Post: #51

(09-04-2017 01:03 AM)h3ltrsk3ltr Wrote:  img]https://s12.postimg.org/ny5d6r7pp/IMG_4888_1.jpg[/img]

How do I get to look like that (or better) in 1-3 years? Serious question.

1 year of bulking. High intensity/low volume 6-8 reps

6 months of maitnence diet, getting a grasp on which protein/carb/fat macros work best for the person -- everyone is different.

6 months on a body building diet plan, cutting calories 50-75 every week.

Morning HIIT 8 hours before an evening resistance training. Keeping EPOC raised.
Then of course, water/ sodium/ carb manipulation before photoshoot. Easy shit.

I won't go into the drugs, but truthfully you could you wouldn't need many, at least not to look like this guy. That's a two year plan, but with drugs, you can get there in a year, but you would have no life other than working, gym, cooking, so 99% of people would quit.

Post: #52

^ you say he's nothing special and his physique is easily obtainable followed by saying you would need to dedicate your entire life to training and nutrition for two years.

The guy is huge and ripped. 99.9% of men will never look like him, with or without gear. But why would you want to look like that? It's a form of body dysmorphia.

Post: #53

(09-04-2017 04:48 AM)Cambodian Creamsicle Wrote:  ^ you say he's nothing special and his physique is easily obtainable followed by saying you would need to dedicate your entire life to training and nutrition for two years.

The guy is huge and ripped. 99.9% of men will never look like him, with or without gear. But why would you want to look like that? It's a form of body dysmorphia.

Body dysmorphia? Perhaps. But if that's how you're bent, it's how you're bent.

As I said earlier, it ain't for everyone. But if that's what you feel called to do then fuck it why not.

Post: #54

The really fascinating thing for me is that some people really hate bodybuilders more than they do obese people, it's crazy.

I think its one of those things where people see a bodybuilder and say "if I just took steroids I could look like that" and then "but I don't wanna look like that anyway".

I think most bb haters still look at bbing Instagram's.

Post: #55

For me personally it's the level of extra admin involved: another thing to know and understand in depth, another set of responsibilities I have to schedule, etc etc. With a limited number of hours in my day, and a number of competing interests, it just simply isn't a good return on investment for me. If it's your thing, then more power to you.

Post: #56

(09-04-2017 08:08 AM)Steelex Wrote:  The really fascinating thing for me is that some people really hate bodybuilders more than they do obese people, it's crazy.

I think its one of those things where people see a bodybuilder and say "if I just took steroids I could look like that" and then "but I don't wanna look like that anyway".

I think most bb haters still look at bbing Instagram's.

I don't think people hate on bodybuilders. There is some animosity to those who don't admit they do steroids, because steroids really do change the game in ways you never could without. Scientific fact is that you grow more muscle with steroids and no training than following a lifting program: http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJ...7043350101

I mean, that pisses some people off, when steroid users claim that the naturals lack of results is because he is lazy.

Post: #57

(09-04-2017 04:48 AM)Cambodian Creamsicle Wrote:  ^ you say he's nothing special and his physique is easily obtainable followed by saying you would need to dedicate your entire life to training and nutrition for two years.

The guy is huge and ripped. 99.9% of men will never look like him, with or without gear. But why would you want to look like that? It's a form of body dysmorphia.

99,9 % is wrong. I could make 50 percent of the forum members look like that if it was my job and I still had the passion about this that I used to when I owned my gym and trained competitors.

As far as the the other question , why look like that ? Because you get pussy. Trust me , guys like to say looking like this doesn't matter , but that's bullshit. You can have all the game in the world but when this guy walks beside you on the dance floor , all eyes are on him. Not you. That's reality. Primal instinct. Women want to feel protected. Women want to be ravished. That's truth.

Post: #58

(09-04-2017 01:43 PM)LINUX Wrote:  As far as the the other question , why look like that ? Because you get pussy. Trust me , guys like to say looking like this doesn't matter , but that's bullshit. You can have all the game in the world but when this guy walks beside you on the dance floor , all eyes are on him. Not you. That's reality. Primal instinct. Women want to feel protected. Women want to be ravished. That's truth.

Of course guys want to make themselves more attractive to women, and to get more and higher quality chicks but let's face it, it's not the be all and end all. Anybody who is willing to go to those extremes with the sole intention of getting laid has his focus all wrong in my opinion.

