Post: #1

If you want to be happy in the US, don't leave it. A lot of guys on here will tell you to go to South America, Europe, and Asia because the women are so much nicer but what do you think will happen when you return? You will be forever discontented with the women here and then what? You will be forever unhappy. The worse thing I ever did was living in Brazil and Europe. Now, it takes a tremendous effort to put up with American women. I can barely tolerate them.

There is an old saying: ignorance is bliss and it's very true. My friends that have never left this country are much happier than I am. Because this is all they know! So really, don't travel and meet foreign women, sure it will be fun while you are there but you are going to be miserable once you come back. And since you will have to live most of your life here you might as well never know what exist elsewhere because then you will just be unhappy. That knowledge that there are better women out there will forever keep you in a state of discontentment. So before you rush off to those foreign countries with their feminine women, think really hard about it. Because I can tell you, there have been many a times, I wish I had never gone and had just remained ignorant but some happy with my lot here.

There is another saying - about Brazil: there are two kinds of men, those dreaming of going there and those dreaming of returning. I was the first and now I am the second. But even Brazil is changing...

Post: #2

Is it really that hard to be happy in America? I tend to believe that happiness is largely internal. That is, if you are mentally healthy and determined to actually be happy, you will find happiness almost anywhere. And if you're just a miserable person, you won't even be happy in the best of circumstances.

As for America, it may not be the best, but it's far from the worst. The thing about America is that you are constantly being bombarded with lots and lots of choice. That can make some people very unhappy, because they're constantly worried about making the wrong choices. However, once you've developed the discipline to not worry about that sort of thing and focus on getting what you want, the overabundance of choice can work in your favor. This extends to the female situation. In a country of over 300 million people, there are certainly lots of women who have what you are looking for. The problem is in weeding through all the ones that don't. Even that can be pleasurable, however, if you approach it with the right mindset.

Post: #3

Nomad,

PM'd you something.

Small solace, but hey.

Post: #4

Ultimately, we each have to choose. This I am writing this in hindsight. As humans once we experience better, a better life, a better job, whatever, it's very difficult to forget this. We always compare our current lot in life with what we have experienced before and this can be a source of great discontentment and unhappiness. Depending on your personality, this may be easier to live with.

America is certainly better than other places BUT it's also worse than others. When it comes to women, it's a definitely in the low end of the scale for me. I don't know a single guy who actually likes plowing through hundreds of women just to find one half decent/half sane one. I certainly don't, it wears you down. In the end, happiness is relative to what you have experienced. Everything in life is for that matter. Reminds me of an interview Roosh did recently of this guy that went to EU for three months. At the end of the interview he goes: I am dreading having to go on a date with an American girl again.

Post: #5

Live in America, stack american dollars, go to the gym, enjoy top-notch food, AND SWOOP FOREIGN GIRLS.

I like you Nomad, but you gotta just go outdoors more often and enjoy life. ; ).

Post: #6

Well, I appreciate that DVY But I will admit a big part of the problem for me, is that I did not grow up in America. I believe if you grew up here, it's much easier to understand and be a part of the culture. I actually grew up in South America and Europe and because of this I always feel like an outsider here in the US. I never quite fit in...always difficult to really connect with American girls...

PS It's too hot to go outside here in Miami unless I am going for a swim.

Post: #7

Aha! Miami. That makes more sense. Miami, and Florida in general, seems like the kind of place where you really have to turn your brain off to have a good time. And for some people that's just not easy.

There are lots of other places in the States where 40 year olds don't try really hard to look like 14 year olds and where people are down to earth and friendly. If you can't outright move to those places, you can take weekend trips there. New Orleans for one is a good example. I've been to NOLA a handful of times and always found the locals to be very friendly and approachable. Very little attitude. Also, Miami is the hub for Latin America, so that makes escapes that much easier.

