Post: #1

Just about all my TRUE friends I have known since my teens(I'm 33 now). I'll meet new people, but they don't stick. They tend to become more like temporary activity buddies. We may be bound by a common interest and all will be cool and fun, but as soon as that interest or whatever brought us together is gone, the friendship fizzles out.

That's one reason I'm not keen on moving to a new city. I'm not sure I'd be able to make new friends, and true friends are extremely valuable. I'd make new buddies to shoot the shit with of course, but I'm talking about the type of people you'll know for the rest of your life and who will still be there even when the catalyst that brought you together(e.g. school, work, lifestyle, hobby, etc) is gone. Everyone I meet these days just seems like a fluid social connection. People who are there as long as there is some immediate need for you in their life, and when that need is gone, they are gone.

And then I also wonder about this from a global perspective. Is this the case all over the world? Or is it easier to make true friends in some cultures over others.

Post: #2

Yeah I feel you on this. I meet a lot of people on the road but a real connection like I have with my buddies back home is rare.

I think part of it is that as you get older you become very unique and individualized, making it harder to meet someone similar to you. Think back when you were 20 and could get alone with anyone. But now you have particular tastes and standards, and those friendships wouldn't cut it today.

Post: #3

I think you can make friends on this page... Im 34 and I really liked the guys I meet through this page and Im as wierd and douchebag as they come :-) Dunno about making friends with Roosh though after I tried to game him like a girl, he kinda got "busy" :-) long story but got his number logged wrong in my rented cellphone, so when he texted me it was under some unknown girlname, so I acted accordingly

Post: #4

"That's one reason I'm not keen on moving to a new city. I'm not sure I'd be able to make new friends"

Depends on what city. A place like London and NYC is pretty easy to meet people b/c people from all over the world are moving there and starting over. They WANT to meet to new people.

Post: #5

I feel you bro, I can relate to what you're saying and I'm only 26. I've been living in this small college town for seven years and once had a fat crew of good friends, but as time has expired they have slowly dropped off like flies, and I'm down to one good friend, and one friend that I don't really want to chill with much because he's basically an arrogant, egotistical, douchebag. It's like I know I need to make more friends while I'm still living here, but it's hard for me to make the effort and take the initiative. Sometimes it just feels like a lot of work, and most people, unless they are new to town, already have a crew of friends that they are content with. I have a ton of casual friends, who I would classify as acquaintances that I'm cool with, but never actually hang out with on a regular basis.

I think one of the main reasons it gets harder to make/maintain new friends as you get older is the fact that a lot of dudes once they get to their late 20's/30's start getting really serious with their girlfriends, then get married, and then if they have kids you can pretty much forget about hanging out. Also, people become so absorbed by grad school/career, it like eats up 80% of their time, I have definately more or less lost some good friends due to these reasons.

Post: #6

Quote:he kinda got "busy"

The streets were flooded!

Post: #7

It's also about how much you're willing to put yourself out there. As most people age, they are less willing to do that. I'm not talking about being social, I'm talking about discussing some real shit that may make you feel vulnerable. That, and in general, experience teaches us not to do crazy shit. Sharing an experience that pumps up emotions (ie playing pranks, doing physically dangerous acts, playing team sports, etc) makes people grow closer.

What Roosh touched on is interesting as well. He may be an interesting and fun guy to hang out with, but how many people are willing to just sell everything they own and travel the world. And how many people out of that small pool are you going to get along with?

I have a couple close friends who have my back no matter what. One from high school and a handful I have met through pua. The hs friend type is common, but with the pua guys, we've shared things about ourselves with each other (fears, insecurities, goals, etc) that most guys generally don't, as a means of improving our inner game. We've also gone out to the bars/clubs/daygame together and shared a lot of great experiences together. It had a latent effect of bringing us closer together. Even though having a big social circle of aquaintanes and party friends is great, a handful or even one or two really close friends is all a guy needs. More than that and you can spread yourself too thin and have unneeded drama.

Post: #8

Yeah man, completely understand where you're coming from on this one. I think a lot of it has to do with the leader/follower dynamic and the fact that the older you get the less you want to follow anyone. A lot of it also comes back to competition and sizing each other up which when your younger you're much more willing to engage in.

One thing that I'm trying to work on more in my life is looking more for reasons TO like someone rather than looking for reasons NOT to like them. Essentially not writing people off after the first stupid thing that they do or say, which I used to be ruthless about.

One other tip is to be the kind of guy that you would want to meet yourself, which is the main things you can see guys on this board trying to achieve. Would you want to meet the creepy guy standing in the corner on the back wall at the club, or the guy having a blast, yucking it up with random people at the bar?

