Post: #176

(09-22-2014 01:38 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  Several years ago in all slavic countries but particularly in Ukraine there was a high percentage of women with absolutely no future.These girls lived for the moment they were just content with one night of passion.It was like dream for them.
Till 2005 you could still find some girls of this kind in CR not anymore.They also tend to vanish in Poland.In Ukraine they still exist but in considerably less quantities.This was the biggest advantage of the eastern Block the masses of people below desperation line.
Now men go there just because their odds of finding beautiful women are better,the former dreamy situation is lost.Some describe this period till 2003 as golden age I doubt we will see sth like this again in our lives.

I can attest to this. I saw Central Europe degrade before my own eyes. Before when you asked a girl what she wanted, she would say love. Now, you are lucky if you get to bang her a second time.

The "dreaminess" is what a man should live for. That excitement and tenderness. The greatest two girls that have ever crossed my path were both Russian. When I look back on my life, I cannot think of happier times. This level of quality is in extreme minority even in the homeland, but this treasure hunt is what gives purpose to my life, and I am proud of it. Many people go around chasing things that will add nothing. In life all that matters are strong emotions and experiences, everything else is just there to pass the time.

Post: #177

^^True but lets NOT forget that they didn't change that much. They just got older and you guys want to new young generation. Obviously they are going to be a different breed than the older SOVIET minded chicks. If I talk to a girl my wife's age I will still hear the same "dreamyness" plus the excess baggage they now have.

Not knocking young blood but one shouldn't mistake progress with change..because no one changed. It is important to realize the difference because it means it technically is possible for a future generation to come out different depending on the liberal politics and economics present when they grow up. Starve them and make their life difficult again with a new Berlin type of wall and you might see the innocence once again...in the newer generations.

Post: #178

(09-22-2014 10:08 AM)Roosh Wrote:  My dates are cheap (walk + cafe) so I don't care about the money, just the time.

Mine too but here in Ukraine, most girls will study the menu for 10 minutes just to find the most expensive shit on it (usually mojito without alcohol or a glass of proseco) and then the waiters will always try to convince them to take something more or "better".
In Kiev, it can get expensive...

Post: #179

The point is how strong is slavic power and in what degree it can resist to westernization.If we see the results in CR Germanization is almost unbeatable.I trust Russians in this regard they never lose but the other slavic nations are tempted to lose their appeal to the money sirens of the West.
Personally I try to support slavicization in the West by every means possible although we were told in school it is one of the three dangers against Greek nation(the other two being panislamism,panturkism and catholicism,westernism).
This means that in every case I support slavic interests whether they are right or wrong.I also support their economies by buying slavic products and generally I spend money on their direction.

Post: #180

How does Kiev compare to centeral EU in terms of easiness ? And how to Philippines ?
Is it somewhere in between ? If for comparison I say that Phils is 10x easier then central EU, how much easier is Ukraine ?

tyty

Post: #181

In Ukraine you get roughly the same amount of girls like in Poland but you get better quality.If you get 6s-7s in Poland you can get the same amount of 7s-8s in Ukraine.The most beautiful women are out of reach in both countries.
Regarding spending however in Ukraine you are expected to spend more on girls than in Poland so the value/money is not that great.
For example if I stay one week in Poland I will likely bang two girls in the 6 range.If I stay one week in Kiev I will bang 2-3 girls in the 7 range.In Kiev I will spend around 2000 euro including everything plane ticket,accomodation,dating expenses,clubs,taxis,in Poland I will spend around 1000 euro for the same period.

Post: #182

(09-22-2014 03:44 PM)OnlyMarryInTajikistan Wrote:  

(09-22-2014 01:38 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  Several years ago in all slavic countries but particularly in Ukraine there was a high percentage of women with absolutely no future.These girls lived for the moment they were just content with one night of passion.It was like dream for them.
Till 2005 you could still find some girls of this kind in CR not anymore.They also tend to vanish in Poland.In Ukraine they still exist but in considerably less quantities.This was the biggest advantage of the eastern Block the masses of people below desperation line.
Now men go there just because their odds of finding beautiful women are better,the former dreamy situation is lost.Some describe this period till 2003 as golden age I doubt we will see sth like this again in our lives.

I can attest to this. I saw Central Europe degrade before my own eyes. Before when you asked a girl what she wanted, she would say love. Now, you are lucky if you get to bang her a second time.

