http://maidsafe.net/
http://www.safecoin.io/
IPO in three days, cool project. Thinking about putting 2-3BTC in

(04-19-2014 07:01 AM)Satoshi Wrote:  http://maidsafe.net/
http://www.safecoin.io/
IPO in three days, cool project. Thinking about putting 2-3BTC in

Thanks man, I probably invest a very small amount like one btc. They look like they know what they are doing -- that is what really matters. Alt-coins are really worth the investment only in the very beginning because most of them are the real ponzi-schemes. Invest in the beginning and your return can be amazing.

(04-19-2014 07:01 AM)Satoshi Wrote:  http://maidsafe.net/
http://www.safecoin.io/
IPO in three days, cool project. Thinking about putting 2-3BTC in

Aren't you gonna run out of BTC soon, if you keep putting varying amounts of your BTC stash into these various other crypto projects?

Well, to each his own..

Many of us have probably heard that in the BTC sphere, recently, there has been considerable discussions regarding "side chains" - which likely would allow the bitcoin protocol to co-opt features of almost any other crypto currency.. which seems even more reason to be investing a vast majority of resources into bitcoin - rather than into alts.

Though I do NOT doubt that there still could be short-term potential with various alts and getting in on the ground floor.. if you can time your entry into such and into the right one(s).

(04-19-2014 07:01 AM)Satoshi Wrote:  http://maidsafe.net/
http://www.safecoin.io/
IPO in three days, cool project. Thinking about putting 2-3BTC in

Can nyou explain what this safecoin project is? Is it a platform for bitcoins or is it a new coin you can buy with Bitcoins? Checking out their website but kinda confused about what it is exactly.

If it's just an altcoin what makes it different than the dozens of other altcoins popping up all the time that basically go nowhere. Even if you do get a 40% bump for getting in early 40% of something with no trading value or no trading volume is still worthless. I'm kinda confused by what this project is though if someone can elaborate.

(04-19-2014 08:02 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  

(04-19-2014 07:01 AM)Satoshi Wrote:  http://maidsafe.net/
http://www.safecoin.io/
IPO in three days, cool project. Thinking about putting 2-3BTC in

Aren't you gonna run out of BTC soon, if you keep putting varying amounts of your BTC stash into these various other crypto projects?

Well, to each his own..

Many of us have probably heard that in the BTC sphere, recently, there has been considerable discussions regarding "side chains" - which likely would allow the bitcoin protocol to co-opt features of almost any other crypto currency.. which seems even more reason to be investing a vast majority of resources into bitcoin - rather than into alts.

Though I do NOT doubt that there still could be short-term potential with various alts and getting in on the ground floor.. if you can time your entry into such and into the right one(s).

The below link provides a fairly good discussion to bolster points about how sidechains could strengthen bitcoin to the detriment of alt coins. More or less, what I was trying to assert in my earlier post.

http://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments...idechains/

From what I underdtand essentially its not a crypto its made to keep your bitcoins safe. Whether you use the safe network or not it sounds like very good news for bitcoin.

(04-19-2014 09:03 PM)shanked Wrote:  From what I underdtand essentially its not a crypto its made to keep your bitcoins safe. Whether you use the safe network or not it sounds like very good news for bitcoin.

I looked back at my post, and I see that I was likely being very ambiguous about what i was referring to...

First, I was asking Satoshi about the potential dispersion of his investments, but I do understand that there could be many ways to invest in various bitcoin supporting technologies that are NOT alt coins.

Second, I agree with you Shanked that surely if there are mechanisms to bolster either bitcoin security or ease of use or just being able to manage ones bitcoins in easier and safer ways, then those will be very valuable contributions to the bitcoin ecosystem.. and it may be profitable to invest in those systems on the ground floor, and or just that those systems may just cause the value of bitcoin to go up through improving and increasing adoption (hopefully).

The original title of this thread is kinda funny when your realise that bitcoin when up pretty much that percentage in just 4 days last week.

Still dont fully understand it so I emailed them. Exciting to have the chance to be in at the start of something.

(04-19-2014 12:13 PM)jamaicabound Wrote:  

(04-19-2014 07:01 AM)Satoshi Wrote:  http://maidsafe.net/
http://www.safecoin.io/
IPO in three days, cool project. Thinking about putting 2-3BTC in

Can nyou explain what this safecoin project is? Is it a platform for bitcoins or is it a new coin you can buy with Bitcoins? Checking out their website but kinda confused about what it is exactly.

If it's just an altcoin what makes it different than the dozens of other altcoins popping up all the time that basically go nowhere. Even if you do get a 40% bump for getting in early 40% of something with no trading value or no trading volume is still worthless. I'm kinda confused by what this project is though if someone can elaborate.

