Post: #26

(08-03-2018 01:28 PM)TheFinalEpic Wrote:  Most men aren't cut out for the lifestyle. Plain and simple.

If you aren't on the level where you have an abundance mindset, where you understand that women are just looking for fun and experiences, you'll get chewed up and spit out. If you care too much, or place women on a pedestal, instead of treating them as a side dish to your life, you will have a rude awakening. Most guys will do anything for the almighty pussy, and men with "high SMV" are no exception.

And, speaking about playerdom, even "players" aren't in it for the long haul. Most can be in this game for a couple years, but the attrition rate in the player world is high. Navy SEAL drop out rates.

Most "players" begin to see friends and acquaintances getting married, having kids, etc. and start questioning what they are doing with their lives. You'll experience burnout due to all the shit that has already been mentioned in this thread, pettiness, dumb chicks, flakes, etc. and think that settling down is better. The relationship life looks pretty good, you only have to deal with her shit now, instead of 5 or 10 girls at a time, and you think she's pretty good. You weigh the pros and cons, the pros are more than the cons, and you leave the game for "greener pastures" as a spoken for man.

I see this lots, have experienced it myself, and realize that the game actually never ends, regardless of relationship status. High SMV men aren't immune to this, and frankly, most men that are exceptional in their respective fields are straight up betas when it comes to women.

I think every man that is a player had some sort of experience that made him that way. You either took the redpill early in life like I did (at age 15 due to dating a certified BPD chick), you had a lack of experience until later in life, and become a player to satisfy all your unsatisfied desires early on in life (many guys get into the lifestyle in their late 20's), or you have some other circumstance that made you that way. You have to actually want the lifestyle though. Even these circumstances won't keep you in the game long term.

The number of guys that are players in highschool and college is high. You play a sport or are in a band? Instant SMV, instant women. What you realize though, is that these guys are mostly betas that have women coming to them simply because their SMV is high due to athletics or interests. As soon as this SMV is gone, they end up shacking up shortly after they get out of school. I know dozens of these guys. They played baseball or hockey, and then once they don't go anywhere with it, they shack up with the hottest girl they can get, and start posting about how much they love her.

The number of guys that are players into their late 20's and early 30's is significantly lower. And, once you reach your mid 30's, you're talking like 1 in 500 that are actually good at it. The competition weeds itself out, because most people are going downhill instead of getting better as the years go on. By the time you're 40, you're going to be standing alone if you can keep yourself in shape, have solid finances, and have game.

You have to truly love women if you are going to be a player. You have to love them for all that they are, and understand that they are just acting in their nature with every action they do. Do most guys understand women? Nah son, most guys are pining on Instagram about how they would "drink her dirty bath water". The lack of understanding, the lack of actually loving women for being women is sky high. The thirst is also sky high, the confidence of even most high SMV men with women is low.

How many guys do you know that believe in "The One" or they shack up with any girl that will fuck them. Ask yourself how many guys do you know that have girls on multiple continents continually asking them when they'll next be in their country? My guess is probably 0 in your everyday life. I don't think that most guys are players, I think most guys get laid like once in a while when the stars align.

The amount of players, and especially men that have "high SMV" and are ALSO players is low as fuck. You want to be 1 in 100,000? Make some bank, be good with women, and keep yourself in shape throughout your 20s and into your 40s, you'll be highly sought after.

I spit my coffee laughing (in a good way) when you mentioned the "drink her dirty bath water" bit. Hahah. I've been guilty of doing that here & there in the past. The key red pill moment in my life for sure was going through a divorce.

10 years ago, 15 years ago, etc.... I had aspirations of being a player but as a young man in my 20's back then I was a much less refined, almost alcoholic, unfocused FOMO-suffering lad that sometimes gave off a vibe similar to "a beer is never enough" no offense buddy lol. I'm obviously at least a decade older than you now. I had to experience some female related war stories & age a bit to gain wisdom the hard way.

Post: #27

I really thought about this thread and I think I know why some men turn into lifelong players or throw away the marriage life for good. It takes a certain kind of an ego and pride to really make this happen and that is what it comes down to. Majority of the guys chasing this life, whether they like to admit it or not, are chasing it for the validation that comes from this very life. Being a player is dangerous yet even in this feminized society we secretly look up to men who get laid a lot.

When this ego is bruised at some point in life, instead of taking the hit and just shaking it off, it seeks redemption and wants to get even. It doesn't even have to apply to women either, it can apply to anything from success in athletics to success in business. Some guys naturally have this sort of an ego that once it is bruised or hurt, they have this desire to seek redemption.

While some say it is because a girl broke his heart, I think it can be other social setbacks too such as not fitting in with the cool kids in your developmental years.

It is rare for a guy who was high SMV early in life to be a player for so long because the chip on his shoulder is not there. The need to go out often, approach lots of girls, set up a nice dating profile and make lifestyle sacrifices to fuck lots of hot women is just not worth it.

For me, that is the reason I have put in effort into this lifestyle because I almost committed suicide due to the social depression I was going through in college. My high school and college years were arguably the worst years of my life which is why when anyone hypes them up so much, it tends to hit a nerve.

I'll never experience being 16 and sneaking into a girl's house with her as her parents are gone and fucking, the adrenaline rush that would come from it.

I'll never experience fucking a hot high school teacher when I am a high school student and hoping we don't get caught.

I'll never experience fucking an 18 year old hot college girl when I am 18 as well going through the same things in life.

It bites at me at times but at the same time, I seek this lifestyle as a band-aid in a way. Even if I am 35 and fucking randoms who aren't nearly as hot as the ones some 20 year old dude high SMV dude would be fucking, I am cool with that. I'll even take fucking escorts (in places where it is legal) over marriage and kids because for a guy like me, marriage is giving up and losing.

I am fucked up right? Well, I admit it, most guys who are fucked up won't....

They'll try to bash the game and take a blue pill approach to life.

They'll join MGTOW type movements while looking for sympathy on a game forum.

They'll talk about how "there is so much more to life than pussy because women are evil" garbage while deep down, wanting to fucking hot girls but knowing they lack the spine and willpower this lifestyle requires.

