The Bitcoin thread
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(04-10-2014 07:00 PM)JJ Roberts Wrote:(04-10-2014 06:44 PM)el mechanico Wrote: 350! Damn
Aint gone below 357
With the greatest possible respect to those Bulls in the thread who were thinking of getting involved, DO NOT PUT ANY MORE OF YOUR MONEY INTO BITCOINS. For those already holding Bitcoins, STOP TRADING NOW. STOP LOSS. CUT YOUR LOSSES NOW.
Gentlemen, please, I am not trying to be a smart arse, I am simply trying to save you from taking a financial kicking and losing all your money.
The charts show clear and relentless one-way momentum over a period of months...down. It looks like Bitcoins are a terrible investment and I'm really doubting that the price is ever coming back.
I fear the price is going to crash and its never coming back. I think it's going to bottom out at below $US 100.
(04-10-2014 10:30 PM)zarzuelazen Wrote: The charts show clear and relentless one-way momentum over a period of months...down. It looks like Bitcoins are a terrible investment and I'm really doubting that the price is ever coming back.
Look at the price one year ago. Today vs today one year ago.
100% gain.
(04-10-2014 10:30 PM)zarzuelazen Wrote: I fear the price is going to crash and its never coming back. I think it's going to bottom out at below $US 100.
I really hope it does go down to 100. I should have bought into BTC 18 months ago when it was 100. My mistake.
I will be buying a LOT of BTC if goes down to 100.
I will be buying when people are panic selling and selling when gold rush greed pushes the price up to a level that is not sustainable in the months that follow.
PS dont worry about me losing my "life savings" I won't be investing more than 1 percent of my total net worth into BTC.
Next 8 days are going to be bearish.
After that we will see.
^ this. doing what others don't. Thats how you make money.
Have just watched a 50 dollars upwards surge happen on bitstamp in the last few hours alone and the order book has shifted and is showing a ridiculous amount of buyers flooding in compared to sellers.
Interesting...
Interesting...
JayJuanGee · 2014-04-10 23:46:00 · #1585
(04-10-2014 10:30 PM)zarzuelazen Wrote:(04-10-2014 07:00 PM)JJ Roberts Wrote:(04-10-2014 06:44 PM)el mechanico Wrote: 350! Damn
Aint gone below 357
With the greatest possible respect to those Bulls in the thread who were thinking of getting involved, DO NOT PUT ANY MORE OF YOUR MONEY INTO BITCOINS. For those already holding Bitcoins, STOP TRADING NOW. STOP LOSS. CUT YOUR LOSSES NOW.
Gentlemen, please, I am not trying to be a smart arse, I am simply trying to save you from taking a financial kicking and losing all your money.
The charts show clear and relentless one-way momentum over a period of months...down. It looks like Bitcoins are a terrible investment and I'm really doubting that the price is ever coming back.
I fear the price is going to crash and its never coming back. I think it's going to bottom out at below $US 100.
First: Keep in mind that I am trying to be polite in my response to you, and I realize you chimed in on this thread a few times in the past... with similar kinds of comments.
Second: How do you know the price direction of bitcoin or its future anymore than any other guys reading or participating in bitcoin or this thread? Have you read the thread? Are you invested in bitcoin? what about other investments? how do you know the fundamentals of bitcoin as compared with anything else?
Third: Do you know the various personal factors about guys reading this thread and participating in bitcoin in order to advise them how to invest (especially regarding bitcoin) - for example risk tolerance, diversification of financial assets, financial goals (short-term, long -term)?
Fourth: Do you really believe that your statement is helpful in any kind of way to the direction of this thread? ok.. you believe that the sky is falling... so fucking what (woops my nice guy slipped a little bit)? we are adults, here, no? So if you end up being correct about the direction of bitcoin (probably NOT, but possible), then later down the road you can tell us "I told you so?" o.k. so what? Are you telling us anything different from what we could find if we were to google bitcoin and read what the mass media is saying about bitcorn or bitcom?
I will leave it at that, for now.
Quote:Second: How do you know the price direction of bitcoin or its future anymore than any other guys reading or participating in bitcoin or this thread? Have you read the thread? Are you invested in bitcoin? what about other investments? how do you know the fundamentals of bitcoin as compared with anything else?