Post: #9

Maybe when we're younger, we're just more "open" people in general. We're more open to more people, possibilities and experiences. There might also be fewer opportunities to bond with others as you get older. Going to high school and all the emotional ups and downs you get maneuvering your way through it can be bonding and make life-long friends. If you want to talk about friends whose bonding last the test of time, talk to war vets who fought side by side.

I guess as you get older, you just don't have any many of these experiences that bond and then you end up with more situational friendships that don't last beyond a couple years at most.

Post: #10

My 2 cents :

When we are young, Friendships are Unconditional ...... when we grow up some sort of monetary gain even subconsiously is involved and the basis for good friendship is not there.

Post: #11

Good insight chrisss. That's the sort of thing I was wondering. How it is here versus other places. And you're spot on about people thinking nothing of leaving the city they grew up in to take a job that pays more 2,000 miles away.

Post: #12

If I may add to this. I'm 35, and have only had 2 close friends in my life. Part of this is my own choice. I refuse to have to pretend to be who I am not, and follow the 10-step life protocol everyone else is following.

I had a best friend I knew since Kindergarten. After College, our friendship started to crumble slowly, until one day - I never heard from him at all right after his wedding 3 years ago. I even tried calling him, and he never returned my calls, until one day - I got the hint that I was not part of his circle anymore, and I stopped trying. His loss.

He got married, had kids, got sucked into the life of climbing the corporate latter. His wife hated me from day 1 without even so much as ever saying one word to me. All she "saw" was this loose cannon husbands buddy who gets lots of attention from women and travels the world. My friends wife especially hates me I guess, when I slept with her maid of honor on her wedding night...and she told her so. I think my friend is just a beta male who did not want to ruffle feathers with his wife, and just cut-me off. This is clearly the first sign of a woman placing your nuts on a vise-grip aka Marriage.

Point being - is that the older I get, the more I realize that he was my friend for that phase of my life, which is now over. The phase I was learning about life, and growing up. Now, my new valuable friends must be a reflection of what my life is today, and be similar themselves to that, and my own personality/life situation. Otherwise, it will all be temporary buddies to go pick up women or travel buddies for the sake of security.

I am really good at picking up women for SNL, and picking up buddies to swoop with. In the end, I think that I just appreciate everyone in my life for what they were able to contribute no matter how short or long.

Life is short - just roll with it, and be happy doing things you love. Let the chips fall where they may. Nobody will care about you, or what you did, who you pissed off, or who you banged 100 years from now - you'll be dead.


My .02

Post: #13

" EE has a different cultural perspective on friendships. It's harder to make a friend but when you do make one it's a friend for life.... Most EE chicks would love to date Americans but they would not be with them for good cause they can't bond with them as much as with EE guys. Why is it so hard to make good friends in the US?"

For sure, I totally agree!! Many times I've tried to explain to people in the US how the public rudeness/private sincerity of ex-Soviet society (I spend most of my time in Moldova and Ukraine) is just tremendously better, but you have to be there, I suppose Especially if you meet through business/work, the contrast is obvious...if a Ukrainian decides they like you, that's it--even if they're poor and you're rich [not hard where social security is $30/month or, better for drinking adventures, if they're rich and you're poor! In the US, despite the relaxed first-name-basis-with-the boss atmosphere, EVERYONE knows the office politics angle of every happy hour, holiday party, and random drunken hookup.

The "bonding" experiences can be great fun (dude, in what other region can you show up in a real war zone with a bottle of brandy and get to play with the sniper rifles an hour later?) but ultimately superficial I think...even if you become fluent in the local languages [which is a hell of a challenge but worth it] there's a certain level at which you won't "get" each other.

Strangely I found that EE women "bond" with Western men more easily than their own--I think even Western chauvinist alphas can't help but take them more seriously than the local dudes...

Post: #14

I agree with Mixxmaster.

Friends are great, but I'm completely happy not having these romantacized friendships like we see in movies.

Post: #15

I think all these answers, down the board, are really good and accurate.

I especially like the mention of the differences between soviet social behavior vs that in capitalist culture. As a person who has followed peoples experience in the east over the years, through books and forums, I find that that has been the consistent essence of what has been said.

It seems to come down to this:

The economic structure of a country invariably affects the social environment and culture. People in less competitive societies enjoy easier relationships that are based less on politics and tiers of social acceptance(nerds vs jocks, rich vs poor, etc.) Differences in people are more widely accepted, and non-self interested behavior (the true measure of a friendship) such as loyalty / trust is easier to come by and rely on. People are more open to trust and getting to know strangers in general.

I suppose this is because 1. There is less to compete for 2. Once the focus is taken off of competition for economic superiority, then relationships become the obvious quality of life enhancer.

