Post: #1

I'm thinking about putting together a 2 or 3-day workshop (I could stretch it out longer to provide more support and get a bigger payout) to teach people how to set up a location-independent freelance business like the one I run. Obviously, it's more ideal to just create a book or info product, and I have finally got around to making headway on the book, but I thought the workshops would be a good way to pull in a bit of extra cash while in tourist locations and provide an excuse to get off my computer and do something more social.

Target market would be expats who are dying to make some extra money abroad and backpackers who would do anything to keep the dream alive longer. I've thrown the idea out there in conversations, and people definitely sound interested. I mean, when the uninitiated learn what I do, you can see the way their eyes just light up... Of course, testing the market for viability before spending too much time and effort would be a cinch as well.

I could post up in a beach locale somewhere until I was ready to go somewhere new and then head out. Since it's a temp event, there's no obligation to stay in one place.

The reason I'm posting this is to pose this question - as fellow travelers, what would you see as a reasonable price to pay for something like this, assuming you were convinced that it really would provide you with a way to make money, often very considerable money, while traveling around the world?

Concern with backpackers is they travel on light budgets, but I believe a lot of them do have access to cash for something they think is worth it, and of course there is quite a bit of variance among the crowd too. Expats may be the better market because they often have more funds and many really are dying for a way to find employment in their country of choice. This is an option for them floating under the radar, so I think they'd pay well for it.

Suggestions welcome.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #2

I think it's a good idea if you can run a low cost test and see if there's interest.

It's a great idea, Having a 2-3 day workshop where you run them through the process, get them all their necessary accounts, and have them perhaps start bidding on jobs could be an extremely solid idea.

Post: #3

To clarify, I'm not planning to hold the attendees hands as they set up a business. Talking with Engima on Skype, I realized "workshop" may have been misleading.

This is more like an informational class, where I introduce strategies and tactics as well as how the market works and give a lot of great advice and tips that they can run with, but I'm not going to babysit them. Maybe private coaching with hand-holding could be an upsell, but that would be a headache to do with just anyone who walked into a class.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #4

(10-28-2014 12:19 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  To clarify, I'm not planning to hold the attendees hands as they set up a business. Talking with Engima on Skype, I realized "workshop" may have been misleading.

This is more like an informational class, where I introduce strategies and tactics as well as how the market works and give a lot of great advice and tips that they can run with, but I'm not going to babysit them. Maybe private coaching with hand-holding could be an upsell, but that would be a headache to do with just anyone who walked into a class.

Sending you a PM. I don't think too much hand holding will be required if structured properly.

Being a freelance workshop, you can create a highly structured curriculum for them to follow, and ensure they keep on the path. The real money is in a 2-3 day or even longer immersion program I think.
Add in a nice resort/beach location, and I think you have a solid offer.

The value is there, if you can take an average liberal arts graduate and get them earning 25-30$/hour within a month or two of starting, it'd be completely worth it for them to shell out a 1000$ to get a head start and start getting jobs ASAP.

Post: #5

^ They don't even have to be a liberal arts graduate if they've got half a brain and decent writing skills. I don't have a degree and it took me 3 days to get up and running.

I got your pm and will definitely get back to you. Will be a bit later on tonight though.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #6

Great idea Doube B!
Here's a better approach, long term wise:

Get 1-2 guys going using your teachings and guidance for free to get them up to where they can get clients and start making regular money. Not that your system doesn't work. We in here know that your'e a great and talented writer. However, the people you are targeting, the fresh graduates or the backpackers, more than likely, have no idea who you are. This is the simplest best and most efficient way to achieve that and build tremendous social proof along the way for both you and your brand.

Then, the next best thing you can do is to start a once a week podcast about working freelance where you'd be interviewing guys who are at first, location independent freelancers and once you have enough guys doing your system, interviewe them. This would also add very strong social proof to your system and build your brand. Beyond the borders of this forum that is.