Maybe I lack that willpower too and maybe I'll never get there, who the fuck knows but I admit that it was a fucked up childhood and a college experience that almost drove me to suicide which has me chasing this lifestyle. If I have to avoid and skip marriage altogether and a die lonely man, that is the path I will take. That is how bad I want it and I am willing to make the sacrifices for it which is why I have had successes in the past.

I know that I will lose a ton of friends and make a lot of enemies by chasing this life, but I am willing to accept every setback from STDs and even an early death for it.....

Post: #28

(08-03-2018 03:49 PM)EndsExpect Wrote:  

(08-02-2018 06:38 PM)Bastard Sword Wrote:  Has anyone else noticed this, or does anyone see genuine male promiscuity on a regular basis? I really feel that even for high-SMV men, the default is to be in a relationship with a hot girl.

At your age... You have absolutely no idea what the people around you are actually doing. Everyone puts up a front. I mean do you really think Facebook shows what peoples lives are actually like?

Most guys who are players... don't try to come across as players. What you will notice is that their relationships are short, and they focus more of their life attention on friendship with other men.

I think this hits the nail on the head. It just depends on who you're asking and what they actually want to tell you. I'm a 5'8 Indian dude that you'd never expect has a triple digit notch count of girls 7+, but my online game is super strong.

However, if anyone asks I would never tell them my notch count is 100+. Honestly, I just tell everyone my notch count is 7, except for a few very close friends that know.

Additionally, I think its an expectation thing too. You could tell people your notch count is 100+, but then when you go out, people have these expectations that you';l just go and talk to all the girls or always pull, or just something that is incongruent with reality. I know plenty of guys who slay, but you would never think they do, or they simply wouldn't tell you. I mean with apps and stuff, many men have really solid rotations. Best way to fuck it up is telling others about it and showing off.

Post: #29

a beer is enough,

You seem to going through the make up for lost time phase. You were based on your post completely unsuccessful with woman in your teens and early-mid20s.

This is probably going to be quite common amongst guys who come on the scene later than usual.

However, you speak in terms very exclusive. It's marry or fuck many different girls. You will and I tell you this from experience probably at some point meet someone you like I want to spend more than a few days with. You don't have to marry her. You can have a normal relationship. There is nothing abnormal or negative about doing such.

You could easily have a long term relationship while at the same time getting some on the side. I imagine many guys on the forum practice that.

You also don't need to personally evaluate yourself based on your success with woman.

I am anti-marriage as well. It doesn't prevent me from having loving and caring relationships. It also doesn't prevent me from having flings either. Try not to think in terms of boxes and just see where your journey takes you. If you live off a base off numbers and checking boxes you will be far less happy and too distracted to enjoy the ride.

Life is full off curves. If you try to stay on a straight line all the way through with a unilateral focus you will miss out on many of the greatest experiences.

Post: #30

(08-03-2018 09:38 PM)a beer is enough Wrote:  I really thought about this thread and I think I know why some men turn into lifelong players or throw away the marriage life for good. It takes a certain kind of an ego and pride to really make this happen and that is what it comes down to. Majority of the guys chasing this life, whether they like to admit it or not, are chasing it for the validation that comes from this very life. Being a player is dangerous yet even in this feminized society we secretly look up to men who get laid a lot.

You're assuming everyone has the same motivations for banging girls... Using the word player in this context too lumps such an insanely diverse group of people all into the same box. The definition of what constitutes a player is kind of subjective really anyway. To a guy who has only banged a couple girls, someone who does 5 notches a year could be a pretty crazy player.

Quote:When this ego is bruised at some point in life, instead of taking the hit and just shaking it off, it seeks redemption and wants to get even. It doesn't even have to apply to women either, it can apply to anything from success in athletics to success in business. Some guys naturally have this sort of an ego that once it is bruised or hurt, they have this desire to seek redemption.

Yeah, this type exists, but projecting this observation across all players as a sort of standard set of motivations is definitely not accurate.

Quote:While some say it is because a girl broke his heart, I think it can be other social setbacks too such as not fitting in with the cool kids in your developmental years.

It is rare for a guy who was high SMV early in life to be a player for so long because the chip on his shoulder is not there. The need to go out often, approach lots of girls, set up a nice dating profile and make lifestyle sacrifices to fuck lots of hot women is just not worth it.

For me, that is the reason I have put in effort into this lifestyle because I almost committed suicide due to the social depression I was going through in college. My high school and college years were arguably the worst years of my life which is why when anyone hypes them up so much, it tends to hit a nerve.

I'll never experience being 16 and sneaking into a girl's house with her as her parents are gone and fucking, the adrenaline rush that would come from it.

I'll never experience fucking a hot high school teacher when I am a high school student and hoping we don't get caught.

I'll never experience fucking an 18 year old hot college girl when I am 18 as well going through the same things in life.

It bites at me at times but at the same time, I seek this lifestyle as a band-aid in a way. Even if I am 35 and fucking randoms who aren't nearly as hot as the ones some 20 year old dude high SMV dude would be fucking, I am cool with that. I'll even take fucking escorts (in places where it is legal) over marriage and kids because for a guy like me, marriage is giving up and losing.

I am fucked up right? Well, I admit it, most guys who are fucked up won't....

They'll try to bash the game and take a blue pill approach to life.

They'll join MGTOW type movements while looking for sympathy on a game forum.

They'll talk about how "there is so much more to life than pussy because women are evil" garbage while deep down, wanting to fucking hot girls but knowing they lack the spine and willpower this lifestyle requires.

Maybe I lack that willpower too and maybe I'll never get there, who the fuck knows but I admit that it was a fucked up childhood and a college experience that almost drove me to suicide which has me chasing this lifestyle. If I have to avoid and skip marriage altogether and a die lonely man, that is the path I will take. That is how bad I want it and I am willing to make the sacrifices for it which is why I have had successes in the past.

I know that I will lose a ton of friends and make a lot of enemies by chasing this life, but I am willing to accept every setback from STDs and even an early death for it.....

I respect your struggle man, but don't overanalyze this player stuff too much and what categories most guys fall into. Just do what you want to do. Don't worry about the past. If you are on this site, you're already way ahead of the curve. Just because a lot of guys SMV goes down in their thirties, doesn't mean that it's the same for everyone. For many of our RVF redpill aware men it is among the best period of their lives. Mine is shaping up to look similar.

