Post: #26

[/quote] Yeah. It's virtually impossible to help people at that altitude because EVERYONE is in the "death zone" at that point. If you try to help people, you drastically increase your chance of getting into trouble and winding up dead.
[/quote]


Lots of climbers have abandoned there own climb, in a very unselfish way, to save a climber in the poo, perhaps it was there only chance in life to climb Everest, but there heart and head told them what to do

If the world becomes "everybody for themselves", we are doomed

"Lifes about, shooting your load"

Post: #27

Climbing Everest has become a tourist attraction for many wealthy people with free time. For $60-80k you can find a group of pros who will get you to the top, or have you die trying. Blind people, deaf, people without limbs, cameramen with hundreds of extra pounds of equipment, the elderly - all have made it to the top. It's amazing what a group of sherpas, professional climbers, and oxygen tanks can do.

Many pro climbers absolutely hate this, and point to disasters like 1996 as to what can happen when you have a bunch of relatively inexperienced climbers on the mountain who bought their way in. Everest showed her true colors that night.

The truth is it's not Sir Edmund's Everest anymore, it's a much more bourgeois experience. Hillary himself was sharply critical of cutthroat nature of the climb these days, in particular of experienced climbers leaving other people to die when the weather took a turn for the worse. Many will argue you cannot physically help another person at that altitude and those conditions, but if Sir Edmund says you can, then I would listen to him.

Post: #28

(12-04-2012 04:41 PM)Wool Suit Wrote:  Climbing Everest has become a tourist attraction for many wealthy people with free time. For $60-80k you can find a group of pros who will get you to the top, or have you die trying. Blind people, deaf, people without limbs, cameramen with hundreds of extra pounds of equipment, the elderly - all have made it to the top. It's amazing what a group of sherpas, professional climbers, and oxygen tanks can do.

Many pro climbers absolutely hate this, and point to disasters like 1996 as to what can happen when you have a bunch of relatively inexperienced climbers on the mountain who bought their way in. Everest showed her true colors that night.

The truth is it's not Sir Edmund's Everest anymore, it's a much more bourgeois experience. Hillary himself was sharply critical of cutthroat nature of the climb these days, in particular of experienced climbers leaving other people to die when the weather took a turn for the worse. Many will argue you cannot physically help another person at that altitude and those conditions, but if Sir Edmund says you can, then I would listen to him.

+1

And Sir Edmund was most likely the most well known person on the planet who's phone number was still listed in the White-Pages/directory till the time that he died.

"Lifes about, shooting your load"

Post: #29

(12-04-2012 04:29 PM)RASER Wrote:  Once again, as in life, it's all about the odds, 1 in 3 will die trying,

Still better odds than marriage, yet people keep lining up for that one...

Post: #30

The climbers who left men to die are tarnished with that forever (case in point David Sharp 2006) whilst those who lose their dream of the summit to save a man's life are lauded forever (Lincoln Hall 2006 a week after the death of David Sharp)

Post: #31

(12-04-2012 04:46 PM)RASER Wrote:  

(12-04-2012 04:41 PM)Wool Suit Wrote:  Climbing Everest has become a tourist attraction for many wealthy people with free time. For $60-80k you can find a group of pros who will get you to the top, or have you die trying. Blind people, deaf, people without limbs, cameramen with hundreds of extra pounds of equipment, the elderly - all have made it to the top. It's amazing what a group of sherpas, professional climbers, and oxygen tanks can do.

Many pro climbers absolutely hate this, and point to disasters like 1996 as to what can happen when you have a bunch of relatively inexperienced climbers on the mountain who bought their way in. Everest showed her true colors that night.

The truth is it's not Sir Edmund's Everest anymore, it's a much more bourgeois experience. Hillary himself was sharply critical of cutthroat nature of the climb these days, in particular of experienced climbers leaving other people to die when the weather took a turn for the worse. Many will argue you cannot physically help another person at that altitude and those conditions, but if Sir Edmund says you can, then I would listen to him.

+1

And Sir Edmund was most likely the most well known person on the planet who's phone number was still listed in the White-Pages/directory till the time that he died.

"Lifes about, shooting your load"

Post: #32

The great Sir Ed was a Kiwi, Kia Kaha Aoetearoa.

Post: #33

(12-04-2012 04:29 PM)RASER Wrote:  

(12-04-2012 02:09 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  You can't. It's almost physically impossible to carry someone down. And there are no rescue parties up there. Before the trek begins, everyone pretty much knows the deal. That if they get hurt, they are on their own and will be left to die. They go into this knowing that with the ultimate thrill comes the ultimate risk. They discuss all this at base camp and they are fully aware what they are getting themselves into.

