Post: #51

Two things that would have given me a better life:

1. This Forum
2. Martial Arts

I have to agree with all the commenters who say that if you have even the slightest interest take a heavy sparring martial art or boxing. When I'm training I feel like I'm completing something I should have learned when I was 12 and I'm a better man in all ways for it. Don't wait.

Post: #52

One of my martial arts teachers once said that a turning point for him was actually taking a punch or two in the face in a street confrontation. He said that after that at that point he knew he could handle a blow and it didn't scare him anymore.

Post: #53

(11-08-2013 03:11 AM)speakeasy Wrote:  One of my martial arts teachers once said that a turning point for him was actually taking a punch or two in the face in a street confrontation. He said that after that at that point he knew he could handle a blow and it didn't scare him anymore.

One of my muay thai trainers said a similar thing about the flinch reflex. He said that after getting punched and kicked in the face so many times he no longer flinched.

Post: #54

(03-12-2013 09:23 PM)Mark Minter Wrote:  When I was young, I played football and I would not as afraid of taking on a big dude in a violent tackling drill as I was of approaching a girl. Approaching is hard. There is fear of social rejection.

Contact sports, wrestling, judo, bjj, boxing and muay thai are different from pick up but both CS and MA develop confidence to face challenges. I feel like it adds an extra 30% to my confidence if I go out after 3 hours of wrestling. I also make a point of picking guys to wrestle with who will give me the biggest challenges, the guys who outweigh me by 40-60 pounds or have better technique or both. It forces my mind and body to wake up and get in the zone.

I look at MA not as some sort of magic potion for perfect pick up but more like how university students take Adderall to add an edge to their grades. MA is an supplement but I still need to channel the attributes that I develop in MA towards game (confidence, ability to meet challenges head on, awareness in finding flaws in the overall "connection", slipping through gaps, knowing when to yield, when to feint, when to attack etc).

I also feel less social rejection (let's just say 30%) after a training session because I've spent 3 hours trying to survive on the mat and being thrown around, submitted and being smashed in front of my peers. The confidence comes less from "winning" because I could easily feel a hollow victory by picking training partners who weigh 40+ pounds less than me. The confidence comes from giving everything I've got. It also comes from just surviving an extra 60 seconds against a black belt judoka, BJJer or getting a few in on my Muay Thai coach.

Post: #55

Go around asking random strangers "Hey bro do you even lift?"

Post: #56

kazushu Wrote:One of my muay thai trainers said a similar thing about the flinch reflex. He said that after getting punched and kicked in the face so many times he no longer flinched.

A guy from my jujitsu gym told me something similar when I was only a teenager. "No matter how much you train here, you won't lose your fear until you get beaten on the streets and taste your own blood."

That made quite an impact on me at the time. Not only the words, but his alpha way of saying it.

He stopped training because of a knife wound after some drunken fight... No matter how tough you think you are, shit happens.

Post: #57

Work on a rig for a few months. You'll get yelled at daily by meatheads who's truck's tires have more brain cells than they do. That's enough to toughen almost anyone.

Post: #58

(11-07-2013 07:31 PM)Nascimento Wrote:  Often times I get shoulder checked at the club (maybe once a night) and although my typical response is instant anger

Not to call you out too much, but why is this your first instinct? Do you feel like you have something to prove?

Quote:and maybe consider reacting against it,

This is also interesting.

I'm a pretty good fighter, yet it does not occur to me to be instantly angry or jump to action when some guy bumps into me into a bar - okay, maybe that's exaggerating as I'm sure I've been irritable before, but my typical reaction is for an immediate friendly apology to pop right out of my mouth. I don't even stop to think about it.

Of course, I do read his eyes too (after the apology, I don't wait) and if it turns out it was intentional and he wants to continue with it, well hey, we can go there, but I give every opportunity for the guy to back out of it and be civil even if it is that way.

Hell, I've even bought guys drinks on multiple occasions as an "apology" over stupid shit in bars, even though I knew without a doubt I could kick the living shit out of them.

In some cases I've still ended up kicking their asses later on because people do mistake kindness for weakness, but I guess that's life.

Quote:it's also very common that the guy instantly apologizes and I just say it's cool and give him a shake.

If the guys are instantly apologizing, I don't think it's a shoulder check - I think it's two shoulders colliding in a bar.

I'm one of those guys who always has people at bars punking him and/or challenging him, often by people it turned out had no business starting shit with me in the first place. People who know me always shake their heads when they see how people fuck with me because I'm literally one of the most open, friendliest guys you'll ever meet.

