Post: #1

The big artists from the 90s are all turning 40. The following outcomes are germane to them:

(1) They get their first dose of mortality, their first dose of knowing they really are past it and they won't be able to succeed off attention whoring anymore.
(2) Their bodies are changing, so that big speedball is more likely to kill them than take them out for a weekend.

I'd guess with this one it's mostly (1) with a possible hint of (2). "Died suddenly" is always a euphemism for suicide.

God save us from people who mean well. -storm

Post: #2

http://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-42696376

Dolores O'Riordan was a great singer and a wall survivor. Wasn't expecting her to die at age 46. What is it with all of the big artist from the 90s dying suddenly?

Post: #3

I wouldn't have called her a wall survivor even before she died; she looked more like a zombie. The video you posted is from 24 years ago lol.

Post: #4

In a strange coincidence, I had the Cranberries song "Linger" stuck in my head all weekend and I couldn't figure out why.

They were definitely a big part of the sounds of the '90's.

Post: #5

Why are they all dying? Can’t hold their drugs. I had concert tickets to see them in ‘96. Her bipolar flared up and it was canceled 2 days before the show. This was before the days of automatic refunds. Back then you had to go somewhere in person and demand and a refund. I don’t think I got mine.

Post: #6

I have the occasional fetish for a short haired broad with a pretty face and tight body and I do not find her overly attractive. Talented band, though.

Post: #7

I always preferred the Sundays, even though they never reached the same level of fame.

Post: #8

(01-16-2018 01:27 PM)RIslander Wrote:  I have the occasional fetish for a short haired broad with a pretty face and tight body and I do not find her overly attractive. Talented band, though.

For me, she could look hot one moment and then awful the next. It's like she could bounce between 7 and 4 depending on how long her hair and how anorexic she was on the day she appeared on camera.

Damn good voice on her. I'm sad to see another 90's music icon check out way too early.

Post: #9

(01-16-2018 01:42 PM)Germanicus Wrote:  

(01-16-2018 01:27 PM)RIslander Wrote:  I have the occasional fetish for a short haired broad with a pretty face and tight body and I do not find her overly attractive. Talented band, though.

For me, she could look hot one moment and then awful the next. It's like she could bounce between 7 and 4 depending on how long her hair and how anorexic she was on the day she appeared on camera.

Damn good voice on her. I'm sad to see another 90's music icon check out way too early.

Post: #10

I naturally wonder if there was some self-destructive behavior going on. She was only 46, and she had three kids. I assume they were all born after 1994. It's a sad story indeed, because "Zombie" is a masterpiece.

A few big names of the 1980's have died. It does seem like we've lost more from the 1990's though, and that makes no sense at all.

Post: #11

Drugs and alcohol have always been linked to the music industry. In the late 70s through the 80s it was all about cocaine. Contrary to popular belief, it’s pretty hard to get yourself in trouble with just cocaine. It’s the other shit you’re doing at the same time as the coke that causes problems(speedballling). It’s the underlying heart condition (I.e. hypertrophic cardiomyopathy) that’s aggravated by coke use.

If you look at the popularity of drugs in the music industry over time, you’ll see the trends there mimic those in the larger population. Post ww2 heroin/opiate use was rampant among jazz musicians. In the 50s and early 60s it was alcohol. By the late 60s it was everything. Heroin, coke, etc. 10 years later, coke was king. Then coke got distorted into crack(a dirty drug) and heroin became popular again by 1990. By 2000 coke was popular once again. In ‘08 we’re back to opiates.

Heroin is a dirty drug. You’ll never associate heroin use with cleanliness. Cocaine is considered a clean drug but crack is not. Crack btw was invented to protect guys like Shitavious Washington from the inherent dangers of ether creep while doing freebase. In all seriousness, crack was the end result of the coke trend enjoying such a long undisputed time at the top. It was bound to get bastardized into something ugly.

What you’ll notice about the late 60s/early 70s, and the 90s is that in the 60s/70s you had dirty unwashed hippies. In the 90s you had the grunge movement/alternative which was little more than the children of hippies attempting to one up their parents. They did more drugs , harder drugs, and they dressed even worse, with less concern over personal hygiene.

In a nutshell, heroin/opiates/opioids become popular whenever cultural attitudes reject cleanliness and high standards of appearance. The time the cranberries were popular was a time when a large portion of the youth embraced filth. It’s when facial piercings and tats on women became popular. The music cultural of the time embraced hard, heavy drug use with heroin and lsd being among their favorites.

I remember being in school back then and you could watch girls who were 8s transform into 5s within a few months if they decided to embrace that grunge shit. A girl you rubbed one out too while imaging her grinding on your face turned into someone who looked like a homeless person you didn’t want to stand closely to because you just know they smell awful.

