Post: #26

Does this waiter deserve a tip?

Waiter Spills Beer on German Leader Angela Merkel

Post: #27

If I'm Angela Merkel (in a position of higher economic and political power than the puny waiter), and knowing how a server lives and what he's paid, as long as he gives good service and apologizes...a minor mistake like that I can forgive and would still tip.

If a server cockblocked me or did it on purpose, then that's a different story.

It's precisely these situations that I think all people should go through being a restaurant server at least once in their lifetimes (as opposed to military conscription).
It teaches them kindness, empathy, and class like no other school can.

So now you know what I think, I need your feedback G...

Was this Beta?

Post: #28

Fake....

http://www.businessinsider.com/restauran...oax-2012-2

Post: #29

(02-28-2012 12:14 PM)Brian Wrote:  Fake....

http://www.businessinsider.com/restauran...oax-2012-2

Good hypothetical scenario for the topic of this thread regardless.

Btw, let the restaurant produce *their copy* of the receipt. I just looked at the OP photo and it said "Merchant Copy" at the bottom. Yes, I know what Photoshop can do---so show independent observers the original "merchant copy" receipt and let Breanna the waitress talk.

Post: #30

(02-28-2012 03:31 AM)Enfant_Terrible Wrote:  God, I'm on fucking fire about this tipping issue

I think every person should be a restaurant server at least once in their lifetime.

Few more thoughts before bed:

-If you don't want to tip, cook the food yourself. It's cheaper.

If you want higher wages for servers (and everybody else for that matter) so there would be no need for tip. Support the following policies/issues:
-make it easier for restaurants to open and maintain their business if they do their jobs. Less bureaucracy, please.
-Low or zero income taxes. More money to spend and pump into the economy.
-No government subsidies on food. Subsidies make food expensive.
-Allow smoking areas in restaurants. More G's dropping cash on your resto.
-No costly, undeclared wars. Money spent in wars to kill people could've been spent paying off that debt that will keep on taxing us financially and psychologically.
-feel free to add...

Socialism

You bring up many good points, less bureaucracy is better!

However, it is wrong to vilify the customer.
The customer can tip, as long as it isn't stated that gratuity is a certain amount, anything they want, whether that be 0, or 100%.

This anger that people have about not tipping should be directed towards those issues that you have stated, it is extremely negligent on their behalf to take the easy way out, by accusing the customers of moral wrongdoings.

Post: #31

(02-28-2012 12:33 PM)johnwu Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 03:31 AM)Enfant_Terrible Wrote:  God, I'm on fucking fire about this tipping issue

I think every person should be a restaurant server at least once in their lifetime.

Few more thoughts before bed:

-If you don't want to tip, cook the food yourself. It's cheaper.

If you want higher wages for servers (and everybody else for that matter) so there would be no need for tip. Support the following policies/issues:
-make it easier for restaurants to open and maintain their business if they do their jobs. Less bureaucracy, please.
-Low or zero income taxes. More money to spend and pump into the economy.
-No government subsidies on food. Subsidies make food expensive.
-Allow smoking areas in restaurants. More G's dropping cash on your resto.
-No costly, undeclared wars. Money spent in wars to kill people could've been spent paying off that debt that will keep on taxing us financially and psychologically.
-feel free to add...

Socialism

Yup, no tipping in welfare state places like Sweden for example

You bring up many good points, less bureaucracy is better!

However, it is wrong to vilify the customer.
The customer can tip, as long as it isn't stated that gratuity is a certain amount, anything they want, whether that be 0, or 100%.

I did state that it's the customer's call to tip any amount and you're right tipping shouldn't be mandatory since it goes against the concept of tipping.
And it is precisely in that power of choice on the customer's part that servers will judge what kind of person they are.

This anger that people have about not tipping should be directed towards those issues that you have stated, it is extremely negligent on their behalf to take the easy way out, by accusing the customers of moral wrongdoings.