The question is, what is going to stop this sustained downward momentum? It's all bad news, where's the good news? Seems to me, we need some good news to break out of this down-hill slide. Personally, I do hold a small amount of bitcoin but not much. A few months back I decided to wait and see what happened before getting involved, I was holding back, which proved to be a wise decision. I actually like the idea of Bitcoin and wanted to seriously invest, but so far I still don't see a good entry point.
Quote:Third: Do you know the various personal factors about guys reading this thread and participating in bitcoin in order to advise them how to invest (especially regarding bitcoin) - for example risk tolerance, diversification of financial assets, financial goals (short-term, long -term)?
Well of course, everyone needs to make their own judgements based on their own situation and the facts as they see it, but how it is working out for you so far? From what I can see in the history of this this thread, you keep saying that the price is cheap and its a good buy, only for the price to keep falling. JJ keeps saying that a solid support level has been reached, only for the price to keep falling through.
Quote:Fourth: Do you really believe that your statement is helpful in any kind of way to the direction of this thread? ok.. you believe that the sky is falling... so fucking what (woops my nice guy slipped a little bit)? we are adults, here, no? So if you end up being correct about the direction of bitcoin (probably NOT, but possible), then later down the road you can tell us "I told you so?" o.k. so what? Are you telling us anything different from what we could find if we were to google bitcoin and read what the mass media is saying about bitcorn or bitcom?
Well, unfortunately, looking at the history of this thread again, who has the best track-record so far? It looks to me that unfortunately, the pessimistic scenario I outlined earlier is what's happing,...a fairly catastrophic sustained price crash.
JayJuanGee · 2014-04-11 02:51:00 · #1587
I appreciate your responding in quite a bit of detail, even though I largely disagree with a lot of your points. And, you skipped several of my questions, but you seemed to have attempted to answer a large majority of them…. so I thank you for that. I disagree with you mostly because it seems to me that you are coming in this thread with an art thou holier than thou approach to advise us what is supposedly good for us, and I doubt you give a shit about us except to try to suggest that we shouldn't be involved in this bitcoin thing-a-ma-jiggy.
You are NOT really investing in the thread in terms of providing details about yourself and only just seem to be attempting to pick us apart to suggest that we are not too bright for investing in bitcoin. Many of us know the various risks of investing in bitcoin and have discussed and disclosed some of our concerns about several of these various risks.
I’ll respond briefly to several of your points.
This is NOT completely unexpected to have bad news and complications regarding bitcoin, and variations of bad news and challenges has been a part of bitcoin’s history. Surely there is a lot going on including manipulation of prices etc, but many guys are already aware of a lot of these challenges to bitcoin.
If you are selectively looking at bitcoin from any time after late November 2013 to present, you are going to find a downward trend. But pick any time prior to early November 2013 to present and you will see an upward trend. Bitcoin is much more complex than a product of the last few months’s price performance.
There is plenty of good news and plenty to stop the downward momentum of the bitcoin price, and a large number of these arguments have been made by me and several other posters in this thread concerning fundamentals, network, infrastructure, block chain, etc, etc.. I do NOT need to get into arguing these various fundamentals when you are making statements to suggest that these kinds of positive fundamentals do not exist. IN essence, you are NOT engaging in credible arguments when you are being so superficial and selective about your depiction of the current status and the direction of bitcoin.
That does give you some additional credibility to be someone who has at least dabbled into ownership. That way your experiences are more concrete.
I would have thought that today would have been a great entry point, but there are a lot of good entry points, depending on your time-line and your investment strategies. If you are looking for only an upward trajectory, then maybe you are considering inveting in the wrong asset and maybe for the wrong reasons. Even though bitcoin may not be good for you, does NOT mean that bitcoin may NOT be good for some other RVF members.
It is working out fine for me. I have been fairly detailed in disclosing a lot about my investment strategy and reasons behind my getting involved and I provide quite a few disclosures from time to time. Bitcoin is a small part of my overall investment portfolio.. but it definitely is an asset class that is much different from my previous experiences because I never had access to 24/7 monitoriing of an asset, and so that has created a new dynamic for me.
Sure it is fair that I have been saying that prices are cheap at any point below $1,000, and yes, the price has mostly kept falling during that period… true. I have continued to buy while the price has been falling that has been my planned strategy that I have somewhat tweaked since I started.. but mostly I buy as the price falls.
So what? None of us claims to be experts, and each of us is expecting the BTC price to go up and likely to go up quite rapidly, which is yet to be seen. I expected to be in bitcoin for at least a couple of years, absent some major change to the fundamentals of bitcoin, and my time in bitcoin has been less than 5 months.