I've been in bars and clubs and seen huge dudes wearing tight fitting clothes standing in a corner all night nursing their beer, reeking of insecurity. Chick free zone. It's not uncommon. Mass alone does not guarantee pussy.

There are more productive ways to spend your time, there are other ways to increase your attractiveness to women. The guys I know who look like this are not well balanced men with their shit together (doesn't mean to say you can't be).

Yeah chicks want to be ravished, but since when did you need to have an IFBB pro physique to be the guy doing the ravishing, some you'll win and some you'll lose no matter how big you are, and yeah some chicks do go for that look, which is fine when you are playing the field and racking up notches, but what percentage of these chicks are wife material. If you want to get and keep real quality balance is important, of course there are always outliers.

Whatever floats your boat I suppose, if you love the gym, get a kick out of training hard and living the life then fair play, but dedicating your spare time to putting on huge mass in the hope that it will improve your sex life seems like a massive waste of effort to me.

I get that some forum members are huge and get all the pussy they can handle, but other forum members are doing the same without rocking the same size. So how much of it is down to the muscle? I know which group I'd rather be in.

If you are on testosterone because your levels are low it's a completely different set of circumstances.

Post: #59

(09-04-2017 03:38 PM)Lagavulin Wrote:  

(09-04-2017 01:43 PM)LINUX Wrote:  As far as the the other question , why look like that ? Because you get pussy. Trust me , guys like to say looking like this doesn't matter , but that's bullshit. You can have all the game in the world but when this guy walks beside you on the dance floor , all eyes are on him. Not you. That's reality. Primal instinct. Women want to feel protected. Women want to be ravished. That's truth.

Of course guys want to make themselves more attractive to women, and to get more and higher quality chicks but let's face it, it's not the be all and end all. Anybody who is willing to go to those extremes with the sole intention of getting laid has his focus all wrong in my opinion.

I've been in bars and clubs and seen huge dudes wearing tight fitting clothes standing in a corner all night nursing their beer, reeking of insecurity. Chick free zone. It's not uncommon. Mass alone does not guarantee pussy.

There are more productive ways to spend your time, there are other ways to increase your attractiveness to women. The guys I know who look like this are not well balanced men with their shit together (doesn't mean to say you can't be).

Yeah chicks want to be ravished, but since when did you need to have an IFBB pro physique to be the guy doing the ravishing, some you'll win and some you'll lose no matter how big you are, and yeah some chicks do go for that look, which is fine when you are playing the field and racking up notches, but what percentage of these chicks are wife material. If you want to get and keep real quality balance is important, of course there are always outliers.

Whatever floats your boat I suppose, if you love the gym, get a kick out of training hard and living the life then fair play, but dedicating your spare time to putting on huge mass in the hope that it will improve your sex life seems like a massive waste of effort to me.

I get that some forum members are huge and get all the pussy they can handle, but other forum members are doing the same without rocking the same size. So how much of it is down to the muscle? I know which group I'd rather be in.

If you are on testosterone because your levels are low it's a completely different set of circumstances.

That's nowhere close to IFBB material. He would barely place top 5 in a decent NPC event. And I disagree that there are more productive ways of spending your time. Guys on the forums waste countless hours a day reading the news, watching sitcoms that tell them when to laugh, and reading about the upcoming armageddon. That same amount of time could be spent in the gym and cooking/eating.

But don't take my word for it, do what I did which is not hypothesis, it's a real life experiment. Walk the walk. Spend 5 years walking around looking normal, with you freshly pressed white dress shirt and fancy leather shoes. And spend 5 years walking around in a white t shirt, jacked as fuck. Only then, will you see what I am talking about. Until then, you only see things one sided because you haven't seen the other side. You can only imagine it and disagree with it because it's not quickly obtainable.

Post: #60

I've spent 20 years in gyms. No, you couldn't even make a small fraction of the men on this forum look like that. The guy in the pic has very good genetics, plus years of dedication to training and nutrition, and on boat loads of drugs, and also young. I've been on steroids and I've been around guys on steroids since I was a teenager. I'm not talking out of my ass. His physique is not easily attainable.

To your other point, of course a big meathead is going to out slay some poindexter with khaki pants on, but the best guys I've ever seen with women weren't juice pigs.

(09-04-2017 01:43 PM)LINUX Wrote:  

(09-04-2017 04:48 AM)Cambodian Creamsicle Wrote:  ^ you say he's nothing special and his physique is easily obtainable followed by saying you would need to dedicate your entire life to training and nutrition for two years.