Absolutely that things can be improved on a macro/big picture level. However, while the status quo between servers and customers are in place...people need to understand the dynamics between a typical customer eating a nice dinner meal and a typical server who's only certain income is almost negligible for his living needs.

Post: #32

(02-28-2012 12:23 PM)Enfant_Terrible Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 12:14 PM)Brian Wrote:  Fake....

http://www.businessinsider.com/restauran...oax-2012-2

Good hypothetical scenario for the topic of this thread regardless.

Btw, let the restaurant produce *their copy* of the receipt. I just looked at the OP photo and it said "Merchant Copy" at the bottom. Yes, I know what Photoshop can do---so show independent observers the original "merchant copy" receipt and let Breanna the waitress talk.

Yeah, it is something that is not outside the realm of possibility.

I would wager this happens plenty.

I mentioned earlier that Bill Gross said he did something similar when he was younger.

Post: #33

(02-28-2012 10:42 AM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 09:26 AM)Lemmo Wrote:  This sounds fake. Probably some OWS type trying to demonize bankers.

Maybe, but it is not really that far fetched either.

Bill Gross had a similar story of him doing the same thing in one of his newsletters if I recall correctly.

Let me guess, you have never worked in the service industry?

Actually, it IS fake. Check the Smoking gun link posted earlier.

Post: #34

(02-28-2012 01:24 PM)Vicious Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 10:42 AM)thegmanifesto Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 09:26 AM)Lemmo Wrote:  This sounds fake. Probably some OWS type trying to demonize bankers.

Maybe, but it is not really that far fetched either.

Bill Gross had a similar story of him doing the same thing in one of his newsletters if I recall correctly.

Let me guess, you have never worked in the service industry?

Actually, it IS fake. Check the Smoking gun link posted earlier.

Gotcha.

Check my post above.

Post: #35

(02-28-2012 12:33 PM)johnwu Wrote:  This anger that people have about not tipping should be directed towards those issues that you have stated, it is extremely negligent on their behalf to take the easy way out, by accusing the customers of moral wrongdoings.

That's the problem I have with the issue.. particularly in California.

It is expected that the customer pay at least 15%. A lot of people do it out of habit. One time I was at a lunch and the waitress completely forgot one of our orders, and didn't do anything to really make up for it when she found out (a while after we had all received our orders) but the person paying the bill still gave her 15%.

The problem is that giving the tip is basically something that just happens, and is expected of you, without much consideration that what you are giving is in fact a tip.

Most people don't look at it as a tip anymore, but as another tax. They don't realize that there is a lot of grayness to tipping. The tipper can tip whatever he wishes, but most people would never want to seem cheap by tipping "too little."

Now that I think about it, that OP waitress was probably servicing other tables as well, so that $20 expected tip was just one of probably 3-4 tables she was working, so she could potentially make up to $75+ an hour if she finds herself at the right restaurant. I know that restaurant that she is working at, and it's right next to a bunch of financial/law firms in Newport Beach. She has the right type of client, so she is most likely working 6 hour shifts and making more than most of her college-graduated friends in a year.

Like I said before, I don't think any server deserves to make more than any professional/educated worker.

Post: #36

(02-28-2012 12:14 PM)Brian Wrote:  Fake....

http://www.businessinsider.com/restauran...oax-2012-2

Good catch, I saw this as well: http://www.thesmokinggun.com/buster/phot...oax-869032

Post: #37

(02-28-2012 01:56 PM)kerouac Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 12:33 PM)johnwu Wrote:  This anger that people have about not tipping should be directed towards those issues that you have stated, it is extremely negligent on their behalf to take the easy way out, by accusing the customers of moral wrongdoings.

That's the problem I have with the issue.. particularly in California.

It is expected that the customer pay at least 15%. A lot of people do it out of habit. One time I was at a lunch and the waitress completely forgot one of our orders, and didn't do anything to really make up for it when she found out (a while after we had all received our orders) but the person paying the bill still gave her 15%.

