Post: #1

CDC summary of the overdose deaths plaguing America:

Quote:Drug overdose deaths in the United States continue to increase in 2015
91 Americans die every day from an opioid overdose (that includes prescription opioids and heroin).

Drug overdose deaths and opioid-involved deaths continue to increase in the United States. The majority of drug overdose deaths (more than six out of ten) involve an opioid.1 Since 1999, the number of overdose deaths involving opioids (including prescription opioids and heroin) quadrupled.2 From 2000 to 2015 more than half a million people died from drug overdoses. 91 Americans die every day from an opioid overdose.

We now know that overdoses from prescription opioids are a driving factor in the 15-year increase in opioid overdose deaths. The amount of prescription opioids sold to pharmacies, hospitals, and doctors’ offices nearly quadrupled from 1999 to 2010,3,4 yet there had not been an overall change in the amount of pain that Americans reported.5,6 Deaths from prescription opioids—drugs like oxycodone, hydrocodone, and methadone—have more than quadrupled since 1999.7

https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/epidemic/index.html

Plenty more infographics on the website itself.

Nearly every day I hear reports of Americans dying of opioids(and other drugs) which seem to be getting worse and worse and in the last few years its like a 9/11 every 3 weeks. Whats going on? What's causing this and what's the consequences?

Post: #2

My Dad comes from one the most idealic, close knit small communities in rural America. In fact so much so that books have been written about this part of America and lots of people visit it for its charm. In the past year I was shocked to see headlining the local paper a headline saying to the extent "heroin overdoses continue to overwhelm local resources".

My Aunt who is a nurse there confirmed the problem is out of control. This is a very culturally conservative blue collar community. It has not been affected by diversity or migration beyond at most a percent or two of Hispanics. In fact you will still be very lucky to see any minorities, especially new ones.

My Aunt said it had to do with an increased crackdown on prescription drugs so people were going to Heroin.

This problem is real, perhaps quietly eating away at America worse than anything else right now.

Post: #3

The entire opiod crisis can be traced back to a misused quote out of a medical journal that big pharma used to push oxys and percs onto people with bad backs and knees who could have gotten better with alternative pain management. Once the medical community realized they were creating a generation of zombies, they curtailed it but by then it was too late, the Mexican dope pushers moved in en mass all over the US and specifically targeted methadone clinics to find customers.

Post: #4

I don't touch those pain medications, I have a friend who's a doctor and he told me to not touch them because that stuff was the same (if not stronger) than heroin and as hard to break off of it.

That said, I do have some friends who are otherwise normal people, but cannot function if they don't have their Oxys or Percocet. It sucks, one of them related to me how if he don't has his pills he'd get bone pains, sweats, vomits and withdrawals that would be horrible. It sucks that people are being given these by drs.

Post: #5

Exactly what Scotian said. These companies market to doctors who in turn perscribed them like candy. They took a couple of sentences based on a small controlled study and pushed the narrative that less than 1% of patients became addicted. Once you run out of the cash to support the pills, the next step is heroin and fentanyl, the synthetic stuff. It's a mess, all fueled by greed.
https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archi...ds/528840/

Post: #6

Putting on my flame suit:

I've done a fair amount of drugs in my life ranging from the pot, psychedelics, cocaine, some oxies, and even smoked opium.

Anytime i've tried new drugs I did so in moderation. Enough to enjoy the buzz but not incapacitate myself.

With that said, I have very little sympathy for idiots who overdose (alcohol, coke, prescriptions, or otherwise).

How retarded and foolish do you have to be to zonk yourself to the point of passing out, getting revived, and then doingit again?

I have no problem with restricting medical care for people who overdose again and again. If you're that stupid to overdose multiple times, it's time to let Darwin do his work and weed out an idiot with a death wish.

The park I walk my dog at is infested with homeless idiots who shoot up. One day a lady came out of her tent shouting for someone to call an ambulance because some dipshit OD'd.

I just kept walking. Not my problem and i'm especially not going to be forced to follow this dumb ass to a hospital because i'm now responsible for some waste of life.

Take some personal responsibility with your damn vices. It's not that hard. The only crisis here is an idiot epidemic of those who can't handle their drugs.

Post: #7

(10-04-2017 11:35 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  Take some personal responsibility with your damn vices. It's not that hard. The only crisis here is an idiot epidemic of those who can't handle their drugs.

Couldn't agree more. Use of these drugs is 100% voluntary. No one is standing over them with a gun in one hand and a needle and spoon in the other, forcing them to shoot that shit in their arms.

