Post: #1

I like the mindset of many of the members here, so I wanted to bring this question to the forum.

How important and/or beneficial is it to read books in your opinion?

I got my bachelors at a good university in a field that required a lot of reading and writing. Looking back on it I grew tremendously from those years.

But......

Do real world experiences teach you more?

Do books teach you things that are valuable in your day to day life, or are they more just general knowledge that is hard to apply?

I have a lot of free time for the next five months, and if I become convinced that it is worth it I could probably read upwards of 20-30 books.

Thoughts?

Post: #2

How beneficial is it to use the internet? How beneficial is it to talk to people?

Post: #3

“In my whole life, I have known no wise people (over a broad subject matter area) who didn’t read all the time – none, zero.” Charlie Munger

Also,
https://25iq.com/2015/07/26/a-dozen-thin...t-reading/

Post: #4

It depends what you read but I've learned far more reading in my spare time in the last 2 years or so than I ever learned from university.

Moreover, just about any problem you've had, some one has likely written about it, whether it is saving taxes, investing, learning a language, so save some time and read what other people have written.

Post: #5

Consistently reading books is one of the best habits you can form. There are dozens of book threads in the deep forum, tons of book posts and recommendations on blogs from guys like Roosh and Cernovich, and all over the internet in general. Find a handful that intrigue you and order them used on Amazon.

No one has ever been on their deathbed and wished they would've read fewer books.

Post: #6

(03-29-2017 05:00 PM)wi30 Wrote:  No one has ever been on their deathbed and wished they would've read fewer books.

I like that you guys are in favor of reading books, but this specifically stuck out to me. Do you really think that is the case?

When I originally posted this my train of thought was mainly about what the return on investment is with reading and what it allows you to do in life that you otherwise wouldn't be able to.

Just to give you an example of what I mean about the return on investment issue (this might be a bad example, so bear with me), how long does it take to read the average book? I probably average 20-25 pages an hour depending on the book. Let's say the average book is 400 pages. That's 20 hours.

If I read 10 books on South America (culture, politics, cuisine, w/e), that would take me 200 hours. Well what if I spent those 200 hours working a side job and earned at a rate of $15-$20. That would give me roughly $4000 which I could probably actually fly to SA and travel around for at least a couple of months.

Which of those seems like the wiser decision?

Also, as I asked earlier, what do books allow you to do in your real life that you otherwise wouldn't be able to by not reading them?

Post: #7

You have to strike a balance. I've found just reading a wikipedia article is usually enough to satisfy my desire for knowledge on some topic. If I then need more I'll find a book on it.

I think just reading for the sake of it isn't a worthwhile persuit. That's time that could be better spent elsewhere.

I'd estimate over the last few years I've read about 1 book every 2 or 3 months, ranging from small to large. None of those were novels, which I consider a complete waste of time. All were in some way practically usefull.

Post: #8

You're looking at reading as if it is a chore. If it doesn't interest you, that's fine. But don't lecture the rest of us about how it's a "waste of time" or we can be doing something more "productive".

It seems like you've already made up your mind about it so I'm not sure what you're after.

Post: #9

misinterpreted

Post: #10

Outside of practical books that help you solve a problem you're actively working on, I've always felt reading books is just entertainment for smart people. Yeah, you can get benefits like becoming wiser or having an expanded worldview, but without some specific end those qualities help you reach, it's just about what makes you feel good about yourself.

More generally, I put reading books together with being educated.

I do need to read more though because I'm a terrible writer.

Post: #11

(03-29-2017 09:40 PM)TigerMandingo Wrote:  You're looking at reading as if it is a chore. If it doesn't interest you, that's fine. But don't lecture the rest of us about how it's a "waste of time" or we can be doing something more "productive".

It seems like you've already made up your mind about it so I'm not sure what you're after.

This was probably the most useless post I've read in a while. I just double checked, and I never used the term "waste of time" or something more "productive". I also was not lecturing in the least bit, I was asking a question and giving some perspective.

Post: #12

OP, it's obvious you're new to reading as a hobby. I don't mean that as an insult. You just haven't experienced the benefits.

Clearly if you plan on reading 10 books on South America vs. actually going there it's apples and oranges. That would be the equivalent of reading 10 game books and never approaching a girl. You can't replace an experience by reading about it. I can sit in the travel section and read every thread about Poland, but I still have to go there for that information to apply to my life. Those threads are there so you can find some good tips and advice before stepping off the plane.

Do you really think guys who read aren't working full time? Do you watch TV, play video games, aimlessly surf the web, or have any time in your day that isn't actually productive? The ROI vs. working a part time job is a ridiculous comparison.

Most people read fiction. When I read novels it's in bed before going to sleep. I prefer fiction that applies to real life: Atlas Shrugged, 1984, Brave New World, etc. Probably less than 10% of my reading is fiction though.

You'll grow more as a person and gain a better understanding of the world by reading nonfiction. Books on history, culture, science, business, personal finance, self improvement, biographies, philosophy, and so on. It'll make you a more interesting man and other people will see you as well read. You'll have a better vocabulary and enhanced writing skills. You'll think about money differently and make smarter choices with what you do with it.

I've learned more from reading books in my spare time than I ever did getting a bachelor degree in business. Formal schooling is designed to dumb you down and make you a great employee for someone who skipped college and decided to work for themselves.

If you don't want to read a particular book you pick up, don't force yourself to. I've put down books halfway through because they were boring me and it felt like a chore to finish. I've done the same thing 30 pages in as well. When you get your hands on a really good book though, you'll be up 3 hours past when you were planning to go to bed because you can't put it down.