The problem is that giving the tip is basically something that just happens, and is expected of you, without much consideration that what you are giving is in fact a tip.

Most people don't look at it as a tip anymore, but as another tax. They don't realize that there is a lot of grayness to tipping. The tipper can tip whatever he wishes, but most people would never want to seem cheap by tipping "too little."

Now that I think about it, that OP waitress was probably servicing other tables as well, so that $20 expected tip was just one of probably 3-4 tables she was working, so she could potentially make up to $75+ an hour if she finds herself at the right restaurant. I know that restaurant that she is working at, and it's right next to a bunch of financial/law firms in Newport Beach. She has the right type of client, so she is most likely working 6 hour shifts and making more than most of her college-graduated friends in a year.

Like I said before, I don't think any server deserves to make more than any professional/educated worker.

Exactly, the fact that the cost of the food impacts the amount of tip the waiter receives is silly. Serving a $100 steak is no more difficult than a $5 burger but it is expected that the server receives $14 more.

Post: #38

(02-28-2012 02:16 PM)canucktraveller Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 01:56 PM)kerouac Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 12:33 PM)johnwu Wrote:  This anger that people have about not tipping should be directed towards those issues that you have stated, it is extremely negligent on their behalf to take the easy way out, by accusing the customers of moral wrongdoings.

That's the problem I have with the issue.. particularly in California.

It is expected that the customer pay at least 15%. A lot of people do it out of habit. One time I was at a lunch and the waitress completely forgot one of our orders, and didn't do anything to really make up for it when she found out (a while after we had all received our orders) but the person paying the bill still gave her 15%.

The problem is that giving the tip is basically something that just happens, and is expected of you, without much consideration that what you are giving is in fact a tip.

Most people don't look at it as a tip anymore, but as another tax. They don't realize that there is a lot of grayness to tipping. The tipper can tip whatever he wishes, but most people would never want to seem cheap by tipping "too little."

Now that I think about it, that OP waitress was probably servicing other tables as well, so that $20 expected tip was just one of probably 3-4 tables she was working, so she could potentially make up to $75+ an hour if she finds herself at the right restaurant. I know that restaurant that she is working at, and it's right next to a bunch of financial/law firms in Newport Beach. She has the right type of client, so she is most likely working 6 hour shifts and making more than most of her college-graduated friends in a year.

Like I said before, I don't think any server deserves to make more than any professional/educated worker.

Exactly, the fact that the cost of the food impacts the amount of tip the waiter receives is silly. Serving a $100 steak is no more difficult than a $5 burger but it is expected that the server receives $14 more.

Take into account not only the cost of food but the manner of service given to you and the fact that you didn't feel like cooking that night.

Btw, have you worked as a server in a busy restaurant?

Post: #39

(02-28-2012 01:56 PM)kerouac Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 12:33 PM)johnwu Wrote:  This anger that people have about not tipping should be directed towards those issues that you have stated, it is extremely negligent on their behalf to take the easy way out, by accusing the customers of moral wrongdoings.

Most people don't look at it as a tip anymore, but as another tax. They don't realize that there is a lot of grayness to tipping. The tipper can tip whatever he wishes, but most people would never want to seem cheap by tipping "too little."

Exactly, pay the price of service and labor if you don't feel like cooking yourself. It's not like people are getting ripped off--the prices are on the menu and they can observe how the service was to base their tipping decision on.

Like I said before, I don't think any server deserves to make more than any professional/educated worker.

Your opinion. Like I argued above, why put limits to income based on education and skill if there's a demand for a particular job/service?

Post: #40

"The original receipt does not contain the notation “Get A Real Job.” Nor does it have an arrow pointing to those words from the “Tip” line.

The amount on the actual receipt is $33.54, Reagan said, not $133.54 as seen on the altered receipt. And while the tip on the online receipt claims that the server was left $1.33 (or one percent of the bill), the actual tip was more than $7 on the $33.54 tab."

