Post: #76

(04-22-2014 10:54 AM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  I admit I didn't read a lot of what you wrote, Man. I did peek in and caught the gist of it though.

Yeah, it does seem like this chick has taken some liberties with your emotions and enjoys the validation. She has her own team of hamsters pulling for her here and may not be doing this purposely, but she is doing it.

For instance, you don't write long email letters to people whose feelings you don't reciprocate about the feelings you don't reciprocate. That just drags shit out and makes it worse - it's her own exercise in self-validation.

All that said, you have known each other for a long time. I think you can cut this woman out of your life without making it an act of nuclear war.

In other words, make it temporary. Resist the urge to tell her off. Be civil and recognize that you're just as much at fault for this as she is.

Maybe even send her a brief message about how you just need to be away from her for a while and get "this thing" out of your system - just so she doesn't riddle you with messages "wondering" what's going on and tempting you to reopen the conversation.

Then proceed with your game, fucking other women, getting in shape, etc. Focusing on yourself.

When the feelings pass (and they will), you're back in control of your own emotions and thought processes, and you're getting laid on the regular or in a relationship with someone else, then maybe you can be actual friends and not just having a pretend friendship with someone you're in love with. Might be a few months, might be a year - whatever - but I don't think you have to completely napalm your friend out of your life just because she wasn't into you.

Also, read this book if you haven't already: http://www.amazon.com/No-More-Mr-Nice-Gu...8&sr=&qid=

I think it'll give you a lot of epiphanies.

(04-22-2014 05:55 AM)EpicBeta Wrote:  But that may be tricky because she's one of the best friend's closest girlfriends, even though they rarely get to hang out these days. It would probably work fine to see her for a while, but it wouldn't be long before the subject came up with one of us, and the girl catches on that I'm avoiding our close friend in common.

Dating her friends might not be a bad idea. If you actually develop real feelings for her friend, you'll likely get carried away into that and be able to leave all the BS between you two behind with relatively little friction and awkwardness. No avoidance needed.

There is a chance she'll suddenly get weird and have her own little jealous moments (even if it's just the loss of the validation), but if you think she's drama-free enough that might not happen.

Just banging her friends might not be enough though - because you'd still be looking at her. This would probably only work if you were actually into her friend on an emotional level.

I also suggest just being straight up about the whole thing with this other girl if you are seriously dating her (if she doesn't know already, which she probably does). You don't want to leave that little bait lingering out there that gives your "bff" a reason for little hush-hush pointless conversations and messages between you based on this secret thing your new gf doesn't know.

Drama queens eat that shit up, so I'd rob her of that temptation by laying the cards right down on the table.

Just my thoughts.

Thanks a lot! Very helpful way to think about it. I'll get that book. Cheers!

Post: #77

dam op i stopped when i read you slept with her for a night and NOTING HAPPENED. jesus christ if i sleep with a girl at night hormones are flying man and ima at least get a blowjob or something. dang.... but at least you knew that was weak. and before i keep going I think you should take option 3 without the keeping the friendship thing. let the train wreck be over and move on . dont live in the past

Post: #78

Again not wishing to derail the thread, but further to my previous post in this thread, I think there's some leverage to be hand sometimes, if you stay in touch with exgf's, on a casual basis.
I've got an unusual situation with an ex, she regularly hits me up to tell me how her life is going, sometimes she tells me about guys she's seeing.
I know what you're thinking, a chick telling you about other guys is bad news, and normally I would think that too, and I would write that girl off and fade her out of my life.
However.
Just recently, she mentioned to me about a guy she's begun seeing (she has self esteem issues), she expressed doubts that he would like her, that he would not be into her body.
Sensing an opportunity, I asked her to send a pic or two of her and I would let her know if she has anything to worry about.
Interestingly, she assumed I meant naked (I never mentioned the word, but once she said it, I assumed the sale).
At first she outright refused to countenance sending anything, but then began to come around, and now, I'd say it's 50/50 that she'll send me something.
I would never have had the balls to tell a girl to send me pics before I came across Roosh & Heartiste.
That said, if I receive no pics, I'll have to decide how best to proceed.
My instinct would be probably not to mention anything at first, and then hit her up some night I know she's out drinking, and more likely to have lower inhibitions, and gently push and tease til she sends me something.