Generally speaking, in this thread, we are NOT competing with each other about who is right and who is wrong. Surely, there is some of that going on, but to a large part, we are sharing information with each other in order that guys can come to better decisions about what is good for himselves. If you are correct with your prediction, then good for you, and so now you want to continue to predict that bitcoin prices are going to continue to go down. You have said your piece, and so other guys are predicting or at least hoping that you are wrong about that.
I continue to doubt that your general prediction is very helpful for guys to make a more informed decision, yet if you want to continue to share some of your particulars about your buying decision, I am sure that several guys would be more than willing to provide suggestions, in the event that you are willing to interact or maybe to follow through with some kind of action besides just saying you don’t know about when to get in. If you want to get in, then no time like the present and figuring out some price points that you are aiming for. Though you already told everyone to get out, so that would be an internal inconsistency, so really, I do NOT know what to suggest for you besides maybe learning a bit more about the various positive aspects of bitcoin and reconsidering your earlier contrary view.
You are NOT really investing in the thread in terms of providing details about yourself and only just seem to be attempting to pick us apart to suggest that we are not too bright for investing in bitcoin. Many of us know the various risks of investing in bitcoin and have discussed and disclosed some of our concerns about several of these various risks.
I’ll respond briefly to several of your points.
(04-11-2014 01:50 AM)zarzuelazen Wrote: The question is, what is going to stop this sustained downward momentum? It's all bad news, where's the good news?
This is NOT completely unexpected to have bad news and complications regarding bitcoin, and variations of bad news and challenges has been a part of bitcoin’s history. Surely there is a lot going on including manipulation of prices etc, but many guys are already aware of a lot of these challenges to bitcoin.
If you are selectively looking at bitcoin from any time after late November 2013 to present, you are going to find a downward trend. But pick any time prior to early November 2013 to present and you will see an upward trend. Bitcoin is much more complex than a product of the last few months’s price performance.
There is plenty of good news and plenty to stop the downward momentum of the bitcoin price, and a large number of these arguments have been made by me and several other posters in this thread concerning fundamentals, network, infrastructure, block chain, etc, etc.. I do NOT need to get into arguing these various fundamentals when you are making statements to suggest that these kinds of positive fundamentals do not exist. IN essence, you are NOT engaging in credible arguments when you are being so superficial and selective about your depiction of the current status and the direction of bitcoin.
(04-11-2014 01:50 AM)zarzuelazen Wrote: Seems to me, we need some good news to break out of this down-hill slide.NONE of us have ever claimed to be experts in predicting the short term ups and downs of bitcoin or the overall negative direction since late November 2013. There is plenty of good news, if you were to open your eyes to such various bitcoin developments.
(04-11-2014 01:50 AM)zarzuelazen Wrote: Personally, I do hold a small amount of bitcoin but not much. A few months back I decided to wait and see what happened before getting involved, I was holding back, which proved to be a wise decision. I actually like the idea of Bitcoin and wanted to seriously invest, but so far I still don't see a good entry point.
That does give you some additional credibility to be someone who has at least dabbled into ownership. That way your experiences are more concrete.
I would have thought that today would have been a great entry point, but there are a lot of good entry points, depending on your time-line and your investment strategies. If you are looking for only an upward trajectory, then maybe you are considering inveting in the wrong asset and maybe for the wrong reasons. Even though bitcoin may not be good for you, does NOT mean that bitcoin may NOT be good for some other RVF members.
(04-11-2014 01:50 AM)zarzuelazen Wrote: Well of course, everyone needs to make their own judgements based on their own situation and the facts as they see it, but how it is working out for you so far?
It is working out fine for me. I have been fairly detailed in disclosing a lot about my investment strategy and reasons behind my getting involved and I provide quite a few disclosures from time to time. Bitcoin is a small part of my overall investment portfolio.. but it definitely is an asset class that is much different from my previous experiences because I never had access to 24/7 monitoriing of an asset, and so that has created a new dynamic for me.
(04-11-2014 01:50 AM)zarzuelazen Wrote: From what I can see in the history of this this thread, you keep saying that the price is cheap and its a good buy, only for the price to keep falling.