Post: #31

(08-03-2018 10:18 PM)True Balla Wrote:  I think this hits the nail on the head. It just depends on who you're asking and what they actually want to tell you. I'm a 5'8 Indian dude that you'd never expect has a triple digit notch count of girls 7+, but my online game is super strong.
However, if anyone asks I would never tell them my notch count is 100+. Honestly, I just tell everyone my notch count is 7, except for a few very close friends that know.
Additionally, I think its an expectation thing too. You could tell people your notch count is 100+, but then when you go out, people have these expectations that you';l just go and talk to all the girls or always pull, or just something that is incongruent with reality. I know plenty of guys who slay, but you would never think they do, or they simply wouldn't tell you. I mean with apps and stuff, many men have really solid rotations. Best way to fuck it up is telling others about it and showing off.

I learned this the hard way. Had a fat friend who played the Keytar in some lame band. I was amazed to learn that he pulls chicks from his concerts every time he plays one. I swear to god I would love to know why so many women will fuck any guy on stage! A fat guy playing the lamest instrument ever invented... are you serious?

Also... this has applied to a ton of other things in life. This applies to everything from rape survivors to massive kinksters. You just never fucking know what people are doing behind closed doors.

Post: #32

(08-03-2018 09:38 PM)a beer is enough Wrote:  I really thought about this thread and I think I know why some men turn into lifelong players or throw away the marriage life for good. It takes a certain kind of an ego and pride to really make this happen and that is what it comes down to. Majority of the guys chasing this life, whether they like to admit it or not, are chasing it for the validation that comes from this very life. Being a player is dangerous yet even in this feminized society we secretly look up to men who get laid a lot.

When this ego is bruised at some point in life, instead of taking the hit and just shaking it off, it seeks redemption and wants to get even. It doesn't even have to apply to women either, it can apply to anything from success in athletics to success in business. Some guys naturally have this sort of an ego that once it is bruised or hurt, they have this desire to seek redemption.

While some say it is because a girl broke his heart, I think it can be other social setbacks too such as not fitting in with the cool kids in your developmental years.

It is rare for a guy who was high SMV early in life to be a player for so long because the chip on his shoulder is not there. The need to go out often, approach lots of girls, set up a nice dating profile and make lifestyle sacrifices to fuck lots of hot women is just not worth it.

For me, that is the reason I have put in effort into this lifestyle because I almost committed suicide due to the social depression I was going through in college. My high school and college years were arguably the worst years of my life which is why when anyone hypes them up so much, it tends to hit a nerve.

I'll never experience being 16 and sneaking into a girl's house with her as her parents are gone and fucking, the adrenaline rush that would come from it.

I'll never experience fucking a hot high school teacher when I am a high school student and hoping we don't get caught.

I'll never experience fucking an 18 year old hot college girl when I am 18 as well going through the same things in life.

It bites at me at times but at the same time, I seek this lifestyle as a band-aid in a way. Even if I am 35 and fucking randoms who aren't nearly as hot as the ones some 20 year old dude high SMV dude would be fucking, I am cool with that. I'll even take fucking escorts (in places where it is legal) over marriage and kids because for a guy like me, marriage is giving up and losing.

I am fucked up right? Well, I admit it, most guys who are fucked up won't....

They'll try to bash the game and take a blue pill approach to life.

They'll join MGTOW type movements while looking for sympathy on a game forum.

They'll talk about how "there is so much more to life than pussy because women are evil" garbage while deep down, wanting to fucking hot girls but knowing they lack the spine and willpower this lifestyle requires.

Maybe I lack that willpower too and maybe I'll never get there, who the fuck knows but I admit that it was a fucked up childhood and a college experience that almost drove me to suicide which has me chasing this lifestyle. If I have to avoid and skip marriage altogether and a die lonely man, that is the path I will take. That is how bad I want it and I am willing to make the sacrifices for it which is why I have had successes in the past.

I know that I will lose a ton of friends and make a lot of enemies by chasing this life, but I am willing to accept every setback from STDs and even an early death for it.....

LOL bro I'm begging you. I'm imploring you. Stop lamenting the past. Stop ruminating on this. Live life as hardcore as you can. Work hard, play hard. Grab it by the pussy my bro. Look. I went through a divorce & I have a son, but I love my son (my ex loves my son as well). Even though I took the plunge & it didn't work out, I wouldn't take back my son for the world. I know for a fact he has good genetics from both sides & that we are ensuring that he will have access to a very good education & comfortable surroundings to grow up in (this seems highly likely fortunately).

I'm not crying about the past. I think that the struggles from the past only make me stronger, and you should look at it the same way. You said it yourself. You can whip yourself up into good shape & you're not tied down geographically. You still have the world ahead of you bro. You have PLENTY of time, so start living life & enjoy it.

Post: #33

(08-03-2018 11:39 PM)WhatTheFuck Wrote:  

(08-03-2018 09:38 PM)a beer is enough Wrote:  I really thought about this thread and I think I know why some men turn into lifelong players or throw away the marriage life for good. It takes a certain kind of an ego and pride to really make this happen and that is what it comes down to. Majority of the guys chasing this life, whether they like to admit it or not, are chasing it for the validation that comes from this very life. Being a player is dangerous yet even in this feminized society we secretly look up to men who get laid a lot.

You're assuming everyone has the same motivations for banging girls... Using the word player in this context too lumps such an insanely diverse group of people all into the same box. The definition of what constitutes a player is kind of subjective really anyway. To a guy who has only banged a couple girls, someone who does 5 notches a year could be a pretty crazy player.

Quote:When this ego is bruised at some point in life, instead of taking the hit and just shaking it off, it seeks redemption and wants to get even. It doesn't even have to apply to women either, it can apply to anything from success in athletics to success in business. Some guys naturally have this sort of an ego that once it is bruised or hurt, they have this desire to seek redemption.

Yeah, this type exists, but projecting this observation across all players as a sort of standard set of motivations is definitely not accurate.

Quote:While some say it is because a girl broke his heart, I think it can be other social setbacks too such as not fitting in with the cool kids in your developmental years.

