Post: #1

I believe that Thailand is overrated to a high degree, and can't understand some of the other guys' fascination with it. Am glad to have seen it, but generally, there's nothing in it for me to warrant a second thought. Would probably never come back.

*I was there during so-called dry weather season. I imagine my impressions would have been even worse if I was there during a rainy season.

Pros:

Thai girls have generally nice tan, and in Bangkok they like wearing short skirts, so there are lots of smooth legs flashing on the streets. That shit can get you horny in no time.

They also have decent attitudes.

If you are into tropical aesthetics, the country is beautiful.

Public infrastructure (notably roads, public transportation, as well as hospitals) is generally better than in surrounding countries.

Cons:

Thai girls on average are somewhat ugly (also their noses are naturally flat, but that is often not noticeable due to prevalent nose job surgeries). Their body figures also aren't much to write home about it (on average they are also "fatter" than surrounding countries). Sure there are some decent ones, even stunners, but I'm talking averages here. For that reason in terms of their sheer physical attractiveness I would place Thai girls below Vietnamese and Cambodians.

With Thai girls, and in general with anyone within native Thai population, there's no intellectual stimulation. These people are mindless drones who are only good as such to their culture at large. Don't underestimate this. You may think that superficial interests and conversations are fun (especially if you believe that caveman interests/existence is a "guy's thing to do"), but any longer term exposure to this would devastate anyone who isn't already a drone himself, or otherwise jaded and fucked up in some way.

The Land of Smiles my ass. OK, maybe on surface level Thais seem to be relaxed, but scratch behind the surface and you will find some of the most craziest individuals around. When not actively trying to cheat you, the average Thai dude is only concerned to keep (or gain) his face in public. Now, the issue of face is prevalent everywhere in Asia, but here is taken to another level. The moment he loses face, there's no way to predict how crazy the Thai guy will get. Machete, AK47, bazooka(?) nothing would be out of character to these fuckers. And don't let me even mention how the king has to keep his face, even if it means years of jail for you.

Food hygiene is really low, sometimes appallingly low (so is anywhere else in that part of Asia for that matter, except perhaps Japan). In vast numbers of neighborhood family restaurants, not to mention street food stalls, the food safety is non-existent. Not only that, but they actively go out of their way to cut corners at your health's expense (think of gutter oil. Do you even know what gutter oil is?) Between the average non-existent restaurant food safety and average restaurant appallingly low food hygiene, well, good luck with that.

Bangkok is an urban dump. Think toxic air, combined with perpetual humidity, and the aesthetics of smelly river, some slummy neighborhoods, and sweaty people, all wrapped up into a cacophony of dirt, noise and smell.

Bangkok is holly shit polluted (so is Saigon, Beijing, Taipei, for that matter). The quality of breathing air is remarkably low. Beats me why would any westerner willingly submit themselves to longer exposures of that.

Bangkok's Khao San road (backpacker's area) is a shit hole. I didn't stay there, but went out my way to check it out. It's full of pretentious younger Europeans and Israelis applying another checkmark to yet another unnecessary destination that they have to be seen in their Facebook-designed lives.

There are also older and downright old Americans and Aussies, you know those dignity-less broken souls of men with thousand-yard stares, their entire mature existence caught in a vicious cycle of booze and bar girls.

And then there is a range of younger broke ass westerners who are acting out Leonardo DiCaprio character's fantasies form the movie The Beach, while on faulty assumption that being broke in a third world shit hole is somehow living "authentic lives".

The coast (Pattaya), the islands, and the rest? Well, the entire love scene can be visualized with a picture of drugged out backpackers making out with fellow smelly backpackers on one hand, and drunken older westerners cavorting with bar girls and lady boys on the other.

In addition to backpackers and language teachers, the rest of Thailand is filled with westerners who are running from something, in most cases either law, or contractual obligations, or are otherwise assorted misfits who by choice or sensibility could not fit into their own society any longer. So there are former drug pushers, credit loans skippers, wife beaters, deadbeat dads, pedophiles, lifestyle radicals, and just plain, old losers. The latter are a particular segment of men who never amounted to anything back home, those who have been ran over by time, and who when faced with employment age discrimination and failing health simply gave up and moved on to international lower leagues in a desperate hope of keeping some factor of their own existential significance in place.