Sure it is fair that I have been saying that prices are cheap at any point below $1,000, and yes, the price has mostly kept falling during that period… true. I have continued to buy while the price has been falling that has been my planned strategy that I have somewhat tweaked since I started.. but mostly I buy as the price falls.
(04-11-2014 01:50 AM)zarzuelazen Wrote: JJ keeps saying that a solid support level has been reached, only for the price to keep falling through.
So what? None of us claims to be experts, and each of us is expecting the BTC price to go up and likely to go up quite rapidly, which is yet to be seen. I expected to be in bitcoin for at least a couple of years, absent some major change to the fundamentals of bitcoin, and my time in bitcoin has been less than 5 months.
(04-11-2014 01:50 AM)zarzuelazen Wrote: Well, unfortunately, looking at the history of this thread again, who has the best track-record so far? It looks to me that unfortunately, the pessimistic scenario I outlined earlier is what's happing,...a fairly catastrophic sustained price crash.
Generally speaking, in this thread, we are NOT competing with each other about who is right and who is wrong. Surely, there is some of that going on, but to a large part, we are sharing information with each other in order that guys can come to better decisions about what is good for himselves. If you are correct with your prediction, then good for you, and so now you want to continue to predict that bitcoin prices are going to continue to go down. You have said your piece, and so other guys are predicting or at least hoping that you are wrong about that.
I continue to doubt that your general prediction is very helpful for guys to make a more informed decision, yet if you want to continue to share some of your particulars about your buying decision, I am sure that several guys would be more than willing to provide suggestions, in the event that you are willing to interact or maybe to follow through with some kind of action besides just saying you don’t know about when to get in. If you want to get in, then no time like the present and figuring out some price points that you are aiming for. Though you already told everyone to get out, so that would be an internal inconsistency, so really, I do NOT know what to suggest for you besides maybe learning a bit more about the various positive aspects of bitcoin and reconsidering your earlier contrary view.
(04-11-2014 01:50 AM)zarzuelazen Wrote: JJ keeps saying that a solid support level has been reached, only for the price to keep falling through.
No I keep saying that the "next" support level has been reached.
If you dont know what that means in terms of chart based trading and taking advantage of panic sellers then its not my job to educate you.
Personally I have been pecking away by buying BTC at every down swing with a view to taking advantage of the volatility.
I will be selling at the frothy heights of fervour too.
Calling next support levels is never about predicting a "bottom".
Catching falling knives is not the business here.
Taking advantage of the swings is.
Espresso · 2014-04-11 03:54:00 · #1589
Price of bitcoin dropping:
![[Image: 2bVRHRX.jpg]](http://i.imgur.com/2bVRHRX.jpg)
(04-11-2014 01:50 AM)zarzuelazen Wrote: It's all bad news, where's the good news?
where to start... since you are apparently being very superficial in your research, here is some superficial good news
http://time.com/56738/bitcoin-atm-comes-...itol-hill/
http://www.cnbc.com/id/101571751
Quote:Legg Mason's Bill Miller may have lost 20 percent of his investment in bitcoin, but he's still bullish on its potential. The money manager told CNBC on Thursday he bought into the cryptocurrency after its biggest exchange, Mt.Gox, collapsed earlier this year.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Miller_(finance)
http://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2014/04/0...t-settles/
http://blogs.wsj.com/moneybeat/2014/04/0...-decision/
Congressmen willing to introduce bills for better regulations
http://www.businessinsider.com/bitcoin-v...rge-2014-4
Quote:Even before this moment, venture capital groups had invested at least $134 million in Bitcoin-related firms and services, according to a report from the Aite Group. As of March 17, North American VC firms had banked a total of $98.6 million in Bitcoin-related projects.
http://www.coindesk.com/french-retail-ch...ents-year/
Quote:Major French retail chain Monoprix is making plans to start accepting bitcoin payments on its merchant website this year, according to the company’s director of e-commerce, Patrick Oualid.
http://blogs.marketwatch.com/thetell/201...ipe-moves/
Stripe and Square, two of the biggest players in the innovative payment industry slowly bringing Bitcoin along
http://www.bizjournals.com/atlanta/blog/...m-ttv.html
Quote:Atlanta-based Bitcoin services company BitPay is said to be raising a massive Series A — which one source estimates at $30 million.
That took 5 minute. BTW Coinmap just passed 4000 in bitcoin-accepting merchants.
