Post: #276

The Taiwan situation does sound like a potential disaster. You do bring up a good point in regards to going by history. This does seem like the beginning of a slippery slope of sorts.

Post: #277

Theoretically speaking, how would China react if Taiwan magically found itself in possession of a nuclear program? Would they suck it up or would it be the final trigger to attack before Taiwan is lost forever?

Post: #278

(06-29-2018 03:06 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  Theoretically speaking, how would China react if Taiwan magically found itself in possession of a nuclear program? Would they suck it up or would it be the final trigger to attack before Taiwan is lost forever?

If Taiwan suddenly has nukes then the possibility of them declaring independence goes up and the loss in prestige to the Communist Party could be fatal so they would probably attack to avoid losing Taiwan forever. For now, China is playing the long game, squeezing Taiwan economically and slowly siphoning off their diplomatic allies and intimidating them with war games close to their territory. China has time on their side. The other big question is how much Americans are willing to sacrifice in order to keep Taiwan free and democratic by deterring a Chinese attack - is that even compatible with an "America First" foreign policy?

Post: #279

(06-16-2018 07:26 AM)Arado Wrote:  Most China watchers were pushing TPP in order to exclude China from further trade integration until they stopped their unfair practices. If Chinese content in TPP countries was the main concern, it should have been loudly articulated and addressed in the negotiations. An anti-China message would find much more receptivity instead of blanket statements about globalism, America first, and bad deals.

What might be in the short term corporate interest is not necessarily the best long term for the nation as a whole.

China watchers know who butters their bread.

(06-29-2018 03:06 AM)Handsome Creepy Eel Wrote:  Theoretically speaking, how would China react if Taiwan magically found itself in possession of a nuclear program? Would they suck it up or would it be the final trigger to attack before Taiwan is lost forever?

Taiwan(R.O.C) has never been a signatury to the Chemical Weapons Convention.
They also have a world-class chemicals industry and large island stronghold a few miles from a major Communist city.


Taiwan doesn't need nuclear weapons, may already have a credible deterrent

Post: #280

US-China Trade War has officially begun. (CNBC link)

Quote:Trade War begins: US and China exchange $34 billion in tariffs

President Trump's tariffs on $34 billion worth of Chinese goods kick in, escalating a war of words between the world's two largest economies into a full-blown trade conflict.

Washington's 25 percent duties went into effect at midnight EDT and affected products such as water boilers, X-ray machine components, airplane tires and various other industrial parts.

China immediately retaliates with tariffs on its $34 billion list of goods issued last month, including soybeans, pork and electric vehicles.

Beijing calls it the "biggest trade war in economic history."

Trump's move? Remember this is simultaneously going on along with Pompeo's trip to NK and ongoing tensions in the South China Sea and over Taiwan policy. Lots of moving pieces.

Post: #281

Not related to Trump, but pertains to the wider topic of the Chinese colonization of Africa on the example of the new Chinese-built SGR railway in Kenya:

https://www.standardmedia.co.ke/article/...-sgr-walls

It's much worse than the Chinese just controlling some capital and resources in exchange for providing locals with jobs and infrastructure. When they invest in something, they take total control of it to ensure long-term dependence in every area.

Post: #282

This news story may not seem related to Trump's China policy, but it is. I actually immediate knew that the ex-apple employee in question was Chinese the moment I read saw the story's headline.

Ex-Apple worker charged with stealing self-driving car trade secrets

Quote:U.S. authorities on Monday charged a former Apple Inc employee with theft of trade secrets, alleging that the person downloaded a secret blueprint related to a self-driving car to a personal laptop and later trying to flee the country, according to a criminal complaint filed in federal court.

The complaint said that the former employee, Xiaolang Zhang, disclosed intentions to work for a Chinese self-driving car startup and booked a last-minute flight to China after downloading the plan for a circuit board for the self-driving car. Authorities arrested Zhang on July 7 at the San Jose airport after he passed through a security checkpoint.

"Apple takes confidentiality and the protection of our intellectual property very seriously," Apple said in a statement. "We’re working with authorities on this matter and will do everything possible to make sure this individual and any other individuals involved are held accountable for their actions."

Tamara Crepet, a lawyer provisionally appointed to represent Zhang, did not immediately respond to a request for comment.
The criminal complaint says Zhang was hired to develop software and hardware for Apple's autonomous vehicle project, where he designed and tested circuit boards to analyze sensor data.