It's not an alt-coin, it's built on the mastercoin protocol witch store it's data in the bticoin blockchain. See the bitcointalk thread https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=577149.0 and the whitepaper https://github.com/maidsafe/Whitepapers/...4-safecoin
There is also a five minute video witch explains pretty good.

Quote:Aren't you gonna run out of BTC soon, if you keep putting varying amounts of your BTC stash into these various other crypto projects?

Got a refund on the Neptune miner since it seems to not going the break even, that's a 5% lost. My mining contracts is break even and gave me about 10% profit. My mastercoins is traded at the same price I bought them for and I will use them to buy MaidSafeCoin. Only thing I lost on is ExeCoin witch I bought when I was drunk. Payed about 2BTC for them and now they are wort like 0.4BTC or something.

I don´t understand what you are actually getting when you invest in MaidSafe?

Isn´t it like a protocol for a distributed p2p version of internet? Like what torrent is for file sharing?

So much innovation going on all over the place atm. Hard to stay on top of it all.

(04-20-2014 04:29 AM)Satoshi Wrote:  

Quote:Aren't you gonna run out of BTC soon, if you keep putting varying amounts of your BTC stash into these various other crypto projects?

Got a refund on the Neptune miner since it seems to not going the break even, that's a 5% lost. My mining contracts is break even and gave me about 10% profit. My mastercoins is traded at the same price I bought them for and I will use them to buy MaidSafeCoin. Only thing I lost on is ExeCoin witch I bought when I was drunk. Payed about 2BTC for them and now they are wort like 0.4BTC or something.

Yeah... I am NOT going to really second guess anybody else's strategies when it comes to their various investments... whether alt coins or some other bitcoin related projects. Some of these investments may work better than others and there may be some luck involved (either good or bad).

At this point, I put most of my studies into BTC and my money as well. I believe that all my alt coin investments add up to less than 5% of my total crypto-currency investments... and I have NOT otherwise invested in any other BTC businesses (not yet, anyhow).

I am still considering that I will cash out on the various alt-cryptos on or after the next bubble. That is my current thinking.. however, it may be more strategic to take a loss on the alts before the next BTC bubble and then accordingly just to convert whatever value is currently in those various alts into BTC...

I am a little bit torn about whether or how to employ the stop loss.. but I am thinking that some of the alts will sometimes over perform btc on the short-term, and maybe it would be better to cash out one by one after they have had performance boosts. Luckily these alt coins are NOT a large portion of my cryto-coin investments... NOT exactly toy money, but NOT a great quantity of money invested in them - about the equivalent of 2.7 BTC.

(04-20-2014 04:46 AM)pants Wrote:  I don´t understand what you are actually getting when you invest in MaidSafe?

Isn´t it like a protocol for a distributed p2p version of internet? Like what torrent is for file sharing?

So much innovation going on all over the place atm. Hard to stay on top of it all.

I think that the question with any of these crypto projects is how does it make money, and if it just makes money for BTC or improves the BTC infrastructure, then it may be better to just invest in BTC - rather than investing in these side projects (so yes, we would probably need to be able to understand the monetary value proposition, if there is one)

(04-20-2014 04:57 AM)JayJuanGee Wrote:  

(04-20-2014 04:29 AM)Satoshi Wrote:  

Quote:Aren't you gonna run out of BTC soon, if you keep putting varying amounts of your BTC stash into these various other crypto projects?

Got a refund on the Neptune miner since it seems to not going the break even, that's a 5% lost. My mining contracts is break even and gave me about 10% profit. My mastercoins is traded at the same price I bought them for and I will use them to buy MaidSafeCoin. Only thing I lost on is ExeCoin witch I bought when I was drunk. Payed about 2BTC for them and now they are wort like 0.4BTC or something.

Yeah... I am NOT going to really second guess anybody else's strategies when it comes to their various investments... whether alt coins or some other bitcoin related projects. Some of these investments may work better than others and there may be some luck involved (either good or bad).

At this point, I put most of my studies into BTC and my money as well. I believe that all my alt coin investments add up to less than 5% of my total crypto-currency investments... and I have NOT otherwise invested in any other BTC businesses (not yet, anyhow).

I am still considering that I will cash out on the various alt-cryptos on or after the next bubble. That is my current thinking.. however, it may be more strategic to take a loss on the alts before the next BTC bubble and then accordingly just to convert whatever value is currently in those various alts into BTC...

I am a little bit torn about whether or how to employ the stop loss.. but I am thinking that some of the alts will sometimes over perform btc on the short-term, and maybe it would be better to cash out one by one after they have had performance boosts. Luckily these alt coins are NOT a large portion of my cryto-coin investments... NOT exactly toy money, but NOT a great quantity of money invested in them - about the equivalent of 2.7 BTC.

