Post: #1

So I have a lot of success pulling girls from different avenues, whether Tinder, Instagram, Day game, night game, events, etc. I also do pretty well in closing them because I've traveled a lot and have a lot of cool pictures, videos, etc. However, my problem comes up after I've started seeing a girl. I've lost all my best girls, LTR's, potential LTR's, or hottest plates because they didn't feel an emotional connection with me. Normally, I wouldn't care or make a post about it but it seems to be happening quite consistently.

Some examples:
1) My first LTR we broke up after a long time because she didn't feel an emotional connection. I won that break up so not upset
2) Lost the second girlfriend because she didn't feel an emotional connection
3) I've lost a ton of flings in between because they didn't feel an emotional connection
4) I just lost a stunning 5'9 Russian girl I was seeing for the past month because she didn't feel an emotional connection.

Now it's adding up to a recurring pattern that I need to address. I've talked to my roommate about it and he suggested that I just need to start being a little jealous sometimes, ask the girls if they're seeing other guys, etc. Sometimes just get mad at the girls for dumb things.

Now I'm a super analytical and very logical person. I'm pretty good at solving problems and remain pretty neutral on most topics during dates etc. If a girl does something dumb whether career move etc, I've learned its better to just encourage it and not say anything. I'm also not really the jealous type because if the girl is seeing another guy, well they're doing it behind my back anyway and will continue doing it regardless if I get mad or not. Frankly, I've just never really cared much about being jealous or angry etc.

Which now brings me to the point, are these some of the things I should start doing? Are there other ways I can build an emotional connection?

I've also been described as a pretty cold person by others (co-workers, etc.). I'm not sure why because I think I'm pretty nice, but this is something I definitely want some advice on addressing.

Post: #2

Your roommates suggestion about being jealous, asking about other guys, and getting mad at girls is irresponsible and terrible advice.

Sounds like you're stoic, not cold.

My question is, if the way you described yourself is truly how you are, how are you pulling these girls ?

Also another thought, do you think maybe these girls are giving the excuse "emotional connection" as an excuse to bail or jump to some other dude ?

You need to stop being so analytical, and just live in the moment you're with a woman and actually enjoy their company.

Not giving a shit is one of the best tools you have in your shed - don't ever get rid of that.

Knowing when to turn it up or down is what you need to master.

Another question, are you having fun with these girls, do you have any emotions, as in like or love any of these women ?

It sounds like you're "aloof" for the lack of a better word.

Are you trying to find a serious relationship or wifey material ?

I think the questions I asked and maybe a little bit more about your personality will help.

Post: #3

You are who you are. Probably just a cold ass mofo.

Don't change who you are, your chill is probably what draws them in.

Post: #4

Stay on point. Chances are, you'll find a girl that's similar to you and she won't even notice.

Post: #5

Lack of emotional connection is a blanket term for a lot of things. You're probably aloof and that's great, it works for getting laid.

Girls will rationalize when they can't nail you down and they will use this term to put the blame on you.

Assuming you want to work on this, it will make you more of a suitable LTR candidate.

Off the top of my head without knowing you but based off other guys and our discussions:

- show some vulnerability from time to time and build comfort; make it a 'two-way street', emotionally
- fuck them well and use the pillow talk for the emotional 'building' -> the post-sex window is when we show most of our 'emotions' and fucking them well sets the tone for how they process your emotions (soft vs. vulnerable - 2 different things)
- listening to them. You don't even need to listen, just give them that impression i.e. pay attention to them
- take an interest in their lives and transition this to a more philosophical discussion to connect
- call them out on their shit from time to time -> this means fall for a shit test (the small ones) every now and then i.e. concede here and there

Long story short, you can substitute emotional connection for affection. Don't stress about it though because the list above is just a list. It's the woman's prerogative to stimulate the affection from you.

Same way it's our job to stimulate their sexual side.

Everyone has this, it's just dormant to varying degrees.

The fact that you're analytical and rational is a win in every aspect of life so don't let it bring you down unless you're actively looking for a partner.