In April, Zhang took paternity leave following the birth of a child and traveled with his family to China, according to the complaint filed in the U.S. District Court for the Northern District of California.

When Zhang returned near the end of April he told his supervisor he planned to resign, move back to China and work for Xiaopeng Motors, an intelligent electric vehicle company headquartered there with offices in Silicon Valley, the complaint says.

Zhang's supervisor called in Apple security officials, who discovered that Zhang had run extensive searches of secret databases and had come on to Apple's campus on April 28, when he was supposed to be on paternity leave, the complaint alleges.

While on campus, the complaint alleges, Zhang took circuit boards and a computer server from a self-driving car hardware lab, and his Apple co-workers showed him a "proprietary chip."

The complaint did not state whether the chip was intended for self-driving cars. About 5,000 of Apple's 135,000 employees were allowed access to information about its self-driving car project, but only 2,700 of them had access to the secret databases that Zhang had access to, according to the complaint.

Zhang told Apple officials he had taken the hardware from the lab because he wanted to transfer to a new position within Apple and thought it would be useful to him, the complaint states.

Zhang also allegedly downloaded data to a personally owned computer, including a 25-page secret blueprint for circuit board for a self-driving car, which investigators described as "the single file" that "serves as the basis for the instant criminal charge."

Agents for the Federal Bureau of Investigation questioned Zhang and served a search warrant at his house on June 27, according to the complaints. Agents learned he had purchase a "last-minute, round trip airline ticket with no co-travelers" destined for China on July 7 and arrested Zhang at the airport, according to the complaint.

I don't think most people, even the pro-American types who constantly repeat the phrase "buy American" really understand what the US is facing off against. The part of this news story to me that is interesting, is not that fact that someone would attempt to steal trade secrets, but how casual the attempt was.

Trump isn't simply facing off against the government of a country that wants to serve its citizen's interests -- he's facing off against an entire culture that simply does not play by any rules at all. The Chinese government doesn't even actively engage in many efforts to move intellectual and financial resources into China. Rather, it has crowdsourced this to the citizenry. It's main role is to simply nix as many China investment efforts by foreign companies that are not skewed heavily to the Chinese side's benefit.

I don't believe that Xiaolang Zhang was a corporate spy. My best guess is that he was operating entirely autonomously, with the goal of firming up his ability to contribute at his new job with Xiaopeng Motors.

Basically, you've got a country with an extremely nationalist populous that is intent on winning at all costs squaring off with a country that champions healthy bilateral trade. One of those countries heavily restricts the ability of capital to even leave the country and has an army of citizens who are extremely eager to steal trade secrets. The other has a populous that is highly individualistic in nature, contains many people who follow some sort of ethical guidelines in life and is absolutely free to take money out of the country to invest elsewhere.

What I love is that Zhang wasn't even committing his crime with the expectation that their could be consequences. He didn't load his family up on the airplane. He was probably planning to keep them in the US (to gain citizenship if they hadn't already), while he used stolen trade secrets to shore up his success working for a China based competitor. He'd literally told his supervisor that he planned to leave the company to work for a competitor, but still thought that it would be cool to leave an electronic paper trail that clearly demonstrated that he was seeking out valuable trade secrets.

Post: #283

To understand the true extent of China's Extreme Mind-Phuckery read:

How China’s Economic Aggression Threatens the Technologies and Intellectual Property of the United States and the World
https://www.whitehouse.gov/wp-content/up...18-PDF.pdf

And;
THE NAKED COMMUNIST: 45 COMMUNIST GOALS
http://www.restoring-america.com/Documen...0NOTES.pdf

Excerpted from:
https://ia801601.us.archive.org/23/items...02-046.pdf

Post: #284

Brilliant Video about the China Trade War:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=isBbnEt0LJU&t=4s

Post: #285

The new story I posted above earlier this morning is just a sliver of data on the state of the cultural and economic issues confronting US-China relations.

The following excerpt from The China Law Blog, however, provides a few more data points, which in combination with the news article, paint a more deliberate picture.