There are also Russians in Thailand. But they are animals of different breed then westerners.

Summary:

If you've never been to Thailand and are considering it either short or long term do think about it some more because at best you will simply not get anything out of it other than what I have described in above paragraphs.

Do not fall for the typical peer-pressure ad that is made to appear as if the deliverer of the news is in some type of paradise:

Woo, hoo, I'm in Thailand dude! I'm eating great food, living on the cheap, and I'm smashing babes all around!

Because that same ad can be interpreted as:

Woo, hoo, I'm inhaling black soot dude. I'm eating mystery meat cooked on gutter oil (no wonder it's cheap), and am fucking exotic disease traps that have been laid previously by hundreds of others like me.

You have one life and one body.

Use it wisely.

Post: #2

It's nice to see a different perspective on Thailand. I've been there once but just the south, didn't go to Bangkok. Most people will say how great it is, I didn't mind it but the Thai girls aren't really my type either. The lady boys get annoying.

Post: #3

Wow what an incredibly negative post. I have only been to Bangkok for a few days and up north to Chang Mai. Never made it to the south but I really liked Chang Mai, nice and chilled out. Its obvious the OP had a bad experience in Thailand but saying things like

" Woo, hoo, I'm inhaling black soot dude. I'm eating mystery meat cooked on gutter oil (no wonder it's cheap), and am fucking exotic disease traps that have been laid previously by hundreds of others like me"

is just as bad as those who talk over exaggerate how good it is. No need to try and scare people off it just because you personally didnt like it.

Post: #4

Gaston, have you been anywhere in Asia that you would recommend?

Post: #5

Thank you for this. Good to get a different perspective. I have only traveled a little in central america before and se asia seems like the starting point for alot of backpackers. I can also admit that I have watched "The beach" a few too many times.

The one reason that I was attracted to it was that it is cheap, good weather and easier women.

What other places would you suggest? I know Colombia is a good viable optioin but other than that. Eastern europe is bad weather it seems or similar to the cold shit I get in the usa during the winter.

Post: #6

I stayed in Bangkok for a month and actually liked it. I rented an apartment in a middle class gated community in the suburbs. I intentionally avoided areas frequented by Westerner deadbeats. I found the restaurants to be clean. On the top floor of a building in Siam Square they had a large food court with not only Thai but Chinese, Middle Eastern, and Vietnamese Food. It was cheap and delicious. The only down side of the food is that they can put too much sugar in the sweet sauces and Thailand has a large diabetes problem as a result. Thailand is more attractive if you actually have an interest in the culture. There are a few good Buddhist meditation places in the country that accept English speaking people. It is also good if you want to learn Muay Thai or Thai cooking. I also like the King. Democracy sucks. I agree that the women tend to be thin and not have much shape although I did see some exceptions, but not many.

Post: #7

We all have so many varying views and opinions, likes and dislikes....who can say which one is right or wrong. However, I feel your views are very negative. I often equate Thailand to an onion, with so many varying layers. It really depends how many layers you peel apart in order to see below the surface of Thailand. There is such an amazing mix of people, food, nightlife and energy in Thailand..... I am currently living in Bogota, Colombia and can tell you this city/country while very different from Bangkok and Thailand also has similarities in the fact there are many layers below the surface and you need time and a bit of curiousity to really get a good honest view of a country dont be so quick to judge.....both places are in my opinion top notch.

Post: #8

"In addition to backpackers and language teachers, the rest of Thailand is filled with westerners who are running from something, in most cases either law, or contractual obligations, or are otherwise assorted misfits who by choice or sensibility could not fit into their own society any longer."

Arent we all on this forum a bit like that lol. Gaston you made some good points but lighten up a bit. It aint that bad. Try living in Ecuador or the Congo for a year or 2.

Post: #9

Complaining about Bangkok being dirty tells me you need additional travel to put things in perspective.

Post: #10

Weird misfit foreigners, chaotic streets, sleaze, bizarre food everywhere, all in a tropical haze.

SIGN ME UP!

I spent long enough being anally retentive. Bring on the degeneration!

Post: #11

If its so bad then why does nearly everyone else say different. Gaston what happened to you?

Im thinking either you made a mistake with a ladyboy (some australian guy told me one of his best friends did this and completely relocated his life when the news got out, what a retard) or you caught the herp. Im thinking the latter.