Post: #8

Yep, I would have to agree with that. Miami is one of the worse larger cities in the US. The only good things about it is the weather in the winter and the foreign tourist. All of the crazy people from the rest of the country seem to flow down to here. One guy from the forum recently left because he couldn't take it anymore.

Post: #9

(10-11-2013 09:45 AM)Nomad77 Wrote:  A lot of guys on here will tell you to go to South America, Europe, and Asia because the women are so much nicer but what do you think will happen when you return? You will be forever discontented with the women here and then what? You will be forever unhappy.

Wait...who says you have to return to the US?

I like the way Seth Godin put it when he said "Instead of wondering when your next vacation is, maybe you should set up a life you don't need to escape from."

Look at Roosh and many of the members on this forum. They created lifestyle businesses that give them financial and location independence. Now they don't have to put up with American girls, American taxes (sort of) and the disintegrating culture that makes you want to fucking kill yourself because it's so perverse, politically correct and depressing.

What you're saying is "don't even bother seeking greener pastures because you'll eventually have to come back to your shithole." Except that nobody is forcing you to stay in your country. If you want to leave, leave. Who says you should stay and "learn to like it"? Fuck that.

I came to Thailand on a one way ticket 9 months ago, right after being laid off from a great job. I had almost no money in the bank. I didn't know a soul in Thailand or a word of Thai. All I had with me was a laptop and some clothing.

I stayed in disgusting hostels for months, desperately scrambling for clients on the iffy WIFI connection, if there was one. I begged my contacts to let me do grunt work for them for $15/hr. There were days when I didn't have enough money to eat and I'd wander the streets at night because I didn't have $7 for a bed in some shitty dorm room.

Yeah, and now I have a thriving business with people banging down my email inbox and sending money to my paypal account unprompted just to lock me down. Oh, and I bang several new, young, beautiful, feminine Thai girls every week and I don't hear one peep of the obnoxious bullshit I heard from every fatty back in the US.

I'm not bragging. I have nothing to prove to anybody. I'm just so incredibly grateful to be living my life so beautifully after all that pain and struggle and uncertainty.

Sorry dude, I don't mean to be a dick. But what you're suggesting is conceding defeat, bending over, and taking it up the ass from a country that wants you to die a 1984-style death: incarcerated, all your assets seized and given to your slovenly ex-wife (who took the kids to raise them as nice gay boys), and you mumbling in a corner of your cell, with froth on your lips, "I deserve this...I deserve this..."

And I'll put a goddamn gun in my mouth before I let that happen and I find this whole notion of not eating the forbidden fruit perverse. You only have one life to live. So go to Asia, go to South America, go to Eastern Europe, and if you dig it, find a way to stay.

Post: #10

How many guys on this forum are living outside of the US? If it's more than 1% I would be in awe! You, me and Roosh are the exceptions The vast majority of men out there and on this forum, including all of my friends, won't be able to do this for one reason or another...

Post: #11

So. There are good sides and bad sides to living in America.

As Nomad77 mentioned earlier in this thread, by and large the women are low quality. That they are such an important part of a man's happiness shouldn't be discounted.

But the money here can be great. The poosy arbitrage that an American can leverage from living frugally and making good hustles can turn into a great life elsewhere, even permanently if you really get your shine on. First-world money with first-class girls? Sign me up.

Post: #12

That being said, that worry was central to my thoughts in my thread The Wroclaw Gambit. If you're happy eating cheeseburgers, you might not want to sample a steak...

Post: #13

I grew up in a different country, lived in another one, now live in the US. I've also traveled to over 20 countries including Brazil and Thailand. I wouldn't say I'm happy in the US, but I'm content. It's a big country and there's a lot to it. Besides, I may sound like a heretic here, not everybody defines his self worth by the number of women he has slept with. I'm ok if I have one girl who is not perfect, but nice enough. However, If I find myself not being able to get laid here at all, I'll leave the country. Not right away, but after careful planning.

