Post: #1

I've been seeing a girl for 2 months on and off. We banged on the fourth date and pretty good kissing and make out before.

Then, after that we had about 2 more great bang sessions.

Now, the last 2 dates or so, she is not staying at my place. We still kiss passionately and make out. Last time she said she was having a stressful week...and from what I could tell, she was with orientation and her job.

So, we have a date tomorrow night to do dinner and a movie. She wants me to meet her friends ( a couple ) who will double date with us and I agreed. When I texted her if she wanted to be at my place by 5 or....for me to pick her up ....she texted back "I have a girlfriend coming into town tomorrow so I'll just meet you there." meaning at the restaurant. Well, I don't know if this is BS or not...but the point is...she setting it up to not spend the night with me and bang.

I'm getting pissed. I just called her I could tell she was with her friends..I could hear the girls talking...in her apartment. I told her to call me back and she's calling me soon.

I want to know how to approach this. I feel like saying "look, I haven't slept or spent the night with you in over 2 weeks...why are you shutting off/changing? I want you to stay with me after our date." But that may be too beta/needy.

She tells me a lot...including last night...that she "adores" me and "likes me a lot" and we do make out, including last night.

I keep spending money on dinners and dates....but she's shut off the spending the nights over and banging.

I need advice and insights on how to handle this. I'm early 40s and she's 25.

Post: #2

Preamble: Never listen to what a woman says, watch what she does with her vagina.

1. Cancel this play date with friends thing immediately.

2. Radio silence 1 week after canceling unless she initiates.
2b. Go out and bang other chicks.

3. Invite her over to your place at 9pm or later for a drink once communication picks up again. Don't even try to put up a facade of watching a movie or some shit.

4. $$$ Profit - you bang her and she falls madly in love with you for treating her as disposable, or you move on to a better chick.

Wrap your dick, it's likely she's back to old dick or found a new one.

Post: #3

She's throwing up a lot of bullshit. Freeze her out until she makes a huge effort.

Post: #4

Stop spending on her, especially the moment she's shown she doesn't deserve it.

Post: #5

Thanks guys...I suspected this may be the case. I'm not going to out right accuse her...but probably call it off. I'm hoping there will be a liberating feeling when I do this and not heartbreak as I was starting to like her.

Post: #6

She may not be banging anyone else, she may just be trying to put you under her thumb.

You will find out once you cancel the date and start re-establishing frame using the steps Travesty444 laid out.

Post: #7

Just use the time away from her to bang more girls. That feeling won't be as strong.

Post: #8

(08-21-2014 08:45 PM)robreke Wrote:  I was starting to like her.

You can't do this until after she has begged for commitment and has tangibly helped you succeed in your life as a man.

Post: #9

(08-21-2014 08:08 PM)robreke Wrote:  I want to know how to approach this. I feel like saying "look, I haven't slept or spent the night with you in over 2 weeks...why are you shutting off/changing? I want you to stay with me after our date." But that may be too beta/needy.

Please don't. Don't put off any desperation, it is a bad energy. You are the man, you lead, she responds.

(08-21-2014 08:08 PM)robreke Wrote:  I keep spending money on dinners and dates....but she's shut off the spending the nights over and banging.

Question, would you normally pay for the dinner for the couple and her if you go? Is that your normal generous pattern? Just curious, I am a pretty generous guy. If you go out with her and her girls do you think you would be inclined to pick up the tab? Once again just curious.

I would take the following lesson from your current situation, be prepared to take notes.
YOU BANGED A GIRL ALMOST HALF YOUR AGE. YOU CAN DO IT AGAIN (WITH ANOTHER CHICK). YOU HAVE PROVEN YOU CAN PICK UP YOUNG CHICKS.

Post: #10

(08-21-2014 09:45 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(08-21-2014 08:08 PM)robreke Wrote:  I want to know how to approach this. I feel like saying "look, I haven't slept or spent the night with you in over 2 weeks...why are you shutting off/changing? I want you to stay with me after our date." But that may be too beta/needy.