Once again, as in life, it's all about the odds, 1 in 3 will die trying, do the math, these are the facts, "do you feel lucky punk"?

Cost around $60k to do the climb with a professional team.

For mine not worth the risk or expense.

Its around 8900m high, on a fine low wind day they *could* land/hover a helicopter and remove the bodies if they wanted, but they don't, i think the mountain is giving the climbers a message but they don't listen and push the odds.

If you play with fire you get burnt..........

"Lifes about, shooting your load"

It's more like 1 in 12 will die.

Post: #34

I read a long book on one of the everest account.

Like Wool Suit said. Its not the same Everest. Now Its a pay your way.
People that have money like that aren't gonna be the coolest guys to hangout with in the bar.
They are there for the bragging rights and that its.

The sherpas actually spend weeks climbing the mountain before hand setting markers and clearing paths so it'll be easier for the rich guys to get up.
The people that die are the ones that are stupid.
They take those unnecessary chances to get up the mountain for their own vanity.
They don't care about the rest of the people..they just wanna get to the top.

That 1 in 12 chance you have of dying is low. If you follow the fucking directions of the sherpas.

Post: #35

Has anyone read Into Thin Air by Krakauer? I find the '96 incident absolutely fascinating. There is a lot of controversy over what exactly happened and who is to blame.

Post: #36

/thread-55952.html

Relevant: vegan sets out to climb Mt. Everest to show how healthy vegans are, dies

Post: #37

This forum is a bit like Mount Everest, in that you run into dead posters whose posts are perfectly well preserved...

Post: #38

(12-07-2018 12:23 AM)911 Wrote:  This forum is a bit like Mount Everest, in that you run into dead posters whose posts are perfectly well preserved...

OP's last post was in 2013, but his last log in was in October 2018. I wonder how common it is for members who joined so long ago to never post again but still pop in from time to time?

Post: #39

Fascinating and brief documentary on the 1996 Everest incident, with commentary from Krakauer and other survivors.

One of the survivors, Beck Weathers, was so badly frostbitten he had to have part of his hands and feet amputated

Post: #40

TigerMandingo, I read it a few years ago. It was a series of events that came together perfectly and produced the result.

Post: #41

Krakeaurs us a better writer than mountaineer. His book is good, but the Russian who helped to save folks wrote a rebuttal that showed that Krakeaur was a pussy and contradicted a lot of his facts. Anatoli Boukreev.

Post: #42

(12-07-2018 01:01 PM)Hypno Wrote:  Krakeaurs us a better writer than mountaineer. His book is good, but the Russian who helped to save folks wrote a rebuttal that showed that Krakeaur was a pussy and contradicted a lot of his facts. Anatoli Boukreev.

I agree partially, although I wouldn't call anyone who decides to climb Everest a "pussy". I've yet to read Boukreev's account but it is indisputable that he did save 3 lives. Hero in my book.

Another thought I had about this incident is how it shows the awesome power of nature. Not to sound callous or anything but here you have a group of mountaineers with all their high-tech gear, North Face jackets, walkie talkies, and oxygen tanks thinking they got it all figured out. And then BOOM. A smack in the head from good ol' Mother Nature as if to say, "hey jackass, you are nothing compared to me and I can crush you anytime I want".

MN always knows how to put a check on human arrogance.

Post: #43

(12-07-2018 01:01 PM)Hypno Wrote:  Krakeaurs us a better writer than mountaineer. His book is good, but the Russian who helped to save folks wrote a rebuttal that showed that Krakeaur was a pussy and contradicted a lot of his facts. Anatoli Boukreev.

Link?

Post: #44

Is there much point to climb Everest nowadays?
I've been interested in mountaineering and the Himalayas since childhood, but now given it's such a big commercial operation and you get queues of people walking up to the top, you might get the impression of visiting some other famous tourist sight in the world, not of exploration. Obviously it's still a great deal of physical exertion, but less unique, more like a thing for rich people to do.

Post: #45

I m on a mobile but Boukreev's book is titled The Climb.

Krakeaur had no experience climbing at that altitude. He painted several facts favorably to himself when in fact he went down the mountain and left the others to die. Boukreev went back up without oxygen and saved some of them. Boukreev never set out to write a book like JK did but did so only when JK got key facts wrong. It's been 20 years since I read those books but the consensus at the time was that JK didn't attempt a rescue and shaded the facts in his book to favor himself.

