Post: #1

Wondering what you guys think about how many guys is it ok for a chick to have slept with before she becomes a no-go for long term relationship material?

I met a pretty attractive chick a few weeks back and she seemed to be fun, intelligent and lots in common and was getting along great so thinking this may be LTR material, and they weren’t any obvious things that set my alarm bells off. However, a couple of nites back we decided it was time to do the talk about exes and she told me she’d been with four guys till now( 2 long term bf’s and 2 short term bf’s).

Now I might sound a bit old-fashioned, but am I all right in thinking this is above average for a 22 year old and strike her off as I was looking for something serious as opposed to a fling. Or should I just accept the world’s changed and they don’t make women as they used to anymore – 4 for 22 is normal relationship wise?

Regards,

Trying to avoid becoming a beta chump

Post: #2

Dude I hate to break it to you, but I'd say that number is pretty low, check out Roosh's blog post about "girl notches." An attractive girl by that age can easily have had sex with 20+ dudes, don't let it be a mind fuck for you, if you've only had sex a couple times. I'd say you'd be a "beta chump" by disqualifying her, but it's whatever, take whatever perspective you want. I have an acquantance friend, who is a pretty chill and good looking dude, but for some reason never mentioned girls and showed no interest when girls would engage him, well I came to find out even though he is really cool (liberal, drinks, smokes weed, does other drugs, etc.), is hardcore Christian and is still all hung up about sex. He lives in a big college/party town and is surrounded by cute women all the time, but he wants a "good girl" that isn't a "slut" so he disqualifies all these potential girls, I never asked if he was a virgin, but I hope for his sake he's not. Anyways, do whatever you feel comfortable with, but I know from personal experience, I've taken your attitude and it's not going to help you get laid, if that's what you're trying to do.

Post: #3

I would say 4 is pretty low for a 22 year old chick. I don't think that's high at all. I definitely wouldn't disqualify her for a relationship based on that.... but that's just me....

Post: #4

Thanks guys, Point taken. Yeah, I am a conservative guy with assets to protect, so careful about this stuff.

However, getting laid has already happened - I was looking at it from a LTR point of view. At that point in life where hoping to get something serious, and this looked like it.

I thought I was not being unrealistic on 4 being too many for 22 going by Roissy - http://roissy.wordpress.com/2008/12/29/i...fy-a-slut/

Quote:[i]0 lifetime partners: Sweet virginal manna. A bit weird, but you’re confident you’ll break her in.
3 lifetime partners: Typical woman. Wife and mother of your children material.
10 lifetime partners: Above average. Proceed with caution.
15 lifetime partners: Well above average. Be dominant or she’ll cheat.
25 lifetime partners: A whole lot. Use her and lose her.
100 lifetime partners: Stopwatch material. You wonder how fast you can get her from “Hi” to “Spread your ass cheeks, I’m going in”.[/i]

Post: #5

4 is too high for marriage material

Post: #6

You need to think differently, and more intelligently.

First things first, never talk about exes with a potential girlfriend. As long as she doesn't have mental issues, crotch rot, and as long as she isn't still in love with an ex, you have absolutely no need to know anything about her sexual past.

Second, if you do ask, get prepared to hear her lie. And on the off chance that she does tell the truth, why the fuck would you want to know about the time she was in cancun and sucked two dicks in a day?

Lastly, I promise you she has been with more than 4. She was just looking for a number that you might find credible. If she just said one, you might suspect. If she said a lot, you, being insecure, would be like OMG what a SLUT11!!!11!!
So, she pulls out the, um yeah, I just had a couple of boyfriends, and then a couple others randomly.

Don't be a chump, and don't think this is the 17th century.

Fucking feels good. Men and women do it all the time. You will appreciate the men she has been with before, when she gives you good head, and knows how to reverse cowgirl.

Don't be a jealous loser.

Think of all the women that you have banged who are now married. Are they whores? Are their husbands somehow less of a man? No, they aren't.

Post: #7

(06-06-2010 05:15 AM)DrArete Wrote:  Don't be a jealous loser.

No not being jealous. I just think the best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.

(06-06-2010 05:15 AM)DrArete Wrote:  Think of all the women that you have banged who are now married. Are they whores? Are their husbands somehow less of a man? No, they aren't.

