Post: #1

As the title suggests, I'm not sure if i should go back to school to finish my Town Planning Masters Degree. Heres's the rub:

I started the course in September 2015, but, long story short, I foolishly slumped into a very lazy lifestyle, skipping lectures and smoking a lot of weed. During this time, I somehow managed to land a graduate job in my field.

As I had missed so much course material, I met with my supervisor who told me that I could continue the course, but on a part-time basis, as I was about to start at my new job. I then spoke to my future boss, who was fine with the arrangement. So, in September last year, I commenced work whilst studying part time on the side, with the agreement that I would go full time as soon as I completed the degree (expected September 2017).

During this time, I discovered that I don't really have a "passion" for this subject. So, I researched other opportunities and decided to embark on an online copywriting course on the side. I continued to study for my university course on the basis that I needed financial stability, and there were no guarantees that the copywriting would take off.

However, just last week I found out that I have failed the degree, due to failing a module. Consequently, I will be awarded a Postgraduate Certificate, due to completing a third of the course. If I wanted to continue the course, I would have to undertake it at a different university, although I would only have to study two-thirds of the course.

I decided to speak to my boss at work to see what options I have. My boss told me that whilst I'm "very good" at my job, my contract states that I need to have the Masters Degree. This has resulted in my employer agreeing to keep me on till September 2017, when my contract will be terminated, due to failing to attain the Masters Degree.

I am now unsure as to what to do. I had to take out a loan to fund this degree, and am currently having to pay off £200 (~$250) per month (the debt totals over £10k/$12,500). I therefore need some financial stability, otherwise I will default on the loan. I told my mum about this (I still live at home), and she is hellbent on the idea that I should return to school to finish the degree off. She is even offering to pay the new course fees for me (which, whilst being very kind of her, pissed me off - why did she allow me to apply for a loan if she already had the funds to help me?!). I, however, am really keen to just leave the house. I am almost 24 and am the only one of my friends still living at home. My goal is to move to London as soon as possible, but my debts are holding me back.

Therefore, the way I see it, I have the following options:

1) Go back to school in September and finish the degree, and then look for a new job in Town Planning - Potential starting salary for the top firms is £28k (~$35,000). I have been told that I'm very good at my job, despite having little passion for it. I would focus on the copywriting or a part-time job on the side. This would also give me the option to study in London, which is ultimately where I want to be. However, the thought that I would be 25 and just finishing school depresses me. I feel like i should be trying to make as much money as possible at this stage in my life, not going back to school. Also, despite it being offered to me, I feel bad taking my mum's money.

2) Immediately start looking for a new job, but commencing in September in London. I would probably be on a salary lower than if I go back to school, but at least I'd be out of the house and where I want to be. Also, if I'm not that passionate about the course, why should I put myself through another year of study? I would undertake copywriting on the side.

In conjunction with the above, I'm not sure what would be the best strategy to pay off my debts quickly. If I focus on the copywriting, it may take me a while to find clients, but the pay off would eventually be decent (providing I am successful). Whereas, If i worked part-time on the weekends, although I'd be earning a secure income, the amount being earned would not amount to much.

Given the information provided, what do you guys think are the best options with regards to my career and debt? Ultimately, I want to be a copywriter, but I have to be realistic and acknowledge that it will take me a while to start earning enough money to live on.

Post: #2

Are you able to summarize all of this into two brief paragraphs? At least try to be more concise. I'm not qualified to give financial or general life advice yet, but the guys on here that are may be hesitant to help because it's your first post and it's too time consuming to go over. Provide extra details or more information only when necessary.

Post: #3

Passion is overrated. Take your mom's money (with gratitude), finish the degree in city planning, and don't move out as long as your mom will let you stay. Work on the copywriting on the side.

Time is not on your side. I know 30 year olds that played their cards right vs those that didn't - the difference is astounding.