Post: #79

(03-24-2014 03:20 PM)Ziltoid Wrote:  My advice.

• She's really not that funny, down to earth, cool, or talented. She is probably not even that hot. When someone is unattainable to you, your imagination and fantasies get carried away and fill in the blanks in such a way that a woman seems far more perfect than anyone, let alone her, could possibly actually be.
• What are you getting out of this "friendship", and what is she? You get to keep the suspension of disbelief alive for your romantic fixation, and she gets attention, validation, and the thrilling drama of watching you fawn over her and repeatedly turning you down. No combination of words or actions exists that is going to stop her from stringing you along and to become involved with you sexually or romantically. Have a few drinks alone and take a long hard look at why it is you value her as a "friend" so much.
• Tell her you have feelings for her that you cannot undo but that you realize it would not work out, and that keeping her around as a friend would be unhealthy for you. Cut ties, move on.
  

Simple as that. Stop obsessing over this broad, no good will come of it.

Im by no means any good, but i would like to add my 2 cents.

I would just use her friendship and turn it around back to her.
she seems ok with you watching her fuck other guys, so why wouldnt she be ok with you fucking other girls?

She seems like the Perfect Wing-girl just go out with her and use her.
There's no need to ruin a perfect friendship with bitter hatred.

Transfer that energy into something more productive, especially if you're just getting into game now. if you're new, you wont see it correctly but deeper in, you will learn to utilize a female company, something i definitely didnt learn in my beta days.

edit: i enjoyed the long read. it really captures who you are.

Post: #80

(04-24-2014 04:31 AM)amity Wrote:  At first she outright refused to countenance sending anything, but then began to come around, and now, I'd say it's 50/50 that she'll send me something.

The effort you spend talking to her as a "friend" (and frankly, it sounds like you're being her emotional sponge/support) would get you WAY more than the "possibility" of a receiving a naked picture or two if you spent it on pursuing other girls.

Go out and get your dick wet and drop your ex. Your advice is well meaning, but wrong.

IF you see your ex out drinking and you want to go for some fucking and she's into it, great. Keeping her as a friend and waiting for the possibility of nude pictures? Come on.

Post: #81

@Aneroid Ocean Fair comments bro, I hear ya, when I think about it, it is a little bit sad. You're right, better to get out there and lay some pipe rather than awaiting the possibility of getting a couple of pics from a chick I might not lay a hand on again.

Post: #82

If actually enjoyed reading the posts as it reminds me of other guys who've come to me before. Ignore, ignore, ignore. Concentrate on your new chicks. All the negative energy you have from this girl could ruin your chances with the others.

Don't respond to her messages
It does not matter that you're seeing her friends
If you have to reply - 'ok' , 'cool', 'yah' are good responses.
You've got to remember that you're being logical about this all, she never will be logical, hell she won't even understand half the shit you're telling her. So why persist? Life moves on. I bet if you asked many of the forum members how many of them have lifelong friends, it would be a low percentage.

Let it go, cry it out, punch a boxing bag. It'll take time but you'll recover, having a passion for something else will help, even if that is slaying new pussy.

There's another thread about an article where a nice guy says he doesn't want a woman anymore. Read that story (even if it is a troll response) look at the parallels between that and yours.

I'll try finding a post by MattC if I can that he made on here when he had a crippling oneitis and how he got out of it. I'm sure it was on here or our blog but it'll help. We've all been there and there's no doubt about it, you're suffering from oneitis.

Post: #83

Thanks ppl! I'm glad at least a couple of you enjoyed the full novel hahaha.

I've been staying strong, not responding at all to her email (in my last long post on page 3).

Then I got this follow up email:

"Can u let me know if u got this? I felt relieved to have sent it but now I just feel weird not knowing if you got it or not..."

Aww poor thing. I'm tempted to just keep ignoring, but part of me thinks that's not really being the bigger person/turning the other cheek, as much as it is openly hostile, or asking for more attention.

Thought I might just say - "u can go back to feeling relieved"

And just leave it at that... ignore anything that follows. But I'll wait to see if anyone wants to chime in first.

Not sure what I'll do yet..

Thanks again for the additional feedback all

Post: #84

You ever get that boundaries book I mentioned? I think it could really help you.