You're getting this wrong, I don't know where I said that a girl having any relationship before me is wrong. Huh?

I do feel sorry for the guys whose gfs/partners I banged/made out with. I don't want to be that chump.

Post: #8

If you believe anything a woman tells you with regards about how many dudes she fucked with, I have a bridge to sell you... I stopped asking chicks how many dudes they have fucked back when I was 18 because I quickly realized its pointless to ask. Personally, I feel its a very beta question to ask. Christ Rock had a funny bit about the topic when he said that women only count LTR dick and never ever count "miscellaneous dick" between LTR.

Post: #9

(06-06-2010 07:26 AM)playa_with_a_passport Wrote:  If you believe anything a woman tells you with regards about how many dudes she fucked with, I have a bridge to sell you... I stopped asking chicks how many dudes they have fucked back when I was 18 because I quickly realized its pointless to ask. Personally, I feel its a very beta question to ask. Christ Rock had a funny bit about the topic when he said that women only count LTR dick and never ever count "miscellaneous dick" between LTR.

Agree, I think women have a tendency to lie about how many guys they have fucked. But thats not what I am asking here. What I asked was what do guys here think is one too many to disqualify in general when looking for a LTR.

Post: #10

(06-06-2010 07:43 AM)Iceman Wrote:  Agree, I think women have a tendency to lie about how many guys they have fucked. But thats not what I am asking here. What I asked was what do guys here think is one too many to disqualify in general when looking for a LTR.

Bad question.

1. You will never know how many she has slept with.

2. Even if you could know, its a ridiculous question. If anything, girls with very little sexual experience are more likely to cheat.

3. There is no magic answer, you just have to spend time with her. If you both value the time you have together, and make each other happy, it is likely that you will both work to keep that going, instead of cheating.

4. No guarantees in life. 50% marriages end in divorce. She might screw the yoga instructor after 15 yrs of marriage, you might bang her sister right when you get back from honeymoon.

Just chill the fuck out, and evaluate your individual situation.

Post: #11

(06-05-2010 10:41 PM)Iceman Wrote:  http://roissy.wordpress.com/2008/12/29/i...fy-a-slut/

Quote:[i]0 lifetime partners: Sweet virginal manna. A bit weird, but you’re confident you’ll break her in.
3 lifetime partners: Typical woman. Wife and mother of your children material.
10 lifetime partners: Above average. Proceed with caution.
15 lifetime partners: Well above average. Be dominant or she’ll cheat.
25 lifetime partners: A whole lot. Use her and lose her.
100 lifetime partners: Stopwatch material. You wonder how fast you can get her from “Hi” to “Spread your ass cheeks, I’m going in”.[/i]

Doesn't this answer your question? I think this is pretty accurate.

Post: #12

(06-06-2010 12:36 PM)Giovonny Wrote:  

(06-05-2010 10:41 PM)Iceman Wrote:  http://roissy.wordpress.com/2008/12/29/i...fy-a-slut/

Quote:[i]0 lifetime partners: Sweet virginal manna. A bit weird, but you’re confident you’ll break her in.
3 lifetime partners: Typical woman. Wife and mother of your children material.
10 lifetime partners: Above average. Proceed with caution.
15 lifetime partners: Well above average. Be dominant or she’ll cheat.
25 lifetime partners: A whole lot. Use her and lose her.
100 lifetime partners: Stopwatch material. You wonder how fast you can get her from “Hi” to “Spread your ass cheeks, I’m going in”.[/i]

Doesn't this answer your question? I think this is pretty accurate.

LOL. Roissy is funny, but a tool.

See my posts above if you need clarification on why "numbers" is something most thinking people get over shortly after the time they first get laid, at say 17 or 18.

Post: #13

I think DrArete is on point, dropping knowledge, pure "science". Yeah we'd all love for our women to be virginal, but it's the fucking 21st century, an attractive woman can get sex pretty much whenever they want. I'd agree that it would suck to date a girl who has fucked like 50 dicks, been gang-banged, etc., but this is stuff we don't want to know, if it comes out later and you can't handle it, then I'd understand. It sucks when your notch count is super-low and hers is super-high, but such is life for some people. If you dig this girl, then deal with the present and don't dwell on the past. The vast majority of girls will lie about this shit, and whoever said they only count the LTR dicks and not the rest, is probably right. Final thought, yeah there is a big difference between men and women, because women can get dick whenever and most guys who aren't incredibly handsome/rich/famous need game and often "put in work" to get laid, but what's with the double standard, maybe you've fucked 30 broads and she's only fucked 4 dudes, you'd think it would be fucked up if she disqualified you based on this rational.