The "dreaminess" is what a man should live for. That excitement and tenderness. The greatest two girls that have ever crossed my path were both Russian. When I look back on my life, I cannot think of happier times. This level of quality is in extreme minority even in the homeland, but this treasure hunt is what gives purpose to my life, and I am proud of it. Many people go around chasing things that will add nothing. In life all that matters are strong emotions and experiences, everything else is just there to pass the time.

That was sweet. Reminds me of my time in Latvia, in 2008. I was in a small city, which leads me to believe the small city girls still have this sense of romanticism in EE?

Post: #183

Quote:In Ukraine you get roughly the same amount of girls like in Poland but you get better quality.If you get 6s-7s in Poland you can get the same amount of 7s-8s in Ukraine.

But not using the same game. In Ukraine don't you use a semi sponsorship type of game by giving gifts?

If a guy is using the same game in Poland and Ukraine, I don't think he will necessarily get more quality/quantity in the same amount of time in Ukraine. Not in 2014, anyway. In the long run he will probably get better quality in Ukraine, but that's not guaranteed. In Odessa, I just don't see foreign guys with the top girls (8 and above) even though there are so many of them. The same in Poland, though there aren't many top girls there.

Post: #184

(09-01-2014 04:14 PM)Lucky Luke Wrote:  

(09-01-2014 04:02 PM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  You were simply defeated by the Turks and Arabs....

I found his post a bit odd. ....The fact is that all girls can be sluts and all girls can be wives. It's a question of knowing them and screening, but preconceived notions are not helpful.

You seriously think a confirmed hardened whore can be a good wife? Or maybe you are suggesting the more believable idea that one doesn't know if a woman has (relatively) good character before one knows her?

Post: #185

(09-24-2014 06:39 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:In Ukraine you get roughly the same amount of girls like in Poland but you get better quality.If you get 6s-7s in Poland you can get the same amount of 7s-8s in Ukraine.

But not using the same game. In Ukraine don't you use a semi sponsorship type of game by giving gifts?

If a guy is using the same game in Poland and Ukraine, I don't think he will necessarily get more quality/quantity in the same amount of time in Ukraine. Not in 2014, anyway. In the long run he will probably get better quality in Ukraine, but that's not guaranteed. In Odessa, I just don't see foreign guys with the top girls (8 and above) even though there are so many of them. The same in Poland, though there aren't many top girls there.

From my experience almost 90% of polish girls ask for financial support some time during the relationship not always in the beginning as Ukrainian girls do.Polish women want you to taste the goodies first so you will be hooked by them.
Some Ukrainian and polish girls fall for the thrill of the western cock in this case never asking for other offer.
The 8's and 9's in both countries are doable only if sb lives there long term or the girl has emigrated to his country.Other than that all of them get hooked with local men.(sometimes the mismatches are attrocious).

Post: #186

I'm in Odessa now for 3 days. I've been on 3 dates. I have walked through the center multiple times (saw Roosh on a date, will meet up this week). I have visited the two big malls twice. I have visited Mac Donalds (usually a hangout for youngsters) a lot and yesterday a bar (Shkaf) but I have yet to see the beautiful women everyone is always raving about.

The average girl in the streets is barely a six in looks. Wide faces with bad skin, wide hips and saggy bodies that have never ever seen a gym before or any sports for that matter.

This might sound very negative but I just don't see the hype. Especially after coming from Chisinau in Moldova and Cluj and Iasi in Romania. In Chisinau you can throw a rock in any direction and you will hit a pretty girl.

Perhaps it's better in the weekend in clubs. But I doubt it that I won't be talking to 3 layers of make up.
Ukrainian guys look very hipsterish and beta. Lots of weird beards.

First post in a year and not a positive one.

Post: #187

(09-24-2014 07:37 AM)Spike Wrote:  I'm in Odessa now for 3 days. I've been on 3 dates. I have walked through the center multiple times (saw Roosh on a date, will meet up this week). I have visited the two big malls twice. I have visited Mac Donalds (usually a hangout for youngsters) a lot and yesterday a bar (Shkaf) but I have yet to see the beautiful women everyone is always raving about.

The average girl in the streets is barely a six in looks. Wide faces with bad skin, wide hips and saggy bodies that have never ever seen a gym before or any sports for that matter.

This might sound very negative but I just don't see the hype. Especially after coming from Chisinau in Moldova and Cluj and Iasi in Romania. In Chisinau you can throw a rock in any direction and you will hit a pretty girl.

