Post: #376

(01-31-2018 04:50 PM)Repo Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 11:47 AM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 08:31 AM)Hell_Is_Like_Newark Wrote:  If your decision to not get vaccinated only affected you, I wouldn't care if you got it or not. However, not getting vaccinated has ill effects on others. Case in point: My area over the past couple of years have had breakouts of German measles. Non-vaccinated illegals, anti-vaxxers, and people who lost their immunity* are to blame. The thing with measles is someone who is infected can infect others hours after they have left the area... Malls, subways, etc. The disease is that virulent.

I had a personal scare when an alert went out that a man infected with measles was in the same areas that I commute to work during the week, around the time I would have been there. A few days before I had blood work done and found out my immunity to Whooping Cough was minimal and my immunity to measles was none. The vaccines I had as a kid had worn off. My doctor didn't have measles on hand. I ran out to the local pharmacy and got a new MMR shot (gave me the dry heaves the next morning).

People who exercise, eat a healthy diet, address their stress levels, and minimize their exposure to toxins will have a very low likelihood of ever getting one of these diseases, because they have naturally maximized their immune system. If they also take certain natural supplements during an outbreak (echinacea, zinc, vitamin C, vitamin D, etc.) then the odds grow even smaller. (Modern sanitation methods have reduced any systemic risk arising from poor sanitation.)

On the other end of the spectrum are people who could care less about proper diet, exercise, stress, or toxins. Instead, they are lazy and want modern medicine to use the "magic pill" to cure (or prevent) all their ills, even if the magic pill contains mercury or formaldehyde.

So far, so good. I am all about free choice. The problem occurs when the lazy and the ill-informed wish to force their choices upon the rest of us. The same people who are so lackadaisical and negligent about their own health want their own do-nothing health philosophy foisted upon the innocent (i.e., those who have taken great pains over many years, or even decades, to safeguard their health and maximize their immune systems).

“Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!” Benjamin Franklin.

BTW: When Americans are asked what type of government they have, more than 99% of will respond by saying "a democracy." Not true. They live in a Constitutional Republic, where certain inalienable rights are protected on behalf of the minority against the tyranny of the majority. I often use this quote by Benjamin Franklin to highlight that fact. The Constitution protects the minority -- and the Second Amendment protects the Constitution.

This is rich how you can be so demeaning to people who don't agree with you in such a passive aggressive way full of strawmen. Instead of trying to have a rational conversation you put yourself up on a pedestool and basically just threw personal insults to everyone else.

I was not any more demeaning to anyone else than I have been to myself. As I stated on Post #354:

Quote:BTW: I was a non-believer regarding holistic health, until my own bad health and the dereliction of the medical establishment, forced me to perform the research that proved myself wrong. So, I understand perfectly the sentiments of those who reject this stuff. When your own health implodes, however, you will discover the meaning of "there are no atheists in a foxhole."

So, I fully admitted my previous ignorance -- and the fact that it took ill health to cure that ignorance. Some people learn from their mistakes, learn, adapt, and grow. Some people revel in their ignorance. I do not place myself on my pedestal. After five years of reading hundreds of books on health and probably thousands of articles, I simply know that I am right.

(01-31-2018 04:50 PM)Repo Wrote:  Also I've yet to meet an anti vaccer who has never been sick with less contagious diseases than the ones people vaccinate for. The idea that vitamin and low stress will fend off Polio or Measles is interesting. Where is your data/research for this fact?

Polio and Measles are caused by viruses. Simply eating healthy foods fends off viruses:

Quote:Eating fruits and veggies keeps your immune system strong.

Fact. Mom and dad were right when they told you to eat your fruits and vegetables. Studies show that people who eat a lot of them get sick less. The nutrients in them can help your immune system fight viruses and bacteria.

https://www.webmd.com/cold-and-flu/featu...e-system#1


Many supplements have anitviral properties:

   

https://draxe.com/antiviral-herbs/

These were simply two quick articles garnered from a Google search. There are thousands of articles on this topic.