Quote:In entering into a sales agreement with a Chinese factory interested in buying your high value equipment, you should understand that the Chinese factory owner almost certainly holds the following five fundamental beliefs that will drive its behavior in the sale process:

1. Your price is unfairly high. The important thing to know is that the Chinese side believes your price is both too high and fundamentally unfair. The Chinese side views this as the legacy of foreign imperialism, designed to keep the Chinese down, always under the thumb of the foreign oppressor. This attitude is supported by the general ideology of the PRC government. Under this basic belief, the Chinese factory owner feels morally justified in working to avoid paying you the full price for the equipment.
To achieve this, the basic strategy of the Chinese side will be the following:

a. Insist on paying in installments, then not paying the last installment.

b. Insist on a major discount, in the range of 30% to 40%. This then becomes the new base price for the equipment.

c. After paying the discounted price for the first two units, insist on an additional discount for future purchases.

2. Training is not necessary. Any requirement for training the Chinese side in how to use your equipment is just another way for you to unfairly extract more money from the Chinese side. It is also a way to keep the Chinese side down by showing that the Chinese have something to learn from foreigners. The Chinese believe that operation of the equipment is governed by a simple magic pill. Foreign companies that insist on a training program are withholding access to the magic pill.

3. Proper equipment set-up is not necessary. Your requirement that the Chinese side retain you for proper equipment set-up is a waste of time and designed to shift blame for operational failure onto the Chinese side. The Chinese side believes the equipment should “just work.” For this reason, elaborate site set up and pre-operations testing should not be required. Just turn the key and go.

4. After sale support and maintenance is not required. Requirements from the foreign equipment supplier for such after-sale support is designed to do two things: unfairly extract more money from the Chinese side and keep the Chinese side employees ignorant about the true nature of how the equipment operates. That is, you are unfairly hiding the magic pill from them. In addition, the equipment should “just work,” with no need for after sale maintenance or support. Your requiring a service contract or related after-sale support is either your admitting that your equipment is fundamentally defective or your trying to unfairly milk more money from the Chinese side.

5. Your attempts to protect your IP is foreign oppression. Intellectual property protection that prevents the Chinese side from copying your equipment is just another form of foreign oppression. The Chinese side does not believe the design of your equipment is the result of years of hard work and R&D and it wants to be able to copy it so that it can be manufactured in China at a “fair” price.
This then means the Chinese side’s standard strategy will be to purchase as few units as possible and then use its initial purchase(s) to extract the “magic formula.” The strategy is to abandon future purchases and have clones of your equipment manufactured in China.
Obviously not all Chinese companies subscribe to all five of these beliefs and some Chinese companies do not subscribe to any of them.

But most do and I know this from what they have told me (in Chinese), from what I have overheard (in Chinese) and from what I have read (in Chinese). I mention all this because foreign companies find this all hard to believe and even when they do believe it, they find it hard to truly internalize and adjust their selling behavior accordingly. The typical Chinese factory owner will negotiate and implement its purchases of advanced foreign equipment based on these five beliefs. Many foreign suppliers, when faced with the resulting behavior, will conclude that the Chinese are operating in bad faith. However, to deal with the Chinese buyers, the first step is to understand that they believe their approach is fair. They are simply working against the unfair advantage of the foreign seller by making a more level playing field.

The important thing from the standpoint of the foreign seller is to recognize the following:

These basic beliefs are natural and will not be changed.

Since these basic beliefs are pretty much universal among Chinese companies, it is easy to predict how the Chinese buyer will behave at every critical point in the sales process.

Since the approach of the Chinese side can rarely if ever be changed, foreign companies that want to sell their high value equipment to

China should design their sales programs based on what the Chinese side will do, with contracts that protect the foreign seller from the negative consequences of near certain Chinese company actions.

Post: #286

(07-10-2018 11:11 PM)Suits Wrote:  The important thing to know is that the Chinese side believes your price is both too high and fundamentally unfair. The Chinese side views this as the legacy of foreign imperialism, designed to keep the Chinese down, always under the thumb of the foreign oppressor.

.

However, to deal with the Chinese buyers, the first step is to understand that they believe their approach is fair. They are simply working against the unfair advantage of the foreign seller by making a more level playing field.

My dad has listened to China's propaganda for the past half decade-decade or so and literally believes these things hook line and sinker, and is incredibly defensive about any challenges to these beliefs(Kiwis are passive and conflict-avoidant, which is probably why he likes it here despite despising aspects of Kiwi culture). Sad thing is he is relatively high IQ so he really shouldn't. But narcissism and psychological damage hmm...

Could the Chinese mentality be summed up by narcissism and refusal to admit fault and always blaming others?

I just always have to laugh to myself when I keep hearing "foreign imperialism". On one hand apparently the Opium Wars sucked, but I can't imagine the Chinese not having it coming...