It is rare for a guy who was high SMV early in life to be a player for so long because the chip on his shoulder is not there. The need to go out often, approach lots of girls, set up a nice dating profile and make lifestyle sacrifices to fuck lots of hot women is just not worth it.

For me, that is the reason I have put in effort into this lifestyle because I almost committed suicide due to the social depression I was going through in college. My high school and college years were arguably the worst years of my life which is why when anyone hypes them up so much, it tends to hit a nerve.

I'll never experience being 16 and sneaking into a girl's house with her as her parents are gone and fucking, the adrenaline rush that would come from it.

I'll never experience fucking a hot high school teacher when I am a high school student and hoping we don't get caught.

I'll never experience fucking an 18 year old hot college girl when I am 18 as well going through the same things in life.

It bites at me at times but at the same time, I seek this lifestyle as a band-aid in a way. Even if I am 35 and fucking randoms who aren't nearly as hot as the ones some 20 year old dude high SMV dude would be fucking, I am cool with that. I'll even take fucking escorts (in places where it is legal) over marriage and kids because for a guy like me, marriage is giving up and losing.

I am fucked up right? Well, I admit it, most guys who are fucked up won't....

They'll try to bash the game and take a blue pill approach to life.

They'll join MGTOW type movements while looking for sympathy on a game forum.

They'll talk about how "there is so much more to life than pussy because women are evil" garbage while deep down, wanting to fucking hot girls but knowing they lack the spine and willpower this lifestyle requires.

Maybe I lack that willpower too and maybe I'll never get there, who the fuck knows but I admit that it was a fucked up childhood and a college experience that almost drove me to suicide which has me chasing this lifestyle. If I have to avoid and skip marriage altogether and a die lonely man, that is the path I will take. That is how bad I want it and I am willing to make the sacrifices for it which is why I have had successes in the past.

I know that I will lose a ton of friends and make a lot of enemies by chasing this life, but I am willing to accept every setback from STDs and even an early death for it.....

I respect your struggle man, but don't overanalyze this player stuff too much and what categories most guys fall into. Just do what you want to do. Don't worry about the past. If you are on this site, you're already way ahead of the curve. Just because a lot of guys SMV goes down in their thirties, doesn't mean that it's the same for everyone. For many of our RVF redpill aware men it is among the best period of their lives. Mine is shaping up to look similar.

Exactly. Womens' SMV's are also plummeting in their 30's & especially after their mid-30's. Arguably faster & in a harsher fashion than a lot of men.

Post: #34

(08-03-2018 11:51 PM)EndsExpect Wrote:  

(08-03-2018 10:18 PM)True Balla Wrote:  I think this hits the nail on the head. It just depends on who you're asking and what they actually want to tell you. I'm a 5'8 Indian dude that you'd never expect has a triple digit notch count of girls 7+, but my online game is super strong.
However, if anyone asks I would never tell them my notch count is 100+. Honestly, I just tell everyone my notch count is 7, except for a few very close friends that know.
Additionally, I think its an expectation thing too. You could tell people your notch count is 100+, but then when you go out, people have these expectations that you';l just go and talk to all the girls or always pull, or just something that is incongruent with reality. I know plenty of guys who slay, but you would never think they do, or they simply wouldn't tell you. I mean with apps and stuff, many men have really solid rotations. Best way to fuck it up is telling others about it and showing off.

I learned this the hard way. Had a fat friend who played the Keytar in some lame band. I was amazed to learn that he pulls chicks from his concerts every time he plays one. I swear to god I would love to know why so many women will fuck any guy on stage! A fat guy playing the lamest instrument ever invented... are you serious?

Also... this has applied to a ton of other things in life. This applies to everything from rape survivors to massive kinksters. You just never fucking know what people are doing behind closed doors.

Yep yep, word on the street is even local level fame game (ie. musician, band, etc.) is no joke. I've heard about tales like that time & time again. But I'd never get up on stage and play some shit or yell or sing into a mic with the sole intention of getting pussy. Pussy would be the perk. I'd have to love the craft first & foremost.

Post: #35

If you are a male 8, and you want to have sex as often as you like with a female 8, it's easier to be in a LTR than chasing new skirt every night. There aren't enough female 8s out there that you can pump and dump then with impunity unless you are a celeb.

Post: #36

(08-04-2018 12:14 AM)RawGod Wrote:  If you are a male 8, and you want to have sex as often as you like with a female 8, it's easier to be in a LTR than chasing new skirt every night. There aren't enough female 8s out there that you can pump and dump then with impunity unless you are a celeb.

The other thing you have to do to increase your odds (assuming you have decent bankroll / cash flow, etc.) is try to reside in or frequently visit a large market city. In the USA I'm talking places like NYC, Los Angeles, Houston, Miami, Chicago, etc. These types of cities tend to have a larger amount of rated 8+ chicks roaming about in town for various reasons. And of course there are other key regions throughout the world where you have better odds of finding hotter chicks as well.

Post: #37

(08-03-2018 06:31 AM)monsquid Wrote:  Back in his NYC playboy days Paul Janka said that the reason why he was able to rack up such a high notch count wasn't because he had game, good looking, and generally attractive... plenty of dudes in a place like NYC who have that. No, the reason why he was so successful was because he didn't have a normal 9-5 lifestyle. He hated the grind of investmenet banking so quit that job and instead became a high level SAT tutor for rich parents in the upper east. That gave him a lot of time off and flexible schedule. So he kept trying over and over again (which takes a lot of time and energy) to optimize his system. He made himself flexible so he can fit into the busy schedules of NYC career women. He admits as much himself.

That kind of time and energy to constantly chase women might be sustainable for a few years but like I said unless you are pathologically obsessed with women you are not going to be able to sustain that into your 30s and so on.

I work in a corporate job in NYC. It's been stressful the past few months. I've gotten to the point where I've been pushing myself to go out on Friday nights to game, only to suddenly say "fuck it" when I'm almost at my destination, turn around, and go home, because I'm just so worn out from work. And I work only 40 hours a week.

And it's not just a matter time and energy. Regular gaming also costs money, both in terms of real costs and opportunity costs. If you work a high-income corporate job (120k+ USD plus bonus), not only will you have less energy to go out and game every night, but that's also energy you could have put into getting ahead in your career -- raises, advancements, opportunities to work abroad, etc. On top of that, you save money by not going on dates and by living somewhere cheaper with less than ideal logistics.