Once you have say 5-10 guys making money regularly from your system/guidance, (say 1k/month within 2-3 months of starting) while promoting it heavily in your podcast, do a retreat or workshop in a nice beach town, somewhere that is a great place to bootstrap such a venture. Sihanoukville next door to you or Da Nang in Vietnam or Dumaguete or Panglao in the Philippines or even Chiang Mai, come to mind and charge them 1K per head. Have this over a 2-3 days or a weekend. Limit it to say 10-15 people to give it the scarcity effect as well as to keep it intimate and high level and you'd have people fighting over each other to hand you money!

I just remembered about your private freelancing forum! Is it still up? If yes, that would make your work a lot easier as you could interview these guys who are having success for your first few podcasts. Within a week, you could have the first 5-6 episodes already right in front of you. Heck, you may not even need to do much other than heavily market to the right people your existing forum and have your podcast having the same name. Would make things a lot easier as you already have your forum as a solid foundation to base things around.

A key question to answer: Are you going to make this retreat/workshop exclusively about copywriting? SEO writing? Or are you going to include other areas of freelancing such as web designing, programming, graphic design (making logos etc...), translation, etc...?

How about teaching people how to use their existing skills from their previous careers or work experience or academia or even hobbies/sports, whatever and teach them to build a service business based around that skill. A productized service business in other words which is a very very hot and a very legit and sustainable biz model.

You could even bring in say 2-3 guest speakers, guys who are successful freelancers/location independent guys running online and or freelancing businesses. Each could be an expert in a specific area and talk about that aspect of working freelance and or online, say for example how to market yourself properly, the legal aspect of working as a freelancer, what kind of projects to work on, how to properly screen potential jobs/people online to weed out the scammers and low ballers versus the high quality work/people to work with etc..Or a successful copy writer, a successful web designer, a successful translator etc...

You could easily find those 2-3 high quality guest speakers from this very forum. (I'd modestly recommend Vincent Venturi, YMG and G Global as 3 obvious and excellent choices!). Or you could reach out to a couple of heavy hitters in the DC and work something with them to get them to show up to your event. That would boost your brand, credibility and social proof like you can't believe it!

The more I think about it, the more I realize there are many many things you could focus on and offer your students. The sky's truly the limit here!

This has great potential if done right. I trust you will not only do it right but will kill it!

Now make it happen amigo!

Post: #7

(10-28-2014 02:24 AM)Vacancier Permanent Wrote:  The more I think about it, the more I realize there are many many things you could focus on and offer your students. The sky's truly the limit here!

Just an idea: you can organize a kind of competition amongst young, yet talented copywriters, SEO specialists, whatever. Each focuses on a niche and over X-month period, the entrant with the most sustainable/profitable biz model is declared winner. Maintain a leader board to drive motivation.

The competition may have a buy-in or you can claim equity/profit-sharing in each project, or both. Either way, you will give personalized guidance/feedback to each participant along the way.

After the competition, you will become a passive partner in the winning entry (or all sustainable entries), and may decide to offer the other entrants equity to continue participating in the winning case. By that point, you've created a solid team of guys all contributing to a worthwhile business.

Post: #8

Great idea that I think can work for sure.

I had a similar idea before to teach people in Thailand affiliate marketing who wanted a way to earn money and stay here.

Post: #9

Good idea BB. Here are my thoughts.

Start low and don't try to make a jackpot from the first minute.
Why not test the waters first and see how it goes? Even if you are doing your first "workshop" almost for free you have nothing to lose in the long run. With time you will figure out how much you can charge and also what the "fair price" is.

Test the waters and if you don't like it and it's not worth the hassle---> fuck it and move over to next project.

The most important thing is to put this thing into action.
Often you have to "give" before you can "take".

Post: #10

if you do a seminar/workshop make sure to tape it and sell it as an info product afterwards!