Post: #287

(07-10-2018 11:31 PM)The Catalyst Wrote:  

(07-10-2018 11:11 PM)Suits Wrote:  The important thing to know is that the Chinese side believes your price is both too high and fundamentally unfair. The Chinese side views this as the legacy of foreign imperialism, designed to keep the Chinese down, always under the thumb of the foreign oppressor.

Could the Chinese mentality be summed up by narcissism and refusal to admit fault and always blaming others?

The Chinese mentality is a product of having a society that has only one god: winning.

The Chinese are not a religious people. They don't based their earthly action on the will of a higher being. Any gods that exist in their mind simply seek to serve their needs. They have nothing to live for, but to improve their own status and the status of their offspring.

Unlike most societies, they'll eager choose protracted suffering over a balance between success and comfort.

Admitting fault or weakness in a society like that will just invite others to view you as wounded prey to make an easy target of. That's why everyone in China prefers to lie even when their deceit is clear as day.

China is the perfect Orwellian society -- power for the sake of power, even if no pleasure is gained from having it. Power means being able to decide what the truth is and anyone with less power is always quick to adopt the party line. People here are in a habit of absolutely crushing anyone who doesn't show them complete submission.

That's why friendships don't general exist based on a level of equality. Rather, there is the superior friend and the inferior friend, with the inferior friend consistently honouring the superior friend with gifts and praise in exchange for whatever value the superior friend provides, such as business deals, social access or just the benefit of their presence.

This isn't a result of communism. It's been like this for at least hundreds of years, based on my readings of travel journals published in the 1800's. Rather, I believe that China's natural inclinations towards scheming and plotting in pursuit of even the most insignificant gains is the reason a communist-style power structure has succeed better there than elsewhere.

Post: #288

China sounds like a version of hell of earth. Not quite as wild and dysfunctional as Africa, but it's own kind of awful evil. Can't believe they are #2 in GDP. I think Africa and China deserve each other.

I always laugh when people say removing the vote from women or people who don't pay taxes is an evil idea. Meanwhile, there is a culture of 1.3 billion people sucking us dry and trying to crush us, with absolutely no right to vote for anyone at all!

Post: #289

Newsletter Update - Interesting trade to profit from the Trade War with China, NAFTA and the EU:

Following excerpt makes the key points because I catch grief if I do a full article cut and paste...

Is the Trade War Already Over?

... A failed trade negotiation would not likely send Ford shares lower. After all, that wouldn't be a surprise to investors.

Keep in mind Ford currently offers investors a 5.4% dividend, which is very attractive in today's market. So even if trade negotiations fail, Ford shares could still move higher thanks to the company's very attractive dividend.

On the other hand, if Trump is successful in negotiating a trade deal, shares of Ford will SOAR higher. That's because the company will be able to grow international profits on top of its successful U.S. business. And considering the cheap current price of the stock, investors will be competing to buy shares as quickly as possible.

As you can see, in the event of a trade war, Ford is a good investment. And if the trade war is resolved, that makes Ford a GREAT investment.

Action to take:

Buy shares of Ford Motor (F) up to $12.

Speculative investors can buy the Ford January 2019 $12 calls using a $0.40 limit.

Disclaimer: After I hit my current SPY trading targets I may pick up 50 to 100 of these calls at the next "Trade Wars FUD Volatility" market dip.

Post: #290

(07-11-2018 07:31 AM)Samseau Wrote:  China sounds like a version of hell of earth. Not quite as wild and dysfunctional as Africa, but it's own kind of awful evil. Can't believe they are #2 in GDP. I think Africa and China deserve each other.

I always laugh when people say removing the vote from women or people who don't pay taxes is an evil idea. Meanwhile, there is a culture of 1.3 billion people sucking us dry and trying to crush us, with absolutely no right to vote for anyone at all!

Thing you gotta remember is that while some of the worst aspects of humanity are visible, some of the most noble aspects are also quite present.

I think that a forum member once said China is the land of "living saints and devils" or something to that effect. I tend to view my time here positively while also being mindful of the knocks I've taken to get to where I am here.

It's a very polarizing place, but I'd hate to portray it as strictly negative or evil. I'd describe it as rampant Id. The "I," and "me" reign supreme here and can lead some nasty things like the trade imbalance we like to speak of or the corporate theft Suits mentioned.

If we were to give China a DND alignment, I'd say it's straight-up Chaotic neutral.