Post: #14

I also agree with DrArete. The last thing I'd want for myself as an LTR partner is a virgin. However I still remember having similar idealistic views when I was around 25. Things indeed change significantly when you mature, and now I wouldn't even ask her. Why the hell would I want to know that? She's got much less than me anyway.

Post: #15

Iceman,

4 is too high for "long term relationship" material..

You should never ask a girl about her background with that shit...you should be able to sniff out a whore a mile a way.

Post: #16

Dont forget tho, the number of guys a girl slept with needs to be recalculated for lying, since they all will lie. For women it is X, where X is the number of guys she said.

X+3= Real number of guys shes slept with
X*2= number of guys shes blown/non penetrative sex

for a guy, where X is the number of chicks hes nailed

X/2(rounded down)+1= Real number of chicks hes slept with
X*10= the number of times a guys been blown off by a chick but told his buddy he fucked her later, but always forgets to add to the "tally".

Post: #17

i would certainly dump a girl if i come to know she had BFs or even slept with more than ONE guy.

girls with multiple sex partners are useless...not even worth bang (because of std alert).

Post: #18

Meh STDs are overrated, i have never gotten one, and i get checked pretty often. All this fear tactic to help promote abstinence. For a one night thing i prefer girls with quite a few guys under their belts, they tend to be much more interesting in bed.

Since im happy without a girlfriend this kinda stuff never really worries me. I tend to find that virgins tho tend to make bad LTR girls, as they play with sex as a game, and tend to be much more inexperienced. All the chicks i have a lot of fun with on a friendship level have had many guys, like 6+ by 25. Virgins and inexperienced girls bore me.

Post: #19

(06-06-2010 10:22 PM)3am Wrote:  Iceman,

4 is too high for "long term relationship" material..

You should never ask a girl about her background with that shit...you should be able to sniff out a whore a mile a way.

3am,

Yeah I agree. 4 to me indicates an inability to maintain a relationship and a habit of seeking new cock. And I agree with others here, likely there were more.

I'm not too bad at sniffing em' out - some lil signs were always there but sometimes you go soft (comes round and cooks, wants to get a pup together). She's actually quite nice to be with - but I reckon the inner slut would eventually come out in a few months once the novelty and euphoria of a new relationship/cock wears off.

Post: #20

You know what, I take back all the advice I tried to offer you in this thread Iceman.

You just don't get it, do you.

If you give up on a potentially good relationship, just because of some paranoid idiocy/jealousy of how she lived her life before she even met you, then you deserve to die old and alone in a Bangkok whorehouse.

Post: #21

the thing is, everyone who games often and well knows how easy it is to cheat, and how fickle women are. How can you expect something differnt from how youve been training yourself to act? Plus you need to look at yourself. Its not easy to go from getting girls often to the same ol' chick every night of the week. Honestly you will run out of stories, gimmicks etc.. in a ltr, since game theory doesnt really cover the relationship dynamic. Then there is the paradigm shift most women get when they start activily looking for more of a care taker over an alpha. And this coming from a guy who says that the hardest girls to get are the single ones, since married and girls with b'fs are so much easier to nail.

I dated a chick for 6 months, and we broke up and she was saying, "You are an awesome guy to fall in love with, but a terrible one to spend a lifetime with" and its totally true. I have so many bad habit from the game, not playing along with chicks, always seeking to be the alpha, bossy, demanding, almost totally unsupportive of her stupid chick logic problems, and the jealousy of me hanging out with hot girls who ive known for ages. A player really doesnt have the skill set to make a really good relationship work too well, its a whole nother aspect of the game.

So since you cant provide what girls often are looking for in a LTR, its very difficult to find a "good" girl who will be interested beyond 6 months with bi weekly interactions, and god forbid moving in together. Plus old habits die hard. The way you hook her is totally not what she wants in a long term relationship, and then she will start bitching about the differences. Maybe its my age, but i see it as very very difficult for holding down a quality ltr with a scope of beyond the sex with any women, since all women cheat given the chance, just as all guys would. It just comes down to a matter of standerds of guys and girls they will cheat with.