That said. I'm still with many other here in the "ignore" camp. If you do meet in person again, which you may if you start dating/banging her friends. Be indifferent - if she asks why you didn't reply to her previous emails/texts, just say, "Why would I?" THEN GET UP AND LEAVE. DO NOT ENGAGE AND RATIONALIZE WITH HER.

Indifference is the opposite of love/interest in a person. That may give you the closure you desire.

(03-31-2014 12:59 AM)Tytalus Wrote:  Just walk away. What you need to do is move on. And learn some boundaries.

http://www.amazon.com/Boundaries-When-Ta...boundaries

This chic is more like an obsession that you're trying not to be obsessed with.

Post: #85

(04-28-2014 11:57 PM)EpicBeta Wrote:  Thought I might just say - "u can go back to feeling relieved"

NO. DON'T YOU FUCKING DO IT.

I will find you and beat you

She doesn't exist any more, just move on. Consider it spam.

Notice how she needs your attention now that you don't give a shit. Or at least pretending not to give a shit.

Let her fucking feel weird.

Don't respond. Look how she is spinning now, now that you are manning up.

Ignore it, it is spam.

Post: #86

Hahaha thought u might say that. Ok I'll try. It just feels fucking heavy/difficult because we've been tight for so long. It's completely out of character for me to take it to that level (with her), but that's probably a good thing. And ya it's quite refreshing to see the wheel spinning lol

Post: #87

I ordered it, but still haven't had a chance to read. Looking forward to it and already trying to adopt those principles in life as much as possible.

Thanks again!

P.S. I can't tell if the quote function is working on my phone. Sorry if it creates any confusion!

Post: #88

(04-29-2014 12:10 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(04-28-2014 11:57 PM)EpicBeta Wrote:  Thought I might just say - "u can go back to feeling relieved"

NO. DON'T YOU FUCKING DO IT.

I will find you and beat you

She doesn't exist any more, just move on. Consider it spam.

Notice how she needs your attention now that you don't give a shit. Or at least pretending not to give a shit.

Let her fucking feel weird.

Don't respond. Look how she is spinning now, now that you are manning up.

Ignore it, it is spam.

This. If you do it, I will join samsamsam, hunt you down and we'll both beat you. You have been warned.

Post: #89

aint nobody got time for that

Post: #90

(04-29-2014 01:39 AM)caracal Wrote:  

(04-29-2014 12:10 AM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(04-28-2014 11:57 PM)EpicBeta Wrote:  Thought I might just say - "u can go back to feeling relieved"

NO. DON'T YOU FUCKING DO IT.

I will find you and beat you

She doesn't exist any more, just move on. Consider it spam.

Notice how she needs your attention now that you don't give a shit. Or at least pretending not to give a shit.

Let her fucking feel weird.

Don't respond. Look how she is spinning now, now that you are manning up.

Ignore it, it is spam.

This. If you do it, I will join samsamsam, hunt you down and we'll both beat you. You have been warned.

And then I will join them, but I will also bring my baseball bat, because maybe that would knock some sense into you.

DO NOT REPLY TO HER EMAIL.

Post: #91

(04-29-2014 12:19 AM)EpicBeta Wrote:  Hahaha thought u might say that. Ok I'll try. It just feels fucking heavy/difficult because we've been tight for so long. It's completely out of character for me to take it to that level (with her), but that's probably a good thing. And ya it's quite refreshing to see the wheel spinning lol

If you want different results in life, you have to do something different than what you did in the past.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #92

(04-28-2014 11:58 PM)Tytalus Wrote:  That said. I'm still with many other here in the "ignore" camp. If you do meet in person again, which you may if you start dating/banging her friends. Be indifferent - if she asks why you didn't reply to her previous emails/texts, just say, "Why would I?" THEN GET UP AND LEAVE. DO NOT ENGAGE AND RATIONALIZE WITH HER.

Indifference is the opposite of love/interest in a person. That may give you the closure you desire.

(03-31-2014 12:59 AM)Tytalus Wrote:  Just walk away. What you need to do is move on. And learn some boundaries.

http://www.amazon.com/Boundaries-When-Ta...boundaries

This chic is more like an obsession that you're trying not to be obsessed with.

RE: her friend, she's weaseled her way out of hanging out with me again 2 weekends in a row, and she likes to wait a full day to respond to any messages, if at all. So I think that's dead, but good riddance. Time to move on. I don't have time for polite flakey bitches. Fuck em both hahaha.