Perhaps it's better in the weekend in clubs. But I doubt it that I won't be talking to 3 layers of make up.
Ukrainian guys look very hipsterish and beta. Lots of weird beards.

First post in a year and not a positive one.

I was in Chisinau in May last year and I had never seen so many beautiful women in my life.

I was in Odessa in July and I must say that there were even more beautiful girls than in Chisinau. In my opinion, in the summer all Ukrainian pretty girls go to Odessa for 2 weeks holidays. In September, I don't know...

Post: #188

Just came back from a date. We walked around the city parks a bit and I must revise my opinion a bit. I did see some hotter girls today. It's just not in the massive amounts I saw in Chisinau.
Granted, the weather sucks. It's windy and chilly and most girls don't dress sexy but hell, it's a large city with a large population. They still should be around way more.

Post: #189

(09-24-2014 07:19 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

(09-24-2014 06:39 AM)Roosh Wrote:  

Quote:In Ukraine you get roughly the same amount of girls like in Poland but you get better quality.If you get 6s-7s in Poland you can get the same amount of 7s-8s in Ukraine.

But not using the same game. In Ukraine don't you use a semi sponsorship type of game by giving gifts?

If a guy is using the same game in Poland and Ukraine, I don't think he will necessarily get more quality/quantity in the same amount of time in Ukraine. Not in 2014, anyway. In the long run he will probably get better quality in Ukraine, but that's not guaranteed. In Odessa, I just don't see foreign guys with the top girls (8 and above) even though there are so many of them. The same in Poland, though there aren't many top girls there.

From my experience almost 90% of polish girls ask for financial support some time during the relationship not always in the beginning as Ukrainian girls do.Polish women want you to taste the goodies first so you will be hooked by them.
Some Ukrainian and polish girls fall for the thrill of the western cock in this case never asking for other offer.
The 8's and 9's in both countries are doable only if sb lives there long term or the girl has emigrated to his country.Other than that all of them get hooked with local men.(sometimes the mismatches are attrocious).

I think this more depends on your looks/game ... Even here in Phils it's rare for girls to ask me for anything (young,tall,decent looking).

Post: #190

Tomorrow I am heading for Poznan.Everyone faithful join me for the pilgrimage.I may record some dialogues with polish girls to show the above mentioned issues.
For sure lots of guys in Poland fuck without paying but many many girls expect pomoc and wsparcie.In fact it has happened to me so often that I thought it is the norm in Poland till some girls told me it is not the norm.

Post: #191

Any Euro seaside side will become dead in September. There are plenty of hot women there, in terms of fitness, I'd say they exercise more than in other parts ofbthe country

Post: #192

Ok just left Kiev a few days ago and since I was there for a month and a half+ off and on I thought I’d give a quick summary of how I ended up:

* All in all did ok but not that great. Finished +3 (all late 20s low 7-somethings) but it took a lot of work and right now I sure don't feel like I got decent enough results and just had to work too hard for what I got (sound familiar? )

* one of the biggest issues I had (as highlighted by me and guys like Lika and Travolta in this thread) was that night game was just not all that great in August and early September in Kiev. Students were gone + the war situation seemed to put a damper on girls going out. Plus (as we all found out) lots of girls head to Odessa in late Summer.

* I got ~25 numbers in my phone from girls I met in Kiev. Of the three girls I smashed, got a 1st date bang from a 7+ I day gamed the first weekend, and 2 internet bangs from late 20s what I would call 'busted' Ukrainian girls. Not top tier by any stretch but low 7s girls who had seen better days is how I'd describe them. Not really what I came looking for!

* I'd say I was about 1 for 50 re day game. Did a lot of approaches early on (say 2-3 per day) but then slowed down. Need to do a lot of work there. Did manage 2 instadates, one with a solid 8, but both didn't work out.

* due to the lack of nightlife and day game success I ended up concentrating my efforts on internet game, with mixed results. Both of my internet girls had clearly seen better days and put me on a bit of a long game run before I smashed them. Also messed around with one other internet date one night but dropped her, and had a near miss with another internet girl who got too drunk and passed out at my place while we were messing around.

* going back to my night game dilemma, in retrospect it sucks not having those ‘big nights’ where anything can happen and you get an SNL, makeouts, several #s etc. that you can parlay into big rewards either that night or later on. Instead, nights out ended up being dead and huge time sucks (inevitably I drank too much and didn't feel like gaming/going out the next day), even after sometimes going to 4-5 places. That situation really hurt my mojo and was incredibly frustrating, so much so that I eventually just gave up on night game.