Post: #12

It's easy to see the negatives you've seen. I agree with alot of what you wrote to an extent.

The main things that get me down that you mentioned:

-Loser sexpats and the unsavory Thais they attract / seek (prostitutes, ladyboys, bar girls, skanky gold-diggers... yuck)
-The saving face and superficiality in the culture. It's a noticable negative, definitely.
-The health issues - pollution and food ingredients. Yeah, it is a big problem.

There's alot of awesome lifestyle to be carved out here though. Bangkok is just... conducive to it in some good ways. It has just the right mix of enough high-end venues, some cool international jetsetters /entrepreneurs, startup businesses, and relaxed easygoingness. There's pumping nightlife 7 days a week and all sorts of colourful regular party-goers you can get to know. There's a real buzz among expats, everyone living here (non-loser) is a trailblazer - running a business, freelancing, teaching, modelling.. alot of dynamic people.

There's also young people and from all over the world living here - usa, europe, japan, taiwan, china, korea, and tourists from many nearby countries. Add to that that your high status as a white guy (even though they dont show it immediately, Thai people really look up to westerners who are not sexpat losers or obnoxious tourists). All these things combined make it a continual adventure. I still get excited at the start of every night out... could meet anyone and end up anywhere.

Also, Thais are deeper than you give them credit for. It's definitely hard to get to as a westerner - but it's there. Their cultural "properness" actively discourages creativity, intellectual discourse and personal expression. BUT you can find it if you look for it, and Thai whimsy, playfulness and banter can be absolutely delightful. They're genuinely fun-loving, chilled-out people and I have learned a thing or two from them. You're right though, it is definitely hard to come into contact with as a foreigner without a real effort to get under the surface.

Post: #13

(10-23-2012 06:20 AM)Gaston Wrote:  There are also Russians in Thailand. But they are animals of different breed then westerners.

I thought you liked Russian girls.
Did you also find the ones in Thailand were mostly inaccessible and coupled up with a Russian boyfriend?

I agree with Thai girls being unattractive and brain dead.

Thailand has its place but the experience is age dependent. I went as a 28yr old and was borderline too old. For the student generation its an acceptable fun low class holiday.

A well traveled man in his 30's that has standards will see it as you describe.

I will only go back there for the shopping.

Post: #14

It is good to have another perspective, but the same critical commentary can be written about ANY destination. Poland, Ukraine, Japan, you name the country and it is possible to write a negatively slanted post about it. You could write the exact same thing about the Philippines as well, hell probably worse, since they lack the food culture and the girls aren't as hot overall.

Ultimately it depends on your goals: are you visiting for two weeks and want to smash as much as possible, or do you intend to live there, or something else. As for dirty? Bangkok is not dirty. Why don't you visit any major city in India, and you will see what the third world can really be like. I really don't understand complaints about cleanliness frankly. I don't hang out in dirty areas and I can afford to eat high quality food in clean establishments. If you have any reasonable amount of cash, you can easily buy your way out of dirtiness in any place.

Post: #15

Agree or not, that was a stellar piece of travel writing and reminds me of Mark Manson's now widely read thrashing of India.

I found Thailand much more enjoyable than you did but think there's a lot of truth in what you reported. It sounds to me that you just spent way too much time in Bangkok.

Post: #16

(10-23-2012 08:41 AM)Vicious Wrote:  Complaining about Bangkok being dirty tells me you need additional travel to put things in perspective.

Bangkok has a rep of being some sort of "it" place for the westerners, while Calcutta, or Bangladesh, or Nigeria do not. There are worse places in the world than Bangkok, but we are not traveling there in droves. So thanks for extracting that out for me now, in terms of sheer numbers Bangkok has to be if not the worst/most polluted city per number of westerners mass reach(ed). THAT is the point.

RawGod Wrote:Weird misfit foreigners, chaotic streets, sleaze, bizarre food everywhere, all in a tropical haze.

SIGN ME UP!

I spent long enough being anally retentive. Bring on the degeneration!

But that's exactly the disillusioned mass way of thinking. Which is equally wrong.

The contemporary Anglophone culture(s) stifles much of any real creativity, spontaneity and joy of life and replaces it with politically correct careerism and mass consumer uniformity. Yes, I can see how some of us want to escape that, but by going completely into another direction (on the other end of the pendulum swing) you are not solving any problems. You are just bringing a new set of problems and issues for yourself only in different form. So the imbalance is thus still present.