Post: #14

(10-11-2013 09:45 AM)Nomad77 Wrote:  If you want to be happy in the US, don't leave it. A lot of guys on here will tell you to go to South America, Europe, and Asia because the women are so much nicer but what do you think will happen when you return? You will be forever discontented with the women here and then what? You will be forever unhappy. The worse thing I ever did was living in Brazil and Europe. Now, it takes a tremendous effort to put up with American women. I can barely tolerate them.

There is an old saying: ignorance is bliss and it's very true. My friends that have never left this country are much happier than I am. Because this is all they know! So really, don't travel and meet foreign women, sure it will be fun while you are there but you are going to be miserable once you come back. And since you will have to live most of your life here you might as well never know what exist elsewhere because then you will just be unhappy. That knowledge that there are better women out there will forever keep you in a state of discontentment. So before you rush off to those foreign countries with their feminine women, think really hard about it. Because I can tell you, there have been many a times, I wish I had never gone and had just remained ignorant but some happy with my lot here.

There is another saying - about Brazil: there are two kinds of men, those dreaming of going there and those dreaming of returning. I was the first and now I am the second. But even Brazil is changing...

I totally relate to this. I was recently saying on another thread how the red pill is effecting my overall happiness. I was a lot happier before I knew about all this stuff. Not saying I want to go back to being blue pill. And I couldn't anyway, once the cat's out of the bag, it ain't going back in and there's no returning.

The first time I ever heard about any of this stuff was from an uncle of mine that works on merchant ships. He's spent most his life overseas or at sea. He told me, "man, once you get used to dating Thai women you'll never even want to think of being with an American woman again. You'll see what I mean one day." This was years ago before I even started traveling. I just took it as a bunch of crazy talk. None of it made any sense to me then. Now I understand all too well what he's talking about.

(10-11-2013 01:42 PM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  

(10-11-2013 09:45 AM)Nomad77 Wrote:  A lot of guys on here will tell you to go to South America, Europe, and Asia because the women are so much nicer but what do you think will happen when you return? You will be forever discontented with the women here and then what? You will be forever unhappy.

Wait...who says you have to return to the US?

I like the way Seth Godin put it when he said "Instead of wondering when your next vacation is, maybe you should set up a life you don't need to escape from."

Look at Roosh and many of the members on this forum. They created lifestyle businesses that give them financial and location independence. Now they don't have to put up with American girls, American taxes (sort of) and the disintegrating culture that makes you want to fucking kill yourself because it's so perverse, politically correct and depressing.

What you're saying is "don't even bother seeking greener pastures because you'll eventually have to come back to your shithole." Except that nobody is forcing you to stay in your country. If you want to leave, leave. Who says you should stay and "learn to like it"? Fuck that.

I came to Thailand on a one way ticket 9 months ago, right after being laid off from a great job. I had almost no money in the bank. I didn't know a soul in Thailand or a word of Thai. All I had with me was a laptop and some clothing.

I stayed in disgusting hostels for months, desperately scrambling for clients on the iffy WIFI connection, if there was one. I begged my contacts to let me do grunt work for them for $15/hr. There were days when I didn't have enough money to eat and I'd wander the streets at night because I didn't have $7 for a bed in some shitty dorm room.

Yeah, and now I have a thriving business with people banging down my email inbox and sending money to my paypal account unprompted just to lock me down. Oh, and I bang several new, young, beautiful, feminine Thai girls every week and I don't hear one peep of the obnoxious bullshit I heard from every fatty back in the US.

I'm not bragging. I have nothing to prove to anybody. I'm just so incredibly grateful to be living my life so beautifully after all that pain and struggle and uncertainty.

Sorry dude, I don't mean to be a dick. But what you're suggesting is conceding defeat, bending over, and taking it up the ass from a country that wants you to die a 1984-style death: incarcerated, all your assets seized and given to your slovenly ex-wife (who took the kids to raise them as nice gay boys), and you mumbling in a corner of your cell, with froth on your lips, "I deserve this...I deserve this..."