The guy is huge and ripped. 99.9% of men will never look like him, with or without gear. But why would you want to look like that? It's a form of body dysmorphia.

99,9 % is wrong. I could make 50 percent of the forum members look like that if it was my job and I still had the passion about this that I used to when I owned my gym and trained competitors.

As far as the the other question , why look like that ? Because you get pussy. Trust me , guys like to say looking like this doesn't matter , but that's bullshit. You can have all the game in the world but when this guy walks beside you on the dance floor , all eyes are on him. Not you. That's reality. Primal instinct. Women want to feel protected. Women want to be ravished. That's truth.

Post: #61

(09-04-2017 03:52 PM)LINUX Wrote:  But don't take my word for it, do what I did which is not hypothesis, it's a real life experiment. Walk the walk. Spend 5 years walking around looking normal, with you freshly pressed white dress shirt and fancy leather shoes. And spend 5 years walking around in a white t shirt, jacked as fuck. Only then, will you see what I am talking about. Until then, you only see things one sided because you haven't seen the other side. You can only imagine it and disagree with it because it's not quickly obtainable.

Yeah fair enough it's not IFBB material but the point is the same. I appreciate that time spent watching sitcoms etc could be better spent elsewhere but there are other ways to spend it than hammering the gym and cooking/eating/taking steroids.

You can walk around looking normal, and you can walk around jacked as fuck. For me the sweet spot is somewhere in between, where that spot is on the scale will differ from guy to guy.

It's true that I can only see things from one side because I haven't experienced having that level of muscle, but neither would I want to, and it's not because it's not quickly obtainable. It's simply not a look, or a lifestyle I would want for myself. I'm good with a lean athletic physique and a little bit of bulk in the right areas, easily achievable, and maintainable with a good routine, good diet, and consistency. No steroids or short cuts required.

It's your choice man, and I respect that. I personally don't feel the need, and I would struggle to disregard the health risks, succinctly summed up by helmutschmidt in the first reply on this thread.

I sincerely hope the guys on the forum who do use have no cause for regret 10-15 years down the line. The risks are real, and just because you haven't fallen foul of them doesn't mean you won't, and doesn't mean others reading this thread won't. The longer you go the bigger they get.

Post: #62

(09-04-2017 04:35 PM)Cambodian Creamsicle Wrote:  I've spent 20 years in gyms. No, you couldn't even make a small fraction of the men on this forum look like that. The guy in the pic has very good genetics, plus years of dedication to training and nutrition, and on boat loads of drugs, and also young. I've been on steroids and I've been around guys on steroids since I was a teenager. I'm not talking out of my ass. His physique is not easily attainable.

To your other point, of course a big meathead is going to out slay some poindexter with khaki pants on, but the best guys I've ever seen with women weren't juice pigs.

CC, this is my job. This is what I do and what I have been doing my whole life. I can absolutely make a many guys on this forum look like this, no problem. And this guy does not have good genetics. He will never make it on a top level.

Post: #63

Just because you go to the gym for a long ass time doesn't mean you actually know what you're doing. I see idiots at the gym everyday. I only consider myself lifting for 6 years because before then even though I was going, I had no idea what I was doing.

Post: #64

(09-04-2017 05:46 PM)CaptainChardonnay Wrote:  Just because you go to the gym for a long ass time doesn't mean you actually know what you're doing. I see idiots at the gym everyday. I only consider myself lifting for 6 years because before then even though I was going, I had no idea what I was doing.

Yes, and going to the gym for 10 years consistently, verses dieting and training for a show or photoshoot are completely opposite things. Completely opposite ways of training. Completely opposite ways of dieting, completely opposite ways of living, and completely opposite effects on your mentally. The body is a complex thing, only doing what you force it to do by time and effort.

Post: #65

My friend once told me that nobody does only one cycle. Thats my biggest concern. I've thought about doing a mild cycle of test a few times now, and the boost I'd get from such a cycle seems worth the risk. I'd only want to do it once but that's probably not realistic.

I've come to the conclusion that if you're not willing to use for a long time, or even your whole life. It might not be worth it.

Post: #66

Agree with Linux; the guy in the picture is quite small, and the only thing thats impressive in that pic is the low body fat percentage. I would venture to guess that the guy in the pic is a runner. He has skinny legs. Where I disagree with you Linux is that this body would take two years to build naturally. I'd say one year natural, with a coach breaking your ass everyday to eat and workout properly. People that say its "impossible" here probably have little experience in building/growing bodies, including their own.