Post: #6

Do you ever get true deep feelings for these women you date or not? Have you ever felt love?

Post: #7

(12-01-2017 12:21 PM)kaotic Wrote:  Your roommates suggestion about being jealous, asking about other guys, and getting mad at girls is irresponsible and terrible advice.

Sounds like you're stoic, not cold.

My question is, if the way you described yourself is truly how you are, how are you pulling these girls ?

Also another thought, do you think maybe these girls are giving the excuse "emotional connection" as an excuse to bail or jump to some other dude ?

You need to stop being so analytical, and just live in the moment you're with a woman and actually enjoy their company.

Not giving a shit is one of the best tools you have in your shed - don't ever get rid of that.

Knowing when to turn it up or down is what you need to master.

Another question, are you having fun with these girls, do you have any emotions, as in like or love any of these women ?

It sounds like you're "aloof" for the lack of a better word.

Are you trying to find a serious relationship or wifey material ?

I think the questions I asked and maybe a little bit more about your personality will help.

I agree, Stoic is a good word

1) Well on paper I'm pretty awesome. Super smart, successful, world traveler, photos, videos, social proof etc. all to back it. I just pretty much run neutral / don't fuck it up game. Show them my travels, tell them some of the stories, etc. It's actually kind of a formula at this point since it's usually the same photos and stories etc. most of the time.

2) It could be an excuse, but I don't think it is. Girl #2 definitely wasn't an excuse. We both want it to work but she just doesn't feel that connection.

3) I do enjoy their company. Although, I suppose I put a higher emphasis on getting laid vs. anything else. But as long as I'm getting laid I'll spend time with them anywhere. I love walking around and seeing stuff (I hold their hand too) etc. How can I find other avenues of displaying affection or showing them I enjoy their company?

4) I agree its nice to not give a shit. But losing a good girl always hurts, especially if its the same reason too, gotta fix that analytically speaking.

5) I mean most of them are probably short-term flings which is why I don't give a shit, but I do like them as people or I wouldn't spend time with them. But my long term relationships also ended for the same reason. So I do want to start improving now before I lose a wifey-material type woman to this. #2 was wifey material for me.

Well if I am aloof, I want to be less aloof, any recommendations on how to go about it?

Post: #8

(12-01-2017 12:21 PM)Steelex Wrote:  You are who you are. Probably just a cold ass mofo.

Don't change who you are, your chill is probably what draws them in.

I agree, I don't have a problem drawing in. I just have a problem keeping them in.

(12-01-2017 12:27 PM)Dulceácido Wrote:  Stay on point. Chances are, you'll find a girl that's similar to you and she won't even notice.

I agree, but very few women are super analytical as well. In addition, the ones that are usually aren't too pretty

(12-01-2017 12:35 PM)Noir Wrote:  Lack of emotional connection is a blanket term for a lot of things. You're probably aloof and that's great, it works for getting laid.

Girls will rationalize when they can't nail you down and they will use this term to put the blame on you.

Assuming you want to work on this, it will make you more of a suitable LTR candidate.

Off the top of my head without knowing you but based off other guys and our discussions:

- show some vulnerability from time to time and build comfort; make it a 'two-way street', emotionally
- fuck them well and use the pillow talk for the emotional 'building' -> the post-sex window is when we show most of our 'emotions' and fucking them well sets the tone for how they process your emotions (soft vs. vulnerable - 2 different things)
- listening to them. You don't even need to listen, just give them that impression i.e. pay attention to them
- take an interest in their lives and transition this to a more philosophical discussion to connect
- call them out on their shit from time to time -> this means fall for a shit test (the small ones) every now and then i.e. concede here and there

Long story short, you can substitute emotional connection for affection. Don't stress about it though because the list above is just a list. It's the woman's prerogative to stimulate the affection from you.

Same way it's our job to stimulate their sexual side.

Everyone has this, it's just dormant to varying degrees.

The fact that you're analytical and rational is a win in every aspect of life so don't let it bring you down unless you're actively looking for a partner.