Post: #12

She was married for 20 years, then divorced, with a crazy airplane rage incident that got her arrested after the separation. The husband had the three kids while she was in the mental hospital. Don't know what happened to the kids after the divorce. It sounds like they still stayed with their father.

She seems like a classic case of a middle aged career woman who decided she wasn't happy with a good husband, so she went eat, pray, love.

I hope her family and children find comfort and peace after their loss, so I don't want to speak ill of the dead too much, but I think her death is largely caused by her trying to live the feminist dream instead of being happy with her husband and children.

Post: #13

One thing we don't know is how much money she actually made. People in the music industry make a lot of money, but never actually get their hands on that money. With all the parasites in the industry, we don't know how rich or poor she was. Touring is often the best way for performers to make money.

Do you remember when the girls in TLC declared bankruptcy?

My point is that she might have been touring out of necessity, not because she wanted to. Rick Dees, for example, once broke down the money that performers make on a CA. They get about 9%. Producers and writers also get a cut. The record companies and agents and managers get huge cuts.

Post: #14

There's a chance she made some money in the 90s.

Nowadays most artists get an advance, which is a loan, and generally don't meet the requirements to keep it. They also sign away their tour and merchandise money.

A couple years ago Young Thug, a top rapper (popularity wise, he mumbles and wears skirts don't like him) was worth $15,000. He may have more now, don't know, could also be in debt fucking himself signing that line of paper.

Post: #15

While still very much alive.
Billy Corgan's account of what it is like to live & breathe the music industry machine of the 90's as an idealistic & somewhat naive 20-something is quite the eye-opener.

Distribution rights over parallel universes...? The fuck?

Post: #16

(01-16-2018 03:33 PM)porscheguy Wrote:  In a nutshell, heroin/opiates/opioids become popular whenever cultural attitudes reject cleanliness and high standards of appearance.

Actual cleanliness and high standards of appearance would involve not doing drugs, IMO.

Post: #17

(01-16-2018 07:43 PM)CynicalContrarian Wrote:  While still very much alive.
Billy Corgan's account of what it is like to live & breathe the music industry machine of the 90's as an idealistic & somewhat naive 20-something is quite the eye-opener.

Distribution rights over parallel universes...? The fuck?

That's all negotiation.

As I mentioned in another thread, I took much lower advances from labels with the understanding the label was only licensing the rights to release my sound recording for a set period of time, after which the rights returned to me.

Digital streaming has fucked over the artist's ability to do this.

One bit of knowledge I've told people that no-one ever seems to believe is this: your music is focus tested by most labels, where a diverse range of listeners rate your songs between 1 for bad, and 5 for great.

I was getting consistent 5's. I was initially-pleased by this, until the suits said, "No, no, that's a bad thing." You see, 5's make the advertisers nervous. They're paying to catch the listener's attention between the songs by standing out more than the songs themselves. If your 5 ends, the listener might be too busy thinking about the song, trying to remember it or the artist's name, and not be paying attention to the advertising.

If you write 5's, Radio won't touch you, which is why i was told by the Suits, "What you really need to do is go back, and write a bunch of 3's." They were serious.

It was a shit enough industry before the Silicon Valley wankers got involved.

Still, at least the labels had some kind of personal investment in you. Apple and Google doesn't care if artists starve do death.

Post: #18

(01-16-2018 12:50 PM)porscheguy Wrote:  Why are they all dying? Can’t hold their drugs. I had concert tickets to see them in ‘96. Her bipolar flared up and it was canceled 2 days before the show. This was before the days of automatic refunds. Back then you had to go somewhere in person and demand and a refund. I don’t think I got mine.

That job must have sucked.

Post: #19

I heard about this today, what the hell happened to her?

Post: #20

(01-16-2018 09:53 PM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  That's all negotiation.

As I mentioned in another thread, I took much lower advances from labels with the understanding the label was only licensing the rights to release my sound recording for a set period of time, after which the rights returned to me.

Digital streaming has fucked over the artist's ability to do this.

One bit of knowledge I've told people that no-one ever seems to believe is this: your music is focus tested by most labels, where a diverse range of listeners rate your songs between 1 for bad, and 5 for great.

I was getting consistent 5's. I was initially-pleased by this, until the suits said, "No, no, that's a bad thing." You see, 5's make the advertisers nervous. They're paying to catch the listener's attention between the songs by standing out more than the songs themselves. If your 5 ends, the listener might be too busy thinking about the song, trying to remember it or the artist's name, and not be paying attention to the advertising.

If you write 5's, Radio won't touch you, which is why i was told by the Suits, "What you really need to do is go back, and write a bunch of 3's." They were serious.

It was a shit enough industry before the Silicon Valley wankers got involved.

Still, at least the labels had some kind of personal investment in you. Apple and Google doesn't care if artists starve do death.

If nothing else, what I find ludicrous about the notion of distribution rights over parallel universes, is that it's such an intangible & nigh on pointless demand.
Mere power play though it may be.