Post: #11

For "a 2 or 3-day workshop" in SEA, a reasonable price to pay would be 1000 dollars, for "serious" expats, but, SEA backpackers won't, I think, pay more than 200 per day, tops. So, between 400 and 600 dollars for them...

Now, you could be audacious and try something like: SEO and copy-writing skills in the morning, and "gaming"-PUA skills in the evening... why not? Thus you'd have all of foreigners' basic interests covered, money and chicks

Post: #12

What's up BB! Position it as a premium offering from the start.... at least $1000 I'd say. No lower than $800.

Aim for sorted-out expats who need that initial focused push, and backpackers who are closer to "flashpackers" than shoestring budgeters.

Five bright clients with some smarts and resources @$1000 each is a much nicer group to teach than 10-15 who are hoping for the get-rich-quick magic bullet. You really do offer massive value/years of experience, so totally justified in charging alot.

Higher pricing means people value it more, it will attract more capable people, and people are more likely to actually follow through with it and gain some success.

Overall more rewarding/less hassle for you.

Post: #13

I think 1000 bucks sounds steep. Anybody who has the budget to pay for that type of workshop, probably has a good source of money already, I doubt many people would be willing to pay all that money for a day workshop.

I wouldn't pay more than 200 bucks unless it was a babysit type of instruction and I was sure that I was really going to start making money on this, otherwise it would be like reading a blog on how to make money doing x and then don't do anything about it because you have no idea on how to go about it.

I hope I don't sound as if I am hating, I am just giving my honest opinion.

Post: #14

(10-28-2014 08:39 AM)pitt Wrote:  I think 1000 bucks sounds steep. Anybody who has the budget to pay for that type of workshop, probably has a good source of money already, I doubt many people would be willing to pay all that money for a day workshop.

I wouldn't pay more than 200 bucks unless it was a babysit type of instruction and I was sure that I was really going to start making money on this, otherwise it would be like reading a blog on how to make money doing x and then don't do anything about it because you have no idea on how to go about it.

I hope I don't sound as if I am hating, I am just giving my honest opinion.

Pitt, would you pay 1k if BB could show you how to make 1k to 2k a month?

Post: #15

The price you can get away with charging depends on your sales process and your own selling skills, ultimately.

There's a reason why most "courses" have a free/low cost initial presentation/sales pitch; to get people in front of you and excited.

Post: #16

BB, as for my opinion (you asked haha)...

If you plan on teaching people, I would assume you plan on creating some type of outline with supplemental reading material that they can follow along while you teach.

If you are going to do that anyway, you might as well create a finished product that you can sell to everyone that is interested in freelancing.

The course could be the first product you sell them and some of those people typically want more hand holding which is where you workshop would come in.

I know you are looking into doing this locally, but if you plan on doing the work, you might as well put together something that could be scaled (sold via online across the world).

You would also get a lot of feedback from people purchasing your course.

From what I have read, the big thing is getting customers. If you can do that for other freelancers, that could be a nice service that should make you a lot of money.

Post: #17

(10-28-2014 08:50 AM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

(10-28-2014 08:39 AM)pitt Wrote:  I think 1000 bucks sounds steep. Anybody who has the budget to pay for that type of workshop, probably has a good source of money already, I doubt many people would be willing to pay all that money for a day workshop.

I wouldn't pay more than 200 bucks unless it was a babysit type of instruction and I was sure that I was really going to start making money on this, otherwise it would be like reading a blog on how to make money doing x and then don't do anything about it because you have no idea on how to go about it.

I hope I don't sound as if I am hating, I am just giving my honest opinion.

Pitt, would you pay 1k if BB could show you how to make 1k to 2k a month?

For private coaching, i would fly there right now to go meet him and pay that 1000 bucks but for a day workshop, no.

Post: #18

(10-28-2014 09:15 AM)pitt Wrote:  

(10-28-2014 08:50 AM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  

(10-28-2014 08:39 AM)pitt Wrote:  I think 1000 bucks sounds steep. Anybody who has the budget to pay for that type of workshop, probably has a good source of money already, I doubt many people would be willing to pay all that money for a day workshop.

