it's a sham.

(04-20-2017 11:37 AM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  Are you going to sit here with a straight face and tell me the Thunder would hold a higher seed than the Rockets if neither man suited up all year?

This is some Skip Spencer hot-take you've got going.

http://www.cbssports.com/nba/news/vegas-...very-team/

Vegas pegged the Thunder over/under for 45.5 wins before the season started, the Rockets at 41.5. Pretty much every pundit I looked up had OKC winning more games than Houston. Their supporting casts are pretty close (Lou Williams and Eric Gordon have been great though), and Westbrook makes his team look like dogshit, whereas Harden makes his team look good. Westbrook gets insane stats and is an amazing player but stretching the "Most Valuable Player" award to define a guy who makes his team look worse than it is makes no sense. I hope Leonard, Harden, or even Lebron/Steph take it.

Russ is the most fun player in the league to watch, but if I were a Thunder fan I'd rather get the W than see my player shoot my team out of the game in the 4th with his teammates wide-open.

I don't think their supporting casts are even close so we will have to agree to disagree

For those of us who are old enough to recall Iverson was looked upon in a similar light in Philly when he was required to do everything but mop up the floor at nights end. He heard the same criticism. He took countless shots, overcompensated night after night and was a turnover machine but still made at least one play they made your jaw drop every contest. Wasn't until Dikembe came aboard that they made any real push towards relevancy.

Same thing applies here. The parallels aren't hard to draw if you know the game. Harden is more efficient no doubt; but for as much as Westbrook has to do and when the ball is in your hands every possession it wont always be pretty.

Let's put this discussion to bed because as Kai said you cant be mad either way.

Both are top 10 players imo

Meanwhile raise your hand if you didn't see this major letdown by the Cavs coming

Cleveland looks flat but it's par for the course for them.

I'm dying a little bit inside here. Last time I take advice from my work homies on this stuff.

The Bucks spooked me out from day one because they all ADHD and young with no dear. I remember the trap Saturday night game in Millwuake post trade this year where the Raptors came out and played like complete trash. Watching that game I was uneasy at how patehtic the Raptors looked and how easy the Bucks seem to be getting what they wanted from us. The media and fans up here tossed that game aside as a blip. In the greater sum of the season that on-off bad game did indeed seem like a one time thing but clues were embedde into that game where many of our best players played like shit and Kidd seem to expose them greatly.

I remember that game because NORMAN POWELL played much better than Derozen and was the only Raptors player aside from Ibaka who has some flow in his game. Evreyone else was trash.

So fast forward today... Raptors and Casey still have not learned!


Plus, after the Brooklyn series I'm convinced Jason Kidd knows how to fuck with Dwayne Casey. Coach Casey has been tossing out trash lineups all series long.

AGAIN, WHY HASNT POWELL BEEN GETTING PLAYING TIME. The man is our most athletic player who can keep u with those Buck young guns.

This series still goes on but why these Raptors have to just roll over and bend like this. Complete crap.

Casey is the most awkward coach in the league. On one part he is our teams best ever, yet, time and time again, he trots out trash lineups, draws up garbage schmes and play, and far too many times are team comes out very flat and then has to work hard to dig themselves out of holes. Look at the trash they are running, the Bucks just shake it off and swarm dudes cosntantly. Lowry still has not figured out how to get it inside, Ibaka is taking to many 3-point shots when he should be clowning these young ass African Bucks inside. JV has his flaws but I suspect he can grind down the Bucks big man if you give him enough touches to do so.

It is all a mess.

(04-20-2017 07:23 PM)MY DETROIT PLAYAS Wrote:  Meanwhile raise your hand if you didn't see this major letdown by the Cavs coming

Cleveland looks flat but it's par for the course for them.

They couldn't get buckets to fall in the first half and their D was sloppy and lazy. Amazing comeback. When you have Lebron James in the game it's never over. Congrats to him for passing Wes Unseld and Kobe for each of their respective playoff records (rebounds and points). I think its only a matter of time before he passes Magic with the most playoff triple doubles. I think he needs 14 or 15 more.

Is it possible to fire a coach in the playoffs mid-series? Can we just bring Stakhouse up from coaching our D-League team? I'm not even joking he would do a much better job than Casey.

After that rant the ball gods finally get Powell into the game. Also look how so far he has been one of most effective on the floor. This is all tied with Wright being effective as well. This isn't by fluke as the two are able to run around with these Bucks but Casey does not understand this. Dump Carol on the bench and start Powell and rotate in Tucker for bulk minutes and close out with the Patterson and Tucker lineup which has gotten good traction this series.

The Cavs pulled off a pretty damn impressive comeback tonight. I thought that the Cavs would win it in 6, but now, the series is gonna end in a sweep. Indiana has no excuse to blow a 25 point lead like they did. They should be up 2-1 going into Game 4.

Nate McMillian is gonna end up getting fired and Paul George will end up walking. I wonder why Larry Bird thought it was a great idea to fire Frank Vogel, the man who led the Pacers to two consecutive Eastern Conference Finals appearances.