Even your example of '5s' being a problem (while a far more real world example), is also evidence of how it appears to be more about money making & control as opposed to producing the best music possible.

Post: #21

(01-16-2018 09:57 PM)Kurgan Wrote:  I heard about this today, what the hell happened to her?

It took several weeks or longer before Amy Winhouse's cause of death was released, wasn't it? I assume it will be the same with this lady.

By the way, I just read the account of her air rage arrest, and I think she got a celebrity pussy pass even though the judge in the case took pains to deny that that was the case. She stomped on a stewardess's leg, requiring her to get medical treatment, then spit on and headbutted a police officer. The judge declined to give her a criminal conviction. Is that really normal for Ireland if you spit on and headbutt a police officer?

Post: #22

I'm not going to rip on her. She probably died from drugs as most singers of her genre tend to go out and as we've seen. The 90's singers have all seemed to drop like flies in the past few years.

In my opinion she was genuinely talented as a singer and had some really good songs out there. Sure it was all about heavily biased Irish socio political shit but it was good. Even though I didn't care for Zombie it does get nearly unlimited playtime in asia.

Linger and Dreams were interesting songs though. No depth sure.. but interesting. They were surreal in their qualities and other worldly.

Post: #23

I think that she had some massive personal problems especially as she aged. She had 3 kids, but that did not help.

Quote:In November 2014, O'Riordan was arrested and charged in connection with air rage on an Aer Lingus flight from New York to Shannon. During the flight she grew verbally and physically abusive with crew. When police were arresting her after landing, she resisted, reminding them her taxes paid their wages and shouting "I'm the Queen of Limerick! I'm an icon!", headbutting one Garda officer and spitting at another.[43] Later she told the media that she had been stressed from living in New York hotels following the end of her 20-year marriage.[44] The judge hearing her case agreed to dismiss all charges if she apologised in writing to those she injured and contributed €6,000 to the court poor box.[43]

In May 2017, she publicly discussed her bipolar disorder, which she said had been diagnosed two years earlier.[45] That same month, the Cranberries cited her back problems as the reason for cancelling the second part of the group's European tour. In late 2017, O'Riordan said she was recovering and performed at a private event.[46][47]

Fame is almost useless to women frankly. Men use it to get laid and can have a great time if they don't abuse drugs too much.

But for women it just inflates their egos. The best way that women can be is to use the fame to get a high-value husband and be happy with him while avoiding the pull of the celeb supplication.

It's very possible that she took plenty of the legal drugs - antidepressants and various psychotropics. Honestly after having researched that crap I honestly believe that they are far more destructive for your health than pure heroin or cocaine abuse.

Post: #24

(01-17-2018 12:28 AM)CynicalContrarian Wrote:  Even your example of '5s' being a problem (while a far more real world example), is also evidence of how it appears to be more about money making & control as opposed to producing the best music possible.

To sum up my long experience with the music industry:

It's about getting dumb people to buy dumb shit sold by controllable puppets with heavy-handed managers singing songs written by songwriters and producers that are in favour with the label heads, hopefully involving samples owned by copyright holders so lawyers need to get involved, all in the name of not scaring off advertisers.

There's over-representation in all those italicized fields by two particular ethnic groups. No points, obviously, for guessing the first, but can you guess the second?

Post: #25

(01-16-2018 09:53 PM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  

(01-16-2018 07:43 PM)CynicalContrarian Wrote:  While still very much alive.
Billy Corgan's account of what it is like to live & breathe the music industry machine of the 90's as an idealistic & somewhat naive 20-something is quite the eye-opener.

Distribution rights over parallel universes...? The fuck?

That's all negotiation.

As I mentioned in another thread, I took much lower advances from labels with the understanding the label was only licensing the rights to release my sound recording for a set period of time, after which the rights returned to me.

Digital streaming has fucked over the artist's ability to do this.

One bit of knowledge I've told people that no-one ever seems to believe is this: your music is focus tested by most labels, where a diverse range of listeners rate your songs between 1 for bad, and 5 for great.

I was getting consistent 5's. I was initially-pleased by this, until the suits said, "No, no, that's a bad thing." You see, 5's make the advertisers nervous. They're paying to catch the listener's attention between the songs by standing out more than the songs themselves. If your 5 ends, the listener might be too busy thinking about the song, trying to remember it or the artist's name, and not be paying attention to the advertising.

If you write 5's, Radio won't touch you, which is why i was told by the Suits, "What you really need to do is go back, and write a bunch of 3's." They were serious.

It was a shit enough industry before the Silicon Valley wankers got involved.

Still, at least the labels had some kind of personal investment in you. Apple and Google doesn't care if artists starve do death.

I find that utterly unsurprising. Is there really no way that you can publish your music for a profit? I would dearly love to hear some of it.