RE: what happens if I see her in person again, I think that's still a possibility. I could imagine her figuring out a way to corner me, whether it's waiting at my apt, or trying to go through friends or family.

I love what you say about acting totally indifferent if I am confronted, then walking away like nothing, or shutting the door in her face. I don't disagree that it would be well deserved, and I'll try to keep that frame.

It would just be much easier to be that icy and cold turkey with her in person, if I was only close to her for 4-5 years. Would have no trouble with that, and I've ended other toxic relationships similarly. It would be easier if we didn't have 17 years of closeness, and a long history of her helping me out and being there for me as a friend.

She set me up and gave me a place to live for well over a year when I was struggling to get on my feet, among other things. That doesn't excuse all the shit she put me through, but it does make it a little harder to just be like, "fuck off and die bitch" (in so many words).

If she did corner me I might have a serious but calm heart to heart with her about why I'm shutting her out of my life, and how careless she's been with her actions over the years. Then force her to let/go, say goodbye once and for all, and accept it.

Or if she calls my parents "worried" or something, I might send a message like - "look, I'm not ready to talk to you, and I don't know if I will ever be. Just live your life and be happy, don't let me get in the way." Or something… but I'd only consider that if it got out of hand, with others getting involved (remember we have mutual friends, and family friends, which complicates it a tad).

But who knows… I'm going to continue ignoring for now, letting the hamster wheel spin, and cross that bridge if/when I get to it. I will keep all of the advice in mind, and I might even go with sheer face-face indifference depending on how things unfold. All your points are well taken. I will not engage or rationalize with her now, and try to avoid that all together. I'll probably been even more comfortable with the idea of blowing her off in person after I sleep on it for a day or two.

Now I've gotta get back to focusing on my fitness, career, and other chicks, so I can get this one out of my head for good! That's one little draw back about the ignoring her completely method; while it's most satisfying to let her wheel spin in the long run, it kind of drags out the drama with her.

If I told her to buzz off, she probably would and that would be the end of it, but I'm sure I'd go through some turmoil either way. I'll do my best to keep ignoring her. Won't respond to the email, don't worry hahaha.

Thanks homies

Post: #93

Yeah, it really is hard to walk away from a friend that has genuinely helped you out in the past. But, recall SUNK COST FALLACY http://www.lifehack.org/articles/communi...tupid.html

Quote:Or if she calls my parents "worried" or something, I might send a message like - "look, I'm not ready to talk to you, and I don't know if I will ever be. Just live your life and be happy, don't let me get in the way." Or something… but I'd only consider that if it got out of hand, with others getting involved (remember we have mutual friends, and family friends, which complicates it a tad).

It seems like what is going to be hardest for you is your internal frame. I can see that you're trying to move on, but the way you talk to yourself in your head is not yet positive enough nor with enough self esteem.

I read in the book "Charisma" what can really hold people back is lack of self forgiveness. I'm NOT talking religious stuff here. Forgiving yourself for your mistakes can really help you move on. At least even identifying why you don't feel you can forgive yourself can be really insightful.

Post: #94

(04-29-2014 05:37 AM)EpicBeta Wrote:  She set me up and gave me a place to live for well over a year when I was struggling to get on my feet, among other things.

Keep in mind the reason you are leaving this relationship is because it is toxic and not serving you. Having said that - you do what I would do to honor what she did for you.

If she ever gets in a jam, people will talk you'll hear. You show up with a wad of cash and give it to her. Don't even have a conversation. There are people who I don't talk to anymore - but if something bad happened to them, I would have my lawyer go over and deliver cash.

That would be the only exception. I believe in loyalty and not forgetting those who have helped me. Any person who forgets those who have helped them is not a man. Off my soapbox.

This would be the only time I would be cool with you having any form of contact with her. I talk like I have a say in the matter I know I don't. Just my suggestion.

Post: #95

(04-21-2014 10:12 AM)tawillionaire Wrote:  Gonna go against the grain here and say hurting her may make you feel better. I once sent an ex girlfriend a text telling her that I fucked her friend and that her friend gave way better head than her (all true by the way). She didn't respond, and I haven't talked to her since, but it still felt pretty good and was a fun story to tell my friends. I consider that the moment I got my balls back after a relationship that took me out of myself.

In hindsight, I was being too nice by only sending a text. Should have sent a picture or video instead.