Post: #377

(01-31-2018 05:25 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 11:47 AM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 08:31 AM)Hell_Is_Like_Newark Wrote:  If your decision to not get vaccinated only affected you, I wouldn't care if you got it or not. However, not getting vaccinated has ill effects on others. Case in point: My area over the past couple of years have had breakouts of German measles. Non-vaccinated illegals, anti-vaxxers, and people who lost their immunity* are to blame. The thing with measles is someone who is infected can infect others hours after they have left the area... Malls, subways, etc. The disease is that virulent.

I had a personal scare when an alert went out that a man infected with measles was in the same areas that I commute to work during the week, around the time I would have been there. A few days before I had blood work done and found out my immunity to Whooping Cough was minimal and my immunity to measles was none. The vaccines I had as a kid had worn off. My doctor didn't have measles on hand. I ran out to the local pharmacy and got a new MMR shot (gave me the dry heaves the next morning).

People who exercise, eat a healthy diet, address their stress levels, and minimize their exposure to toxins will have a very low likelihood of ever getting one of these diseases, because they have naturally maximized their immune system. If they also take certain natural supplements during an outbreak (echinacea, zinc, vitamin C, vitamin D, etc.) then the odds grow even smaller. (Modern sanitation methods have reduced any systemic risk arising from poor sanitation.)

On the other end of the spectrum are people who could care less about proper diet, exercise, stress, or toxins. Instead, they are lazy and want modern medicine to use the "magic pill" to cure (or prevent) all their ills, even if the magic pill contains mercury or formaldehyde.

So far, so good. I am all about free choice. The problem occurs when the lazy and the ill-informed wish to force their choices upon the rest of us. The same people who are so lackadaisical and negligent about their own health want their own do-nothing health philosophy foisted upon the innocent (i.e., those who have taken great pains over many years, or even decades, to safeguard their health and maximize their immune systems).

“Democracy is two wolves and a lamb voting on what to have for lunch. Liberty is a well-armed lamb contesting the vote!” Benjamin Franklin.

BTW: When Americans are asked what type of government they have, more than 99% of will respond by saying "a democracy." Not true. They live in a Constitutional Republic, where certain inalienable rights are protected on behalf of the minority against the tyranny of the majority. I often use this quote by Benjamin Franklin to highlight that fact. The Constitution protects the minority -- and the Second Amendment protects the Constitution.

Sorry, Brutha. Apart from the things you said about the government, which are all true, your medical "theory" is completely baseless. Diseases don't care what you had for breakfast.

That is not a medical theory, it is a medical fact. Denying such a fact is like denying that water is wet.

Quote:Your immune system is your friend. It protects your body from infection. Give it your full support and, as with any friend, there will be perks.

Here’s how it works: Your immune system creates, stores, and distributes the white blood cells that fight bacteria and viruses that enter your body, especially during cold and flu season.

For such a simple-sounding process, there's a lot of bad information out there. Here are some myths and facts about the immune system and how it works.
Eating fruits and veggies keeps your immune system strong.

Fact. Mom and dad were right when they told you to eat your fruits and vegetables. Studies show that people who eat a lot of them get sick less. The nutrients in them can help your immune system fight viruses and bacteria.

https://www.webmd.com/cold-and-flu/featu...e-system#1

Post: #378

This is NOT scientific scrutiny. This is bullshit articles by people posting their opinions. There is absolutely 0 scientific evidence that supports Holistic Medicine.

99% of medical professionals don't believe a word of it. You see "debates" where they have one real doctor stating facts vs. one quack that believes in holistic medicine. It gives the appearance that the medical field is split 50/50 on the issue, when in reality, you'd have 99 doctors telling the other 1 doctor he's a complete fucking idiot.

I equate it to the "debate" on global warming. Do you want me to pull up one or two of the millions of articles that refute holistic medicine? Come-on, Guy.

Post: #379

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  I was not any more demeaning to anyone else than I have been to myself.

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  The problem occurs when the lazy and the ill-informed wish to force their choices upon the rest of us. The same people who are so lackadaisical and negligent about their own health want their own do-nothing health philosophy foisted upon the innocent (i.e., those who have taken great pains over many years, or even decades, to safeguard their health and maximize their immune systems).