Great suggestions. With #4, the Russian girl we had actually done quite a bit of pillow talk that I thought I had done well on and was building comfort. Apparently, that wasn't enough. Maybe she just didn't like my answers or something.

How can I show vulnerability? How do you guys do it? I have a pretty good life so I gotta figure out what to be vulnerable about too...

(12-01-2017 12:45 PM)scheme00 Wrote:  Do you ever get true deep feelings for these women you date or not? Have you ever felt love?

Depends on how you define love. I mean I'm not sure. Maybe with #2. But I mean if love means putting someone else's needs before your own...well I mean my survival > someone else's, right?


Also, Kaotic - I've read that women need to experience a full range of emotions to keep them interested. I feel like jealousy and getting mad at them once in a while is a part of it?
Girlfriend #2 used to get bothered by the fact that I never got jealous. I get she liked the fact that the guy gets protective over her. My roommate also sent me an example of this yesterday. I always just figured it's beta. But I can pretend at X point in a relationship if needed

Post: #9

(12-01-2017 12:54 PM)True Balla Wrote:  How can I show vulnerability?

Drink more soy.

Post: #10

Sexual polarity is what makes a woman attracted to you. The masculine and feminine tension that allows a woman to go to bed with you, and start a relationship with you, doesn't work for long-term. Guys want to talk about "frame" all the time but they fail to understand this concept. It's why most of us who get 50+ lays a year are complete shit when it comes to relationships.

What can you do? Become more venerable, allowing yourself to eventually get hurt or find a woman who needs you to survive, what many 3rd world pussy hopping guys do, which will probably not happen in the USA, or date a woman further on the masculine side of the scale "not expecting much sexual tension and sexual enjoyment" which will lead to a bland relationship.

Or you can just except things like they are and stop trying to fight it and enjoy making the memories "Short-term" until you find a woman worthy enough for you to lower the walls and make sacrifices -- which may never happen or could happen tomorrow.

Post: #11

(12-01-2017 12:54 PM)True Balla Wrote:  Depends on how you define love. I mean I'm not sure. Maybe with #2. But I mean if love means putting someone else's needs before your own...well I mean my survival > someone else's, right?
Also, Kaotic - I've read that women need to experience a full range of emotions to keep them interested. I feel like jealousy and getting mad at them once in a while is a part of it?
Girlfriend #2 used to get bothered by the fact that I never got jealous. I get she liked the fact that the guy gets protective over her. My roommate also sent me an example of this yesterday. I always just figured it's beta. But I can pretend at X point in a relationship if needed

Ok. I have learned that there is a good way and a bad way to express jealousy. Do not come across as controlling or untrusting... ever. When a woman says she wants you to be jealous what she really means is that she wants to see you act PROTECTIVE. That means pushing off competitive males. If a guy comes up to buy your girl a drink, tell him to shove off. If a guy comes up to buy your girl a drink and you act aloof... she is going to feel like you just don't give a shit... like you are not willing to stand up to another guy for her... like she isn't worth your effort. Does that make sense?

See, when women say something you honestly need to translate it, because most of them don't understand how they are feeling, they just know they feel it. So it's like Kaotic said... "no emotional connection" could mean a ton of different things. I tend to come across as cold and aloof as well. In my experience women typically mean that they are feeling I lack passion. I spent years trying to figure out what created that "passionate" feeling in a woman. My guess is that you just need to show a woman your passionate side, and if you are like me and don't have one... then learn to fake it.

Regarding showing vulnerability, you can do this many ways, some will turn her on and some will turn her off. I don't suggest doing this until you are deep into a relationship.

Post: #12

I am more on the stoic side as well OP, so sometimes forming an emotional connection is difficult for me. Like EndsExpect said, sometimes you just have to fake it.

But ask yourself, do you really want to?

If you're like me, getting them in bed is the easy part. Keeping them around is hard. But instead of asking yourself "why can't I form an emotional bond with them?" ask "Do I reallywant to form an emotional bond with them?"