Post: #13

(03-29-2017 10:18 PM)wi30 Wrote:  OP, it's obvious you're new to reading as a hobby. I don't mean that as an insult. You just haven't experienced the benefits.

Clearly if you plan on reading 10 books on South America vs. actually going there it's apples and oranges. That would be the equivalent of reading 10 game books and never approaching a girl. You can't replace an experience by reading about it. I can sit in the travel section and read every thread about Poland, but I still have to go there for that information to apply to my life. Those threads are there so you can find some good tips and advice before stepping off the plane.

Do you really think guys who read aren't working full time? Do you watch TV, play video games, aimlessly surf the web, or have any time in your day that isn't actually productive? The ROI vs. working a part time job is a ridiculous comparison.

Most people read fiction. When I read novels it's in bed before going to sleep. I prefer fiction that applies to real life: Atlas Shrugged, 1984, Brave New World, etc. Probably less than 10% of my reading is fiction though.

You'll grow more as a person and gain a better understanding of the world by reading nonfiction. Books on history, culture, science, business, personal finance, self improvement, biographies, philosophy, and so on. It'll make you a more interesting man and other people will see you as well read. You'll have a better vocabulary and enhanced writing skills. You'll think about money differently and make smarter choices with what you do with it.

I've learned more from reading books in my spare time than I ever did getting a bachelor degree in business. Formal schooling is designed to dumb you down and make you a great employee for someone who skipped college and decided to work for themselves.

If you don't want to read a particular book you pick up, don't force yourself to. I've put down books halfway through because they were boring me and it felt like a chore to finish. I've done the same thing 30 pages in as well. When you get your hands on a really good book though, you'll be up 3 hours past when you were planning to go to bed because you can't put it down.

That was pretty insightful, thanks.

I actually think if I do begin reading as a hobby it will be mainly fiction, because I have started to write and I've read that reading helps develop one's writing.

I just went through my bookshelf and set aside every book that I've purchased and either never opened or stopped reading in the first hundred or so pages. There are sixteen of them, including:

The Communist Manifesto
Wealth of Nations
War and Peace
Origin of the Species
Man and His Symbols

I just wrote some of those out to show how varied they are. I'd love to sit down and read all 16 of them, and I do have the time, I'm just at a loss regarding whether The Communist Manifesto is going to get me anywhere in life.

Now I'm just ranting, but I think I got what I need from this thread, thanks all.

Post: #14

I have the Communist Manifesto, Mein Kampf, John Stuart Mill, Milton Friedman, John Maynard Keynes and a lot of other contradictions on my bookshelf. It's interesting to see other perspectives and why history played out the way it did.

I'm paraphrasing a quote I can't completely recall, but the difference between an average man and an intelligent one is being able to read and understand works he disagrees with. Aristotle maybe?

Post: #15

When it comes to news, I generally read only long-form journalism, whether it's online or in print. Someone once got after me about the time I spent on it, wondering why I don't just watch cable news like everyone else. It's faster, you can turn it on in the background, it's more entertaining, etc.

I had to point out that they were simply watching the same three or four stories, recirculated all day, designed to agitate ("entertain") but with a very shallow depth of actual knowledge. Most of the time, they just choose trials for crimes that don't mean anything to you, but because of the nature of the crime, you get sucked in. You can spend hours like this feeling like you're watching "the news" and learn nothing, or you can read (say) the multi-page special interest spreads in the Economist and walk away with some actual knowledge about Russian politics, Pacific trade, cyberwarfare, etc., and then realize just how much you actually don't know and decide what you want to do with it.

All media is a kind of escape from the limitations of your personal knowledge and experience, but in my view, the written word provides is mind-expanding because it provides room to explore. A movie fills up your senses and tells you precisely what you're supposed to see and hear, it's designed to force an experience. The text forces you to actually process raw data into something, to decide for yourself how it looks and sounds and how you want to feel about it. There's room to step away from an "on-rails" real-time depiction of a moment in a life and spend a moment on a letter they wrote to a loved one about that moment and to let you go back and look at the words as many times as you need to figure out what you think.

Try some non-fiction that explores topics that would make interesting fiction: a good book on Marco Polo or Genghis Khan or the founding of a great world city. If you feel like modern life has destroyed your attention span and need to ease into it, try "Training the Samurai Mind" by Thomas Cleary. It's a collection of short essays written by medieval Japanese lords, warriors, and monks on various topics about society and morality, so you can take each essay as a piece at your own pace and compare their thoughts to their contemporary rivals and to your own daily life.

In any case, it's a form of media consumption and should naturally be taken in moderation against all your other duties and pursuits. I'd say playing something on Audible beats playing something on Spotify 80% of the time, though.

Post: #16

Reading is important, but alone you will get nowhere in life. Social skills will get you further in this world. The ability to read people's minds and manipulate them can bring great success. Steve Jobs, Hitler, Floyd Mayweather etc etc.

Post: #17

(03-30-2017 10:10 AM)wi30 Wrote:  John Maynard Keynes and a lot of other contradictions on my bookshelf.

I have his "General Theory" too. Man that is a laugh. It's something to observe rather than read. Basically his plan was to waffle shit for 470 pages in the most verbose and obtuse manner he possible could, and hope nobody noticed he didn't know crap about the real world.

I once took it camping with me and read a passage from it to everyone just for a laugh. It was basically a bit where he wrote a paragraph long sentence. They looked at me like I'd just taken a dump in their sleeping bag and then asked "what the fuck did you even just say?"

Post: #18

(03-30-2017 11:32 AM)Phoenix Wrote:  I once took it camping with me and read a passage from it to everyone just for a laugh.

You whipped out an economics book during a camping trip?

You must be a hit at parties.