Go mountain climbing = risk of injury/death.
Go to the Running of the Bulls = risk of injury/death.
Go surfing during a hurricane = risk of injury/death.
Shoot chemicals into your veins = risk of injury/death.

All your CHOICE. It's not society's duty to protect you from your own egregious stupidity.

Post: #8

There is the 'dumb factor' where the recipient didn't finish their pharmacology training and accidentally overdosed. They are revived, but are still addicted.

There is also, per EMTs I have spoken to, the fun diversion of "going deep" with heroin, fentanyl or carfentanyl where you intentionally overdose, have a spotter who then calls the ambulance. They arrive and administer the life saving naloxone (for about $1000.00 a pop). The patient is saved, and free to do it again, sometimes that same night. They, of course, don't pay for the treatment themselves.

Post: #9

The opioid epidemic has been going on for a while but the increasing deaths are due to fentanyl. A few mg of fentanyl will kill most people. If you've never weighed a milligram of powder it's comparable to a few grains of sand.

Most heroin is now cut with fentanyl in the north east and probably a lot of the country. People are even pressing fake pain pills that actually contain fentanyl.

Post: #10

The problem with the "it's an idiot epidemic" is that the problem has accelerated hyperbolically in the past decade. Far outpacing the decline in the economy or legal/illegal immigration penetration.

But let's just say they are indeed vast numbers of idiots suddenly popping out of the woodwork. Do you propose anything to stop it? Any public policy measures? Do you just think it's not your problem and therefore shouldn't care? Or do you think it's nobodies problem and are actively against preventative measures or further investigation?

Post: #11

The "crisis" that's draining hospital resources is the fact that an Opioid overdose is easy to treat but recovery can take an extended hospital stay plus a half-assed attempt at rehab. Addicts overdose again and again running up tens of thousands of dollars in medical bills that they have no intention of paying.

If someone overdoses, let them die a peaceful death and everyone would be better off.

Post: #12

(10-04-2017 11:35 AM)The Beast1 Wrote:  Putting on my flame suit:

I've done a fair amount of drugs in my life ranging from the pot, psychedelics, cocaine, some oxies, and even smoked opium.

Anytime i've tried new drugs I did so in moderation. Enough to enjoy the buzz but not incapacitate myself.

With that said, I have very little sympathy for idiots who overdose (alcohol, coke, prescriptions, or otherwise).

How retarded and foolish do you have to be to zonk yourself to the point of passing out, getting revived, and then doingit again?

I have no problem with restricting medical care for people who overdose again and again. If you're that stupid to overdose multiple times, it's time to let Darwin do his work and weed out an idiot with a death wish.

The park I walk my dog at is infested with homeless idiots who shoot up. One day a lady came out of her tent shouting for someone to call an ambulance because some dipshit OD'd.

I just kept walking. Not my problem and i'm especially not going to be forced to follow this dumb ass to a hospital because i'm now responsible for some waste of life.

Take some personal responsibility with your damn vices. It's not that hard. The only crisis here is an idiot epidemic of those who can't handle their drugs.

Most honest post of the day.

Post: #13

(10-04-2017 01:30 PM)Robert High Hawk Wrote:  The problem with the "it's an idiot epidemic" is that the problem has accelerated hyperbolically in the past decade. Far outpacing the decline in the economy or legal/illegal immigration penetration.

But let's just say they are indeed vast numbers of idiots suddenly popping out of the woodwork. Do you propose anything to stop it?

Short of controlling every single aspect of their lives, there is nothing you can do to stop idiots from committing acts of idiocy.

(10-04-2017 01:30 PM)Robert High Hawk Wrote:  Any public policy measures?

There are already innumerable drug laws. How effective are they now?

(10-04-2017 01:30 PM)Robert High Hawk Wrote:  Do you just think it's not your problem and therefore shouldn't care?

It is not my problem. People make their own CHOICES in what they do. Their CHOICE, THEIR problem.

(10-04-2017 01:30 PM)Robert High Hawk Wrote:  Or do you think it's nobodies problem and are actively against preventative measures or further investigation?

What's to investigate? Everyone knows where the shit is coming from and how it's getting distributed. The Govt spends billions on the "War on Drugs." every year. Yet every high school kid knows just who/where to get whatever poison they want.

It's nothing but another excuse to rot away your actual liberty, one "crisis" at a time.

Post: #14

I completely agree that there is an almost infinite amount of laws that do nothing except perhaps exacerbate the problem.