Post: #291

^ Seems lawful evil to me, but I appreciate your first-hand perspective.

Post: #292

Seriously, if you can stand the fuckery in traffic and constantly seeing examples of pig-headed selfishness, there's a lot to be enjoyed in China.

I've met so many lovely girls. I probably would never want to marry a Chinese girl and have to deal with the in-laws, but there are a lot of incredibly sweet girls here.

The food is seriously to die for and there's a lot of progress that I would have predicted would never happen in a 100 years.

The thing that other governments need to be aware of is the fact that they aren't facing off against the best elements of Chinese society -- they are competing directly with the worse elements. The ones the clawed their way to the top using every devious scheme necessary.

Post: #293

(07-14-2018 09:03 AM)Suits Wrote:  Seriously, if you can stand the fuckery in traffic and constantly seeing examples of pig-headed selfishness, there's a lot to be enjoyed in China.

I've met so many lovely girls. I probably would never want to marry a Chinese girl and have to deal with the in-laws, but there are a lot of incredibly sweet girls here.

The food is seriously to die for and there's a lot of progress that I would have predicted would never happen in a 100 years.

The thing that other governments need to be aware of is the fact that they aren't facing off against the best elements of Chinese society -- they are competing directly with the worse elements. The ones the clawed their way to the top using every devious scheme necessary.

As someone who has experience in Chinese Society, do you feel like the teachings of Thick Black Theory(Lee Zhong Wu) is widely accepted as the way to do things there?

Post: #294

China Instructs State Media Not to Provoke Trump During Trade Dispute

Quote:Reuters contended on Wednesday that Chinese media coverage of the trade dispute with America has been relatively muted, and it was by design because the government has instructed its media outlets not to say anything that would enrage U.S. President Donald Trump.

The claim was sourced to “several sources with knowledge of the matter” who claimed to have seen a “memo based on a set of directives issued verbally by government officials.”

“When exposing and criticizing American words and actions, be careful not to link it to Trump and instead to aim it at the U.S. government,” Chinese state media organs were purportedly instructed.

A source who works for a major Chinese news website said media controls imposed by Beijing on the trade conflict were “the most strict yet,” which would vault over a very high bar for the control-freak authoritarian state. This would be the same government that scoured the Chinese Internet of fat jokes when North Korea’s plus-sized dictator visited Beijing in March.

The controls described to Reuters were strict indeed. The website was told to post only stories about the trade conflict by state news agency Xinhua, rather than publishing its own. It was also ordered to keep the topic out of the top few headlines and closely manage comments about it, according to the source.

The website’s smartphone app was no longer permitted to send push notifications on the subject to users, and the website was forbidden from setting up special pages about the dispute.

The problem with this theory is that, as Reuters acknowledges, there have been some rather fiery editorials in Chinese papers excoriating the Trump administration for its position on trade. The idea is that President Trump is much more likely to take umbrage at criticism that targets him personally.

Reuters’ sources also said they were “instructed not to mention the impact of the trade war on Chinese companies” because they don’t want to give the impression pressure against China might be working.

Hong Kong analyst Li Xigen added that Beijing might be worried about stirring up public anger that it cannot easily control if the trade war inflicts real hardships on the Chinese populace.

“China might need to restrict the market access of American companies. But to purge American companies that are already operating in China might be a very bad idea. Those companies generate jobs and revenue for China. Most Apple products are made in China. To do something to harm American firms that are already operating in China would be very stupid,” ventured trade expert Wang Jiangyu of the National University of Singapore.

The Communist Party People’s Daily provided an interesting example of the tightrope walked by Chinese media on Wednesday, publishing an article that attacked Trump for accusing China of sabotaging talks with North Korea but using a few Westerners plucked from Twitter at random to do it, rather than editorializing against Trump directly or quoting Chinese social media users.

Probably a good thing. It is better to be feared than loved, if you have to choose one.

(07-10-2018 11:31 PM)The Catalyst Wrote:  Could the Chinese mentality be summed up by narcissism and refusal to admit fault and always blaming others?

That also sounds like the Arab/Islamic mentality.
Now that I think about it, it also sounds like the Sub-Saharan African mentality.

I don't know much about India or Latin America, someone help me out.
There might just be a pattern here?

Post: #295

(07-15-2018 04:41 AM)Belgrano Wrote:  

(07-10-2018 11:31 PM)The Catalyst Wrote:  Could the Chinese mentality be summed up by narcissism and refusal to admit fault and always blaming others?