Post: #4

(02-19-2017 08:22 PM)Nascimento Wrote:  Are you able to summarize all of this into two brief paragraphs? At least try to be more concise. I'm not qualified to give financial or general life advice yet, but the guys on here that are may be hesitant to help because it's your first post and it's too time consuming to go over. Provide extra details or more information only when necessary.

I normally wouldn't "pile on," but since you're interested in copywriting, you need to cut what you're writing by 75%.

Be ruthless with your words. Use more images and less explanation.

Vigo

Post: #5

Alright ok, cheers for the replies so far.

In sum, I failed a masters degree which is required for my job. My contract will end in september, but I'm in debt by over £10K due to university loans. I've identified the following options but am not sure what to do:

Go back to school and finish the masters - not passionate about it, but I've been told by my employer that I'm good at the job. Mum is offering me money to finish the course, but I feel bad taking it (will be thousands). Will potentially be in London though, which is where I want to be.

Other option is to find a new job immediately, commencing in September in London. Will probably be on a lower salary in comparison to finishing off the degree, but at least I'll have moved out.

In terms of paying off my debts, what's the best strategy? Ultimately I want to be a copywriter, so ether do that on the side, or get a part time job (which is more secure initially).

Post: #6

Also, re Peregrine, wouldn't staying at home be detrimental to my game?

Post: #7

^ it sounds like your time is gonna be tight for a while. By all means, try to get laid but your overall focus should be on the $$$$$ and less on pussy. This is the sort of scenario where it might be good to shack up with a girlfriend while you hustle.

Post: #8

(02-20-2017 08:34 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  Also, re Peregrine, wouldn't staying at home be detrimental to my game?

Work on the foundations while you're at home (approaching, dates, escalating, verbal game, and anything related to lifestyle like the gym). Try to make the most of poor logistics, but that's secondary because everything I listed comes first.

When you eventually get your own place, you'll be unstoppable.

Post: #9

(02-20-2017 08:34 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  Also, re Peregrine, wouldn't staying at home be detrimental to my game?

Get paid, get laid. There's a reason it's said in that order.

I'd take Fortis' advice and shack up with a girlfriend while you get your money right. And if you're serious about copywriting, there is no reason to move to London.

Post: #10

(02-20-2017 10:31 AM)Peregrine Wrote:  

(02-20-2017 08:34 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  Also, re Peregrine, wouldn't staying at home be detrimental to my game?

Get paid, get laid. There's a reason it's said in that order.

I'd take Fortis' advice and shack up with a girlfriend while you get your money right. And if you're serious about copywriting, there is no reason to move to London.

Surely it's not a great idea to move in with a girl if you've only known her for a few months? Or is there something I'm not understanding here?

How come re London? I live near a fairly boring city and London is an exciting place to live. Most of my friends are there too.

Post: #11

When I provide advice, it's always with achieving an exceptional life in mind. If an average life is acceptable to you (nothing wrong with that), then ignore my advice. All you need to know is avoid going into consumer debt and don't marry the wrong woman to live a decent life.

I'm not suggesting you move in with anyone. I'm suggesting you get a girlfriend so you can get laid with the least time investment possible. The player lifestyle is time consuming. Time is not on your side.

Assuming you can't/don't want to go full Buddhist and shun worldly desires and weren't born to rich parents, the "simple" blueprint to an awesome life is: get high paying job, save money, use money to buy productive assets, profit. If you can create a productive asset, even better. The reason for the rush to get to step 4 ASAP is because the benefits are nonlinear (getting there in 10 years is way more than twice as good as getting there in 20 years).

Moving to London severely hampers your ability to execute on step 2, unless moving to London will significantly boost your pay (e.g. finance, law). You could argue that maybe living in London will spark serendipitous events that are financially lucrative for you, and this is possible. But I wouldn't bet on it, especially if you don't have anything exceptional to offer as of right now. Remember, copywriting can be done from anywhere in the world.

Edit: if you love what you do, then my advice also doesn't apply. I'm assuming that you don't particularly enjoy what you do (as you mentioned). My blueprint is a way to optimize life so the least amount of time is spent doing what you don't want to do.