Please don't. Don't put off any desperation, it is a bad energy. You are the man, you lead, she responds.

(08-21-2014 08:08 PM)robreke Wrote:  I keep spending money on dinners and dates....but she's shut off the spending the nights over and banging.

Question, would you normally pay for the dinner for the couple and her if you go? Is that your normal generous pattern? Just curious, I am a pretty generous guy. If you go out with her and her girls do you think you would be inclined to pick up the tab? Once again just curious.

I would take the following lesson from your current situation, be prepared to take notes.
YOU BANGED A GIRL ALMOST HALF YOUR AGE. YOU CAN DO IT AGAIN (WITH ANOTHER CHICK). YOU HAVE PROVEN YOU CAN PICK UP YOUNG CHICKS.

Tomorrow (if I go...though looking like I may cancel)....I would only pay for her and me. Her friends are a couple ....another guy and girl...so I assume that guy is going to pay for them cause I sure as hell am not. And no...if she was with her girlfriends...I would not pay for them.

But yes...my regular pattern is to pay for me and my girl only.

I'm thinking at this point, when I talk to her I'm going to say in a non needy way: "Look, I'm inviting you to stay with me tomorrow night after the movie. I'd like you to stay with me" or something along those lines before I just cancel....giving her one last chance to accept...or blabber with some BS excuse before I cancel as I know she's been looking forward to me meeting her friends as she's been texting me all day. She had actually mentioned last week that she wanted me to "meet her friends" in a sense...what I interpreted as getting more serious. So, that's kind of what this date is about I take it. More feedback welcome....and thanks so far guys.

Post: #11

You already lost this fight.

You are pussy worshipping.

She doesn't and will NEVER care if you want her more or not. She has to want you more.

Post: #12

Damn Travesty444 is laying down some Mackin 101 basics in this thread!! Great read since I just froze a bitch out and waiting for her to turn around!

Post: #13

(08-21-2014 10:07 PM)Travesty444 Wrote:  You already lost this fight.

You are pussy worshipping.

She doesn't and will NEVER care if you want her more or not. She has to want you more.

Ideas for what "excuse" to use when I cancel the date?

Because you're not coming over?

or just make up some bullshit...like I'm tired...worked late, etc ?

I don't want it to be a super smart assey reason

Thanks

Post: #14

(08-21-2014 10:36 PM)robreke Wrote:  

(08-21-2014 10:07 PM)Travesty444 Wrote:  You already lost this fight.

You are pussy worshipping.

She doesn't and will NEVER care if you want her more or not. She has to want you more.

Ideas for what "excuse" to use when I cancel the date?

Because you're not coming over?

or just make up some bullshit...like I'm tired...worked late, etc ?

I don't want it to be a super smart assey reason

Thanks

Don't make up an excuse. That shows weakness. You are anti-comfort at this point. You are dreading her.

"wont make it"

Then radio silence at least 2 days even if she calls and texts 100 times.

A true player spinning multiple plates that wanted to keep this chick in check would go silent, not show up, and ignore her texts until at his whim he felt like getting her back in the rotation.

Post: #15

(08-22-2014 02:21 AM)Travesty444 Wrote:  

(08-21-2014 10:36 PM)robreke Wrote:  

(08-21-2014 10:07 PM)Travesty444 Wrote:  You already lost this fight.

You are pussy worshipping.

She doesn't and will NEVER care if you want her more or not. She has to want you more.

Ideas for what "excuse" to use when I cancel the date?

Because you're not coming over?

or just make up some bullshit...like I'm tired...worked late, etc ?

I don't want it to be a super smart assey reason

Thanks

Don't make up an excuse. That shows weakness. You are anti-comfort at this point. You are dreading her.

"wont make it"

Then radio silence at least 2 days even if she calls and texts 100 times.

A true player spinning multiple plates that wanted to keep this chick in check would go silent, not show up, and ignore her texts until at his whim he felt like getting her back in the rotation.

Travesty,

I know your advice is right.

One of my problems is , I don't really have a good rotation. I actually have two other girls who will see me anytime. One is about a 5 to 6 at best....not overweight....kind of cute...but just also kind of plain. She's out of town this weekend.