Post: #22

(06-07-2010 05:18 PM)DrArete Wrote:  You know what, I take back all the advice I tried to offer you in this thread Iceman.

You just don't get it, do you.

Dr Arete - Not giving up on it at all, just decided that I should keep my eyes open. I did take your advice to 'chill the fuck out' - and take it as it comes.

Post: #23

(06-07-2010 06:34 PM)AlphaQup2nite Wrote:  the thing is, everyone who games often and well knows how easy it is to cheat, and how fickle women are. How can you expect something differnt from how youve been training yourself to act? Plus you need to look at yourself.

Agree, sadly that is true.

I don’t want to turn this into a philosophical discussion but it’s also hard to switch off some instinctive reactions (disgust at sluts, wanting a ‘good’ girl). The only thing you can do is accept reality and adjust.

A while back the fiancé of one of my best mates (now wife) came on while he was away and I was helping her move some stuff. I managed to disappear making some excuse but the whole thing left me disgusted. What does a guy do? If I tell, she will deny or he’ll forgive her (he’s been with her longer than I’ve known him) and I’ll get kicked out, simply because that the easiest thing to do. But if I keep quiet – am I being a good mate?

Learn and live – that’s the only thing to do I say.

Post: #24

(06-07-2010 08:09 AM)Iceman Wrote:  Yeah I agree. 4 to me indicates an inability to maintain a relationship

Inability to maintain relationship at age 22???
You're either kidding, or have unrealistic expectations.

Basically maintaining a healthy relationship is a full-time job which requires effort and skill. Most people have to learn this skill through several relationships. And those few who have this skill innately, gonna be married for several years at age 22, which greatly limits the possibility you'd consider them (and they'd consider you).

Post: #25

Iceman,

DrArete's advice and everyone else who agree along those lines is spot on.

No offense to 3am, but his advice is either out of inexperience or he's not from a 1st world western country. No offense to Charmer, but he seems like he's from a more traditional culture than those on offer in the 1st world west. In a lot of ways Im jealous of him, because in a 'perfect' 1950's world where everyone gets married young, he'd be right and life would be simpler.

But this is a forum where men come to get advice on how to have more choice in life, not on how to settle with the first girl who he deems virginal enough. And its a different world now: women sleep around more, people get married later, you can trust women less, and the best women wait longer to have their choice of the best men. We want you to be one of those best men, and not to cling to an immature sense of jealousy or judgment about her past flings.

The real underlying root issue here is giving you enough power to have enough choice with women to where you can find that 'perfect' mate. Not to have to settle.

Listen carefully: Giving a shit about how many partners they've had will not give you that power. It will take it away. The reality is that you don't even want to ask if she's sleeping with anyone else at the present, before she's your girlfriend. If you care, you have much less of a chance of landing her or keeping her around.

Get out of the habit of asking that question. I have a feeling you had it early in the relationship. Don't have it at all. You don't want to know and it doesn't matter. Being the jealous, judgmental controlling type will limit your choice of women and brand you as a less fun lower quality catch.

Men who have their choice of women aren't jealous or controlling.
Jealous men don't have their choice of high quality women.
High quality women only like men only like men who have their choice of high quality women.

Stating that you are a conservative guy with assets to protect is meaningless. Do you want your choice of women or not? Or do you want to be the good conservative guy who marries a bulldog, because she's a good conservative woman? There are plenty of chumps who go that route.

If you have assets to protect, then use protection, dont get her pregnant, and get a prenup. Marrying a virginal woman will do nothing to protect your assets.

There are other, and more accurate, ways to test a womans character other than asking this question. And being virginal doesnt assure a good character. You have to be in many relationships to be able to know what to look for, and what to avoid. No matter what, if you settle down young, your gambling on that front.

And here's some news: if you act like you don't care, she will more than likely reveal her past behavior to you anyway. If you act like you care, by asking, then she is more likely to permanently cover up the truth.

If you really want a non-feminist virginal woman, then target girls who aren't born in North America. You'll have a lot more luck.

Oh, and your standards are way the hell out of wack. Inability to maintain a relationship at 22, because of 4 guys?! GMAFB
Come back down to earth, my young friend.