That also sounds like the Arab/Islamic mentality.
Now that I think about it, it also sounds like the Sub-Saharan African mentality.

I don't know much about India or Latin America, someone help me out.
There might just be a pattern here?

It's called the "third-world" mentality.

Post: #296

The British Empire had people who knew how to deal with the Chinese. Dare I say we lost that edge when the Empire fell and China went full-on communist with nothing in the way.

Post: #297

(07-10-2018 11:51 PM)Suits Wrote:  The Chinese mentality is a product of having a society that has only one god: winning.

The Chinese are not a religious people. They don't based their earthly action on the will of a higher being. Any gods that exist in their mind simply seek to serve their needs. They have nothing to live for, but to improve their own status and the status of their offspring.

Unlike most societies, they'll eager choose protracted suffering over a balance between success and comfort.

Admitting fault or weakness in a society like that will just invite others to view you as wounded prey to make an easy target of. That's why everyone in China prefers to lie even when their deceit is clear as day.

China is the perfect Orwellian society -- power for the sake of power, even if no pleasure is gained from having it. Power means being able to decide what the truth is and anyone with less power is always quick to adopt the party line. People here are in a habit of absolutely crushing anyone who doesn't show them complete submission.

That's why friendships don't general exist based on a level of equality. Rather, there is the superior friend and the inferior friend, with the inferior friend consistently honouring the superior friend with gifts and praise in exchange for whatever value the superior friend provides, such as business deals, social access or just the benefit of their presence.

This isn't a result of communism. It's been like this for at least hundreds of years, based on my readings of travel journals published in the 1800's. Rather, I believe that China's natural inclinations towards scheming and plotting in pursuit of even the most insignificant gains is the reason a communist-style power structure has succeed better there than elsewhere.

The degeneration of Chinese society and culture follows the same basic pattern as throughout the rest of the world, but communism has a big role to play in how extreme the situation is. Essentially there are none of the buffers of traditional law or social morality that are present in other nations to stand between the power of the Communist Party and Chinese popular life, because these institutions were intentionally destroyed and not rebuilt (in other countries, they are being slowly eroded for the benefit of Cultural Marxist elites).

China used to have distinct socioeconomic classes, among which were cultural elites who maintained things like moral and religious customs. A cursory examination of Chinese history and governance would reveal how much influence these people exerted on politics and society. Chinese have always liked making money and generally being calculating pragmatists, but there were always religious and moral inhibitions at work that simply don't exist anymore.

The upheavals of the 19th and 20th centuries largely erased the Confucian/Daoist/Buddhist character of society. As mentioned, the people running Chinese society are its worst elements. That is directly related to the fall of the Qing Dynasty, the resultant replacement of the scholar-bureaucracy with regional military governance, the leftist derailment of the republican project, the Maoist usurpation, and more recently the CCP's decision to maintain itself using corrupt zombie growth (I could go into how the transition from Deng Xiaoping to Jiang Zemin in the late 1990s was a decisive step in creating a blatantly crony capitalist state and dropping the nascent reforms that would have introduced some rule of law, but that would be a subject requiring factchecking and editorial bandwidth beyond what I am willing to invest in this forum).

Starting with the Boxer Rebellion, pretty much every decade there has been a new lawyer of degeneracy added to Chinese politics, and therefore society and culture. Having talked to Chinese people from every decade starting in the 1930s, the transformations are readily apparent.

China's traditional elites were thrown out of power and in many cases physically eliminated. Unlike concurrent transitions in Japanese or Korean society, the masses of peasant Chinese were not educated according to any classical notions of literacy or culture, as it had all been replaced by Mao Zedong Thought and then Socialism with Chinese characteristics. The old people of today are either former Red Guards or were once kids who wished they could be Red Guards too.

Just as in the West, contemporary Chinese society is fragmented and atomized under the wanton rule of unscrupulous cliques who have little loyalty to the long-term welfare of their nation.

Post: #298

(07-17-2018 05:19 PM)Lunostrelki Wrote:  This isn't a result of communism. It's been like this for at least hundreds of years, based on my readings of travel journals published in the 1800's. Rather, I believe that China's natural inclinations towards scheming and plotting in pursuit of even the most insignificant gains is the reason a communist-style power structure has succeed better there than elsewhere.