Post: #12

How do you get a gf when your hustling all the time and have little time to go out and make that happen? I like the advice but when you are hustling 60 hours a week, getting the girl becomes harder, not just from a time standpoint but also an energy standpoint.

Post: #13

Just use your time efficiently. See a girl that you like whilst walking down the street? Approach. See a girl next to you in line for a coffee? Approach. See a girl waiting for a bus? Approach etc...

Another option is to use tinder/happn sporadically - just don't waste sevral minutes swiping mindlessly

Post: #14

Alright guys, been over a year since I originally posted and a lot has changed since then.

I had every intention of going back to Uni in September, but long story short the university fucked up and has forced me to defer my entry to September 18. Fortunately my boss has been understanding and has said i can stay on. I'm actually starting to like the job now too. I improved on my copywriting and gained a few clients, but now I can't find any further work as i keep being undercut by people in third world countries. Annoyingly I'm still stuck at home as I'm still paying off the debt (only got £3k left go though!). I haven't got laid in over a year, mainly due to shit logistics.... the dry spell is killing me ha.

This past year has been one of self-reflection - I've finally figured that all I want out of life is to be financially free, and I know that I'll have to start a biz eventually. However, whilst I have some ideas, I lack the capital to start atm. Now I feel I have three options:

1) Stay at my job, finish the master's degree (which will mean, as of september 18, working part time and being on a wage of £13k for ~9 months, before going back on £23k), continue to hustle on the side - I'm starting to like this job now and as stated before, people have said I'm good at what I do. As I'd only have to work ~45 hours a week, I'd have plenty of time to work on my biz ideas too. But, the thing is I won't get a significant raise (e.g. £30k+) until I get my professional qualification (after i get the master's), so I'll be stuck on this wage till I'm 27 (almost 25 now). That also means I can't really afford to move out till then either, although my mum is wanting to build an extension to the house and has offered me my own living area. Still won't change the shit logistics though.

2) Look for a performance based role e.g. sales. This is obviously going to get me more money in comparison to the other option and will therefore be faster in providing enough capital to start a biz. It will also teach me a number of skills that relate to starting a business, and my game will improve too. Most of these jobs are in the bigger cities i.e. London/Manchester, so I'd be forced to move out, and I'd have enough money to rent a own studio apartment. But, the huge downside for me is what if i suck? What if I'm absolutely shit at sales and get fired? I'll be stuck renting an apartment and as I'll only have a non-STEM degree, getting a different job will be difficult. I also feel that I'd hate the grinding nature of the role and would probably burn out - it's unlikely i'd have the energy to work on a business on the side.

3) Stay at my job, finish the masters (and maybe get the professional qualification too?), then move to a sales role. That way, if I suck at sales, I have something to fall back on.

Which option do you think is best?

TLDR - Option 1,2 or 3?

Post: #15

Good to hear an update from you! What's the business that you'd like to start but can't due to lack of capital?

Post: #16

(03-17-2018 03:37 AM)the-dream Wrote:  Good to hear an update from you! What's the business that you'd like to start but can't due to lack of capital?

There's quite a few options I'm considering, but the main ones are high-end perfume/aftershave, and a range of board games. Both saturated markets, I know, but which markets aren't these days?

Post: #17

(03-17-2018 03:18 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  1) Stay at my job, finish the master's degree (which will mean, as of september 18, working part time and being on a wage of £13k for ~9 months, before going back on £23k), continue to hustle on the side - I'm starting to like this job now and as stated before, people have said I'm good at what I do. As I'd only have to work ~45 hours a week, I'd have plenty of time to work on my biz ideas too. But, the thing is I won't get a significant raise (e.g. £30k+) until I get my professional qualification (after i get the master's), so I'll be stuck on this wage till I'm 27 (almost 25 now). That also means I can't really afford to move out till then either, although my mum is wanting to build an extension to the house and has offered me my own living area. Still won't change the shit logistics though.