* grinding away online with internet chicks gets old and even when you bang it’s not that rewarding of a feeling for me, for better or worse. Smashing girls from nightgame and daygame gives me a much bigger sense of accomplishment. In particular, the rush and sense of adventure from a big night out (and, I assume, instadate lays) just can’t be beat. I missed out on that in Kiev.

* worst of all and much to my chagrin, there were no “wow” or top-tier girls for me, despite a decent effort with these types of girls. This is my biggest disappointment. I got numbers off 8 girls who were high 7s or 8+s, mostly from day gaming, where I thought I had a decent shot but couldn’t convert. Of those, 2 didn’t respond, 1 was a first date and out (she left town, still in touch, possible long game candidate), another flaked and then went awol, two of 'em I had 3 dates without a kiss so I bailed out as it seemed like a waste of time, 1 was responsive but left for Spain for a few months to learn Spanish and the last one (an 8.5 with huge hooters I instadated) went out with me 2x then faded away.

So basically I came to Ukraine to date & smash high 7s and 8+s or even roll the dice & find a baby mama (!) but ended up just getting some internet scraps here and there along with one nice little day game score. Also had a close near bang and some makeouts with 2 other girls, and have 2 ‘long game’ candidates who were from out of town that I need to follow up on. But I sure didn’t tear it up with the gorgeous girls of Kiev suffice it to say. I saw a ton of top-tier talent around town though, real bummer I couldn't bag even just one of them.

Anyway, nobody ever said game was easy, but with the lack of night game it sure didn’t feel that ‘fun’ most of the time, more like a grind wearing down opponents day by day. But I do feel that my day game got a little better on the whole and that I can build on that in the future. Just gotta keep on truckin' i guess.

Post: #193

@Akula
"But I sure didn’t tear it up with the gorgeous girls of Kiev suffice it to say. I saw a ton of top-tier talent around town though, real bummer I couldn't bag even just one of them.
Anyway, nobody ever said game was easy, but with the lack of night game it sure didn’t feel that ‘fun’ most of the time, more like a grind wearing down opponents day by day. But I do feel that my day game got a little better on the whole and that I can build on that in the future. Just gotta keep on truckin' i guess."

Sounds like you had a depressing trip however why did you not listen to other forum members who all had mixed feelings about visiting Ukraine during the war and some members on the ground said that the nightlife got worse.

Instead I think you would have done better in more remote areas like Lviv where the politics of war have less of an effect on daily life than in Kiev or perhaps even Odessa where Roosh & 20Nation seem to be doing just fine.

Post: #194

Quote:perhaps even Odessa where Roosh & 20Nation seem to be doing just fine.

It hasn't been all rosy... had a slump that I had to work hard to get out of. Day game was more fruitful last year for me in Odessa while this year I had more luck at night. Consistency is not something I've been able to achieve in Ukraine.

Post: #195

@Akula

Would you say Moscow putting in the same effort in the same time frame would yield better results?

It sounds like from you and CR if you have $ and are willing to go on 4 or 5 dates it sounds much easier to rack up young 7.5+ in Moscow even from soley doing day game. Maybe you would need a slightly longer timeframe to pack the dates in.

I am still at a level where spending 4 or 5 dates with a beautiful young feminine woman is never considered "work" but pleasure.

Post: #196

^^with Russkies (UA) it is work. They are working you.

Post: #197

August is the worst month in Ukraine except resorts.I remember landing in Lvov and facing disaster so I reacted and took the train to Ternopil which balanced things out.Not that Ternopil was good(it was totally empty as the poorest Ukrainian city) but I managed to finger a girl in the train who later brought me her girlfriend.
Ukraine is like a wild horse.You have to react to tame it and have it under control.Poland is like a domestic pony always pleasant.

Post: #198

(09-24-2014 06:14 PM)TripleG Wrote:  Sounds like you had a depressing trip however why did you not listen to other forum members who all had mixed feelings about visiting Ukraine during the war and some members on the ground said that the nightlife got worse.

Instead I think you would have done better in more remote areas like Lviv where the politics of war have less of an effect on daily life than in Kiev or perhaps even Odessa where Roosh & 20Nation seem to be doing just fine.