Really?

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  Simply eating healthy foods fends off viruses . .

. . .Many supplements have anitviral properties

Nobody is disputing that it can help the point is exactly what extent to specific highly contagious and dangerous diseases. There is no study in the word that exists that says something like people with low stress levels with high levels of vitamin C who ate such and such have a 80% lower chance of contracting polio or measles than the control population. Generic articles or studies that say "it can help" are completely moot for purposes of this discussion; nobody is disputing that doing certain things can help to a degree, and it doesn't even address herd immunity.

Millions of people across the world try to stay stress free, eat health foods, etc, and they still get sick with regular diseases which are not as bad as the ones we vaccinate for.

Post: #380

(01-31-2018 05:25 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  Diseases don't care what you had for breakfast.

This is worse than ignorance - this is anti-think.

Food is the building blocks by which we are constituted, and the fuel on which we run - the thought that it has no effect on how healthy we are just doesn't make sense.

It is akin to saying that it doesn't matter what materials our cars are made out of, nor what fuel we put into it doesn't matter. Try putting diesel into a petrol engine, and see whether you notice any difference in the way it runs.

Post: #381

(01-31-2018 05:43 PM)Repo Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  I was not any more demeaning to anyone else than I have been to myself.

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  The problem occurs when the lazy and the ill-informed wish to force their choices upon the rest of us. The same people who are so lackadaisical and negligent about their own health want their own do-nothing health philosophy foisted upon the innocent (i.e., those who have taken great pains over many years, or even decades, to safeguard their health and maximize their immune systems).

Really?

Oh, you were referring to that? Anyone who wishes to force their poor life choices on others in an authoritarian manner needs to be called out on it. I stand by my statement. I do not cater to delicate snowflakes. The fact that you believe that the truth is demeaning is your problem, not mine.

"I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell." Harry S. Truman

Post: #382

(01-31-2018 05:46 PM)king bast Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:25 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  Diseases don't care what you had for breakfast.

This is worse than ignorance - this is anti-think.

Food is the building blocks by which we are constituted, and the fuel on which we run - the thought that it has no effect on how healthy we are just doesn't make sense.

It is akin to saying that it doesn't matter what materials our cars are made out of, nor what fuel we put into it doesn't matter. Try putting diesel into a petrol engine, and see whether you notice any difference in the way it runs.

You're saying I'm being ridiculous by arguing something even more ridiculous.

Of course you can't eat rat poison and think you're going to grow big and strong. Geesh.

Post: #383

(01-31-2018 05:51 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:43 PM)Repo Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  I was not any more demeaning to anyone else than I have been to myself.

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  The problem occurs when the lazy and the ill-informed wish to force their choices upon the rest of us. The same people who are so lackadaisical and negligent about their own health want their own do-nothing health philosophy foisted upon the innocent (i.e., those who have taken great pains over many years, or even decades, to safeguard their health and maximize their immune systems).

Really?

Oh, you were referring to that? Anyone who wishes to force their poor life choices on others in an authoritarian manner needs to be called out on it. I stand by my statement. The fact that you believe that the truth is demeaning is your problem, not mine.

"I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell." Harry S. Truman

Incredibly ironic that while trying to make your case you keep quoting people who don't even agree with you and by your own logic are lazy and ill-informed. Benjamin Franklin literally co-authored a guide on vaccinations related to smallpox. I guess him and his 4 year old son he lost to smallpox where just lackadaisical and negligent. Throwing in random quotes does not make you come across as well read, it just tells us that you lack critical thinking skills and how to decipher context.

Post: #384

(01-31-2018 05:29 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  This is NOT scientific scrutiny. This is bullshit articles by people posting their opinions. There is absolutely 0 scientific evidence that supports Holistic Medicine.

99% of medical professionals don't believe a word of it. You see "debates" where they have one real doctor stating facts vs. one quack that believes in holistic medicine. It gives the appearance that the medical field is split 50/50 on the issue, when in reality, you'd have 99 doctors telling the other 1 doctor he's a complete fucking idiot.

I equate it to the "debate" on global warming. Do you want me to pull up one or two of the millions of articles that refute holistic medicine? Come-on, Guy.