In theory, one could even sleep with an escort several times a week (not advocating this) and still have a decent amount of money left over for living expenses and leisure.

The bottom line: For men with high incomes in the USA, constantly chasing tail incurs a huge financial cost. You always end up paying for it, one way or another.

Post: #38

I have discussed in other threads that the younger you are, the easier it is to live the player lifestyle but there is this attitude that exists among older guys that bashes the player life in a passive-aggressive sort of way. If you did what you did, that is all fine and dandy but we fail to keep the focus on sleeping with lots of different women.

Every corner and every turn there are countless cons listed to the player life to the point where you are made to feel bad for not marrying by the age of 35 or settling into an LTR. In some ways I understand and I am happy that we are having this discussion.

You see, when I heard that the 30s are a man's prime, I was very skeptical and I think for good reason too. It might be your financial prime but I fail to believe, after having had the discussions that I have had, that it is in any way shape or form easy to fuck lots of different women in your 30s and this thread is indirectly (on some occasions directly) saying that.

I do think we should warn more and more younger men out there that after your 20s, it becomes a lot tougher to live the player life.

Too many guys have been misled by this belief that it gets easier as you get older, it simply doesn't. Maybe if you want marriage it might but not if you want to fuck lots and lots of different women, it just doesn't get any easier after your early-20s.

Sure guys might say it is unfulfilling, LTRs are better and blah blah blah life purpose but the reality is, they are indirectly saying it is tough to live it. All this passive aggressive criticism towards sleeping with lots of different women is really coming from the place of how difficult it is.

The question becomes how much are you willing to give up to get the life you want, what are you willing to sacrifice?

I do think that for the guys out there who want it bad enough to the point that they are willing to give an arm and leg to have this life due to having a chip on their shoulder, it could be possible to fuck lots of different women in your 30s.

You might be labeled Satan, risk your life doing it, be an outcast to American society, have your name dragged through the mud and even be attacked by your fellow game-oriented men for fucking lots of randoms at the age of 35 but if you are willing to make the sacrifices, I think it could be possible.

Then again I am still in my 20s the older I get, the more I realize people grow apart from this lifestyle so I am guessing life after 30 is hell for a player.

Post: #39

(08-04-2018 02:01 PM)a beer is enough Wrote:  I have discussed in other threads that the younger you are, the easier it is to live the player lifestyle but there is this attitude that exists among older guys that bashes the player life in a passive-aggressive sort of way. If you did what you did, that is all fine and dandy but we fail to keep the focus on sleeping with lots of different women.

Every corner and every turn there are countless cons listed to the player life to the point where you are made to feel bad for not marrying by the age of 35 or settling into an LTR. In some ways I understand and I am happy that we are having this discussion.

You see, when I heard that the 30s are a man's prime, I was very skeptical and I think for good reason too. It might be your financial prime but I fail to believe, after having had the discussions that I have had, that it is in any way shape or form easy to fuck lots of different women in your 30s and this thread is indirectly (on some occasions directly) saying that.

I do think we should warn more and more younger men out there that after your 20s, it becomes a lot tougher to live the player life.

Too many guys have been misled by this belief that it gets easier as you get older, it simply doesn't. Maybe if you want marriage it might but not if you want to fuck lots and lots of different women, it just doesn't get any easier after your early-20s.

Sure guys might say it is unfulfilling, LTRs are better and blah blah blah life purpose but the reality is, they are indirectly saying it is tough to live it. All this passive aggressive criticism towards sleeping with lots of different women is really coming from the place of how difficult it is.

The question becomes how much are you willing to give up to get the life you want, what are you willing to sacrifice?

I do think that for the guys out there who want it bad enough to the point that they are willing to give an arm and leg to have this life due to having a chip on their shoulder, it could be possible to fuck lots of different women in your 30s.

You might be labeled Satan, risk your life doing it, be an outcast to American society, have your name dragged through the mud and even be attacked by your fellow game-oriented men for fucking lots of randoms at the age of 35 but if you are willing to make the sacrifices, I think it could be possible.

Then again I am still in my 20s the older I get, the more I realize people grow apart from this lifestyle so I am guessing life after 30 is hell for a player.

Hence why you should always have another purpose or other purposes in life to keep some sort of meaning in your life. I don't know what you do for a living, but are you passionate about it? What are you passionate about? Use your dayjob to help finance your hobbies & passions or side business ventures if you have any. Remember, you'll always find at least some women that appreciate a man with purpose. A man with passions & cool hobbies. A man that is contributing something to society. You might not be doing it today, but you still have the opportunity to do so in the future. And in the meantime don't neglect your health & physique. All the basic stuff they talk about in this forum.

And all the power to you if you aspire to be a player. You see the best players that I knew over the years typically didn't advertise it a whole lot. They went ahead & enjoyed their conquests I'm sure. Unless you're living in a real small town or are held down within the confines of a small ethnic community you'll likely be fine in terms of avoiding excessive criticism.

Post: #40

(08-03-2018 08:32 AM)[email protected] Wrote:  High SMV men have women work around their schedule. They don't make time for those whores, they make time for him.

I once got this girl off Tinder, she was in a competitive residency program, ivy league educated, fitness type chick, pretty attractive. I told her I was cutting for the next 6 weeks and I'd rather just stop talking to her until then because I preferred being alone during that kind of struggle (fat loss, not literally cutting). She saw my body picture where I was at 8% bodyfat.. 6 weeks later I texted her and she drove like 45 mins to see me that weekend. I think most guys in that position wouldn't have the balls to tell someone to stop talking to them for 6 weeks, but that's the kind of abundance mentality that makes women think you are very high SMV.

(08-03-2018 03:49 PM)EndsExpect Wrote:  Most guys who are players... don't try to come across as players. What you will notice is that their relationships are short, and they focus more of their life attention on friendship with other men.

Was just thinking about this today. If I were a player I would never mention that to other guys, especially at work. There's nothing to gain from it.

Post: #41

(08-03-2018 10:18 PM)True Balla Wrote:  I think this hits the nail on the head. It just depends on who you're asking and what they actually want to tell you. I'm a 5'8 Indian dude that you'd never expect has a triple digit notch count of girls 7+, but my online game is super strong.