Where I digress with the thread, is that I personally see no benefit to steroids or testosterone usage, if you are not a professional/elite athlete.

For steroids, since it doesn't translate into sports or physical talent, I have no use for it. I workout to increase my athletic ability, I have no desire to be a body builder, and I see being a body builder as non-athletic. I have never seen an athletically gifted body builder, other than former pro/elite athletes that become body builders. I feel body building is detrimental to athletics. If its to bulk, you dont need juice. Food works just as well, and leaves you with no side effects. For workout recovery? Maybe... if you are a pro or elite athlete. But if you are neither, you are only kidding yourself and fucking up your body for a lifetime.

I'm 190, 5'10", and somewhere near 14% BF right now. I'm pretty big for my size from a life time of playing sports and being active. Women paw at me regularly and take their clothes off fast when we are alone. The bad side effects of steroids make no sense to me, because I want to live a very long life. The countless stories of pre-mature death and side effects keep me from doing it. Having a good physic I have built over decades, naturally, keeps me from taking the easy way out.

For testosterone, I personally dont need it. As long as I am eating and sleeping well, exercising and keeping my weight in check, my testosterone is in the high range for my age. Last I checked at age 41 it was over 800. Now some men have low testosterone. I think its environmental, and very genetic. The problem I see with taking test, is that once you start, you have to keep doing it indefinitely. Thats not for me.

I believe in self reliance, not only in life and government, and game, but also with my health and what I put into my body. Signing myself up for a lifetime prison sentence to a drug, to me should be avoided at all costs. I would tell any man who comes from a low T genetic background, to exhaust all environmental options to grow it naturally.

Post: #67

(09-04-2017 10:14 AM)nomadbrah Wrote:  

(09-04-2017 08:08 AM)Steelex Wrote:  The really fascinating thing for me is that some people really hate bodybuilders more than they do obese people, it's crazy.

I think its one of those things where people see a bodybuilder and say "if I just took steroids I could look like that" and then "but I don't wanna look like that anyway".

I think most bb haters still look at bbing Instagram's.

I don't think people hate on bodybuilders. There is some animosity to those who don't admit they do steroids, because steroids really do change the game in ways you never could without. Scientific fact is that you grow more muscle with steroids and no training than following a lifting program: http://www.nejm.org/doi/full/10.1056/NEJ...7043350101

I mean, that pisses some people off, when steroid users claim that the naturals lack of results is because he is lazy.

My philosophy: If you do it, fine, that's on you. But when people ask about your routine and diet, you better mention it, or else your a fraud.

Post: #68

Steroids make you deaf

Post: #69

(09-04-2017 07:25 PM)nek Wrote:  My philosophy: If you do it, fine, that's on you. But when people ask about your routine and diet, you better mention it, or else your a fraud.

People are under no obligation to tell you anything about their lives unless they want to. Do you require your doctors to tell you every time the popped an adderall or ritalin in medical school to get to where they are?

The reason people call people on steroids frauds is because it's easier to point fingers at others and say "he looks like that because he's on drugs." than it is to hit the gym day after day, wake up at 5am to to cardio, and eat chicken breast and broccoli until you puke.

People are always making excuses on why others are in a better position than themselves instead of putting in the hard work. .

Post: #70

(09-04-2017 07:35 PM)Green-On-GO Wrote:  Steroids make you deaf

This workout'll make you a god damn sexual Tyrannosaurus !!

Post: #71

(09-04-2017 08:03 PM)LINUX Wrote:  

(09-04-2017 07:25 PM)nek Wrote:  My philosophy: If you do it, fine, that's on you. But when people ask about your routine and diet, you better mention it, or else your a fraud.

People are under no obligation to tell you anything about their lives unless they want to. Do you require your doctors to tell you every time the popped an adderall or ritalin in medical school to get to where they are?

The reason people call people on steroids frauds is because it's easier to point fingers at others and say "he looks like that because he's on drugs." than it is to hit the gym day after day, wake up at 5am to to cardio, and eat chicken breast and broccoli until you puke.

People are always making excuses on why others are in a better position than themselves instead of putting in the hard work. .

I phrased this wrong, you're correct, no one is under obligation to tell. However, if one does divulge, and omits that information, then yes, they are a fraud.