Reading your post, I find myself wondering if the reason people fuck with me is not because they want a challenge but maybe because they're going through the same process as you and feel they're at a stage in their life where they need to "man up." I say this because often you'll bump into guys who won't be reasonable and let shit go even if it's easy to do so, as if they are playing a game they don't understand and think walking away means some kind of defeat.

It's really frustrating when you have to deal with guys like this all the time. My sincere advice - if you feel you need to test yourself and gain some courage, go to an MMA gym for your lumps and slow your roll. Save the brawling for when it matters, and be careful about accidentally starting something with someone who knows what they're doing just because you misread the situation from the get-go.

Aside from legitimate predators, even most tough guys don't really feel like fighting every random guy they encounter. Give them the benefit of the doubt, I say. At least with your instinctual reaction. Based on my experience, it's often the guys with something to prove that spoil the fun.

Quote:This is probably the first time I've deliberately checked someone. Or maybe it was him? Not sure maybe he was expecting that I move just like I expected him. But then again I wasn't really paying attention I didn't even notice the guy until we touched shoulders.

I don't think this should be something you are confused about. A shoulder check is intentionally bumping shoulders with someone because you feel like they should move before you do (for whatever reason). You either do it deliberately or you don't.

There's not a lot of middle ground there. Might be hard to remember what exactly went through your head, but it's definitely something you ought to think about if you're coming close to getting in fights over the issue.

I'm not saying the specific situation you mentioned had you in the wrong or that you should cower from every guy you meet, but as MikeCF said, there's a time and place for everything.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #59

Well it took me a while, but looks like I'm going to enroll in a Krav Maga or Muay Thai class. Time to get hit.

Post: #60

@ BB,

Just saw your reply in this thread.

All I can say, is given the amount of nights out I've been out over the past year, the amount of times I've had some form of actual aggression or fight instigation shown against me is very low.

I've been shoulder checked maybe a couple times, deliberately. It pissed me off but I just let it go. Didn't see the guy again trying to start anything so there was no point going back to the guy to make a point that isn't necessary to make.

I get shoulder bumped all the time. Sometimes it's more forceful than I would like but I understand it's part of being in a club sometimes. I don't get too bothered by it because I'd rather find a receptive girl to approach than try to measure up to other guys physically.

^^ That event I mentioned above wasn't even in a club. It was during the day on my campus. In hindsight, I was walking like a cocky douchebag at the time, maybe because I was trying to pick a fight for no reason in my mind at the time, because I've never really had a true fight experience. I didn't barge into him intentionally, I didn't notice him properly but the fact I had been thinking those things at the time probably caused me to subconsciously instigate something with the guy.

It was stupid. Nowadays I make an effort to withdraw my shoulder if I'm going to walk by another guy close and we were going to collide had I not moved. Usually it doesn't happen because other guys move out of the way regardless, but even if they don't, I don't see a point in trying to measure who's most manly about it.

I still haven't been in a fight, and I'm much more humble in the clubs. One thing that has been pissing me off recently is girls being extremely physical sometimes. A girl I didn't even approach walks by me and pushes me hard physically so she can walk by. I end up shoving them as they walk by in that moment and forget about it afterwards. Haven't run into problems yet with this yet. I don't mind being slightly pushed away by the arm or shoulder or upper back for someone to walk by in a crowded club but if I'm being shoved it's annoying to say the least.

Either way it's never been something to ruin my night and I get back into having fun and approaching girls within a minute.

Reading D&P past couple articles recently also helped me bring this whole 'fight' thing into focus. Only fight if your life/safety is at significant risk. Out of all the shoulder checking and bumping, shoving, and whatever physical stuff I've had against me the past year, only once do I have a situation that I could have fought legitimately. Some guy grabbed my neck for whatever reason, I was a bit drunk and decided to be passive, I had a couple buddies at that time that broke it up and went over the guy but the bouncers broke it off and nothing ended up happening.

Post: #61

Me- handsome young gent, suited up, buttons blown open, pocket square popping

Some tall white guy shoulder-checks in the club, then refuses to let me pass, and then he yelled at me go around.

The dude was acting "hard", because he was dancing w/his girl.

I went around him, then my blood started boiling. I stopped him and CALMLY asked him "Do we have a problem? Because if you do, we can go RIGHT NOW." Looked him straight in the eyes.

He looked at me, looked at his girl. Told me "No, I was just messing with you man."

I let it go.

Usually I have about 1-2 incidents/year that guys are belligerently drunk or showing off.

Post: #62

@Slubu

Not getting angry easily is a good quality you have.