So he really tipped $7.33 on $33.54? That's a fuckin 20% tip.
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/buster/phot...oax-869032

Total hoax by some on-line attention whore. And people fell for it. Again.

Now that his deception has been discovered, the "Future Ex Banker" has shut down both his blog and twitter account and ran away from the internet with his tail between his legs.

Post: #41

(02-28-2012 02:24 PM)Enfant_Terrible Wrote:  Take into account not only the cost of food but the manner of service given to you and the fact that you didn't feel like cooking that night.

Btw, have you worked as a server in a busy restaurant?

You gotta learn how to use the quote system on this forum. Quoting a whole post to write a one sentence response is bad etiquette.

I have never worked at a busy restaurant, but I have never worked as a garbage man, or as a fruit picker, or as nuclear scientist.

If what you're saying is that it is up to me, as a customer, to reward her for working hard, rather than her boss doing it for me, I don't agree with you there.

One thing I love about going to Europe is that whatever price I see is what I pay. I know, up front, what the cost is going to be. Here in the States I always have to add about 30% on top of the price I see to get a fair understanding of the true cost to me.

Back to your point, I don't think someone working at a restaurant deserves to make $50+ servicing tables. It's a low-skill job. Anyway, it shouldn't be up to me how much she makes. The US ought to move towards a system where prices are up front. Of course, businesses will never go for that. Businesses will do whatever they can, in their power, to dissuade people from moving to something more like the European system. In Europe the price you see is what you pay. What's wrong with that? Why should I, as the customer, put thought into what the server deserves, when I don't do it for any other person's job?

Do I go to a Bank and tip a teller because I think he handled my money well? Do I tip my college professor because today's lecture was particularly engaging? Do I tip my doctor for not messing up?

No.

It's an archaic system that needs to change. The only people who don't want it to change are people who work in that industry who enjoy reaping the benefits of people's naivety.

Post: #42

Pic of Breanna? Bangable?

Post: #43

We need InternationPlayboy to weigh in on this one.

He works in the service industry.

Post: #44

(02-28-2012 02:39 PM)kerouac Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 02:24 PM)Enfant_Terrible Wrote:  Take into account not only the cost of food but the manner of service given to you and the fact that you didn't feel like cooking that night.

Btw, have you worked as a server in a busy restaurant?

You gotta learn how to use the quote system on this forum. Quoting a whole post to write a one sentence response is bad etiquette.

I think I've been doing an ok job with snipping posts here and there. And that quote was a direct response to canucktraveller if you followed the response pattern.

I have never worked at a busy restaurant, but I have never worked as a garbage man, or as a fruit picker, or as nuclear scientist.

If what you're saying is that it is up to me, as a customer, to reward her for working hard, rather than her boss doing it for me, I don't agree with you there.

The restaurant owner/manager is not always present to evaluate level of service. It's between you and the server.

One thing I love about going to Europe is that whatever price I see is what I pay. I know, up front, what the cost is going to be. Here in the States I always have to add about 30% on top of the price I see to get a fair understanding of the true cost to me.

Like I said above, if you want to usher in a new era of tip less service where workers can live at least on their pay then support policies that help the economy.

Back to your point, I don't think someone working at a restaurant deserves to make $50+ servicing tables. It's a low-skill job. Anyway, it shouldn't be up to me how much she makes. The US ought to move towards a system where prices are up front. Of course, businesses will never go for that. Businesses will do whatever they can, in their power, to dissuade people from moving to something more like the European system. In Europe the price you see is what you pay. What's wrong with that? Why should I, as the customer, put thought into what the server deserves, when I don't do it for any other person's job?

Do I go to a Bank and tip a teller because I think he handled my money well? Do I tip my college professor because today's lecture was particularly engaging? Do I tip my doctor for not messing up?

No.

