Post: #1

Just wanted to warn people that in the major western urban center of Ukraine, there are widely varying enforcement of the 90 days in 90 days out rules.

Me and another guy were doing 90 day stays , then leaving for Poland via overland bus and sometimes walking across the border outbound at a checkpoint, staying just a day or two in Poland and then coming back overland on foot or in my case on a bus.

If you do that, in your passport the stamps will be in pairs... in -- out something like below:


Day 1 (in) ---------- Day 89 (out)

day 90 (in) ----------Day 180 (out)

day 182 (in)---------

I left VIA AIRPORT today with a set of stamps looking like above and they totally flagged me and called their boss right away.
They were polite, I didn't try to bullshit them, but it took them about half an hour to fill out forms and I was fined about $100 for 71 days overstay in the last 180. I think it's like 12 HR per day or a little over a dollar.. guessing.

I was starting to freak because I had a flight to catch but they have this deal where they give you a form and you have 15 days to pay in Ukraine which is a pain because you can't go back ( or aren't supposed to for 90 days or when you get a visa) so I guess I'll wire money to some friends and ask them to go to the airport and pay the fine. So I made my flight.

These guards were way different than the ones on the overland route, the overland guys are like gruff cops, they check your shit out but I think they are just screening for wanted assholes.

These guards were chicks, like "good girl" students or something, the boss they called to write me up was a 7.

They were asking me if I was married and how much I made at my profession; when I told them 10K a month we were cracking up and they said I should take them with me. ( Of course they were only joking, I don't want them to get in trouble) "That is a lot for us." one said.

I said I could only take one (there were three) , and one suggested I take one out on my European passport and one on my American.

The fines are to go to some bank account listed on the paperwork they gave me, they weren't shaking me down, just going by the book.

So my point is DON'T try to bend the rules at airports, I think they're preferred posts because they're near civilization ( cities) and the people who get those posts don't want to fuck up and get sent to the boonies.

The guys in the boonies don't seem to give a shit as long as you're not wanted. At this point anyway.

The whole thing was kind of surreal, there were these three 20-something women sitting in the office with me and they weren't mad or anything, I 've worked with law enforcement and most are honorable people in the USA anyway, I respect they're just doing their job, they weren't personally rude to me , it was actually rather entertaining hanging out with them and I didn't bullshit or try to get out of it because I don't like to insult people by lying to them when I knew I didn't follow the rules.

It was a good 30 minutes of filling out antiquated forms by hand and I apologized for making extra work for them. Now I KNOW that's beta, but hey, you're reading this whacking it in DC so that does that make YOU?:banana

Tonight I'm in Wroclaw, on a warm early summer night, it's Poosy Paradise and I'm hot for the hostel worker girl sitting 10 feet away from my door... I'll tell you later how I fuck it up....but it's still a dream compared to the land of the Murkabeests....

Post: #2

I can't believe you flew out of the airport, I told you this was not a good idea!. They have to go by the book at the airport, at land crossings they don't give a fuck, they just get out the calculator and make sure you haven't overstayed the 90 days.

So in fact the rules haven't changed much at all as far as I can see. If you fly out of the airport in this situation you may as well pull down your pants when you hand over your passport. Likewise if you overstay.

Post: #3

(05-22-2012 04:22 PM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  I can't believe you flew out of the airport, I told you this was not a good idea!. They have to go by the book at the airport, at land crossings they don't give a fuck, they just get out the calculator and make sure you haven't overstayed the 90 days.

Well, like Jack Nicholson says in Chinatown ( one of my top 5 all -time favorites, along with Blade Runner, Matrix, Eternal Sunshine) :

"When you're right, you're right, and you're right."

By the way, do you know if outbound by train they hassle you?

Post: #4

Never heard of any problems by car, bus or train. Unless overstaying.

Post: #5

I'm confused... how did you overstay for 71 days? What you did wasn't legit?

Post: #6

(05-22-2012 04:31 PM)Roosh Wrote:  I'm confused... how did you overstay for 71 days? What you did wasn't legit?

He stayed for 161 days out of 180. No because he can only stay 90 in 180

Post: #7

Ah I see.

Everywhere I read said that overstaying is your best bet instead of trying to go legal since the Ukrainian bureaucracy is a mess.

Post: #8

(05-22-2012 04:41 PM)Roosh Wrote:  Ah I see.

Everywhere I read said that overstaying is your best bet instead of trying to go legal since the Ukrainian bureaucracy is a mess.

I overstayed for a month or so. Got a 100 us bill at the airport. They would have allowed me to miss my flight if I didn't pay.

This was in Kiev.

Prior to that, I was bribing a woman who in turned bribed others to get me extensions. It took weeks sometimes. She was only able to do it around 3 to 4 times. Cost a couple hundred which would be cheaper then leaving and coming back.

Post: #9

That isnt a big price to pay..?
100 dollars for 71 days.
thats less than a a buck fiddy a day.

unless theres some lasting effect on a passport..i dont see to much of a problem

Post: #10

when i was there the trick was to cross by car/foot at like day 80ish, then come back before the 90 days are up (so they can't refuse you entry), then just do it again at a different border crossing each time before the next 90 days are up. not sure if this still works.