Someone hasn't done the research nor lived enough life to see the error in these statements. Someone has also clearly drunk the western M.D. Koolaid. Western 'medical professionals' are paid drug pushers with barely any training in nutrition. I've seen first-hand in several cases how 'medical professionals' in lab coats with M.D. after their name prescribed expense and ineffective treatments that didn't address the core problem, which only diet / lifestyle / nutritional changes could. That is, for the patients that survived those deadly 'treatments' long enough to make the necessary changes for their body to heal it.

You also clearly don't understand the hoax of AGW global warming being the end-all-and-be-all of sins but that's for another thread.

There are more red pills to take than just on female nature. Don't stop now, Guy.

Post: #385

You dudes are so open-minded that your brains have fallen out.

Post: #386

(01-31-2018 05:59 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:46 PM)king bast Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:25 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  Diseases don't care what you had for breakfast.

This is worse than ignorance - this is anti-think.

Food is the building blocks by which we are constituted, and the fuel on which we run - the thought that it has no effect on how healthy we are just doesn't make sense.

It is akin to saying that it doesn't matter what materials our cars are made out of, nor what fuel we put into it doesn't matter. Try putting diesel into a petrol engine, and see whether you notice any difference in the way it runs.

You're saying I'm being ridiculous by arguing something even more ridiculous.

Of course you can't eat rat poison and think you're going to grow big and strong. Geesh.

Right, rat poison is an extreme example, but we consume milder toxins every day. If consuming rat poison results in extreme consequences (death) we can expect that the consumption of milder toxins, though likely in higher and more prolonged doses, would result in milder consequences, but consequences nonetheless.

I don't know about you, but when I get a cold, I can almost always trace it back to a period of reduced vitality. Maybe I ate or drank terribly for a couple of days, didn't sleep well, physically exhausted myself or a combination of the above. The difference between contracting a virus and not contracting it, can, and frequently is, that simple.

Post: #387

(01-31-2018 06:05 PM)Repo Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:51 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:43 PM)Repo Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  I was not any more demeaning to anyone else than I have been to myself.

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  The problem occurs when the lazy and the ill-informed wish to force their choices upon the rest of us. The same people who are so lackadaisical and negligent about their own health want their own do-nothing health philosophy foisted upon the innocent (i.e., those who have taken great pains over many years, or even decades, to safeguard their health and maximize their immune systems).

Really?

Oh, you were referring to that? Anyone who wishes to force their poor life choices on others in an authoritarian manner needs to be called out on it. I stand by my statement. The fact that you believe that the truth is demeaning is your problem, not mine.

"I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell." Harry S. Truman

Incredibly ironic that while trying to make your case you keep quoting people who don't even agree with you and by your own logic are lazy and ill-informed. Benjamin Franklin literally co-authored a guide on vaccinations related to smallpox. I guess him and his 4 year old son he lost to smallpox where just lackadaisical and negligent. Throwing in random quotes does not make you come across as well read, it just tells us that you lack critical thinking skills and how to decipher context.

My Benjamin Franklin quotation pertained to democracy as an unworkable form of government when protecting minority rights. He obviously agrees with me, because he was the one who made the statement.

What is ironic is that, while claiming that I lack critical thinking skills, by conflating Benjamin Franklin's quote about government and his guide on vaccines, you engaged in a non sequitur and proved your own lack of critical thinking skills. Your logic (you should see a big problem here):

1. Tail Gunner quoted Benjamin Franklin regarding democracy.
2. Benjamin Franklin promoted vaccinations.
3. Therefore, Tail Gunner is wrong about vaccinations (or he should believe that Benjamin Franklin was generally lazy and ill-informed).



I can now see that my observation about people being lazy and ill-informed was a vast understatement. This is serious hamster thinking.

Post: #388

(01-31-2018 06:16 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  You dudes are so open-minded that your brains have fallen out.

I'm not sure what the core of your argument is.

Are you saying that a morbidly obese man who lives on cheetos and coke will have the same capacity to fend off a virus as a fit, healthy man who eats foods which are by colloquial definition "healthy"?