I wouldn't pay more than 200 bucks unless it was a babysit type of instruction and I was sure that I was really going to start making money on this, otherwise it would be like reading a blog on how to make money doing x and then don't do anything about it because you have no idea on how to go about it.

I hope I don't sound as if I am hating, I am just giving my honest opinion.

Pitt, would you pay 1k if BB could show you how to make 1k to 2k a month?

For private coaching, i would fly there right now to go meet him and pay that 1000 bucks but for a day workshop, no.

Sold. I'll even pick you up at the airport.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #19

BB's shuttle service for new students.

Post: #20

^ I would never wear that shirt.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #21

(10-28-2014 08:39 AM)pitt Wrote:  I think 1000 bucks sounds steep. Anybody who has the budget to pay for that type of workshop, probably has a good source of money already, I doubt many people would be willing to pay all that money for a day workshop.

I wouldn't pay more than 200 bucks unless it was a babysit type of instruction and I was sure that I was really going to start making money on this, otherwise it would be like reading a blog on how to make money doing x and then don't do anything about it because you have no idea on how to go about it.

I hope I don't sound as if I am hating, I am just giving my honest opinion.

Hi mate! See what you're saying here... I do reckon it depends on your target market though. I can imagine the type of person who'd go for it. And you dont need to sell to everybody... just 5 clients a month is $5000 from one workshop. That's the beauty of premium pricing. At $200, you'd need 25 clients a month ...urggh.

For the $1000 price-point, here's your customer: think about someone with a few grand savings, a strong desire to keep the travel dream alive long-term, and stumped about how the hell they can finance it.

An upper-middle class "Eat,Pray,Love" chick floating around Bali who has found herself and doesn't want to go back to her PR job in London.

Or a capable, smart guy in his 30's who just said "never again" to his consulting job that was killing him and is coming to the end of his 6 month sabattical... and wants to keep going.

Or a kid out of college with some cash in the bank, bit the travel bug and will do what it takes to keep exploring and adventuring.

It's all about convincing them that they really will get that return on investment. TBH, I might have bought a program like this a couple of years ago - online or offline *if I was convinced it really was the step-by-step, "inside tactics" instruction to a solid freelance income*.

That's the key. And that's where awesome sales+marketing skills come in. It would need a strong sales funnel, no one pays $1000 off the bat. Several points of contact with people before they buy.... website, video, free "report", autoresponder email sequence. Maybe an introductory webinar, or bi-monthly free 1-2hr talks on whatever tropical island he's hosting it on.

A bold money-back guarantee would help too. With these things, even if people don't get the ROI they were looking for, they rarely refund if they still had a great experience and got alot of value out of it.

What I like about the idea is he's clearly walking his talk. Like he actually has done it, has years of proof+credibility from all his past work, presumably has had big corporate clients to show for it. He's also an experienced marketer if I remember rightly, so he will have the nouse to get people in the door.

Pitt I reckon you're right about the babysit-instruction being the "big result" people would pay for.

BB you could make it a bootcamp and have a guarantee like:

"We get you your first sale (i.e. Elance project or first gig or whatnot) by the end of the workshop, or your money back". Bold but probably doable... and would really get people keen for it.


BTW BB, have you seen "Location Rebel"? It's kind of an online equivalent, with videos, articles and a forum. Price is a one-shot $250 I think. TBH, it's decent but nothing spectacular. Just gives some solid information on various freelancing paths, but it's not that step-by-step walkthrough that people would really pay highly for.

Post: #22

Yeah I'd second RichieP above regarding the money back guarantee of some kind.

People would be a lot happier to part with a big chunk of their remaining savings if they were pretty certain that this is their ticket to extending the dream. Wouldn't necessarily have to be '100% money back no questions asked if you don't make at least as much as the workshop in the first 3 months' or whatever, but something concrete and clearly stated would be good I think.