And I'll put a goddamn gun in my mouth before I let that happen and I find this whole notion of not eating the forbidden fruit perverse. You only have one life to live. So go to Asia, go to South America, go to Eastern Europe, and if you dig it, find a way to stay.

Post: #15

Personally, I am going to be able to leave. For that matter, I am going to be leaving next year again but I don't see any of my friends doing that. Hell, it's hard enough just getting them to come visit me overseas. Every time I come back, I feel so sorry for them but sometimes I think if they are going to stay maybe it's better than they just remain ignorant...

Post: #16

Political issues and problems with women aside, one of the worst things about the U.S. for me is the fact that once everyone gets past college age and starts working, they pretty much just go to work and crash in front of the TV on their free time which is extremely isolating. Once you get to your mid to late 20s it's pretty much impossible to have close friends unless they're your co-workers. Everyone just kind of has their own little bubble and that's it.

Even if you try to attend bullshit like networking or singles events it seems like the interaction is really forced and everyone is just trying to manipulate each other or show off how much better they are.

Post: #17

Yep, it's called working for the American dream.

Post: #18

I know it's the majority vote here but after being to 60+ countries I'd say the major US metro areas are pretty awesome! LA, NYC, MIA, SF, Austin, Boston are a league of their own not just for girls but other options in life. The rest of the country is pretty bad I agree. But what stops you from moving to say LA?

Post: #19

(10-12-2013 03:28 AM)Mumbojumbo Wrote:  I know it's the majority vote here but after being to 60+ countries I'd say the major US metro areas are pretty awesome! LA, NYC, MIA, SF, Austin, Boston are a league of their own not just for girls but other options in life. The rest of the country is pretty bad I agree. But what stops you from moving to say LA?

I agree with this statement. Austin was pretty cool. I think a guy can make America work but you're going to need to have your own little bubble where you don't let the rest of the messed up stuff get to you.

Post: #20

like a lot of things, what America has and does not have is a double-edged sword.

Tonight in Starbucks in my college town me, 50+ YO got a phone number from a 23 YO who's going to be a doctor. She agreed to go on a bike ride, I'd say the chances of her
showing are 1/3.

She's only a 6, but I saw some hot women, all with bright looking guys either loaded Asian students who probably have millionaire parents sending them here or athletic looking 23 year old American guys 6'3" +. I saw his 5'8" blond-blue GF looking up at him like a submissive puppy. Really hot 23 year old ( especially white) girls would look at me as if I was from Mars, I'm far older, fatter, shorter, less likely to be rich soon than these younger guys.

I work with musicians and engineers who like my music, and are some of the best available. My engineer records stuff with Hollywood stars EVERY ONE of you has heard of.
He does it for free because he sees a vision he likes.

The thing I am getting across is there are all sorts of people here DOING SHIT RIGHT, they are NOT JOKING, they are serious about doing things to be on a world class level.
You don't get that most places. Most places they are focusing more on their family and friends. It is viewed as foolish to exhaust yourself working Ukraine. What will you get for it?

You have to pick what environment you want depending on what you want to accomplish. Each has its pros and cons.

There is a lot of COMPETITION HERE, smart, creative, tall, buff guys with great careers on the way. But competition makes for superior, smarter collaborators if YOU want to do something extraordinary. It is very hard for most people to do something extraordinary on your own. Novelists are one of the only ones I can think of.

When people advertise a FULL TIME job, believe what they say: Your time will be FILLED by them. At least in the US if you have half a brain you can do that for 15-20 years and then NOT work FULL TIME.

But if you want to achieve something you can't do over a computer, something cultural or technical, America is often the single best place to be for THAT ASPECT of your life.
But the competition amongst the male "doers" means the women you get will generally be inferior.

Post: #21

(10-13-2013 12:52 AM)iknowexactly Wrote:  like a lot of things, what America has and does not have is a double-edged sword.