Quote:Holistic medicine is a form of healing that considers the whole person -- body, mind, spirit, and emotions -- in the quest for optimal health and wellness. According to the holistic medicine philosophy, one can achieve optimal health -- the primary goal of holistic medicine practice -- by gaining proper balance in life.

This is a pretty common approach for a lot of "normal" doctors now, particularly since so many afflictions can be linked to psychosomatic causes. It's the difference between prescribing anti-depressants or exercise and sunshine.

Is it your position that exercise and sunshine are irrelevant when dealing with depression? That some people are "born depressed" and can only be fixed with pills?

Post: #389

(01-31-2018 08:00 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 06:05 PM)Repo Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:51 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:43 PM)Repo Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  I was not any more demeaning to anyone else than I have been to myself.

(01-31-2018 05:27 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  The problem occurs when the lazy and the ill-informed wish to force their choices upon the rest of us. The same people who are so lackadaisical and negligent about their own health want their own do-nothing health philosophy foisted upon the innocent (i.e., those who have taken great pains over many years, or even decades, to safeguard their health and maximize their immune systems).

Really?

Oh, you were referring to that? Anyone who wishes to force their poor life choices on others in an authoritarian manner needs to be called out on it. I stand by my statement. The fact that you believe that the truth is demeaning is your problem, not mine.

"I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell." Harry S. Truman

Incredibly ironic that while trying to make your case you keep quoting people who don't even agree with you and by your own logic are lazy and ill-informed. Benjamin Franklin literally co-authored a guide on vaccinations related to smallpox. I guess him and his 4 year old son he lost to smallpox where just lackadaisical and negligent. Throwing in random quotes does not make you come across as well read, it just tells us that you lack critical thinking skills and how to decipher context.

My Benjamin Franklin quotation pertained to democracy as an unworkable form of government when protecting minority rights. He obviously agrees with me, because he was the one who made the statement.

What is ironic is that, while claiming that I lack critical thinking skills, by conflating Benjamin Franklin's quote about government and his guide on vaccines, you engaged in a non sequitur and proved your own lack of critical thinking skills. Your logic (you should see a big problem here):

1. Tail Gunner quoted Benjamin Franklin regarding democracy.
2. Benjamin Franklin promoted vaccinations.
3. Therefore, Tail Gunner is wrong about vaccinations (or he should believe that Benjamin Franklin was generally lazy and ill-informed).



I can now see that my observation about people being lazy and ill-informed was a vast understatement. This is serious hamster thinking.

That was not my logic, and the fact that you think it was proves my point about you lacking critical thinking skills. This is just another straw man you are throwing up again. If you actually want to counter an argument I made, which you have not done yet, then I will respond. Actually I probably won't since I don't want to get a warning, so have fun here.

Post: #390

(01-31-2018 08:40 PM)Repo Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 08:00 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 06:05 PM)Repo Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:51 PM)Tail Gunner Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 05:43 PM)Repo Wrote:  Really?

Oh, you were referring to that? Anyone who wishes to force their poor life choices on others in an authoritarian manner needs to be called out on it. I stand by my statement. The fact that you believe that the truth is demeaning is your problem, not mine.

"I never did give them hell. I just told the truth, and they thought it was hell." Harry S. Truman

Incredibly ironic that while trying to make your case you keep quoting people who don't even agree with you and by your own logic are lazy and ill-informed. Benjamin Franklin literally co-authored a guide on vaccinations related to smallpox. I guess him and his 4 year old son he lost to smallpox where just lackadaisical and negligent. Throwing in random quotes does not make you come across as well read, it just tells us that you lack critical thinking skills and how to decipher context.

My Benjamin Franklin quotation pertained to democracy as an unworkable form of government when protecting minority rights. He obviously agrees with me, because he was the one who made the statement.

What is ironic is that, while claiming that I lack critical thinking skills, by conflating Benjamin Franklin's quote about government and his guide on vaccines, you engaged in a non sequitur and proved your own lack of critical thinking skills. Your logic (you should see a big problem here):

1. Tail Gunner quoted Benjamin Franklin regarding democracy.
2. Benjamin Franklin promoted vaccinations.
3. Therefore, Tail Gunner is wrong about vaccinations (or he should believe that Benjamin Franklin was generally lazy and ill-informed).