In my case it's hard for a woman to keep my attention longer than a few weeks. They bore me after awhile. And I think women have a kind of six sense about this. Some may try and talk about, others may feel it's a lost cause and bail before you can beat them to the punch.

But yeah, just listening to them bitch about whatever is a good starter. Instead of trying to provide answers to her problems, be more of an emotional cushion. "Oh I feel so bad for you" or "I can understand why you feel that way". In other words, don't fix her problems. Just listen to her complain. Make it easier on yourself and be highly intoxicated when doing this.

Post: #13

(12-01-2017 02:45 PM)[email protected] Wrote:  I am more on the stoic side as well OP, so sometimes forming an emotional connection is difficult for me. Like EndsExpect said, sometimes you just have to fake it.
But ask yourself, do you really want to?
If you're like me, getting them in bed is the easy part. Keeping them around is hard. But instead of asking yourself "why can't I form an emotional bond with them?" ask "Do I reallywant to form an emotional bond with them?"

I never see guys on the forum really talk about this. I mean there is an enormous amount of focus on how to get a one night stand (rightly so!). Very little talk goes on about what to do once you get a woman naked. I see some guys sharing sexual tips and tricks over in the BSDM thread, but that's about it. I rarely see threads regarding how to adapt game to relationships.

I'm not a very emotional guy. When I was young I used to worry that I was some kind of sociopath. In my experience if a woman can engage my emotions even just a little bit... the sex gets much better. I've done ONS and LTR sex quite a bit and I feel like they are significantly different in the way they feel. My biggest struggle is that just like you I get bored with women rather quickly.

Post: #14

Show vulnerability. If it's real it will be harder and it gives you less control, if it's fake you will have a hard time being congruent but if it's exploited there's no real consequence.

Part of that is taking emotional risks. Like introducing a girl to family, saying I love you, going out of your way to show how much you care. Don't simp out and like playcate or be the guy that puts out all the effort and doesn't get anything in return, but take risks that could hurt your ego or at least make it seem like it. Wait for her reciprocate then up the anty, escalate it.

All of this is good for bonding which is what these girls mean when they say "emotional connection" or "chemistry" or whatever else trite womanese phrase they for their inability to love someone on an emotional level but know they should on a logical level.

Also, one of the best ways to bond with someone is to survive dangerous or difficult situations. Manufacture some of those. Take a girl out at 2AM and walk through some allys in q sketch part of town and comment on some of the more sketch characters that pas(be safe, bring a gun). Go on an outdoor sex adventure where you treaspass and fuck on a rooftop or somewhere you shouldn't. Make your girls try new stuff with you.

I'll revisit this thread later and type out some more good bonding experiences but I bet you get the idea. I think being stoic is a powerful mindset to have in life but it doesn't lend itself to direct emotional engagement very well and that's what these women felt were lacking. Being a man you should control your emotions to the best of your ability but sometimes it is advantageous to have them and show them. This is probably one of those few times.

And if you're lucky and can't genuinely feel emotions, learn to fake it.

Post: #15

Women exist on an emotional plane. You're probably getting the bangs because at first they think you're an asshole, but later in the game they realise you're not an asshole, you are in fact a nothing.

Yes. A nothing. Remember. Women exist on an emotional plane. For a true stoic this is like Schwarzenegger being covered in mud to avoid the thermal vision of the Predator.

You can be comforting. You can be a bastard. You can be a lot of things to engage a woman. But being a stoic? It's like a woman being invited to an indoor climbing gym only she finds out that all the climbing faces are completely bare.

She has nothing to work with.

Most girls operate well when they're driven to please you. Her primal drive is to secure your patronage which is why you can be an angry bastard (secure your protection) or a rich, haughty playboy (secure your resources) or any combination and variation in between, but if you're a blank slate then it doesn't matter if you're a billionaire spec ops veteran because she cannot intrinsically gain the sense that you're invested in her enough to provide those things when it matters.

Anyhoo, surely there's something in this world that makes you angry.