That's different. Fucking the friend is a solid move. This is weak. It will be interpreted this way, and used to make her feel better about her actions. And actions speak louder than words. Walk away, be distant.

Post: #96

(04-29-2014 01:17 PM)samsamsam Wrote:  

(04-29-2014 05:37 AM)EpicBeta Wrote:  She set me up and gave me a place to live for well over a year when I was struggling to get on my feet, among other things.

Keep in mind the reason you are leaving this relationship is because it is toxic and not serving you. Having said that - you do what I would do to honor what she did for you.

If she ever gets in a jam, people will talk you'll hear. You show up with a wad of cash and give it to her. Don't even have a conversation. There are people who I don't talk to anymore - but if something bad happened to them, I would have my lawyer go over and deliver cash.

That would be the only exception. I believe in loyalty and not forgetting those who have helped me. Any person who forgets those who have helped them is not a man. Off my soapbox.

This would be the only time I would be cool with you having any form of contact with her. I talk like I have a say in the matter I know I don't. Just my suggestion.

Yeah, that giving you a place to live for a year rather changes the complexion of things. It's still an unhealthy relationship that you MUST end, but you have a legit obligation if they hit similar circumstances.

Post: #97

(04-29-2014 03:00 PM)DarkTriad Wrote:  

(04-21-2014 10:12 AM)tawillionaire Wrote:  Gonna go against the grain here and say hurting her may make you feel better. I once sent an ex girlfriend a text telling her that I fucked her friend and that her friend gave way better head than her (all true by the way). She didn't respond, and I haven't talked to her since, but it still felt pretty good and was a fun story to tell my friends. I consider that the moment I got my balls back after a relationship that took me out of myself.

In hindsight, I was being too nice by only sending a text. Should have sent a picture or video instead.

That's different. Fucking the friend is a solid move. This is weak. It will be interpreted this way, and used to make her feel better about her actions. And actions speak louder than words. Walk away, be distant.

Yeah, after reading how she helped OP with a place to stay among other things I agree that it's a dick move to tell her off. Kudos to OP for restraining yourself this long, I would have told her off in a heartbeat.

I would probably tell her straight up that you can't talk to her but she can hit you up if she ever needs help with anything.

Post: #98

Update:

Got a text from her this morning- "Hiiii did you get my email?? Hope you're doing great "

Man she really seems to be in denial about this. My distance over the last month and a half couldn't be more obvious. Seems to be bugging her, but she still doesn't want to admit that I've finally walked away. It's interesting…

If I was still trying to bang one of her friends I don't know if ignoring her last emails/texts completely would work against that or not, or if it would work better to tell her I just can't have her in my life anymore.

But like I said, the friend I was most interested in doesn't seem like an option anymore, so it probably doesn't matter. She's bound to follow up with a more dramtiac message/messages over the next day or so if I say nothing.

That's all fine and good, but it's going to be distracting me. Can't help it…

Hey Samsamsam, going back to what you said about remembering what ppl did for you, and being there for them in a pinch; how would you feel about communicating that - like "you can call me in a life/death emergency, but other than that I'd rather not hear from you anymore." or something brief/simple to that effect? Or would you say just keep ignoring and be help if that situation ever comes up and get's back to me?

(04-29-2014 03:16 PM)tawillionaire Wrote:  Yeah, after reading how she helped OP with a place to stay among other things I agree that it's a dick move to tell her off. Kudos to OP for restraining yourself this long, I would have told her off in a heartbeat.

I would probably tell her straight up that you can't talk to her but she can hit you up if she ever needs help with anything.

Thanks, yeah that's kind of what I was thinking… I'm glad you guys understand why it's not quite as easy as just telling her to piss off, even thought the relationship does need to end.

Last thought; I still feel like ignoring the email and todays text is similar to dickishly telling her off, and I still feel tempted to reply to her email (maybe tonight) with a simple "received." and then say nothing else. I think that would acknowledge her just enough to make it clear that I don't care what she says and I don't want to talk to her, but I'm not trying to provoke drama with her either because I don't care anymore.

But if you guys think I should keep holding off on any responses, I'll probably do that.

Thanks again

Post: #99

Ignore this accidental post - can't figure out how to delete.

Post: #100

Keep ignoring, if you read over what you've written on this page, you're emotionally blackmailing yourself.