I can now see that my observation about people being lazy and ill-informed was a vast understatement. This is serious hamster thinking.

That was not my logic, and the fact that you think it was proves my point about you lacking critical thinking skills. This is just another straw man you are throwing up again. If you actually want to counter an argument I made, which you have not done yet, then I will respond. Actually I probably won't since I don't want to get a warning, so have fun here.

I have three university degrees, so I have a keen understanding of the English language. So, if I misunderstood you (and you provided no explanation or evidence demonstrating that I did), it is because your writing skills are as limited as your critical thinking skills. Adios, Amigo.

Post: #391

(01-31-2018 08:18 PM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 06:16 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  You dudes are so open-minded that your brains have fallen out.

I'm not sure what the core of your argument is.

Are you saying that a morbidly obese man who lives on cheetos and coke will have the same capacity to fend off a virus as a fit, healthy man who eats foods which are by colloquial definition "healthy"?

No. I'm absolutely not saying that. I know that a healthy diet and regular exercise can help you fend off a lot of ailments. You should see my diet--it's exemplary...

But not all diseases can be defeated by diet and exercise. Obviously, you can promote the onslaught of some disease by walking around looking like 200 lbs of chewed bubble gum, drinking too much, smoking, other poor life decisions, etc.

But some diseases are due to a genetic vulnerability, stressful life events, medications, and other medical problems one may have. It doesn't matter what you eat in those cases.

"An apple a day keeps the doctor away," is fun to say, but that doesn't make it true.

And (although your other statement wasn't directed to me), if I may, there are absolutely forms of depression due to a chemical imbalances in the brain, problems with neurotransmitters, the brain's regulation of serotonin, etc., and they can only be treated with medication. The doctors (and there are a few) who do not agree with that are dismissed by the grand majority of doctors that know it's true. Many have tried to disprove the effectiveness and question the use of anti-depressants, but their arguments fall flat on their faces and those doctors are ridiculed by their peers. Although some doctors disagree with the chemical imbalance theory, none have generated a peer reviewed product that passes scientific scrutiny.

Post: #392

(01-31-2018 10:47 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  

(01-31-2018 08:18 PM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  [quote='Dulceácido' pid='1729359' dateline='1517440612']
You dudes are so open-minded that your brains have fallen out.

"An apple a day keeps the doctor away," is fun to say, but that doesn't make it true.

No, science and the fact that it works makes it true.

Quote:It may sound far-fetched but an apple contains so many beneficial ingredients that it will protect you from contracting a whole range of life threatening conditions such as cancer or suffering a stroke.
* * *
Apples beat cancer

Researchers in Hawaii found that an increased consumption of quercetin (from apples and onions) was associated with a reduced risk of lung cancer.

This was supported by epidemiologists from Finland's National Public Health Institute who concluded that a flavonoid-rich diet (and particularly those flavonoids from apples) was associated with a reduced risk of developing cancer.

Their study of 9,959 cancer-free men and women revealed that people who regularly consumed the most flavonoid-rich foods were about 20 per cent less likely to develop cancer.

The researchers found that lung cancer was 46 percent lower among those on these diets and that high consumption of apples was also directly associated with the lowest risk for coronary mortality.

This conclusion was based on their analysis of diet and health outcomes of an ongoing study of 5,133 Finnish men and women aged 30-69, who were initially free of heart disease when the study began in 1967.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/health/articl...rokes.html


There is a 28-page thread on this forum with numerous testimonials by forum members who have experienced the health benefits of apple cider vinegar.

/thread-7518.html

Post: #393

(01-31-2018 10:47 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  ...
No. I'm absolutely not saying that. I know that a healthy diet and regular exercise can help you fend off a lot of ailments. You should see my diet--it's exemplary...

But not all diseases can be defeated by diet and exercise. Obviously, you can promote the onslaught of some disease by walking around looking like 200 lbs of chewed bubble gum, drinking too much, smoking, other poor life decisions, etc.