Once I was exiting a club and I had just parted with my friend at 3 am. I was alone waiting for a taxi when 2 guys approached me. They were young college students, drunk, and one of them was 6 ft 5. The tall guy asked me if I had baby powder in my pockets. When I said no, he started getting angry and said "what, you sure you dont have it???". I said no, and I remained cool. When he saw he wasn't swaying me he got tired and told his friend : " Man why doesn't anyone want to fight tonight???" Then he went searching for other people.

These guys were bullies, but even bullies don't want to hit people for no reason. They like to create a situation first. So if you're cool and not prone to violence, you avoid these kind of useless ego fights.

Post: #63

(05-30-2012 03:20 AM)scotian Wrote:  Get a job in the trades, you'll confront assholes on a daily basis and you're three favorite words will become "go fuck yourself", worked for me anyway.

This has certainly worked for me.

Being an office jockey and sending passive aggressive emails every time you have a problem is just going to make you more and more of a bitch.

Post: #64

(02-11-2014 09:43 AM)slubu Wrote:  Well it took me a while, but looks like I'm going to enroll in a Krav Maga or Muay Thai class. Time to get hit.

Personally, I'd go with MT or western boxing.

Post: #65

Rio can you expand on why?

I'm going to take one class at a few gyms then decide.

Post: #66

To the op:

You shouldn't look at confrontations as a bad thing. In fact, fighting whether it be verbal, physical, or sexual (yeah sex is a form of fighting ) is just a way of releasing tension between two parties. Confrontations are also a way to help identify your own weak spots.

What you need to do is divorce yourself from your pride. I make declaratory statements all of the time that for the most part are 50/50 right/wrong.

So I go and say something that is incorrect. Someone gets in my face and goes, "No it's not!"

A good rabble ensues. Points are made. Yadda yadda yadda.

Whoops! Looks like I am wrong. Admit your mistake, recognize the opponent's debate game, and adjust your world view accordingly. If you're right, gloat for a quick second. Nothing like savoring a good victory and then move on.

It sounds like you're not confident in your own abilities to reason. The only way you will get better is to throw yourself into the fray and see how you end up. Once you get a baseline of where you stand work from there.

For me, I developed my confrontational attitude simply out of boredom. I lived in a leftist this that and the other for a long time and my frustration would rise out of hearing so much kumbiya junk.

I am definitely not perfect yet, but I would definitely love to get into some sort of sport fighting. That would be the quickest way to get a thick skin and learn to lose your pride.

Post: #67

(02-12-2014 06:27 AM)slubu Wrote:  Rio can you expand on why?

I'm going to take one class at a few gyms then decide.

A lot of KM clubs are bullshit. Unless you're getting it straight from an Israeli, I'd be cautious as to if the person is an actual legit KM instructor, or some Karate black belt/self defense guru who did a weekend seminar and got certified.

I also want to train the way I fight, and you can't train a lot of KM techniques full force, or even close to it. Groin strikes, eye gouges, neck strikes, etc. My personal opinion is that if you're not applying techniques at nearly full force, and also having the techniques applied to you in the same manner to defend, you won't be able to use them on the street effectively.

You have to condition yourself to respond under duress, with the adrenalin pumping, etc. in order for you to be able to do it in a real life situation, in my opinion.

Other than that, I don't really want to be doing permanent damage to some dude I have to box up in the parking lot. Tearing out eyeballs draws a lot of police attention.

You have the right idea in trying a few places out and then picking the one you like most. That's something everyone should do when deciding on a gym.

Post: #68

^^ Thanks Rio. The KM place I'm trying out was recommended by a forum guy here who trained for a few years. Did research, they seem legit with all ex military instructors. Have my first class in an hour. On Friday I will try the boxing/MT gym and see which suits me better.

Post: #69

Lift weights. Learn how to defend yourself. Listen to heavy metal/rap instead of girlie techno that they play at the clubs.

Post: #70

(02-12-2014 10:51 PM)StrengthBySonny Wrote:  Lift weights. Learn how to defend yourself. Listen to heavy metal/rap instead of girlie techno that they play at the clubs.

DMX, All day, everyday.

Post: #71

(02-12-2014 11:50 AM)slubu Wrote:  ^^ Thanks Rio. The KM place I'm trying out was recommended by a forum guy here who trained for a few years. Did research, they seem legit with all ex military instructors. Have my first class in an hour. On Friday I will try the boxing/MT gym and see which suits me better.

Fuck it. In honor of this thread I'm gonna hit up that boxing gym 2 blocks from my apartment tomorrow.

This is the spot. Pretty well known place I guess. I can walk there:
http://www.westsideboxing.com/