The other girl is a cute black girl. I mean dark black ....nice features and all but I'm just more attracted to whites/Hispanics.

I'm way more attracted to this girl in question....who I'm canceling on.

I guess...I'll just have to settle for these less attractive options for a bit until I can build a harem up.

In a perfect world, I'd have a harem of at least three women who were at least 7 or better who were just a phone call or text away. I don't have that now.

Suppose I need to get back to approaching more and getting numbers.

Post: #16

(08-22-2014 02:40 AM)robreke Wrote:  Travesty,

I know your advice is right.

One of my problems is , I don't really have a good rotation. I actually have two other girls who will see me anytime. One is about a 5 to 6 at best....not overweight....kind of cute...but just also kind of plain. She's out of town this weekend.

The other girl is a cute black girl. I mean dark black ....nice features and all but I'm just more attracted to whites/Hispanics.

I'm way more attracted to this girl in question....who I'm canceling on.

I guess...I'll just have to settle for these less attractive options for a bit until I can build a harem up.

In a perfect world, I'd have a harem of at least three women who were at least 7 or better who were just a phone call or text away. I don't have that now.

Suppose I need to get back to approaching more and getting numbers.

Samsam spelled it out.

You already did it once getting a 25yo you think is hot.

You can do it again.

Up your game, keep improving.

If calling one of those other chicks drops your confidence or self respect one iota, drop them. Better to start hungry with a clean plate than lick one with rotten old food on it.

You won't improve unless you learn to enjoy the process.

Girls and harems come and go. You always will have to be in at least a light stage of rebuilding or looking for new prospects even if you had a harem you speak of the way to keep them in check is to keep upping your game and going after even hotter chicks while they are you backup confidence booster.

Unless you are going the LTR and kids route there is no reason not to be out there flipping stones.

Post: #17

I will say this. You are an adult man. You are also a human being with feelings.

As long as you are ok with the outcome of your choice, you could still go to dinner and try to make a play to bring her back, despite her having friends over. I am not trying to backtrack on what I said, just that there are always multiple actions to a situation.

As long as you are ok with what happens you could go to dinner. Well in actually, as long as you are ok with any choice you make, then make it (i.e. icing her out).

OP only you know what is right for you in this situation, and for as beta as it sounds go with your gut. Life is about the journey and not the destination. If it blows up lesson learned. Just a small request, if it blows up update us on what happened but try not to belly ache too much (I am not saying you would - I don't know you) - just a more slubu style lessons learned sort of post would help all of us learn and grow. A whiny one would get people jumping on you for not taking the right advice. And I wouldn't want that for you, you seem like a decent enough person.

I hope all that I posted makes sense.

Best wishes on your decision.

Post: #18

(08-21-2014 08:08 PM)robreke Wrote:  I keep spending money on dinners and dates....but she's shut off the spending the nights over and banging.

The problem is she doesn't want to fuck you. You're still giving her attention, validation, dates, and you're not even fucking her. You're getting played.

You can't simply tell her you want more sex--that's a futile attempt to use logic to negotiate her desire. She's not attracted to you (most likely), or perhaps she's a low-sex-drive girl ( /thread-16554.html )

The best course of action, as others have said, is dread game: soft next her and fuck other chicks. Don't bother explaining yourself. If she's into you at all she should come back and be all over you.

More generally, I think you need to do a better job establishing a "fucking" frame in your relationships. No girl that I'm seeing would even consider a date without sex. This isn't something we've talked about--that's just the frame I set, and they buy into it (I wouldn't want a girl who didn't). Every time we meet, we fuck. If you enforce this frame early on, you shouldn't have to deal with situations like the one you've described (by continuing to date her without fucking her, you're buying into the frame that you will see her without having sex, and digging your own grave).

The corollary to this frame is always to consider the logistics for any meet-up. Don't plan, or don't agree to, dates which are not conducive to fucking. For example, a chick I banged on the first date a week and a half ago texted me last night to invite me to join her and her friends for drinks. I wasn't sure if we'd end up back at my place or not after, so I just said no and planned to have her over at my place next week.