However, if anyone asks I would never tell them my notch count is 100+. Honestly, I just tell everyone my notch count is 7, except for a few very close friends that know.

Additionally, I think its an expectation thing too. You could tell people your notch count is 100+, but then when you go out, people have these expectations that you';l just go and talk to all the girls or always pull, or just something that is incongruent with reality. I know plenty of guys who slay, but you would never think they do, or they simply wouldn't tell you. I mean with apps and stuff, many men have really solid rotations. Best way to fuck it up is telling others about it and showing off.

Yea, there's nothing to be gained from bragging that you're a player. A man with confidence high enough to be a player wouldn't even need to brag about it, IMO. Especially at work, there's nothing to be gained from that kind of talk.

Post: #42

(08-03-2018 01:28 PM)TheFinalEpic Wrote:  Most men aren't cut out for the lifestyle. Plain and simple.

If you aren't on the level where you have an abundance mindset, where you understand that women are just looking for fun and experiences, you'll get chewed up and spit out. If you care too much, or place women on a pedestal, instead of treating them as a side dish to your life, you will have a rude awakening. Most guys will do anything for the almighty pussy, and men with "high SMV" are no exception.

And, speaking about playerdom, even "players" aren't in it for the long haul. Most can be in this game for a couple years, but the attrition rate in the player world is high. Navy SEAL drop out rates.

Most "players" begin to see friends and acquaintances getting married, having kids, etc. and start questioning what they are doing with their lives. You'll experience burnout due to all the shit that has already been mentioned in this thread, pettiness, dumb chicks, flakes, etc. and think that settling down is better. The relationship life looks pretty good, you only have to deal with her shit now, instead of 5 or 10 girls at a time, and you think she's pretty good. You weigh the pros and cons, the pros are more than the cons, and you leave the game for "greener pastures" as a spoken for man.

I see this lots, have experienced it myself, and realize that the game actually never ends, regardless of relationship status. High SMV men aren't immune to this, and frankly, most men that are exceptional in their respective fields are straight up betas when it comes to women.

I think every man that is a player had some sort of experience that made him that way. You either took the redpill early in life like I did (at age 15 due to dating a certified BPD chick), you had a lack of experience until later in life, and become a player to satisfy all your unsatisfied desires early on in life (many guys get into the lifestyle in their late 20's), or you have some other circumstance that made you that way. You have to actually want the lifestyle though. Even these circumstances won't keep you in the game long term.

The number of guys that are players in highschool and college is high. You play a sport or are in a band? Instant SMV, instant women. What you realize though, is that these guys are mostly betas that have women coming to them simply because their SMV is high due to athletics or interests. As soon as this SMV is gone, they end up shacking up shortly after they get out of school. I know dozens of these guys. They played baseball or hockey, and then once they don't go anywhere with it, they shack up with the hottest girl they can get, and start posting about how much they love her.

The number of guys that are players into their late 20's and early 30's is significantly lower. And, once you reach your mid 30's, you're talking like 1 in 500 that are actually good at it. The competition weeds itself out, because most people are going downhill instead of getting better as the years go on. By the time you're 40, you're going to be standing alone if you can keep yourself in shape, have solid finances, and have game.

You have to truly love women if you are going to be a player. You have to love them for all that they are, and understand that they are just acting in their nature with every action they do. Do most guys understand women? Nah son, most guys are pining on Instagram about how they would "drink her dirty bath water". The lack of understanding, the lack of actually loving women for being women is sky high. The thirst is also sky high, the confidence of even most high SMV men with women is low.

How many guys do you know that believe in "The One" or they shack up with any girl that will fuck them. Ask yourself how many guys do you know that have girls on multiple continents continually asking them when they'll next be in their country? My guess is probably 0 in your everyday life. I don't think that most guys are players, I think most guys get laid like once in a while when the stars align.

The amount of players, and especially men that have "high SMV" and are ALSO players is low as fuck. You want to be 1 in 100,000? Make some bank, be good with women, and keep yourself in shape throughout your 20s and into your 40s, you'll be highly sought after.

One of the best posts I have read in RVF

Post: #43

A lot of guys in here are saying that the player lifestyle is a grind and that even high SMV men eventually burn out from the game. It's not 1995 anymore, in this modern era of pickup a man who's truly a 10 can get hot pussy literally delivered to his doorstep easier than ordering from skipthedishes. Let's break down what SMV actually is. Unfortunately I still see guys who see Looks, Money, Status as the default criteria for SMV, but the real equation is Looks, Game, Status.

Looks - height, facial structure, hair, muscle, tattoos, piercings, fashion, etc.
Game - push/pull, dread, negs, abundance, IDGAF mentality, sense of humour, etc.
Status - friends, money, lifestyle, preselection, social circle, reputation etc.

If your SMV relies more on game than it does looks, then yes, it's going to be a grind going out there hunting new ass every week. However, if you're a 9 or a 10 looks wise but you're game is only average then all you really need in this era is a dating app and you're basically set for at least a decade of the easiest pussy man has ever captured. Girls will literally drive out of town to fuck a 10, these guys don't even need to leave their doorstep to get a new notch. It's just a different era. Guys who lean heavily on looks for high SMV now have a platform that's made exclusively for them. Back in the day they had to go out and compete with other high SMV men who had the ability to use either game or status to compete, but in our new arena of dating guys with looks are laughing all the way to the pussy bank. There is no digital platform that's built to give guys with A+ game an advantage over other men. If your status is high then maybe you can use something like instagram to get some easy kills but it won't be as effective as being a model on tinder.

So what does that mean in terms of high-SMV guys living the player lifestyle? I think guys with top tier looks are out there crushing it these days while guys who need to game are out there grinding either through day/night game or social circle. I have no idea about high status men, it's such a relative and volatile stat that I'd imagine it's a feast or famine situation.

Post: #44

(08-06-2018 08:53 AM)sonic boom Wrote:  A lot of guys in here are saying that the player lifestyle is a grind and that even high SMV men eventually burn out from the game. It's not 1995 anymore, in this modern era of pickup a man who's truly a 10 can get hot pussy literally delivered to his doorstep easier than ordering from skipthedishes. Let's break down what SMV actually is. Unfortunately I still see guys who see Looks, Money, Status as the default criteria for SMV, but the real equation is Looks, Game, Status.