Re-watching game tape now and DeRozen got undressed and bent over on defence. Dude literlaly slipping and slidding on switches, game plan was to zero in on his lazy D and it worked. Middleton bent man over showing him what damage does when you got a quick step, a good permiter shot and don't be lazy on defence. It was sad to watch but DeRozen hopefully got a wake up call that he needs to elevate his game ASAP. You don't get the privlege to get lazy on D unless you putting the bucket in.

Bucks have learned Derozen is a stone hand to long and likes to milk the ball for a bit to long to ensure he can find is lanes to get shots. It works when he can find them but the Bucks jsut swarm him and give him nothing to work with. He needs to quickly deveop and set up shots for his teammates. Stop relying on garbo 3s that only Lowry or Ibaka can hit. We gotta use are diverse set to get better high percentage shots inside. These young kids will start to make mistakes and fouls when you go at them long enough. They are crafty but they still make dumb ball plays many times and a vertern team should just be hitting them so they make mistakes.

I would rather have the young kids on our bench out there right now. They have energy and get the ball around quickly. No stone fingers. Wright and Powell get the rock around quickly. Let JV and Ibaka body dudes on the inside. Raptors only gettign thirsty for 3-point shots because they give so many up on the otehr end. This game can easily be controlled and won in the paint if the Raptors could calm down and get proper sets and plays going. Diverse sets and line-ups, let use use the deep bench we have to create problems. All I see is that the usual suspects in Carool, Derozen, Lowry are just creating more problems then fixing them. A new aproach is needed ASAP or else this season is done.

Raptors also need to stop being fooled so easy to give up this wide open 3s, fuking embarrsing.

I am in turmoil (still), I have not seen a romp this bad in a while.

For those who only see the Rapots a few times a year and in the playoffs many think this is nothing new. What I am saying is this team is much better than this. But even if Greek Freak is the best player on the court, Raptors need to get flow going with Lowry and DeRozen. You can't explain why they are playing so poorly. It is really on them.

Kawhi Leonard is ballin (posted this in the 4th quarter)

Kawhi Leonard ain't shit (posted this in overtime)

Kawhi Leonard is unstoppable (posted this in the last 45 seconds of overtime)

(04-20-2017 11:58 AM)TravelerKai Wrote:  

(04-20-2017 07:24 AM)Nascimento Wrote:  

(04-20-2017 12:08 AM)kosko Wrote:  Westbrook needs to GTFO. Tonight was a perfect example of why (I hope) he does not win the MVP. Even though I have money on it because I knew he would come out like a mad man this year to prove himself, performances like these (which are not that infrequent) just irk the hell out of me. "Record performing night"... naw... record amount of shit. Just jacking up trash left and right. Not my style of basketball at all.

He is a special and great talent, 100% a beast, but nobody really gives a fuck about a loaded up stat sheet while still taking a fat L like that. The man took almost 50 shots, that is Kobe territory; but the things is if Kobe is jacking up that many shots, 90% of the time his team is getting the W, somehow, some way. Garbage from 3 point line tonight as well when his team was pulling it close to within 5 points late the man bricks two wide open 3-point shots.

People now talking about his historic night of a 50 point tribble double when Harden did the exact same thing (very quietly) during the season.

Call me salty but I hate bummy players that just load up the stats. All is useless if you don't win. You gotta fucking win. The NBA is the one league where one player can literally tilt the tables towards a W. Lebron James has proven this for nearly a decade now. Without Lebron, the Cavs are a lottery team. I am sure OKC is a lottery team as well mins Westbrook but he should be showing up a bit better and commanding things to a point where wins are close. It is only game 2 but considering he had to do all this and his team still falls short I am not sure if they will even get a game. Maybe I am wrong, who knows.

Harden should get the MVP as his team is that much better (with his help of course).

/Rant

He has low basketball IQ. In the final minutes he has a much better chance of getting points by driving and getting fouled or freeing up a teammate when he gets doubled than by taking a hero shot 3.

Yet he still does it over and over again. I know he nailed that ridiculous buzzer beater on the night he broke the record, but the other 9/10 shots he took at the final buzzer aren't being talked about... Because he missed them.

This current generation is all about the 3 pointer. 2 points isn't sexy enough. Each guy between Steph, James, Russell, etc etc. is constantly trying to one up each other on the nastiest splash at the most clutch time.

Sound fundamental basketball, however has not changed. The Cavs did not win by the 3 pointer last year. Lebron would never be against a dirty 2 pointer if he knew he could get the ball back again with enough time, defense, and effort.

Taking the easy shot requires alot of faith and trust. Maturity as well.

Because the math is there to justify it.

Take 20 mid range shots and make 50% = 10/20 = 20 Points

Take 20 3Pointers and make 35% = 7/20 = 21 Points


Move the 3 point line back 8-12 inches and this stuff stops.