Post: #19

Dont you get pissed off when your local restaurant deleted your favorite menu?

Post: #20

(08-23-2014 04:29 PM)Sebastian Wrote:  Dont you get pissed off when your local restaurant deleted your favorite menu?

Yup, thing is there's more restaurants that I like nearby that also have my favorite menu. . . so I Just go there.

Post: #21

(08-22-2014 01:19 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  I will say this. You are an adult man. You are also a human being with feelings.

As long as you are ok with the outcome of your choice, you could still go to dinner and try to make a play to bring her back, despite her having friends over. I am not trying to backtrack on what I said, just that there are always multiple actions to a situation.

As long as you are ok with what happens you could go to dinner. Well in actually, as long as you are ok with any choice you make, then make it (i.e. icing her out).

OP only you know what is right for you in this situation, and for as beta as it sounds go with your gut. Life is about the journey and not the destination. If it blows up lesson learned. Just a small request, if it blows up update us on what happened but try not to belly ache too much (I am not saying you would - I don't know you) - just a more slubu style lessons learned sort of post would help all of us learn and grow. A whiny one would get people jumping on you for not taking the right advice. And I wouldn't want that for you, you seem like a decent enough person.

I hope all that I posted makes sense.

Best wishes on your decision.

Update - I decided to give her a chance when she called back. She sounded sincere and told me she was looking forward to me meeting her friends. Also...she really did have a friend coming in town to stay a night as when I went to pick her up....her friend was arriving same time as me.

Before...on the call I told her on the call " I want you to stay over tonight" She said okay and she would let her friend who was in town know and if her friend didn't like it she could deal with it.

So, on the date,lots of hand holding....went good with the friends. Then the movie. We got back to my place and I pushed for the bang ...a bit of making out but she said let's get some sleep now. ( side corollary...she takes aderal for ADD...so don't know if that's relavant but she does) I was a bit perturbed but I was actually beat too because I'm moving. We went to sleep and I was determined to hit it in the morning.

At daylight...we banged good. Later that morning...banged great. Went for a brunch. Came back and banged great in the afternoon all over the bed and counters. After the bang I mentioned if we were going to keep doing this, I didn't want anyone else in the picture. Just said it like that. She said okay and there hasn't "really" been anyone since we've been seeing. She did tell me a few nights ago she had been on some dates since we'd been seeing each other but I was the only one she'd gotten physical with.

I think upon reflection, she's a little flaky, very busy ( she has all kinds of functions and is in all types of leadership roles in her law class) I'm leaning toward she wasn't banging others, but simply between the aderal and her very busy schedule the past two weeks, she just hasn't wanted sex as much as me. Who, knows I could be wrong but this is my gut after all of yesterday and today.

Thanks again for input as I think this thread has brought out great game basics for girls who truly are putting you on the back burner for other guys.

Post: #22

That was a close call. Glad it worked out well for you.

Great job demanding what you wanted out of her off the bat.

I want to bite my tongue but I can't. I did a similar thing a year ago by stating to the girl that I wanted to simplify things and have us just see each other. Didn't work out well in the end. Looking back it put me in the role of chaser. We'll see if it works out for you.

Post: #23

(08-23-2014 09:36 PM)Travesty444 Wrote:  That was a close call. Glad it worked out well for you.

Great job demanding what you wanted out of her off the bat.

I want to bite my tongue but I can't. I did a similar thing a year ago by stating to the girl that I wanted to simplify things and have us just see each other. Didn't work out well in the end. Looking back it put me in the role of chaser. We'll see if it works out for you.

Thanks Travesty.

When you asked this girl for exclusivity, what was her initial reaction/response?

Post: #24

Great news!

Post: #25

Now would be a good time in your mini relationship with her to work on that perfect world of yours.

Harem of three of 7 and ups?
One down and two to go.

If she tries withholding sex now that these events have transpired then run some silent treatment game to get the hamster going. Being sure to secure the bang/bangs as soon as you decide to see her again.