EVERY single metric is going up, hash rate of the network, adoption. The price should follow when the market gets out of this bear/consolidation phase.
username · 2014-04-11 09:10:00 · #1591
Price is around $420 after a low of $350 yesterday, I had my finger on the trigger but didn't do it... that was really dumb.
strengthstudent · 2014-04-11 10:03:00 · #1592
(04-11-2014 09:10 AM)username Wrote: Price is around $420 after a low of $350 yesterday, I had my finger on the trigger but didn't do it... that was really dumb.
I missed it as well. My bank transfer to kraken wasn't fast enough(takes usually DAYS).
China is once again causing turmoil. Banning and not banning and banning and not banning Bitcoin. I hope the CEO of Bitcoin or CEO of internet would stop this. In reality, I don't really mind this, panic people panic, I am chilling. Although this is not good news, it is at least causing good publicity. Some new folks jump on the bitcoin train due to 'cheap' Bitcoins and once you jump on the wagon - you usually become a believer or fanatic which are the best kind for bitcoin adoption
(04-11-2014 10:03 AM)strengthstudent Wrote: I hope the CEO of Bitcoin or CEO of internet would stop this.
The CEO of Bitcoin would stop this if only the CEO of email would let him.
I bought a little at 360 and 4 times as much at 350 yesterday so seeing a 15% upswing in a matter of hours is quite nice
JayJuanGee · 2014-04-11 12:11:00 · #1594
(04-11-2014 09:10 AM)username Wrote: Price is around $420 after a low of $350 yesterday, I had my finger on the trigger but didn't do it... that was really dumb.
Yeah, I can relate. The price low pints come fairly quickly, and at some point we have to settle for good enough and have the conviction of just clicking buy.
Frequently, I cannot figure out the bottom, exactly, and I am buying on the way down. By the time we get to the bottom, I am running out of fiat, so I may be too conservative in the amount that I buy at that point.. also considering the price may keep going down and I want more fiat for that.
I keep hoping some day this problem of running out of fiat will be solved for me by bitcoin price increases, and I may NOT feel any need to continue to buy on the way down... and only buy during very large dire hype events
(04-11-2014 12:11 PM)JayJuanGee Wrote: Yeah, I can relate. The price low points come fairly quickly
They go fairly quickly too.
I don't think buying at the "absolute bottom" is a realistic goal to focus on.
Bitcoin has no absolutely bottom price other than 0.
Sure it is possible that bitcoin will NEVER see a price as low as 350 again and if that happens then I will pat myself on the back for buying at the bottom but the only people who buy at the bottom are the ones that are focusing on establishing good trading positions.
Buy the dips when the dips are based on FUD and not on any fault with bitcoin the protocol / technology itself.
Buy when a bitcoin related company fucks up like mtgox because this again has nothing to do with the value and viability bitcoin itself.
Establish good trading points and as long as you always sell higher than where you bought you are quids in.
Buy when people are panicking (for reasons not related to bitcoin the protocol / technology itself) and sell when there is a silly amount of irrational exuberance.
YoungBlood · 2014-04-11 14:51:00 · #1596
Bitcoin is a pump and dump scheme.
It's worth mentioning that bitcoin doesn't allow the government or banks any real control. For this reason, they will most likely find their own version to create and implement in the near future.
Bitcoin had its chance when the mainstream media caught onto it and was soaring in the 1,000s. Even with all that hype, it still came crashing down at an alarming rate by one story. It's just too volatile because, as Warren Buffet put it, "It has no intrinsic value." See for yourself:
The only real winners here are those who mined the coins when it was below 1 cent and sold in the 1,000s.
With all that being said, i highly doubt it will ever reach the thousands again but we'll see come April 15th and thereafter.
It's worth mentioning that bitcoin doesn't allow the government or banks any real control. For this reason, they will most likely find their own version to create and implement in the near future.
Bitcoin had its chance when the mainstream media caught onto it and was soaring in the 1,000s. Even with all that hype, it still came crashing down at an alarming rate by one story. It's just too volatile because, as Warren Buffet put it, "It has no intrinsic value." See for yourself:
The only real winners here are those who mined the coins when it was below 1 cent and sold in the 1,000s.
With all that being said, i highly doubt it will ever reach the thousands again but we'll see come April 15th and thereafter.
strengthstudent · 2014-04-11 15:05:00 · #1598
I don't get that "intrinsic value" bullshit. How useful gold was before the modern age? Mostly used in fancy plates and jewelery aka not very useful and for 99.9% of the folks not worth the gold. Gold wasn't used for thousands of years because of its intrinsic value but because it is scarce and shiny. Fiat currency doesn't have any other intrinsic value than the fact that it is backed by governments as 'official' currency.