If I had to choose between economic prosperity or more fulfilling social relationships, I know which one I would choose. Do people or things ultimately better enhance your quality of life? What if there were no more economic tiers within your country?

I've had my best friend (I was best man in his wedding) break civil partnership law, on two large counts, and stab me in the back for a measly $60k. That was the value of our friendship to him. I wouldn't have sold him out for a million. Nor would I any of my close friends. Thats the way I look at the world and the value of the loyalty that I offer my friends. Once your my close friend, I almost always put your interests above my own. Especially when something as meaningless as money s involved. As long as I feel that you aren't trying to take advantage of me for your own gain.

Trust, loyalty and true friendship are truly rare in a competitive society. Sadly, he sees his betrayal and legal malfeasance as logical. While his inability to think through the true and legally established morality of the situation (he is a die hard christian - I should have known not to trust him based on that alone) is due to low intelligence, I believe, its still symptom of the schizophrenic values that we teach our children here in America.

That is, love your neighbor until there is profit involved. Then, the higher value is to profit, as long as you can get away with it without scandal or being prosecuted.

Post: #16

Want to add that some people from the Northeast (NYC, Philly, etc) tend to form real hardcore friendships for life. When i lived in NYC, it was sometimes difficult to make friends, but the friends you made were for life-- i think it's just the culture in the area. The rest of Middle America not so much...

Post: #17

Team contact sports first and foremost. Then contact sports. Then team sports IMO

Camaraderie is something you will battle to find as you get older. Most of the friends you still have are good friends because you went through shit together. No matter how different you are, you experienced more than a few things together, and normally things that had an influence on your life in some way.

Sports offer that to a very small degree, especially contact sports. When you are putting your body on the line of the guy next to you, bonds build quickly. Why do you think so many men stay in the army, air force or navy? We dont have the kind of activities that allow us to really bond with men anymore.

Post: #18

(06-14-2010 01:20 PM)Whoremonger Wrote:  Camaraderie is something you will battle to find as you get older. Most of the friends you still have are good friends because you went through shit together. No matter how different you are, you experienced more than a few things together, and normally things that had an influence on your life in some way.

I think you nailed it, simple as that. Camaraderie. Going through shit together. And right, those camaraderie opportunities DO diminish with age it seems.

In addition to sports, I think travel often makes friends. Throw a bunch of people in a hostel exploring a strange new country together for the first time and having all these new experiences together, sleeping in the same room and they can bond quick. Everyone is open to new experience and new people and new bonds. They will bond quickly with people they might not even bother to say "hello" if they walked past in their home town. It's too bad people can't realize that and try to be more open in their normal lives.

Post: #19

(03-26-2010 08:37 AM)lavinci Wrote:  Most EE chicks would love to date Americans but they would not be with them for good cause they can't bond with them as much as with EE guys. Why is it so hard to make good friends in the US?

From my limited experience living in US the main issue seems to be more like using different words. Here in US "friend" is very often used as "someone I like to hang out with", while in Europe "friend" means "someone I can rely upon - i.e. ask for help being sure I'd receive it, and he can rely on me the same way". Since having a hang-out buddy does not invoke any significant investment (often not at all), one can have thousands of such "friends" (unlike real friends who, for example, I have lent $3k for a year interest-free). This explained to me why guys here are so afraid to be "befriended" by a girl - they're not really becoming friends in what we consider it, it is more like being put into "you were checked, you were measured, and you were disqualified" category. Having a female friend is much different.

One of the reasons for this kind of friendship here may be the population mobility. As you know, it is typical for most people in Europe to stay in the same area (typically a city) for their whole life; for a lot of families several generations lived in the same city for their whole life. In US it is typical for people to move around; AFAIR the time span for a person to stay at the same place is around five years. Therefore most people do not feel like they need to establish this kind of trusty connection - why would one waste time if in three years they gonna be in a completely different place?

But the reason why it is more difficult to make true friends when you're older is different. It is basically because you become more picky who you'd like to friend with, because you have more to lose. For example, befriending someone who is a drug user when you're a teenager has much less potential consequences than when you're an adult. And when you combine that with the fact that you have much less time now in your hand to find new friends, you're getting exactly the results described.

Having said that, I'd have to admit I have made a lot of friends (real friends) during those five years. Most of them were people from EE who moved to US; feeling the information vacuum and having to share the experience and findings gave us a single bond to share, and so far it worked really well.

Post: #20

Great newspaper/magazine clipping, whoremonger...

Post: #21

(06-14-2010 06:21 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  Great newspaper/magazine clipping, whoremonger...

Hahaha, that Indian dude is spot on!