It's an archaic system that needs to change. The only people who don't want it to change are people who work in that industry who enjoy reaping the benefits of people's naivety.

Ok arguments for tip less service. But you're comparing servers with people who have relatively higher incomes that afford a comfortable lifestyle. Also, we're stuck with a system right now where I pity the fool who doesn't tip well and comes back to that same restaurant with the same server.

Post: #45

(02-28-2012 02:44 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Pic of Breanna? Bangable?

I would take a picture but Newport Beach is about a 1-2 hour drive for me

Post: #46

While this is fucked up, as a chef and cook I have no sympathy. The bitch probably still made a $100+ that day for 5 hours of work, before her hourly wage is factored in.

Servers are entitled babies. I've heard servers whine about only making $200 a night in a 6 hour shift. Meanwhile the cooks who work harder longer days get no cut of that despite the fact its us that get them their tip. Good line cooks will bust their ass to keep service times tight while keeping food quality as good as it can be. Good hot food that comes out fast is what gets servers their tip.

Chef In Jeans
A culinary website for men

Post: #47

(02-28-2012 03:07 PM)Chad Daring Wrote:  While this is fucked up, as a chef and cook I have no sympathy. The bitch probably still made a $100+ that day for 5 hours of work, before her hourly wage is factored in.

Servers are entitled babies. I've heard servers whine about only making $200 a night in a 6 hour shift. Meanwhile the cooks who work harder longer days get no cut of that despite the fact its us that get them their tip. Good line cooks will bust their ass to keep service times tight while keeping food quality as good as it can be. Good hot food that comes out fast is what gets servers their tip.

Would you say that you make way more than the servers if you worked equal working hours as them for a week?

Post: #48

It appears the blogger walked off with the Merchant Copy to doctor up at home, while sticking them with the Guest Copy. You'll notice the table top of the "restaurant table" it's laid on is marble --but True Food uses wood table tops. (I think bamboo?) I'm also pretty sure they don't use an old rusty binder clip to present receipts to customers, but use a real receipt booklet with a space for the pen that folds closed so the credit card doesn't slip out. Nor do they mention offering free wi-fi on their web site. It doesn't appear to be a photoshop job as much as a "steal the merchant copy and stage a fake receipt in a fake restaurant at home" job.

Or given the free wi-fi receipt UNDER the True Foods Restaurant receipt in the photo, they probably went to a local coffee house offering free wi-fi, wrote funny stuff on their stolen Merchant Account receipt, then staged the receipt in the cafe hoping to make it look like they were at True Foods when they took it.

Most likely they scanned the original receipt, darkened up the text so it'd photograph better at a distance, added the "1" to the amount while moving out the $ sign, then printed out a new doctored bill for their photo prank, also leaving extra header space so the address wouldn't be obscured in the final photo. No doubt they printed out multiple copies and signed them until they liked the look. Certainly the handwriting looks different between the two, including the "7".

The paper for the staged receipt looks like ink jet paper, not thermal print paper off a roll. Too white, and too thick/opaque. And the text height for the blogger's staged receipt on top appears to be a different height and font than the "coffee house" receipt clipped below it.

The receipt the restaurant has on file --he stuck them with the Guest receipt.


Side by Side, what the restaurant has on file vs what the blogger put up.

Post: #49

(02-28-2012 03:06 PM)Enfant_Terrible Wrote:  

(02-28-2012 02:44 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  Pic of Breanna? Bangable?

I would take a picture but Newport Beach is about a 1-2 hour drive for me

It's probably worth about ten rep points while this thread is still hot. Better hurry. lol

Post: #50

(02-28-2012 03:31 PM)el mechanico Wrote:  It's probably worth about ten rep points while this thread is still hot. Better hurry. lol

Damn, for 10 rep points I might do it! I go to a gym right by this place pretty often. Maybe I'll stop by on Thursday. Let's keep this thread HOT! I need those points!!!!!