Warren Buffet doesn't really understand Bitcoin, he thinks it just like normal electronic transfer but a bit faster when in fact it is much more. The more you understand Bitcoin, the more amazing you see the technology.
Warren Buffet doesn't really understand Bitcoin, he thinks it just like normal electronic transfer but a bit faster when in fact it is much more. The more you understand Bitcoin, the more amazing you see the technology.
(04-11-2014 03:05 PM)strengthstudent Wrote: I don't get that "intrinsic value" bullshit. How useful gold was before the modern age?
Gold became valuable due to it's integrity which is maintained by its chemical composition (doesn't rust with time, its heavy which makes it hard to steal, its a soft metal which is easily cut into smaller pieces) and because its rare
Bitcoin became valuable due to it's integrity which is maintained by cryptography (can't be forged, can't be double spent, easily divided into smaller pieces) and because its rare
People gained gold by mining
People gained bitcoin by mining
How people fail to see the similarities is amazing
The difference is that you can't send a piece of gold to the other side of the world in the blink of an eye
(04-11-2014 02:51 PM)YoungBlood Wrote: Bitcoin is a pump and dump scheme.
It's worth mentioning that bitcoin doesn't allow the government or banks any real control. For this reason, they will most likely find their own version to create and implement in the near future.
Bitcoin had its chance when the mainstream media caught onto it and was soaring in the 1,000s. Even with all that hype, it still came crashing down at an alarming rate by one story. It's just too volatile because, as Warren Buffet put it, "It has no intrinsic value." See for yourself:
The only real winners here are those who mined the coins when it was below 1 cent and sold in the 1,000s.
With all that being said, i highly doubt it will ever reach the thousands again but we'll see come April 15th and thereafter.
I didn't see Ponzi scheme ?
![[Image: mjlol.png]](http://www.thecoli.com/styles/default/xenforo/smilies/mjlol.png)
you were wrong by your second sentence
you lack blatant technical understanding of the bitcoin technology
if you think mainstream media is finished with Bitcoin you're in for a long, long ride
It has more intrinsic value than the whole fucking financial market your economy is based on.
But we'll get through people like you anyway. Because there are people smarter than you are that are gonna make you use Bitcoin, without you ever realizing it.
Warren Buffet doesn't understand technology. He's a legend at what he does. But he admitted himself he has no idea how to value tech stocks like Google and what not. His analogy with cheques is ridiculous. If there were 21 million cheques in the world and they were reusable, capable of being transmitted anywhere in the world instantly with little fees, they'd be worth their ounce of gold.
FrenchCanadian · 2014-04-11 15:19:00 · #1601
(04-11-2014 03:05 PM)strengthstudent Wrote: The more you OWN Bitcoin, the more amazing you see the technology.
QFT
Gold has been money for over 4000 years
the intrinsic value consists of non trading value, its one of the feature that is required for something to become money.
The intrinsic value of something adds a safeguard (meaning it can be used for other things than trading)
Gold is used in a wide range of things.
instrinsic trustless exchange
that's more intrinsic value than gold right there
that's more intrinsic value than gold right there
Espresso · 2014-04-11 16:51:00 · #1603
(04-11-2014 04:51 PM)Espresso Wrote: Did Warren Buffet just compare bitcoin to cheques?? And seemed quite pleased with himself at his 'clever' analogy?
Funny how the people who are negative on bitcoin only fall into two categories
1) Those who don't understand it
2) Those who's jobs are threatened by it
JayJuanGee · 2014-04-11 17:48:00 · #1605
(04-11-2014 02:51 PM)YoungBlood Wrote: Bitcoin is a pump and dump scheme.
I must say, you are NOT introducing yourself to this thread with much credibility, especially, if you start out with a comment like that. Raises red flags that you do NOT know what the fuck you are talking about b/c you are throwing in some apparent mainstream observation with little to no backing and according suggesting that the claim is true... or that you are enlightening us in some way.
There are 65 pages here. Did you bother to read any of them? Did you bother to consider that some guys here may already be fairly informed about bitcoin? Did you figure that you were going to shed light on some concept that we have NOT yet considered?