Actually, it wasn't that depressing, the weather was great, it's dirt cheap compared to Moscow, I joined a gym early one and got stronger/healthier + I got to eat very well at Puxata Xata every day (guess I'm a simple man with simple needs??).

I had always wanted to explore Kiev. It's definitely a much more laid back and nicer city than big, ugly dirty (but fun) Moscow. It was also very interesting to be there during the conflict and to see and hear how people were dealing with it and to learn the average Ukrainian's views.

Also, I was dying to speak and improve my Russian so that made Lviv a no-go. In retrospect maybe I should have just gone to Odessa esp. since it was late summer, but I have no regrets, I still enjoyed my stay on the whole, it's just that given how much time on the ground I had I thought I would have done better gaming-wise.

(09-24-2014 07:47 PM)Travesty444 Wrote:  @Akula

Would you say Moscow putting in the same effort in the same time frame would yield better results?

It sounds like from you and CR if you have $ and are willing to go on 4 or 5 dates it sounds much easier to rack up young 7.5+ in Moscow even from soley doing day game. Maybe you would need a slightly longer timeframe to pack the dates in.

I am still at a level where spending 4 or 5 dates with a beautiful young feminine woman is never considered "work" but pleasure.

The girls in Ukraine are harder to gauge and more difficult to read compared to what I knew in Russia. In Moscow I felt like I knew the score since I lived there for 5+ years and understood the game for the most part.

I got interrogated a lot more in Kiev for sure and I have to think that the sex tourism thing has really made them more wary of foreigners, versus Moscow where I saw none of that. If anything it's a bit of a novelty that you're a foreigner in Moscow (but not a huge +, just something different for them that helps you just a bit on the fringes).

In Kiev I felt like my story was constantly being tested, and girls wanted to push off dates and extend the process more just to weed out the players and check out my story that I was in town on business for a few months working on a project. With the war going on and so many people losing jobs they must have highly doubted that anyone was working there.

Girls also seemed more flakey & harder to pin down in Kiev, but that could just be bc it's 2 more years into the whole iPhone thing. But that said, when I was back in Moscow for couple weeks I had better rapport and girls got right back to me - like right back is in minutes, versus Kiev where sometimes they took a couple hours or half a day (pseudo gameplaying a la back home but nowhere near as bad). Maybe it's just me, but in Moscow I felt that there was a little less gamesmanship and women are more straightforward.

Neither place is 'easy' but with Moscow I feel like I have a better sense of the game and know when to eject versus up the ante, whereas in Kiev I felt like I never could calibrate and figure it out. For example, I felt like I had a few really good day game sets in Kiev, with 4-5 girls who were all 7.5+s, but all of them ended up going nowhere. In Russia if I'd done that at least one might have worked out typically. But don't forget I lived and worked in Moscow for many years whereas I was just in Kiev for 6-7 weeks, plus I am fairly new to day game and did mostly night game in Russia, so it's a bit of 'apples and oranges'.

Re your last comment, I fully agree - 4-5 dates with a beautiful woman is nothing and I love the chase and building rapport & could care less about how long it takes if it happens in the end. It's just that I didn't have that situation at all in Kiev unfortunately...none of the girls I ended up with were good looking enough to inspire and motivate me, hence my 'doing the gring' comment. I got nowhere with the ones that would have, except a couple I'm still in touch with from time to time but haven't done anything with.

Post: #199

(09-24-2014 05:09 PM)Akula Wrote:  Ok just left Kiev a few days ago and since I was there for a month and a half+ off and on I thought I’d give a quick summary of how I ended up:

* All in all did ok but not that great. Finished +3 (all late 20s low 7-somethings) but it took a lot of work and right now I sure don't feel like I got decent enough results and just had to work too hard for what I got (sound familiar? )

* one of the biggest issues I had (as highlighted by me and guys like Lika and Travolta in this thread) was that night game was just not all that great in August and early September in Kiev. Students were gone + the war situation seemed to put a damper on girls going out. Plus (as we all found out) lots of girls head to Odessa in late Summer.

* I got ~25 numbers in my phone from girls I met in Kiev. Of the three girls I smashed, got a 1st date bang from a 7+ I day gamed the first weekend, and 2 internet bangs from late 20s what I would call 'busted' Ukrainian girls. Not top tier by any stretch but low 7s girls who had seen better days is how I'd describe them. Not really what I came looking for!