Are you hatefucking these women from time to time? Most women will settle for a man that at least shows a girl that she inspires in him some sort of violent animal lust. Do you get behind them and grab a fist of hair at the base of their skull while you straddle their ass and try to fuck them through the mattress? Do you breathe like an enraged werewolf? Do you slap their ass with barely constrained contempt for your little whore?

See, most women will accept a straight face as long as they know that there's an animal in there somewhere.

Maybe you'll be fine if you just stop fucking these bitches politely.

Post: #16

Stop applying 'game' to all of your interactions with chicks.

Once you've got them on the hook drop the facade, be real, show her who you are and what you're all about.

Stop caring so much about how you come across or what she thinks.

Let her see what makes you tick.

This is much easier with a chick that you dig, otherwise you just won't really give a fuck.

If you only ever let her see the stuff that doesn't really matter, she'll come to realise that you don't really matter.

Take risks. Sometimes the biggest ones are the simplest ones.

Post: #17

Women will look for ways to imagine a connection with someone they really like, just like how betas think they've got some special connection with whatever girl they have a crush on. You can manufacture a connection to some extent and for this I'd look at Jugglers old stuff, but I doubt it'd make that much difference as when things run their course in the girl's head it's pretty much done.

Post: #18

Some good advice above on ZFG attitude, but emotional connection is a skill that has a time and a place. A lot of women who didn't like my level of commitment gave me that line to make themselves feel better.

On the other hand, there were relationships I had that failed because of a poor emotional connection.

Dale Carnegie recommended developing an interest in others. Practice this with people you meet, a security guard, uber driver, someone at your office. Try to discover new facts about them in every interaction. There is a book from the 70s called Thinking Big which is a great book on its own that discusses this concept. For example, if you are going to a job interview, practice being friendly with everyone you meet, driver receptionist, strangers in the elevator, even before you get there. It creates positive mental energy and momentum.

Post: #19

Seems like those girls who dumped you did not feel that you were actually together. Meaning you were distant to them.

You probably treated them like long term fuck buddies.

Example.. she did some dumb shit that meant to imply there is some other guy on her radar and you ignored it completely as if she was same night lay bitch ready to be released to the wild the next day. That ignorance showed her that you didn't give a flying fuck if she cheats or not.

I know that to you it's OK to brush it off and you are right cause you are guy. However she felt like an object. A pencil at best. She thought.. he doesn't caaaare. This is how you get a girl (playing prize) not how to keep her.

To keep her it's best to be possessive selfish asshole who wants to OWN her on every level. Straight up. It is kind of stupid but the love it.

Examples..

Dance classes. I tried it with my girl. During classes we suppose to change partners to practise with different people. I didnt want to. I told her she's dancing with me only I'm not sharing her point blank period. She was sooooo impressed and excited.

Sex. Best orgasms I've seen were where I went full nuts and vocal about owning her.. how she's mine how I own her how she cannot do shit without my approval how only I can touch her how useless she is without me how I will punish her if she messes up etc. Total possession mode. She was in heaven.

Decision making. I told her I want her to consult with me on every decision she makes. Out of care of course. Now she cannot dress up without asking me if I like what she picked or even asking me what I want her to wear.

In short I made her MINE. She is not a girl she is mine girl. That's how she feels I'm emotionally connected. Basically she is dominated under my conytol and fucking loves it. I'm also good for her I solve her problems and try to gelp her even with dumb shit she comes up with or cannot handle.

That's what I would recommend to you.

Post: #20

(12-01-2017 01:42 PM)LINUX Wrote:  Sexual polarity is what makes a woman attracted to you. The masculine and feminine tension that allows a woman to go to bed with you, and start a relationship with you, doesn't work for long-term. Guys want to talk about "frame" all the time but they fail to understand this concept. It's why most of us who get 50+ lays a year are complete shit when it comes to relationships.

This makes a great point.

Alpha asshole game will get you laid, but you need to mix in some beta boyfriend game if you want to keep them around and actually have a relationship with them.

The best man for LTR is the one who has the right mix of alpha jerk to spike and maintain attraction, and enough betea traits to keep her in the LTR instead of off getting a better more alpha dick.