And I completely understand the perspective of letting bygons be bygons, or in this case, wasetful addicts. On and individual level, that is often times the best solution.

That still does not address the larger issue of impending social collapse in America.

We are just a bunch of dudes typing our thoughts, so no delusions of grandeur that we can help anything here. I am just quite certain that quality of life goes down for all of us as this problem gets worse. The mere fact that many of us (as in Beast1's story) have to be personally exposed to this type of horrendous dysfunction means that we are already getting affected by it.

So is the solution a more personal one, which is to just ignore it as best as possible? Disdainfully hope it goes away through attrition? I'm not even being sarcastic when I say that may actually be the psychologically healthiest way to deal with this issue, as with many other social ills.

Perhaps I'm naive though, but I'd like to think there's a practical way to fix this problem. The many of the downcast idiot addicts used to be very productive members of society, forming a very important part of functioning society. Their recent fall into degeneracy may just be the canary in the coal mine for bigger social collapse, and one that we can't simply ignore.

Post: #15

Best friend since HS OD'd shooting up last year in his parents house. His parents came downstairs one morning and found him. Only son. Imagine that. Never saw a tox report but I'd bet anything it was fentanyl (H cut with fentanyl to be specific). Don't do H, don't shoot up, don't do opiates. Fucking destroying this country.

Post: #16

Fentanyl and other related chemicals are crazy because you now don't even have to have patches, or inject, none of that. They are available mixed as nasal spray like some kind of OTC cold medicine. You don't know how concentrated the solution is so you could take one spray of it and die. It has happened. The new synthetics are ridiculously strong.

Post: #17

Every generation gets their problem drug. For this generation it's opiates and heroin. The depression, anxiety, lack of purpose and lack of community is what makes that this generations drug of choice. Heroin and opiates have a great way of numbing that psychological pain as well as physical pain if not better. Even if it's only for a short period of time.

And once you're hooked the withdrawal is a bitch. The "dope flu" is a perfect name and people don't like being sick if the cure is so easy. Eat, snort, shoot a little here and back to normal. Why quit? It's the only thing that makes you feel good. The only thing that makes you feel alive. The only way you can escape you own inadequacy and failings as a person.

The only way out is a good, strong supportive social system, other shit you enjoy doing, self reflection and honesty (hardest step), and total personal responsibility. Or you can be tied to a methadone clinic or Suboxone but that doesn't solve anything. The first way I mentioned is hard. Really hard you can just make everything go away in a moment.

And the fentanyl is old news. Now they are cutting it with carfentanyl aka horse tranquilizer. Who knew dealers wouldn't give a shit about their customers. It's not like the doctors are much better passing them out like Skittles. Giving people prescriptions for people that don't want it so when someone offers someone $5+ a pill for some shit they weren't taking anyway of course they are going to sell it.

It's a fucked up situation but people need to take responsibility for themselves, take responsibility for their family and be active in the community and make people feel like they are welcome and a part of it.

Post: #18

While I respect everyone's opinion... people who blame this on "idiots" simply just don't know man! Kevin Trudeau talked about this shit before they locked him up! Pain medications... Over The Counter drugs (OTC) rewire the chemistry of your Brain! Once you get affected by it... YOUR BRAIN IS HOOKED!

Once you're there... it's Game Over I don't give a shit who you are! The "idiots" you guys are talking about are the people who relied on Big Pharma's propaganda... and got their Brain rewired! And now he's the Homeless dude bothering you at McDonald's just like that Poof! That's the type of shit YOU'LL NEVER READ ABOUT... since there's WAYYY so much money involved!

Even Tylenol can trigger the neuropathways of your Brain into getting hooked for more. Calling the addicted who fallowed big pharmas advice "idiots" is simply Pure Ignorance. This is beyond empathy... this is simply not realizing How Much Prescription Drugs CAN BE LETHAL! They cause most of our deseases by fucking up your stomach aka your Immunine System.

Once the Boomers die... you think Big Pharma will just take the money lost in the A$$... no way! Shit will get more lethal like Hoes get more scandalous! This shit is not a Game! I will NEVER take any medication unless I'm dying this second if I don't take it.

From vaccines to Mono Sodium Glutamate and High Fructose Corn Syrup... They'll find a way to Get You hooked more cleverly as time goes by Fellas! Get educated on this shit before you risk becoming one of these "idiots"! This shit is Going on like crazy in Vancouver & Alberta where the repeatedly mentioned "idiots" in Million Dollar Homes Off themselves or Lose it All!