And why is it when people point out that steroids will have an impact on one's results, those defending steroids always default to the "hard work/excuse making" line of reasoning? Many people work hard, not just people on juice, in fact, one could argue the non-juicers are harder workers with more discipline since they're not short cutting. People on juice can work harder because they can recover faster, significantly faster than if they weren't. Your body needs recovery time, and guys juicing need less of it. It's not a matter of willpower or hard work, it's science. And eating chicken and broccoli until you puke isn't being tough or dedicated, it's simply not being smart.

If you want to get bigger, stronger, just for you, more power to you, take what you want. But if you're taking something and then convince yourself you just have more willpower, discipline, and better genetics than others, and try to convince others of this too, then you're a fraud.

Post: #72

Am I missing something.. because the picture provided is something that appears to rival that of an ifbb men's physique competitor.

I wouldnt believe a word from anyone who says they would be able to bring average genetic joe to that level within 1-3 years naturally.

That level of bodyfat, paired with that much mass and fullness is not possible for a natural person even with superb genetics.

The only possible way I could see it happening is with an individual born with a genetic predisposition to myostatin deficiency and even that is a long shot since I've yet to actually see a documented case in an adult male human.

A natural can expect to look like someone like jeff cavalier from athlean X or Igor from VitruvianPhysique after YEARS of training and proper diet.

Post: #73

I have a small body frame and have had body dismorphia since junior high.
I started working out seriously in grade 12 and in 1-2 years put on about 30 lbs of weight. Ive been relatively stable at 150 lbs for a long time and it takes me considerable effort to shoot for 160. Even when I try to I just seem to gain body fat.

AKA I have absolutely shit genetics. I dont look like I lift, unless I take my short off to reveal a decently athletic body. Ive seen kids come to the gym for 3 months and get bigger than me and Ive been at it for 8 years.

Body dysmorphia + shit genetics + having 0 experience with girls ( which is the reason we all STARTED weight lifting if we're honest) means Im ready to do drastic shit.

You might say I have psychological issues, and I probably do, but Im going to hop on some testosterone cypionate.

If what LINUX says is even 10% true, to me its worth it.

Post: #74

Only reason I'm not on them right now is that I feel that I haven't reached my full natural potential and am still in my early 20s.

As for the IFBB comments, get real guys, I know guys that don't pin that look better than the guy in OPs post.

Post: #75

(09-04-2017 06:38 PM)Vaun Wrote:  Agree with Linux; the guy in the picture is quite small, and the only thing thats impressive in that pic is the low body fat percentage. I would venture to guess that the guy in the pic is a runner. He has skinny legs. Where I disagree with you Linux is that this body would take two years to build naturally. I'd say one year natural, with a coach breaking your ass everyday to eat and workout properly. People that say its "impossible" here probably have little experience in building/growing bodies, including their own.

Where I digress with the thread, is that I personally see no benefit to steroids or testosterone usage, if you are not a professional/elite athlete.

For steroids, since it doesn't translate into sports or physical talent, I have no use for it. I workout to increase my athletic ability, I have no desire to be a body builder, and I see being a body builder as non-athletic. I have never seen an athletically gifted body builder, other than former pro/elite athletes that become body builders. I feel body building is detrimental to athletics. If its to bulk, you dont need juice. Food works just as well, and leaves you with no side effects. For workout recovery? Maybe... if you are a pro or elite athlete. But if you are neither, you are only kidding yourself and fucking up your body for a lifetime.

I'm 190, 5'10", and somewhere near 14% BF right now. I'm pretty big for my size from a life time of playing sports and being active. Women paw at me regularly and take their clothes off fast when we are alone. The bad side effects of steroids make no sense to me, because I want to live a very long life. The countless stories of pre-mature death and side effects keep me from doing it. Having a good physic I have built over decades, naturally, keeps me from taking the easy way out.

For testosterone, I personally dont need it. As long as I am eating and sleeping well, exercising and keeping my weight in check, my testosterone is in the high range for my age. Last I checked at age 41 it was over 800. Now some men have low testosterone. I think its environmental, and very genetic. The problem I see with taking test, is that once you start, you have to keep doing it indefinitely. Thats not for me.

I believe in self reliance, not only in life and government, and game, but also with my health and what I put into my body. Signing myself up for a lifetime prison sentence to a drug, to me should be avoided at all costs. I would tell any man who comes from a low T genetic background, to exhaust all environmental options to grow it naturally.

That is not a naturally achievable body, and certainly not within one year.