(04-20-2014 04:46 AM)pants Wrote:  I don´t understand what you are actually getting when you invest in MaidSafe?

Isn´t it like a protocol for a distributed p2p version of internet? Like what torrent is for file sharing?

So much innovation going on all over the place atm. Hard to stay on top of it all.

I think that the question with any of these crypto projects is how does it make money, and if it just makes money for BTC or improves the BTC infrastructure, then it may be better to just invest in BTC - rather than investing in these side projects (so yes, we would probably need to be able to understand the monetary value proposition, if there is one)

As I understand it you will need Safecoins to store data on the network, you buy the storing space. And "farmers" who store the data will get awarded in Safecoins. Alt-coins go up when bitcoin does, just more. Same way they drop when bitcoin drop only harder. At least that's been the pattern.

BTC is for sure the safest one to have the money in with Litecoins as second.

I understand the purpose of the network. Decentralized storage. Something that sounds like a very interesting project.

Still I´m having problems understanding the motivation to invest in this project.

For storage, what network you are part of dose not really matter as they can all be connected. If RooshV moves from one server park to another does not really affect me in any way.
However for a currency it will be important for me to be able to access most people, then I need to be on the most popular currency-network.

If this MaidSafe is a success, there will be plenty of clones, that would be just as valuable.

Only reason I see, is just hope for hype, and then sell the coins.

(04-20-2014 08:39 AM)pants Wrote:  I understand the purpose of the network. Decentralized storage. Something that sounds like a very interesting project.

Still I´m having problems understanding the motivation to invest in this project.

For storage, what network you are part of dose not really matter as they can all be connected. If RooshV moves from one server park to another does not really affect me in any way.
However for a currency it will be important for me to be able to access most people, then I need to be on the most popular currency-network.

If this MaidSafe is a success, there will be plenty of clones, that would be just as valuable.

Only reason I see, is just hope for hype, and then sell the coins.

It's not a currency.
If Roosh v would like to be on the network Roosh would have to buy Safecoins and pay for the storage/hosting using that. And the BTC gained in the fundraising will go to the foundation to develop the project and pay developers. Didn't read to much about it so I'm not 100% about what I'm writing is true, but as I understand it it's like that.

Decentralized storage is the goal.

For this they need computers attached to internet available for storage.
The way they get this is by paying this networks equivalent of miners in the bitcoin network with their cryptocoin called SafeCoin.

So they are hoping the safecoin becomes something people value, else people won´t lend their hardware for storage of files from random people on the internet.

I am not bashing the idea, as i think it´s a good idea. I´m just having a hard time understanding how the economics in such a network will work.

(04-20-2014 09:45 AM)pants Wrote:  Decentralized storage is the goal.

For this they need computers attached to internet available for storage.
The way they get this is by paying this networks equivalent of miners in the bitcoin network with their cryptocoin called SafeCoin.

So they are hoping the safecoin becomes something people value, else people won´t lend their hardware for storage of files from random people on the internet.

I am not bashing the idea, as i think it´s a good idea. I´m just having a hard time understanding how the economics in such a network will work.

http://deadloch.com/why-you-should-buy-safecoins/

Quote:But will safecoins be able to hold a value? I reckon they will. I think people are getting used to the idea that something completely abstract can be worth something. Bitcoin has helped people come to terms with the idea of a completely digital currency. Safecoin will represent value because they are harvested through the process of contributing useful resources to the network. There will also be a psychological link to worth given by the initial exchange rate of the crowd sale.
.............
If the full number of MaidSafeCoins are sold, approximately $8 million USD will be raised. Assuming safecoin value is representative of the project’s success, this means 10% of the project is valued at $8 million, so logically the entire venture will be valued at $80 million. The question then is; is the SAFE network going to be worth more than $80 million in the future?

Also to mention that all fundraisers similar to this, Mastercoin, Counterparty, Protoshares, Nxt and on have gained value after fundraising been finished. They been working on it for 8 years so they should know what they're doing. On a note I'm not trying to promote anything just explain the trades I'm doing and look for input.

From next month I'm going to be living on my BTCs so if we could chocho a little until it would be great.

(04-20-2014 12:47 PM)Satoshi Wrote:  On a note I'm not trying to promote anything just explain the trades I'm doing and look for input.

I'm kind of with Pants on this one and having trouble recognizing that those coin storage investments would be any more valuable than just investing that same quantity in bitcoin. Maybe some other guys can see value in it.. like the potential payoff is worth the risk?