Post: #46

I was thinking about things I would really would love to do once in a life. And at the top is reaching Mt Everest. I am totally amazed by thought about reaching the highest peak of the world. I always thought I don´t have any dreams, but doing this is definitely my dream.
I love mountains, I love fighting with the nature and I love overcoming myself. I don´t care about death, that can meet you there. Everyday a lot of people die in cars, unexpectedly without reaching any potential of life. A lot of people die because of fucking cancer, helplessly waiting for their own death in bed. People get their limbs amputated because they get drunk and fall to river.
It´s ridiculous to be afraid of doing such amazing thing as climbing this mountain. I am afraid, that next day I will be hit by some idiot in car, but I would be never afraid of taking such challenge, as I come prepared well.

There´s one problem and that´s I will probably never be able to stack so much money, that is required to do this. The thought about never being able to fullfil my life with this just because of money is very unpleasant to me. But it will always be my dream.

I WANT THIS

Post: #47

^ I admire your courage but this is something I still do not quite understand. Death on that mountain is probably one of the most agonizing experiences one can go through. We're talking about a slow, torturous demise. But besides death, you are also at a huge risk for frostbite. Sure you can survive but do you really want to go on living as a double amputee?

As I read more stories about the mountaineers that perished on Everest, I am finding one common thread: they were all super confident in their abilities. Some even refused supplemental oxygen (which comes in handy post 8000 meters) or Sherpas to help guide them. Human arrogance + fucking around with nature can have disastrous consequences.

I also noticed a complete lack of black people in mountaineering. They have the common sense to stay the fuck home

Post: #48

Narcissism. The number of climbers will drop quickly in the years to come as the rich baby boomers run out of money. Their kids have real problems like "how do I buy food" and therefore don't have to run off doing dumb shit like this.

Post: #49

(12-07-2018 04:24 PM)tomzestatlu Wrote:  I was thinking about things I would really would love to do once in a life. And at the top is reaching Mt Everest. I am totally amazed by thought about reaching the highest peak of the world. I always thought I don´t have any dreams, but doing this is definitely my dream.
I love mountains, I love fighting with the nature and I love overcoming myself. I don´t care about death, that can meet you there. Everyday a lot of people die in cars, unexpectedly without reaching any potential of life. A lot of people die because of fucking cancer, helplessly waiting for their own death in bed. People get their limbs amputated because they get drunk and fall to river.
It´s ridiculous to be afraid of doing such amazing thing as climbing this mountain. I am afraid, that next day I will be hit by some idiot in car, but I would be never afraid of taking such challenge, as I come prepared well.

There´s one problem and that´s I will probably never be able to stack so much money, that is required to do this. The thought about never being able to fullfil my life with this just because of money is very unpleasant to me. But it will always be my dream.

There are a lot of similar experiences that are equally challenging but more realistic. Hike the Appalachian Trail. Even doing an overnight is invigorating, but you could do a week, a month, whatever. Or scale the face of a mountain. The AT is accessible from a lot of East Coast cities, and some very technical faces from a lot of West coast cities like Denver, San Fran.

Have you even climbed any of the mountains that are closest to you? Have you summitted the tallest peak in your state? Do you even know what it is?

A lot of the people who died on Everest were narcissists who wanted to be able to say they summited Everest without putting in the work. Even Krakeaur can be counted among them, although he had significant experience before the 1996 disaster.

20 years ago when all of this happened, I had an older friend, 50s, who married into the family that owned the Atlanta Falcons at the time (they eventually sold to Arthur Blank). He and his knew girlfriend climbed Kilaminjaro. Its about 6,000 meters but the highest in Africa and therefore one of the Seven Summits. Its a lot less technical than the Himalayas, and can be summitted in a week although its better to take two and allow of acclimitization at altitude. You could do Kilimanjaro for a fraction of the cost of Everest. But maybe start with the tallest peak in your state. I have.

Post: #50

MrLemon: I shared my opinion about death. Everybody dies, but 99% of people duy just for no reason (by any stupid civilization disease or in a car accident). If I see myself in that 1%, than I´m okay with my death, that can come in any moment anyway.

Hypno: There are and I am not overlooking them. Top of the world is just top of the world. I am from Europe.
Yes, I have been to many mountains, that are in my country, but these are just little hills. I have done many kilometers there and I have slept dug in the snow on the second highest peak of my country. Of course, I have been to the highest (several times). Climbing in not unkown thing for me.
3 months ago I have been travelling around Balkan and I wanted to reach the highest peak on my way, but it was only one third of Everest. I admit it was pretty tough, even more with my 25 kg (55 lbs) backpack and yes something could happen to me, because it´s abandoned area, but I don´t care as long as it´s something what makes me really alive.