The degeneration of Chinese society and culture follows the same basic pattern as throughout the rest of the world, but communism has a big role to play in how extreme the situation is. Essentially there are none of the buffers of traditional law or social morality that are present in other nations to stand between the power of the Communist Party and Chinese popular life, because these institutions were intentionally destroyed and not rebuilt (in other countries, they are being slowly eroded for the benefit of Cultural Marxist elites).
[/quote]

If you're a student of Chinese history, you'd know what there is no such thing as Chinese history.

History has been re-written by the victors, as is usually the case, but in reality, there is no cohesive Chinese history that goes back 2000+ years. Every dynasty to come into existence thoroughly destroyed every trace of past institution. The "definition of China" at different points even only 100 years apart share like resemblance to each other.

Sometimes three or more separate countries existed in the region, each with their own culture, traditions and identity. Currently there are two in this "5 thousand year old country," which is actually in reality younger than Germany.

There are two significant stretches of history when there wasn't any Chinese nation at all.

An American friend of mine who is an expert in world religions says that no one knows what the fuck the religious traditions were through out the history of the Chinese region, because every new dynasty would complete remove any trace of past traditions (oral and written) as soon as they took power.

No, communism didn't change China. The Hans have been engaged in extreme communism style power-politics for a long damn time.

Post: #299

(07-19-2018 06:53 PM)Suits Wrote:  This isn't a result of communism. It's been like this for at least hundreds of years, based on my readings of travel journals published in the 1800's. Rather, I believe that China's natural inclinations towards scheming and plotting in pursuit of even the most insignificant gains is the reason a communist-style power structure has succeed better there than elsewhere.

As I said in the previous post, Chinese social norms and values were passed down among the people and the intellectual class. Only the communists found it necessary to erase them. That this erasure happened is self-evident upon review of the available materials (such as basic classics), study of modern China's historical foundations, and prolonged interaction with Chinese people of varying generations.

The change is simple. It is nothing less than the replacement of traditionally held concepts of secular morality (Confucianism) and spiritual philosophy (Buddhism, Daoism) with dialectical materialism. The Orwellian "power is god" stuff is a communist invention, not a Chinese article of faith.

Quote:If you're a student of Chinese history, you'd know what there is no such thing as Chinese history.

History has been re-written by the victors, as is usually the case, but in reality, there is no cohesive Chinese history that goes back 2000+ years. Every dynasty to come into existence thoroughly destroyed every trace of past institution. The "definition of China" at different points even only 100 years apart share like resemblance to each other.

That's a stretch. More so than any other civilization prior to the western Renaissance, the Chinese placed massive importance on recording and studying history. Sima Qian, who compiled and edited the Shiji, was a political outcast and castrated by the Han Dynasty authorities for his offense. Yet he was allowed the option to continue his work, which he completed. Such a history could not be written under the political cult in existence today.

Chinese dynasties did not and were physically incapable of destroying "every trace of past institution[s]." Instead, they picked and chose aspects of the previous dynasties as suited them; at the same time, their power was not great enough to neutralize every dissenting intellectual or brainwash every subject.

Quote:No, communism didn't change China. The Hans have been engaged in extreme communism style power-politics for a long damn time.

As explained, there are many qualitative differences between the China of the communists and those of the dynasties (and the ROC).

Post: #300

(07-15-2018 04:41 AM)Belgrano Wrote:  

(07-10-2018 11:31 PM)The Catalyst Wrote:  Could the Chinese mentality be summed up by narcissism and refusal to admit fault and always blaming others?

That also sounds like the Arab/Islamic mentality.
Now that I think about it, it also sounds like the Sub-Saharan African mentality.

I don't know much about India or Latin America, someone help me out.
There might just be a pattern here?

British Indian here - I always joke with my Chinese friends that Indians and Chinese worship the same God - money.

A lot of Indians from India are mostly 2 faced immoral bastards who can't be trusted. The ones who are outwardly religious are the biggest hypocrites of all. They're the kind of cunts who will donate millions to their temple whilst doing nothing for the poor. They'll say they're cleaning living non-alcohol consuming vegetarians, yet sell drugs. Every time I read an article about financial fraud in the US, my first instinct is "is he Indian"? My instinct is right a lot of the time...

I have a similar feeling about a lot of Eastern Europeans, Africans, middle easterners and Chinese. Westerners are way more trustworthy when it comes to business and in general.

Regarding Mexico, the fact that a country blessed with an abundance of natural resources, that borders the richest country in the world, is a shithole says a lot about the local culture - they have oil for fuck's sake!