Tonight in Starbucks in my college town me, 50+ YO got a phone number from a 23 YO who's going to be a doctor. She agreed to go on a bike ride, I'd say the chances of her
showing are 1/3.

She's only a 6, but I saw some hot women, all with bright looking guys either loaded Asian students who probably have millionaire parents sending them here or athletic looking 23 year old American guys 6'3" +. I saw his 5'8" blond-blue GF looking up at him like a submissive puppy. Really hot 23 year old ( especially white) girls would look at me as if I was from Mars, I'm far older, fatter, shorter, less likely to be rich soon than these younger guys.

I work with musicians and engineers who like my music, and are some of the best available. My engineer records stuff with Hollywood stars EVERY ONE of you has heard of.
He does it for free because he sees a vision he likes.

The thing I am getting across is there are all sorts of people here DOING SHIT RIGHT, they are NOT JOKING, they are serious about doing things to be on a world class level.
You don't get that most places. Most places they are focusing more on their family and friends. It is viewed as foolish to exhaust yourself working Ukraine. What will you get for it?

You have to pick what environment you want depending on what you want to accomplish. Each has its pros and cons.

There is a lot of COMPETITION HERE, smart, creative, tall, buff guys with great careers on the way. But competition makes for superior, smarter collaborators if YOU want to do something extraordinary. It is very hard for most people to do something extraordinary on your own. Novelists are one of the only ones I can think of.

When people advertise a FULL TIME job, believe what they say: Your time will be FILLED by them. At least in the US if you have half a brain you can do that for 15-20 years and then NOT work FULL TIME.

But if you want to achieve something you can't do over a computer, something cultural or technical, America is often the single best place to be for THAT ASPECT of your life.
But the competition amongst the male "doers" means the women you get will generally be inferior.

Are you talking about Davis? I thought you were a Sac resident

Post: #22

(10-13-2013 12:52 AM)iknowexactly Wrote:  like a lot of things, what America has and does not have is a double-edged sword.

Tonight in Starbucks in my college town me, 50+ YO got a phone number from a 23 YO who's going to be a doctor. She agreed to go on a bike ride, I'd say the chances of her
showing are 1/3.

She's only a 6, but I saw some hot women, all with bright looking guys either loaded Asian students who probably have millionaire parents sending them here or athletic looking 23 year old American guys 6'3" +. I saw his 5'8" blond-blue GF looking up at him like a submissive puppy. Really hot 23 year old ( especially white) girls would look at me as if I was from Mars, I'm far older, fatter, shorter, less likely to be rich soon than these younger guys.

I work with musicians and engineers who like my music, and are some of the best available. My engineer records stuff with Hollywood stars EVERY ONE of you has heard of.
He does it for free because he sees a vision he likes.

The thing I am getting across is there are all sorts of people here DOING SHIT RIGHT, they are NOT JOKING, they are serious about doing things to be on a world class level.
You don't get that most places. Most places they are focusing more on their family and friends. It is viewed as foolish to exhaust yourself working Ukraine. What will you get for it?

You have to pick what environment you want depending on what you want to accomplish. Each has its pros and cons.

There is a lot of COMPETITION HERE, smart, creative, tall, buff guys with great careers on the way. But competition makes for superior, smarter collaborators if YOU want to do something extraordinary. It is very hard for most people to do something extraordinary on your own. Novelists are one of the only ones I can think of.

When people advertise a FULL TIME job, believe what they say: Your time will be FILLED by them. At least in the US if you have half a brain you can do that for 15-20 years and then NOT work FULL TIME.

But if you want to achieve something you can't do over a computer, something cultural or technical, America is often the single best place to be for THAT ASPECT of your life.
But the competition amongst the male "doers" means the women you get will generally be inferior.

Those are some really good observations. Competition in America is fierce. Just go to Silicon Valley and try to get a job (or a girl) if you don't believe it.