Post: #23

I know you're legit and honest because of your prior posts on the forum and would probably pay $150 but if I didn't know of your background from the forum, I'd just assume you made money from teaching people how to make money, not from whatever you're actually teaching, and wouldn't pay anything.

You're at a slight disatvantage because the market that you want to go into is by nature very scammy and deceptive so unfairly in your case, people are going to paint you with the same brush.

You'll still be successful from the people who aren't aware how scammy the internet marketing get rich quick and live on a tropical island people generally are but if you can distance yourself from them and make the skeptical people realise you're legit, you'll do so much better.

I think a god way to do this would be to make a personal blog about you and your internet marketing, the lifestyle, SFW travel etc but make it seem more just like a personal journal than salesy, have an about column on the side explicitly stating you fund this all by your internet marketing then a separate page mentioning that you do training (but don't make this the focus of the site). Basically, building rapport. Then, make another site about your training and promote that more aggressively but then when people look you up, they find your personal site and can see you're legit and not just constantly trying to sell them something. That would put you above all the similar presumably somewhat dishonest competitors that I've seen.

Post: #24

(10-28-2014 03:12 PM)the-dream Wrote:  I know you're legit and honest because of your prior posts on the forum and would probably pay $150 but if I didn't know of your background from the forum, I'd just assume you made money from teaching people how to make money, not from whatever you're actually teaching, and wouldn't pay anything.

You're at a slight disatvantage because the market that you want to go into is by nature very scammy and deceptive so unfairly in your case, people are going to paint you with the same brush.

You'll still be successful from the people who aren't aware how scammy the internet marketing get rich quick and live on a tropical island people generally are but if you can distance yourself from them and make the skeptical people realise you're legit, you'll do so much better.

I think a god way to do this would be to make a personal blog about you and your internet marketing, the lifestyle, SFW travel etc but make it seem more just like a personal journal than salesy, have an about column on the side explicitly stating you fund this all by your internet marketing then a separate page mentioning that you do training (but don't make this the focus of the site). Basically, building rapport. Then, make another site about your training and promote that more aggressively but then when people look you up, they find your personal site and can see you're legit and not just constantly trying to sell them something. That would put you above all the similar presumably somewhat dishonest competitors that I've seen.

Yeah, you'd definitely need to build an online brand and provide tons of value before you start doing this. Once people are convinced you are top notch and can help them achieve their goal income, then you'll have a much easier job selling them on a workshop/training.

But if you're willing to hustle and work on building up a high quality brand and offer, it would be very worth it as you could be pulling in 20-30k/month living in Asia.

Post: #25

(10-28-2014 09:14 AM)worldwidetraveler Wrote:  BB, as for my opinion (you asked haha)...

If you plan on teaching people, I would assume you plan on creating some type of outline with supplemental reading material that they can follow along while you teach.

If you are going to do that anyway, you might as well create a finished product that you can sell to everyone that is interested in freelancing.

The course could be the first product you sell them and some of those people typically want more hand holding which is where you workshop would come in.

I know you are looking into doing this locally, but if you plan on doing the work, you might as well put together something that could be scaled (sold via online across the world).

You would also get a lot of feedback from people purchasing your course.

From what I have read, the big thing is getting customers. If you can do that for other freelancers, that could be a nice service that should make you a lot of money.

It's a good idea.

It could be something like this (in THB since BB has been too long gone for USD):

1000 THB half day work shop - 20 invites
5000 THB mastermind group full day workshop - 5 invites
2000 THB/hour private coaching
2000 THB video and ebook course
1000 THB monthly membership site fee

If you want to do the workshop thing, I think you could easily fill seats at something like 2500 THB for 5 hours and lunch. If you raise to say 5000 THB you're going to need more credibility and social proof.

I'd get in touch with guys who have popular expat blogs and advertise, pay them to do an interview with you.