If I ever become bitcoin rich.. maybe I would engage in such investments to help the overall infrastructure while potentially profiting at the same time. Currently, I am far from bitcoin rich... given the current seemingly depressed bitcoin prices.

(04-20-2014 12:47 PM)Satoshi Wrote:  From next month I'm going to be living on my BTCs so if we could chocho a little until it would be great.

Earlier today, I came across this article, which is fairly bullish about the long-term prospects of bitcoin (by suggesting that we could likely reach $2,000s by the end of July, but even does provide that it is possible (but less likely) that bitcoin will go into the 100s. Interesting read, yet in my thinking it would be great if a guy is able to defer drawing upon his bitcoin until the next bubble.. which hopefully will take place this year. I appreciate that this may NOT be practical for some guys.

Good article.

Martingale strategy is what I have been doing. Just didnt realise there was a name for it.

Bitcoin is in stealth mode right now.

I like it

(04-20-2014 03:32 PM)JJ Roberts Wrote:  Good article.

Martingale strategy is what I have been doing. Just didnt realise there was a name for it.

I did not have the energy to read the article, just read MARTINGALE, and a red flag rise up.

A common misunderstanding is that the martingale strategy is a bullet proof system to use in casinos. It´s not.

Don´t know why martingale is mentioned in this article. But if they are guaranteeing profit with an investment strategy, be very careful.

I think its a good strategy for trading volatile stuff like BTC where trying to catch the falling knife is not a realistic alternative

Its a known losing strategy in casinos however

(04-20-2014 04:44 PM)JJ Roberts Wrote:  I think its a good strategy for trading volatile stuff like BTC where trying to catch the falling knife is not a realistic alternative

Its a known losing strategy in casinos however

If the odds are 50/50 and you keep doubling down when you lose, then it could be quite disastrous.

However, I agree with JJRoberts that it will likely be a very good strategy in BTC investments b/c you are likely NOT going to be able to time the bottom of the prices exactly.. and many of us here believe the odds are pretty high that we are going to witness a fairly large and significant appreciation in BTC prices in the coming months - which possibly such rocket could be delayed but is very likely to come. doubling down upon loss lowers the average price per BTC, so when the price finally does go up, it will NOT need to go as high in order to recoup or profit from one's investment (to get back into the red)

On the other hand, if bitcoin tanks.. then you will lose a hell of a lot more than if you had followed a buy and hold strategy or some other strategy. Also, if BTC continues this downtrend forever, without really reversing, then the same loss of a lot more will take place.

On the other hand (I think I am running out of hands), if you are investing more than you are willing to lose, then you could get in big trouble with such a doubling down strategy, and I believe JJ has already covered this topic that, at least you, JJ, have said that so far, you are NOT investing more than you are willing to lose in the worse case scenario(s).

@JayJuanGee Yeah, not going to put in more than 1% of my total net worth

In a disaster scenario and I lose it all it will simply be annoying, it won't restrict my ability to do anything or enjoy my life. In short such a scenario will have no impact on my life.

Here is what one of their representatives said to my email.

Quote:Hi shanked,

MaidSafeCoin is an intermediate coin but is not intended to keep your coins safe. The reason for the intermediate coin is that MaidSafe will be running a test net initially and will potentially need to bring the network up and down during testing. An intermediate
coin is required as coins may be destroyed from time to time as the network is restarted. Once testing is complete and the full SAFE network is launched (with POR resource in place) all holders of MaidSafeCoin will exchange these for safecoin on a 1:1 ratio.
There is nothing to stop people speculating on the price of MaidSafeCoins, buying them at the start then selling them later, users will be able to trade these coins on the master xchange.

There are a few differences from other alt coins. The MaidSafe currency is backed entirely by data so that as more information is added to the network more coins are generated. This provides an incentivisation for users to provide their computing resources to the network, we can these people farmers (as opposed to miners). The currency is also different in that, when the full network is launched, it will be used on the SAFE network’s transaction mechanism (our version of the block chain) that enables immediate transaction confirmation and the ability to process millions of transcations per second. Our transaction mechanism is not chained and this means that users can only see the current and previous coin owners addresses rather than the fully available public ledger of bitcoin. In this way safecoins can be thought of as digital cash.

No problem answering your questions, that’s what we’re here for. Just let us know if you need anything else.

They've been working on this project for 8 years (before bitcoin was created), their career hiring looks to be very thorough and extensive and the idea behind it is quite amazing. The coin is used sort of like an IPO for shares to help them get this network online. Maidsafecoin will be an intermediate coin until safecoin is created and can be traded in the mean time. Decentralizing the internet should remove any middlemen from handling private information and keep your information safe by breaking it up with complex algorithms and storing it in different locations all over the world. That is how I understood it anyone is free to correct me.