Among any of the competition that actually matters, you're up against very smart, driven, creative, fit, aggressive guys in the USA.

And your'e right about America taking business seriously. I do some business coaching here in Bangkok and I'm helping a training partner from my Jiu Jitsu academy set up a dropshipping business. His supplier can't be arsed to talk business with him and expand, even though it means a lot more money and name brand recognition in SEA. They're satisfied with their current profits and so why rock the boat? Doing business in Thailand can be a big fucking headache...

So it seems to me that it all comes down to, do you thrive in that kind of hyper competitive environment or not, and is competition necessarily a good thing, always?

For instance, if you go to SEA as a white guy, you'll be getting tons of pussy if you know what you're doing. It doesn't fall in your lap, you still have to hustle, but it's not like in the US where the whole business is like pulling teeth (for me, anyway).

Some people get off more on the egotistical reward of banging girls with a handicap (being in a loud club in America with poor ratios and guys ready to fight you at the drop of a hat) more than the actual banging of the girls.

Personally, I don't need to prove to myself what a great seducer I am (anymore) by stacking the deck against myself. I'd rather share the company of a sweet, honey skinned girl who makes my bed for me after I violate her mercilessly. No demands, no law suits, no vocal fry, no nothing (beyond inescapable, universal female B.S., of course).

Likewise, if you have an internet business, you don't have to work in an office and deliver results to a boss. YOU are the boss. So you are only accountable to yourself and your business friends. That means you have to learn to manage your time and energy wisely, otherwise you don't have bread on your table.

You have to learn expectation management and reputation management by underpromising and over delivering and helping other people grow THEIR businesses. As opposed to doing the bare minimum required of you to get your biweekly paycheck.

Some people are intrinsically motivated, and some people need a drill sergeant barking at them. It's a matter of personality, really. And one way of making ends meet, or scoring tail, is just as honorable as another. However, a salary is dangerous because it disincentivizes people, especially in large corporations and government institutions. It's similar to how getting in an exclusive LTR makes it unnecessary to stay sharp with your game.

So the whole America vs The Rest of The World thing is moot because everybody is a unique individual with incredibly unique personalities and motivations. I say, take a few trips, check it out for yourself and make up your own mind. Reading other people's experiences is just that, other people's experiences.

Post: #23

@VV and IKE... some great points you guys are making here.

Post: #24

(10-13-2013 02:06 AM)VincentVinturi Wrote:  Personally, I don't need to prove to myself what a great seducer I am (anymore) by stacking the deck against myself. I'd rather share the company of a sweet, honey skinned girl who makes my bed for me after I violate her mercilessly. No demands, no law suits, no vocal fry, no nothing (beyond inescapable, universal female B.S., of course).

To me, the vocal fry is extremely annoying. Actually I didn't know the name of that sound before I read this post and looked it up, but I have to listen to it at work pretty much every workday. I've never dated anybody with vocal fry and can't imagine doing it. Luckily where I live there are many girls who don't make this sound.

Post: #25

If you were born and grew up in America, you will understand and be able to relate to American women better. For example, that model I wrote about here /thread-28172.html This girl loves football, she talks about it all the time, want to watch the games etc. I don't know anything about football because I didn't grow up here. I also don't watch TV, she's got all these shows she watches and talks about, that I have no idea about. It really comes down to you and your personality. I don't fit into American culture so relating to the women is so much more difficult. I can relate to a non-English speaking European or South American girl better than I can to an American girl. So while Miami may be more difficult than other cities, for me, this is a US problem. Also, to me, even the attractive American girls I find unattractive because they are just so masculine. They may dress sexy but everything else about them is masculine.

But I think America is great for business - that's why I tell people, America is my office. Let me leave you with the words of wisdom from an old business man I met on a flight to Brazil once. He said: "In America business is easy but sex is difficult. In Brazil sex is easy but business is really difficult."