Post: #11

(05-22-2012 04:22 PM)Deb Auchery Wrote:  I can't believe you flew out of the airport, I told you this was not a good idea!. They have to go by the book at the airport, at land crossings they don't give a fuck, they just get out the calculator and make sure you haven't overstayed the 90 days.

So in fact the rules haven't changed much at all as far as I can see. If you fly out of the airport in this situation you may as well pull down your pants when you hand over your passport. Likewise if you overstay.

I think this is pretty much true, I have a friend here from the UK, he has a car and is required to leave and re-enter every 60 days, it's no problem for him, about a month a go, he left Ukraine in his car, exited the country near Lvov and had no problems leaving,

what airport did you leave from?

Post: #12

I never leave by plane. Although I have been tempted.

Post: #13

From your airport anecdote, it seems that you have 2 passports.

Could you not have just alternated back and forth between the two passports i.e. 90 in passport 1, 90 in passport 2... perpetually?

Post: #14

(05-23-2012 03:53 AM)Blunt Wrote:  From your airport anecdote, it seems that you have 2 passports.

Could you not have just alternated back and forth between the two passports i.e. 90 in passport 1, 90 in passport 2... perpetually?

I've considered this, and I believe this almost certainly would have worked, but I always try to commit the smallest crime possible to achieve my ends. This is as I described above , to avoid being seen by law enforcement as someone trying to game them.

I'm a mental health person who's worked extensively with law enforcement personnel.

They are so used to people bullshitting, leaving out information, lying, that they are really tired of that. It's insulting and it makes them feel like they are not being dealt with like human beings.

Deliberately using one-then-the-other strategy you mentioned might be a way worse crime ( fraud of some kind) or it might be so obscure it's not even be a crime at all, but I did not want to be there answering the question " Did you come in under another passport?"

This would obviously show I was fucking with them-- not good.

Your passport has a date of birth and combined with name it's a very, very good chance it's the same person.

Of course if you are charged with some really bad thing, you have to protect yourself any way you can, but (1) I don't do really bad things; and (2) I've found the leniency obtained by being very honest is such a relief for cops they usually give you quite a break.

They were explaining " You can only be in 90 out of 180 days. " I said yes, I understand. It's just a Beta honor thing--I'm not going to fucking lie unless it's a matter of huge importance.

In this case they made sure I made my plane, the best English speaker even leading me to the right place with about 25 minutes to spare to help me out.

The person here reporting from Kiev reported harsher treatment, he was worried he was going to miss his plane. I have no idea if that had anything to do with me "kissing ass" -- it might have. Not saying the other person posting here was rude or anything, but all over the world cops have leeway to make uncooperative people suffer and give otherwise benevolent offenders a break. Missing a flight could cost a thousand or more, especially considering the stress. This will cost me about $125; $100 for the fine and $25 to pay someone to go pay the fine.

Post: #15

Understandable. Do you intend on finding a way to stay long-term in Ukraine legally?

Post: #16

I'm confused is the 90 day rule for people from all countries? I'm from USA and stayed 4 months one time and heard nothing. I thought USA citizens had 6 months or more in Ukraine?

Post: #17

(05-23-2012 05:33 AM)iknowexactly Wrote:  The person here reporting from Kiev reported harsher treatment, he was worried he was going to miss his plane. I have no idea if that had anything to do with me "kissing ass" -- it might have.

If you're talking about me, then no, I wasn't being rude and they were not giving me harsh treatment. They were just following the rules.

They were actually very nice and the woman officer was quite attractive.

Kissing ass wouldn't have helped either. Being nice, paying the fine and you would be off.

I never heard of anyone paying their fines outside the airport. Everyone I heard that got the fine paid it at the airport and was able to leave.

Post: #18

dupe

Post: #19

(05-23-2012 01:38 PM)brianmark Wrote:  I'm confused is the 90 day rule for people from all countries? I'm from USA and stayed 4 months one time and heard nothing. I thought USA citizens had 6 months or more in Ukraine?

Nope, 90 days in a 180 day span.

Post: #20

Bumping this for relevance

Does anyone know the current penalties for overstaying and if its possible to perpetually overstay if one keeps paying the fine? (exit tax)

Post: #21

My cousin just asked me similar question 2 weeks ago when I went to Lviv.

Let's say Americans have 90 days to stay there. Italians also have 90 days to stay. He has both passports. What if he goes there 90 days with American passport, get out to Poland 1 day, then go in again with Italian passport another 90 days?

Post: #22

No one knows what the situation is?

Post: #23

Why not take a ride share out to Latvia or Poland if you aren't certain?

Post: #24

(08-23-2017 03:10 PM)El_Gostro Wrote:  Why not take a ride share out to Latvia or Poland if you aren't certain?

Why would a ride share be better?

Post: #25

Buses are more likely to go through controls and checkpoints.