* I'd say I was about 1 for 50 re day game. Did a lot of approaches early on (say 2-3 per day) but then slowed down. Need to do a lot of work there. Did manage 2 instadates, one with a solid 8, but both didn't work out.

* due to the lack of nightlife and day game success I ended up concentrating my efforts on internet game, with mixed results. Both of my internet girls had clearly seen better days and put me on a bit of a long game run before I smashed them. Also messed around with one other internet date one night but dropped her, and had a near miss with another internet girl who got too drunk and passed out at my place while we were messing around.

* going back to my night game dilemma, in retrospect it sucks not having those ‘big nights’ where anything can happen and you get an SNL, makeouts, several #s etc. that you can parlay into big rewards either that night or later on. Instead, nights out ended up being dead and huge time sucks (inevitably I drank too much and didn't feel like gaming/going out the next day), even after sometimes going to 4-5 places. That situation really hurt my mojo and was incredibly frustrating, so much so that I eventually just gave up on night game.

* grinding away online with internet chicks gets old and even when you bang it’s not that rewarding of a feeling for me, for better or worse. Smashing girls from nightgame and daygame gives me a much bigger sense of accomplishment. In particular, the rush and sense of adventure from a big night out (and, I assume, instadate lays) just can’t be beat. I missed out on that in Kiev.

* worst of all and much to my chagrin, there were no “wow” or top-tier girls for me, despite a decent effort with these types of girls. This is my biggest disappointment. I got numbers off 8 girls who were high 7s or 8+s, mostly from day gaming, where I thought I had a decent shot but couldn’t convert. Of those, 2 didn’t respond, 1 was a first date and out (she left town, still in touch, possible long game candidate), another flaked and then went awol, two of 'em I had 3 dates without a kiss so I bailed out as it seemed like a waste of time, 1 was responsive but left for Spain for a few months to learn Spanish and the last one (an 8.5 with huge hooters I instadated) went out with me 2x then faded away.

So basically I came to Ukraine to date & smash high 7s and 8+s or even roll the dice & find a baby mama (!) but ended up just getting some internet scraps here and there along with one nice little day game score. Also had a close near bang and some makeouts with 2 other girls, and have 2 ‘long game’ candidates who were from out of town that I need to follow up on. But I sure didn’t tear it up with the gorgeous girls of Kiev suffice it to say. I saw a ton of top-tier talent around town though, real bummer I couldn't bag even just one of them.

Anyway, nobody ever said game was easy, but with the lack of night game it sure didn’t feel that ‘fun’ most of the time, more like a grind wearing down opponents day by day. But I do feel that my day game got a little better on the whole and that I can build on that in the future. Just gotta keep on truckin' i guess.

You wrote you were in Kiev since the beginning of July.This makes 2 months and a half.
2-3 approaches per day are not a lot.
Generally Ukraine needs running.When I hit the streets there I may walk 6 hours or more searching for viable targets.Your soles get torn down.It is not for relaxation.An average of 20 approaches per day is the minimum otherwise the cost to benefit is very high.
From internet it is possible to get 3 dates with different girls everyday but the appeal of daygame is such that in reality one gives up on internet once he lands on the magic land.

Post: #200

(09-25-2014 02:38 AM)Greek kamaki Wrote:  

(09-24-2014 05:09 PM)Akula Wrote:  Ok just left Kiev a few days ago and since I was there for a month and a half+ off and on I thought I’d give a quick summary of how I ended up:

* All in all did ok but not that great. Finished +3 (all late 20s low 7-somethings) but it took a lot of work and right now I sure don't feel like I got decent enough results and just had to work too hard for what I got (sound familiar? )

* one of the biggest issues I had (as highlighted by me and guys like Lika and Travolta in this thread) was that night game was just not all that great in August and early September in Kiev. Students were gone + the war situation seemed to put a damper on girls going out. Plus (as we all found out) lots of girls head to Odessa in late Summer.

* I got ~25 numbers in my phone from girls I met in Kiev. Of the three girls I smashed, got a 1st date bang from a 7+ I day gamed the first weekend, and 2 internet bangs from late 20s what I would call 'busted' Ukrainian girls. Not top tier by any stretch but low 7s girls who had seen better days is how I'd describe them. Not really what I came looking for!

* I'd say I was about 1 for 50 re day game. Did a lot of approaches early on (say 2-3 per day) but then slowed down. Need to do a lot of work there. Did manage 2 instadates, one with a solid 8, but both didn't work out.