But some diseases are due to a genetic vulnerability, stressful life events, medications, and other medical problems one may have. It doesn't matter what you eat in those cases.
...

This is why I think we need to stay away from absolutes and riducule. For example, some forms of depression are biological, some are lifestyle and some are a combination of the two. I should think we all have known enough people during our lives that we don't need a peer reviewed study to see the truth in that.

And you're right in that some diseases cannot be fought simply by living healthy, but neither should we be jamming ourselves full of questionable medicines when it's not necessary. Flu vaccinations are a prime example. I have seen medical fact sheets which state:

1) The flu shot does not cause any adverse reactions.
2) Any adverse reactions to the flu shot can be minimised with paracetamol.



I got it about a decade ago and within four hours of being injected with that shit I was left with severe muscle aches and cold shivers for several days. It wasn't just me. About a dozen other health workers suffered similar effects. In our state we had a vaccine reaction register which was supposed to exist to prove that vaccines were perfectly safe. Only three of us had the guts to tell the woman administering the program that we wanted to register a negative reaction to the vaccine and she told us point blank she wouldn't put our details in the register because the reaction wasn't vaccine related.

Brilliant system. If just a few people tow the line then at the end of the year they can publish a peer reviewed study which shows there are no adverse reactions to the flu vaccine, and the few people who know the truth are lambasted as "science deniers".

Post: #394

That's right, the rate of people dying, in retirement home, from flu shot today is higher from the rate of people dying from real flu from the last 15years and now that it is mandatory the conspirationist in me think that it is a better and cheaper to decrease the aging population and others suppositions that I won't discuss here.

Also there is a direct correlation between the massive hepatitis B vaccination campaign 30 years ago and the apparition of multiple case of sclerosis 20 years later (12% of the population who got shot).

People need to be careful with those vaccines now that you'll be outlawed if you refuse them, that's my only message here.

Post: #395

There are already punitive measures in place in Australia for refusing vaccinations and they creep closer every year to becoming flat out mandatory.

The ugly question inevitably rears it's head, if vaccination becomes mandatory then what motive will corporations have to make them safe?

Personally I've already experienced the "checks and balances" they use to stifle negative outcomes. It wont be long before someone complaining about a vaccine related illness will immediately be slapped with a cease and desist order on the premise of "protecting the greater good".

If we reach that point then I can say with absolute honesty that I will up stakes and take my family to a "shithole" nation where the state does not have a complete license to poison you and your children at will. Anyone that trusts these psychopaths to do the right thing has clearly not been paying attention to history. Polio may be a son-of-a-bitch, but it's not sentient and as such it doesn't have a burning desire to reduce me and mine to the state of borderline retarded slaves.

Post: #396

(02-01-2018 08:16 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  The ugly question inevitably rears it's head, if vaccination becomes mandatory then what motive will corporations have to make them safe?

Capitalism. Give consumers choice which company they want to receive their vaccination from. ( I think only certain more serious vaccinations should be mandatory). This creates incentive for a company to develop a "safer" way to vaccinate, they can then patent and advertise it, people pick the safer option, everyone wins.

Post: #397

(02-01-2018 01:47 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  And you're right in that some diseases cannot be fought simply by living healthy, but neither should we be jamming ourselves full of questionable medicines when it's not necessary. Flu vaccinations are a prime example. I have seen medical fact sheets which state:

1) The flu shot does not cause any adverse reactions.
2) Any adverse reactions to the flu shot can be minimised with paracetamol.



I got it about a decade ago and within four hours of being injected with that shit I was left with severe muscle aches and cold shivers for several days. It wasn't just me. About a dozen other health workers suffered similar effects. In our state we had a vaccine reaction register which was supposed to exist to prove that vaccines were perfectly safe. Only three of us had the guts to tell the woman administering the program that we wanted to register a negative reaction to the vaccine and she told us point blank she wouldn't put our details in the register because the reaction wasn't vaccine related.

Brilliant system. If just a few people tow the line then at the end of the year they can publish a peer reviewed study which shows there are no adverse reactions to the flu vaccine, and the few people who know the truth are lambasted as "science deniers".