You can make that "pump and dump" claim about almost any asset, investment or commodity that is fairly newly traded and has an uncertain future, yet even though there is some apparent truth to the claim, such a claim is NOT borne out by the facts about bitcoin.. but apparently, you did NOT know that - otherwise, maybe you would have started out your posting a little differently.
(04-11-2014 02:51 PM)YoungBlood Wrote: It's worth mentioning that bitcoin doesn't allow the government or banks any real control. For this reason, they will most likely find their own version to create and implement in the near future.
Actually, it would probably be pretty clever of a government or any government to attempt this….. but it seems very unlikely that any major government is going to attempt this in the near future. Part of the reason they are NOT going to attempt this strategy is because they are too big and arrogant to consider bitcoin as either a threat or a meaningful innovation that they should adopt. Now, a few years down the road, some major government may attempt such competition; however, they are more likely to attempt to defeat bitcoin by regulating it out of existence or engaging in other attack tactics first. By the time they figure out a good and decent strategy to create a competitor, likely it will be too late.
Regardless of all of this, you are speculating about something that is NOT in the works, and NOT in the short-term cards. Accordingly, we can consider and/or cross that bridge if it comes. .. much down the road.. which should NOT necessarily affect what we are doing today.
(04-11-2014 02:51 PM)YoungBlood Wrote: Bitcoin had its chance when the mainstream media caught onto it and was soaring in the 1,000s. Even with all that hype, it still came crashing down at an alarming rate by one story.
You really appear to be talking out of your ass and you seem to NOT know what the fuck you are talking about, and part of the problem is that you are projecting an image of bitcoin that is based on a very short term viewpoint. Please put this in perspective, and give us a little context.
Surely NONE of us really know whether bitcoin will every make $1,000 again, even though several of us who are invested into bitcoin believe that it is pretty likely to hit that price again soon, absent some flaws to the fundamentals of bitcoin. Bitcoin’s fundamentals have NOT been found to have any major or significant flaws. Accordingly, there are going to continue to be some battles that affect the price both upward and downward, but if you are saying with absoluteness that bitcoin will NOT reach $1,000 again, you are again projecting way too much certainty into a situation that is NOT completely knowable.. NOT by you or anyone else.
You are correct that it is possible that bitcoin will never see $450 again and $1,000 is less probable than $450. On the other hand, it is possible that BTC will reach $1,000 within one to two weeks (not too likely but possible), and it is also possible that it could take several months or even a year or more to reach $1,000. I am NOT going to belabor the point, except just to reiterate that NONE of this is black and white, and your tone is surely irritating when you come into this thread and suggest that you have some crystal ball vision that the situation is black and white and you know the answer.
(04-11-2014 02:51 PM)YoungBlood Wrote: It's just too volatile because, as Warren Buffet put it, "It has no intrinsic value."
So you are citing Warren Buffet? That’s profound. Surely, I have quite a bit of respect for Warren Buffet for several reasons; however, his claims about bitcoin are truly NOT something to rely upon.
Part of the reason that Warren Buffet is so wealthy is likely because he does NOT show his hand, and then once he is “in” something, he will let people know that he is “in” – then the asset skyrockets, and and good ole Warren gets out. So Warren’s comments about bitcoin mostly tell us that he is NOT “in,” yet. Bitcoin may be too small potatoes for Buffet because he can make a lot of money in other ways because of the enormity of his already existing wealth. But if Bitcoin were to become bigger, like a 100 billion or maybe a trillion dollar market cap and maybe at such a time,he may be interested in getting in… I kind of doubt bitcoin will be within his direct interest at any point in the near future.. but who knows, he could play a little bit of it on the sides or have one of his affiliates play bitcoin on the sides. He may NOT disclose his cards in that regard, but I would NOT trust what he says about the direction of bitcoin.
(04-11-2014 02:51 PM)YoungBlood Wrote: The only real winners here are those who mined the coins when it was below 1 cent and sold in the 1,000s.
You are saying some fucked up shit if you are suggesting that the only way to profit off of something is to have a 100,000 times return. That is nearly unheard of –even though it has happened in bitcoin, as you alluded to. A lot more people can profit even if they get 1-2% returns (better than a saving account), and there are chances to lose 100% or to gain several times your investment… even though 100,000 times is likely NOT too possible at this point in time and certainly not very likely to occur in the next few years… because bitcoin is more mature than it was during its initial couple of years.