The key to balanced lifestyle is to avoid any extremes and find (or at least create) a sweet spot for yourself that is both conductive to your physical health as well as your mental well-being.

Rick91 Wrote:If its so bad then why does nearly everyone else say different.

Could be any number of reasons. Herd mentality, immaturity, inability to see through layers of signification, etc. But by far and wide it is usually our human unwillingness to admit to ourselves that things are not as what we want to think that they are.

Rick91 Wrote:Gaston what happened to you? Im thinking either you made a mistake with a ladyboy (some australian guy told me one of his best friends did this and completely relocated his life when the news got out, what a retard) or you caught the herp. Im thinking the latter.

Nothing happened to me. See, that's the beauty of human intelligence. The greatest personal time in Thailand wouldn't have prevented me from same conclusion. The shittiest personal experience in another country would not necessarily precluded me from forming an opposite conclusion. That's the power of analytical observation. Ability to distinguish the form from content. Ability to separate the issues of personal experience vs. larger objectivity about a place or a thing.

Post: #17

Gaston, how long where you in Bangkok? My younger brother didnt like it his first week there, for many of the reasons you describe. After a 2 or 3 weeks he warmed up to it and in the end he liked it a lot.

Post: #18

(10-23-2012 10:35 AM)Gaston Wrote:  The key to balanced lifestyle is to avoid any extremes and find (or at least create) a sweet spot for yourself that is both conductive to your physical health as well as your mental well-being.

I agree with this. Where is this for you?

Post: #19

Interesting post, Gaston.

Is there a certain part of the world you're bullish on right now?

Post: #20

You could always just stick to the 1-2 week all inclusive Mexican vacations at a nice CLEAN 5 star resort. People with similar miserable mindsets seem to frequent those places.

Post: #21

All these Asia threads confuse me. It's hot, it's not. Where do you go? I'm not big on shitholes. Actually Santo Domingo DR is about as low as it's going to get my way. Perspective??

Post: #22

Few questions:

1. How much time did you spend in Bangkok?

2. Where in BKK did you stay?

3. How many times did you go to Thonglor Soi 10 or RCA?

4. Which clubs did you go to?

5. How much time did you spend on lower Sukhumvit?

Post: #23

Gaston has expressed an opinion and people are bashing him, he simply does not like the place. Thailand is the most hyped country I know, more so than Brazil.

Quite a few have stated the women are ugly, the few I have met have been strippers and were alright.

I know of a few guys who have gone there on holiday and ended up staying for years. Another guy actually left his wife/kids behind and is living there permanently, not cool I know.

Post: #24

Okay gaston i get there are downsides to Thailand. But chances are if most men who use this forum (men who like to fuck and travel) would end up loving the place. You seem to be a very deep thinker. I would like to think i'am to a degree but compared to you i guess i would come off as an optimistic retard.I have not been yet but i plan on spending about 3 years in south east asia. Thailand will likely be my base.

Post: #25

(10-23-2012 12:00 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  Gaston has expressed an opinion and people are bashing him, he simply does not like the place. Thailand is the most hyped country I know, more so than Brazil.

Quite a few have stated the women are ugly, the few I have met have been strippers and were alright.

I know of a few guys who have gone there on holiday and ended up staying for years. Another guy actually left his wife/kids behind and is living there permanently, not cool I know.

The thing is, Bangkok is two cities. The sexpat/tourist city, and then the real Bangkok. Most people who bash Bangkok for sexpats, ugly girls, obnoxious backpackers/foreigners, etc. never saw the real Bangkok.

If you go to Hawaii, and never leave your resort on Maui, can you really make an accurate judgement on Hawaii? Of course not. Same thing applies here. If lower Sukhumvit, Khao San and Pattaya are your main reference points for Thailand, then you never left the resort.


And the reason people are bashing him is for saying shit like this "Woo, hoo, I'm inhaling black soot dude. I'm eating mystery meat cooked on gutter oil (no wonder it's cheap), and am fucking exotic disease traps that have been laid previously by hundreds of others like me."

Maybe if he went to Thonglor he could have tried to fuck some real Thai girls, and not the prostitutes he mentions.

There is plenty of great info on BKK on this forum, he really should have read it.