Looks - height, facial structure, hair, muscle, tattoos, piercings, fashion, etc.
Game - push/pull, dread, negs, abundance, IDGAF mentality, sense of humour, etc.
Status - friends, money, lifestyle, preselection, social circle, reputation etc.

If your SMV relies more on game than it does looks, then yes, it's going to be a grind going out there hunting new ass every week. However, if you're a 9 or a 10 looks wise but you're game is only average then all you really need in this era is a dating app and you're basically set for at least a decade of the easiest pussy man has ever captured. Girls will literally drive out of town to fuck a 10, these guys don't even need to leave their doorstep to get a new notch. It's just a different era. Guys who lean heavily on looks for high SMV now have a platform that's made exclusively for them. Back in the day they had to go out and compete with other high SMV men who had the ability to use either game or status to compete, but in our new arena of dating guys with looks are laughing all the way to the pussy bank. There is no digital platform that's built to give guys with A+ game an advantage over other men. If your status is high then maybe you can use something like instagram to get some easy kills but it won't be as effective as being a model on tinder.

So what does that mean in terms of high-SMV guys living the player lifestyle? I think guys with top tier looks are out there crushing it these days while guys who need to game are out there grinding either through day/night game or social circle. I have no idea about high status men, it's such a relative and volatile stat that I'd imagine it's a feast or famine situation.

I can see this equation being true to some degree. But location can have a great impact on a man's success as well. Different cities within the same country itself can yield dramatically varying results. Plus sometimes different chicks have different tastes (just like us men have varied tastes as well).

Post: #45

(08-02-2018 09:12 PM)Dodgy Wrote:  That's because a player lifestyle isn't for every man. It can be tough having different girls pass in and out of your life, sometimes (well, most of the time) adding unnecessary tension, stress or drama into your life. Often times I wonder if it would just be easier to find one girl and not have to deal with anymore bullshit (wishful thinking but still).

I think a lot of young guys fantasize about being a player and juggling multiple women, but only imagine the potential fun of fucking them. They never consider the reality of dealing with these women pre and post bang. Personally, sometimes I feel worn out dealing with the entitled attitudes, the bitchiness, the flakiness, the passive aggressiveness, the pettiness and the jealousy. And this is what men with higher SMV than me must deal with too.

And It can be a grind going out on dates that go nowhere, or dealing with stupid drunk girls, or dealing with girls who ghost. Of course this doesn't happen to DiCaprio, but the remaining 99.9% of us have to deal with this bullshit, no matter the level of SMV.

So it doesn't surprise me that many guys would rather stick with one girl despite having the ability to fuck more than one.

Excellent analysis. Truer words have never been spoken. Repped for this.

(08-03-2018 12:44 PM)456 Wrote:  I am a fan of anagrams:

Bastard Sword => Dads Worst Bar => Odd Bar Straws ... (runner up: Dad's Bra Worts)

You have two choices as I see it:

a) It's in the anagrams: quit life and go tend bar!!

b) Forget the bar, instead TAKE the bar exam, get a large dog, a tattoo of a beertap, and get on OKCupid and Tinder. Girls love large dogs, tattoos, and other accoutrements

10/10 Tweakpost. No rep but RVF Official Crack Cocaine Connoisseur of the Year award.

Post: #46

*This post is meant to reply to jordypip23's post, new to this site and don't know how to quote a post.*


While it's true that location and taste have an impact on a man's success, that kind of difference only starts to show up for men who have moderate to above average SMV, where little kinds of advantages helps to push them into the upper stratosphere of SMV. Guys who are truly high-SMV are going to be able to pull anywhere, even under some of the most dire circumstances. A guy who is a 10 looks wise is going to get easy pussy no matter where he is, doesn't matter if he's in NYC or Jakarta, just get on tinder and start swiping. If your overall SMV is a 7 or an 8, then yes little things like taste and location will have an impact on your success, but this thread is about high-SMV men, not above average SMV men.

Post: #47

(08-06-2018 09:43 AM)sonic boom Wrote:  *This post is meant to reply to jordypip23's post, new to this site and don't know how to quote a post.*


While it's true that location and taste have an impact on a man's success, that kind of difference only starts to show up for men who have moderate to above average SMV, where little kinds of advantages helps to push them into the upper stratosphere of SMV. Guys who are truly high-SMV are going to be able to pull anywhere, even under some of the most dire circumstances. A guy who is a 10 looks wise is going to get easy pussy no matter where he is, doesn't matter if he's in NYC or Jakarta, just get on tinder and start swiping. If your overall SMV is a 7 or an 8, then yes little things like taste and location will have an impact on your success, but this thread is about high-SMV men, not above average SMV men.

I certainly hear you on this. In the mid-sized Midwestern metro area I live in, and in the Alpha cities roughly 4 hours away from me in either direction, the types of guys that would have the type of SMV that you are referring to would literally have to have A-list celebrity level fame I think & be in town on tour or something lol.

Post: #48

(08-06-2018 08:53 AM)sonic boom Wrote:  However, if you're a 9 or a 10 looks wise but you're game is only average then all you really need in this era is a dating app and you're basically set for at least a decade of the easiest pussy man has ever captured. Girls will literally drive out of town to fuck a 10, these guys don't even need to leave their doorstep to get a new notch. It's just a different era. Guys who lean heavily on looks for high SMV now have a platform that's made exclusively for them. Back in the day they had to go out and compete with other high SMV men who had the ability to use either game or status to compete, but in our new arena of dating guys with looks are laughing all the way to the pussy bank. There is no digital platform that's built to give guys with A+ game an advantage over other men. If your status is high then maybe you can use something like instagram to get some easy kills but it won't be as effective as being a model on tinder.

The ease of looks in tandem with online game/top level pics has been grossly overestimated.

I've made accounts with model and/or high quality pics- and while this is the optimal strategy as you receive many matches and messages, it's still a grind to actually bang (especially without a conventional 'date' which is often a waste of time).
Girls will ignore your messages (definitely less than 10% attempts are successful at getting her straight over), go cold and block you (this was going fairly direct- trying to get to come over without explicitly mentioning sex by around the 5th message the latest). I can't imagine what it's like for average-looking guys and/or guys with no game.