I agree wholeheartedly. There are some vaccines which have a muddled efficacy. Funny you mention the flu shot (for you Americans Paracetamol is Tylenol), in the military there is a 100% accountability which is command directed that everyone get the "flu shot" (rarely a shot these days, mostly it's an inhalant) and this is not in the elderly, this is mostly young to middle-aged people in relatively excellent health, and the running joke is, "I never get the flu until I get the flu shot." I've seen it happen myself, but most of the "adverse reactions" were injection site pain and swelling. That's probably why they went to the inhalant.

And the military has a wonderful history of human "lab ratting." When we invaded Iraq everyone had to get the Anthrax vaccine. You know, because of all those pesky chemical weapons we found. That vaccine was clearly 99% effective in bovine animals in preventing the contraction of anthrax, but there was absolutely 0 studies surrounding the long-term effects in humans--none whatsoever. But, we had to do it (technically an illegal order, some lawsuits are pending) and this thing fucked you up, you developed a big herpetic like eruption at the injection site and people got sick and you were told to avoid contact with your children--all kinds of weird shit. I was the medic and I clearly saw the problems with it. I felt horrible giving it to all my platoon mates and I didn't take it myself; I forged my records. I still feel guilty about that, but I had no choice.

But, that's not to say we should discredit vaccinations outright. Small pox was declared eradicated by The World Health Organization in 1980, until this movement came along, then we had a few cases in 2007 in a agricultural community of religious nuts that refused to have their children vaccinated. They prayed that they wouldn't get small pox, but God ignored their cries.

MMR, Polio, Female Condyloma, and dozens more I'll omit for the sake of brevity, are all great examples of solid efficacy and success in vaccinations.

Problems arise in issues such as the influenza vaccine (elderly and those with immunodeficiency need the flu vaccine, whether it is necessary in otherwise healthy people is up for grabs) or the anthrax vaccine I mentioned above when they clearly didn't get it right. Now people freak out and discredit all immunizations. To the other extreme, there are people like the guy above that think the "flu shot" is a lethal injection used to execute the elderly in order to control the population. WTF?

That's what I meant by saying, you're so open-minded your brains have fallen out. Let's not throw out the baby with the bathwater, right?

Obviously, some diseases are preventable with good dietary health and exercise. Diabetes and heart disease comes to mind. But, some people are born with diabetes, heart disease, or the genetic proclivity to develop it and there's nothing they can do about it.

Post: #398

The perils of living in a society where the elites are so far removed from wanting the best outcomes for their people. At least back in the day when Eastildor was ever in a state of readiness to rebuff the advances of Westildor the kings of those respective nations wanted their citizens as fit and healthy as they could possibly be.

These days there's an overwhelming sense that most of the world is under thumb and the only thing the elites have to fear are the citizens themselves, hence the drive to keep us healthy and smart enough to fulfil our duties but dumb and sick enough never to aspire to anything better.

Post: #399

I'm going to take a break from the board, and when I return I'll write a post that addresses some of the valid/invalid points made in this thread. As much as I'm tempted to argue, it's too easy to find bad information on the web, and not all good information can be found on the web, so in the interest of not wasting my time I'm going to hold off until I can do it right the first time.

I'm posting this for accountability reasons.

Post: #400

The documentary VAXXED: From Cover-Up to Catastrophe is explored with filmmakers Andrew Wakefield and Del Bigtree. This interview breaks down the film’s fraud accusations against the CDC, the MMR vaccine controversy and the power of Big Pharma:





BREAKDOWN:
00:01 Welcoming Andrew Wakefield and Del Bigtree to Antidote.
00:35 The MMR vaccine controversy.
08:30 The autism “epidemic”.
12:30 CDC fraud accusations.
18:35 Claims of evidence linking early MMR vaccines with autism.
24:20 Vaccination side effects and the power of Big Pharma.
28:30 Studies on vaccinated children vs. unvaccinated children.
34:25 The CDC conflict of interest and regulating vaccines.
38:55 Protecting Big Pharma from vaccine injury lawsuits.
42:50 Action points.
47:35 VAXXED Clip, Trailer.