* due to the lack of nightlife and day game success I ended up concentrating my efforts on internet game, with mixed results. Both of my internet girls had clearly seen better days and put me on a bit of a long game run before I smashed them. Also messed around with one other internet date one night but dropped her, and had a near miss with another internet girl who got too drunk and passed out at my place while we were messing around.

* going back to my night game dilemma, in retrospect it sucks not having those ‘big nights’ where anything can happen and you get an SNL, makeouts, several #s etc. that you can parlay into big rewards either that night or later on. Instead, nights out ended up being dead and huge time sucks (inevitably I drank too much and didn't feel like gaming/going out the next day), even after sometimes going to 4-5 places. That situation really hurt my mojo and was incredibly frustrating, so much so that I eventually just gave up on night game.

* grinding away online with internet chicks gets old and even when you bang it’s not that rewarding of a feeling for me, for better or worse. Smashing girls from nightgame and daygame gives me a much bigger sense of accomplishment. In particular, the rush and sense of adventure from a big night out (and, I assume, instadate lays) just can’t be beat. I missed out on that in Kiev.

* worst of all and much to my chagrin, there were no “wow” or top-tier girls for me, despite a decent effort with these types of girls. This is my biggest disappointment. I got numbers off 8 girls who were high 7s or 8+s, mostly from day gaming, where I thought I had a decent shot but couldn’t convert. Of those, 2 didn’t respond, 1 was a first date and out (she left town, still in touch, possible long game candidate), another flaked and then went awol, two of 'em I had 3 dates without a kiss so I bailed out as it seemed like a waste of time, 1 was responsive but left for Spain for a few months to learn Spanish and the last one (an 8.5 with huge hooters I instadated) went out with me 2x then faded away.

So basically I came to Ukraine to date & smash high 7s and 8+s or even roll the dice & find a baby mama (!) but ended up just getting some internet scraps here and there along with one nice little day game score. Also had a close near bang and some makeouts with 2 other girls, and have 2 ‘long game’ candidates who were from out of town that I need to follow up on. But I sure didn’t tear it up with the gorgeous girls of Kiev suffice it to say. I saw a ton of top-tier talent around town though, real bummer I couldn't bag even just one of them.

Anyway, nobody ever said game was easy, but with the lack of night game it sure didn’t feel that ‘fun’ most of the time, more like a grind wearing down opponents day by day. But I do feel that my day game got a little better on the whole and that I can build on that in the future. Just gotta keep on truckin' i guess.

You wrote you were in Kiev since the beginning of July.This makes 2 months and a half.
2-3 approaches per day are not a lot.
Generally Ukraine needs running.When I hit the streets there I may walk 6 hours or more searching for viable targets.Your soles get torn down.It is not for relaxation.An average of 20 approaches per day is the minimum otherwise the cost to benefit is very high.
From internet it is possible to get 3 dates with different girls everyday but the appeal of daygame is such that in reality one gives up on internet once he lands on the magic land.

Yeah that's right it was late July but I spent 3-4 weeks in Russia and other places in between so it was around 6-7 weeks on the ground in Kiev. Think I got there in mid July too.

I can't argue with you re doing more approaches. Yeah I should have done more. Day game is hard and also physically tiring - I felt like I was walking 5-10 miles each day. 20 approaches a day would kill me!!! 4-5 seems like a lot. I admit I got lazy and a bit discouraged a couple times too (including one weekend where I had 3 girls flake on me + my one regular at the time told me she lost her job and had to move home) but don't forget I'm a traditional night game only guy and am not used to having that game outlet shut off for the most part and having to do everything by internet and day game!

Also, doing 2-3 dates a day sometimes from the internet with ~6s gets old fast. Its tiring, time consuming and sucks the life out of you & prevents you from doing other gaming. If I was constantly getting dates with high 7s & 8s via the internet it would not have been a problem, but we all know that typically doesn't happen. Like I said, most of the internet chicks I met were busted and I ended up with two of the best ones I found...sort of the best of a bad lot. However, these girls would have been chased back home by tons of guys though such is the overall quality in Ukraine. It's all location dependent. I try to keep that in mind now when abroad and find it helps me keep my expectations more realistic.

RE internet versus day game, yeah, seeing all those beautiful women walking around puts most internet girls to shame in Ukraine, but unfortunately my day game wasn't good enough to make it happen more than once, so that's why I reverted back to the internet. In effect I ended up pipelining girls on the internet while in Kiev (!).