While I've had chicks come over fresh direct and make it easy (small percentage)- there have been girls who come straight over, nothing happens and you never see them again. Many women on are on these apps for validation.

Post: #49

(08-04-2018 12:04 AM)jordypip23 Wrote:  

(08-03-2018 09:38 PM)a beer is enough Wrote:  I really thought about this thread and I think I know why some men turn into lifelong players or throw away the marriage life for good. It takes a certain kind of an ego and pride to really make this happen and that is what it comes down to. Majority of the guys chasing this life, whether they like to admit it or not, are chasing it for the validation that comes from this very life. Being a player is dangerous yet even in this feminized society we secretly look up to men who get laid a lot.

When this ego is bruised at some point in life, instead of taking the hit and just shaking it off, it seeks redemption and wants to get even. It doesn't even have to apply to women either, it can apply to anything from success in athletics to success in business. Some guys naturally have this sort of an ego that once it is bruised or hurt, they have this desire to seek redemption.

While some say it is because a girl broke his heart, I think it can be other social setbacks too such as not fitting in with the cool kids in your developmental years.

It is rare for a guy who was high SMV early in life to be a player for so long because the chip on his shoulder is not there. The need to go out often, approach lots of girls, set up a nice dating profile and make lifestyle sacrifices to fuck lots of hot women is just not worth it.

For me, that is the reason I have put in effort into this lifestyle because I almost committed suicide due to the social depression I was going through in college. My high school and college years were arguably the worst years of my life which is why when anyone hypes them up so much, it tends to hit a nerve.

I'll never experience being 16 and sneaking into a girl's house with her as her parents are gone and fucking, the adrenaline rush that would come from it.

I'll never experience fucking a hot high school teacher when I am a high school student and hoping we don't get caught.

I'll never experience fucking an 18 year old hot college girl when I am 18 as well going through the same things in life.

It bites at me at times but at the same time, I seek this lifestyle as a band-aid in a way. Even if I am 35 and fucking randoms who aren't nearly as hot as the ones some 20 year old dude high SMV dude would be fucking, I am cool with that. I'll even take fucking escorts (in places where it is legal) over marriage and kids because for a guy like me, marriage is giving up and losing.

I am fucked up right? Well, I admit it, most guys who are fucked up won't....

They'll try to bash the game and take a blue pill approach to life.

They'll join MGTOW type movements while looking for sympathy on a game forum.

They'll talk about how "there is so much more to life than pussy because women are evil" garbage while deep down, wanting to fucking hot girls but knowing they lack the spine and willpower this lifestyle requires.

Maybe I lack that willpower too and maybe I'll never get there, who the fuck knows but I admit that it was a fucked up childhood and a college experience that almost drove me to suicide which has me chasing this lifestyle. If I have to avoid and skip marriage altogether and a die lonely man, that is the path I will take. That is how bad I want it and I am willing to make the sacrifices for it which is why I have had successes in the past.

I know that I will lose a ton of friends and make a lot of enemies by chasing this life, but I am willing to accept every setback from STDs and even an early death for it.....

LOL bro I'm begging you. I'm imploring you. Stop lamenting the past. Stop ruminating on this. Live life as hardcore as you can. Work hard, play hard. Grab it by the pussy my bro. Look. I went through a divorce & I have a son, but I love my son (my ex loves my son as well). Even though I took the plunge & it didn't work out, I wouldn't take back my son for the world. I know for a fact he has good genetics from both sides & that we are ensuring that he will have access to a very good education & comfortable surroundings to grow up in (this seems highly likely fortunately).

I'm not crying about the past. I think that the struggles from the past only make me stronger, and you should look at it the same way. You said it yourself. You can whip yourself up into good shape & you're not tied down geographically. You still have the world ahead of you bro. You have PLENTY of time, so start living life & enjoy it.

One of the absolute best posts I've seen on this site. Glad I could create a thread that brought out gems like this. Beer, all I can tell you is that the player phase, for a lot of people, is just an itch to scratch. You'll keep going, rack up thirty notches, and probably get bored after a certain point. It's not a big deal, I have full confidence that you can do it.

Post: #50

(08-06-2018 11:39 AM)Player_1337 Wrote:  

(08-06-2018 08:53 AM)sonic boom Wrote:  However, if you're a 9 or a 10 looks wise but you're game is only average then all you really need in this era is a dating app and you're basically set for at least a decade of the easiest pussy man has ever captured. Girls will literally drive out of town to fuck a 10, these guys don't even need to leave their doorstep to get a new notch. It's just a different era. Guys who lean heavily on looks for high SMV now have a platform that's made exclusively for them. Back in the day they had to go out and compete with other high SMV men who had the ability to use either game or status to compete, but in our new arena of dating guys with looks are laughing all the way to the pussy bank. There is no digital platform that's built to give guys with A+ game an advantage over other men. If your status is high then maybe you can use something like instagram to get some easy kills but it won't be as effective as being a model on tinder.

The ease of looks in tandem with online game/top level pics has been grossly overestimated.

I've made accounts with model and/or high quality pics- and while this is the optimal strategy as you receive many matches and messages, it's still a grind to actually bang (especially without a conventional 'date' which is often a waste of time).
Girls will ignore your messages (definitely less than 10% attempts are successful at getting her straight over), go cold and block you (this was going fairly direct- trying to get to come over without explicitly mentioning sex by around the 5th message the latest). I can't imagine what it's like for average-looking guys and/or guys with no game.

While I've had chicks come over fresh direct and make it easy (small percentage)- there have been girls who come straight over, nothing happens and you never see them again. Many women on are on these apps for validation.

I've tried the model approach before and my results were not the same. A lot of guys have a tendency to do this kind of thing and go with pictures of guys that they think are attractive, but not what women are actually hyper-sexually into. The perfect balance in my experience is somewhere between model and ex-con. Jeremy Meeks is the absolute perfect version of what will get you the easiest pussy just based on looks alone. Model & Felon is what works best rather than say, Model & Faggot, which a lot of guys tend to go for unfortunately in pickup. Just my opinion. Get some pics of a 10/10 guy covered in tattoos and see how it goes.