<End Rant/>

Post: #19

This crisis is most highly concentrated among young, working/middle class white men. And is it any wonder?

They've been told from birth that they race they belong to is the great villain of history. They've been taught to believe that their sex is abominable and monstrous. They have limited economic prospects and almost certainly will not live as well as their parents did. Many of them were raised by single mothers and never learned how to be a man. The women of their generation and social class are disproportionately obese whales, tattooed freaks, hypersluts, proud miscegenators, mental headcases, single mothers and SJW/feminists. If they do manage to find a halfway decent woman to spend time with, they live in constant fear of the threat of divorce rape. When they think about the possibility of having children, they look around at the crumbling society they've inherited and despair for the future. If they did the "smart thing" and went to college, they are likely saddled with significant student debt they cannot discharge. Many of them have never accomplished anything of note, instead preferring to win their "achievements" in video games. They have been raised entirely without religious faith, taught to believe that only idiots believe in God and that life is inherently meaningless and then you die.

The staggering fact is not that we have an opioid crisis this bad, it's that this crisis isn't 10x worse.

Post: #20

(10-04-2017 09:42 PM)scorpion Wrote:  This crisis is most highly concentrated among young, working/middle class white men. And is it any wonder?

They've been told from birth that they race they belong to is the great villain of history. They've been taught to believe that their sex is abominable and monstrous. They have limited economic prospects and almost certainly will not live as well as their parents did. Many of them were raised by single mothers and never learned how to be a man. The women of their generation and social class are disproportionately obese whales, tattooed freaks, hypersluts, proud miscegenators, mental headcases, single mothers and SJW/feminists. If they do manage to find a halfway decent woman to spend time with, they live in constant fear of the threat of divorce rape. When they think about the possibility of having children, they look around at the crumbling society they've inherited and despair for the future. If they did the "smart thing" and went to college, they are likely saddled with significant student debt they cannot discharge. Many of them have never accomplished anything of note, instead preferring to win their "achievements" in video games. They have been raised entirely without religious faith, taught to believe that only idiots believe in God and that life is inherently meaningless and then you die.

The staggering fact is not that we have an opioid crisis this bad, it's that this crisis isn't 10x worse.

All this is present in canada and western europe as well without the same severity of opioid abuse.

Supply matters and in this case the US is awash with it.

Post: #21

^Apparently you’ve never been to Vancouver which has the most AIDS infested skid row in North America where junkies are dropping like flies from fentanyl over doses, Canada has a major opiod problem from coast to coast.

https://www.google.ca/amp/www.macleans.c...risis/amp/

Post: #22

(10-05-2017 08:41 AM)scotian Wrote:  ^Apparently you’ve never been to Vancouver which has the most AIDS infested skid row in North America where junkies are dropping like flies from fentanyl over doses, Canada has a major opiod problem from coast to coast.

https://www.google.ca/amp/www.macleans.c...risis/amp/

Are you asserting that Canada's problem is worse than the US?

Post: #23

(10-04-2017 10:20 AM)scotian Wrote:  The entire opiod crisis can be traced back to a misused quote out of a medical journal that big pharma used to push oxys and percs onto people with bad backs and knees who could have gotten better with alternative pain management. Once the medical community realized they were creating a generation of zombies, they curtailed it but by then it was too late, the Mexican dope pushers moved in en mass all over the US and specifically targeted methadone clinics to find customers.

I had a couple of minor procedures done in the last year - really minor stuff w/minimal pain, things I didnt even need an advil for. In both cases the doctor's gave me a prescription w/o my asking for 30 painkillers. Given how much of an issue its become, and how minor the surgery was, both at very reputable doctors, I was surprised at how easily they gave them and how many pills each prescription had. I could see maybe like 5 pills or something but both times they loaded me up w/25-30.

Post: #24

(10-05-2017 02:13 PM)floor7 Wrote:  

(10-05-2017 08:41 AM)scotian Wrote:  ^Apparently you’ve never been to Vancouver which has the most AIDS infested skid row in North America where junkies are dropping like flies from fentanyl over doses, Canada has a major opiod problem from coast to coast.

https://www.google.ca/amp/www.macleans.c...risis/amp/

Are you asserting that Canada's problem is worse than the US?

I’d say its on the same level and for the exact same reason as I outlined above.

Post: #25

It doesn't help that in much of North America heroin is dirt cheap, less than half of what it cost in the 90s.

Its more affordable to be a junky than an alocoholic right now.