Find out what her thing is: (language of love book)


Some women like to talk, in which case you have to listen to her.
Some like gifts - give them small thoughtful gifts all the time
Some like touch - cuddles, hand holding and stroking and touching all the time
Some like quality time - hang our with them and do stuff together.
Some like words - tell them you love them all the time

These are beta traits which don't come naturally, but you have to make an effort to master them if you want her to stick around after the bang.

WARNING:

if you go to far on the beta behavior, she will also lose interest in you.
You have to find the right balance, and be an asshole when its needed to pull her back into attraction.

A lot of men slip in to deep beta mode and lose it.

Post: #21

Eh, my two cents...

Women will develop an "emotional connection" once you're the dominant masculine force in her life. When her tire goes flat? You're the first person she calls. When some dude is harassing her? She knows you'll put him in a chokehold. You're the dude who has the balls to order for her. All she cares about is pleasing you when you bang, so you crush that ass in bed. Why? Because you're a confident, unflinching, fun yet strong man who if she could just "tame" would be a "great father."

It's not a matter of crying when you watch the end of a Disney movie, or confessing your biggest fears to her. That shit makes you a giant blubbering vagina. It's about being that dominant, masculine, almost "fatherly" presence in her life.

My biggest game impediment is being short, but once they've gotten past that, I have them dropping "L bombs" at me within weeks.

Post: #22

Totally agree with Hank, being masculine is the most important thing . You need to be that oak tree in her life . Unwavering to her constant change of emotions. Especially if you aren't a natural emotional/high drama guy like me, and you try to act that way just to keep her then your frame will never be congruent and you will eventually lose her. Like Roosh stated , 1.) Learn game. 2.) Work to be location independent. 3.) Work to be persistent throughout your entire life. Then move to a country where traditional marriage is still praised. Instead of worrying about forcing emotional connection. Do what the fuck you want when you want and that alone will give the woman the drama she "craves". Don't drive your self crazy trying to build emotional connections with women who aren't emotionally connected with themselves

Post: #23

What I find most difficult is the sort of smalltalk and clowning around that is the most effective with casual dating when neither side wants to really reveal their true self. I think the above is a dance that women fall into by default when what they are really hoping for is a magic blend of alpha and beta qualities.

This recent Red Pill interviews video demonstrates the dichotomy very clearly:





I think what women want as far as emotional connection is mostly a one-way street. They want a guy to use as an emotional-tampon, but they don't want him to show vulnerability himself. They also don't want their arm twisted to execute this or that self-help advice. They mostly want you to just sit there and nod your head and seem engaged and after they've vented they'll be happy to let you drown their troubles with F'ing.

Most people, both genders, are on sort of a life-long quest to answer some serious questions about life, the universe, and everything. You don't have to be on some dysfunctional psychological spectrum to have deep unanswered questions, so existential that you reserve it for post-bang afterglow talk.

I find the most difficult women to engage deeply are the ones who seem to have their sh*t together. I think so much of the need for companionship is driven out of some deep-seated insecurity or void that the more well-adjusted women seem like they'd be just as happy settling for pets and a vibrator.

Some degree of angst or restlessness is what makes people dynamic, evolving creatures. When they come across like they feel like they already have all the answers or lack introspection or curiosity in the first place they are boring to me.

Post: #24

If you want an interesting perspective on how (American) women think, read a book like:

https://shaunti.com/tb-books/for-men-only/

It sounds like you fundamentally have some trouble understanding how women think. I suggest this book because it is based on a large amount of surveys and focused groups of how women think that most men aren't aware of. It's targeted to married/LTR men, but it has a lot of invaluable advice that I just didn't know. (And I thought I knew a lot, having read lots of red pill material before.)

Post: #25

For my fellow players like OP and others who have a hard time getting "emotional connections" etc, please google Dismissive Avoidant Attachment. 30% of the population has this style and its dead on the money for what he is written and what others have commented on about feeling (or lack OF feeing) the same. It can be eye opening to learn about this stuff and can help all future relationships with romantic partners