2) Look for a performance based role e.g. sales. This is obviously going to get me more money in comparison to the other option and will therefore be faster in providing enough capital to start a biz. It will also teach me a number of skills that relate to starting a business, and my game will improve too. Most of these jobs are in the bigger cities i.e. London/Manchester, so I'd be forced to move out, and I'd have enough money to rent a own studio apartment. But, the huge downside for me is what if i suck? What if I'm absolutely shit at sales and get fired? I'll be stuck renting an apartment and as I'll only have a non-STEM degree, getting a different job will be difficult. I also feel that I'd hate the grinding nature of the role and would probably burn out - it's unlikely i'd have the energy to work on a business on the side.

3) Stay at my job, finish the masters (and maybe get the professional qualification too?), then move to a sales role. That way, if I suck at sales, I have something to fall back on.

Which option do you think is best?

TLDR - Option 1,2 or 3?

Anyone?

Post: #18

(03-18-2018 04:50 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  

(03-17-2018 03:18 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  1) Stay at my job, finish the master's degree (which will mean, as of september 18, working part time and being on a wage of £13k for ~9 months, before going back on £23k), continue to hustle on the side - I'm starting to like this job now and as stated before, people have said I'm good at what I do. As I'd only have to work ~45 hours a week, I'd have plenty of time to work on my biz ideas too. But, the thing is I won't get a significant raise (e.g. £30k+) until I get my professional qualification (after i get the master's), so I'll be stuck on this wage till I'm 27 (almost 25 now). That also means I can't really afford to move out till then either, although my mum is wanting to build an extension to the house and has offered me my own living area. Still won't change the shit logistics though.

2) Look for a performance based role e.g. sales. This is obviously going to get me more money in comparison to the other option and will therefore be faster in providing enough capital to start a biz. It will also teach me a number of skills that relate to starting a business, and my game will improve too. Most of these jobs are in the bigger cities i.e. London/Manchester, so I'd be forced to move out, and I'd have enough money to rent a own studio apartment. But, the huge downside for me is what if i suck? What if I'm absolutely shit at sales and get fired? I'll be stuck renting an apartment and as I'll only have a non-STEM degree, getting a different job will be difficult. I also feel that I'd hate the grinding nature of the role and would probably burn out - it's unlikely i'd have the energy to work on a business on the side.

3) Stay at my job, finish the masters (and maybe get the professional qualification too?), then move to a sales role. That way, if I suck at sales, I have something to fall back on.

Which option do you think is best?

TLDR - Option 1,2 or 3?

Anyone?

35k is shit. Go 2. If that fails then you can go from there.

Solid career is #1. From here you can take risks with the capital. Buy RE, start niche sites, trade, try to write copy for your own biz (writing copy is essentially a high paid job if you "make it" ..even at the highest levels until you start an actual business.

Dropping 5k on a biz idea is great if you can replace it in a few months. if you're still in your mom's basement you'll be trying to write shit articles to pay her rent instead.

Post: #19

(03-18-2018 10:36 AM)qwertyuiop Wrote:  

(03-18-2018 04:50 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  

(03-17-2018 03:18 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  1) Stay at my job, finish the master's degree (which will mean, as of september 18, working part time and being on a wage of £13k for ~9 months, before going back on £23k), continue to hustle on the side - I'm starting to like this job now and as stated before, people have said I'm good at what I do. As I'd only have to work ~45 hours a week, I'd have plenty of time to work on my biz ideas too. But, the thing is I won't get a significant raise (e.g. £30k+) until I get my professional qualification (after i get the master's), so I'll be stuck on this wage till I'm 27 (almost 25 now). That also means I can't really afford to move out till then either, although my mum is wanting to build an extension to the house and has offered me my own living area. Still won't change the shit logistics though.

2) Look for a performance based role e.g. sales. This is obviously going to get me more money in comparison to the other option and will therefore be faster in providing enough capital to start a biz. It will also teach me a number of skills that relate to starting a business, and my game will improve too. Most of these jobs are in the bigger cities i.e. London/Manchester, so I'd be forced to move out, and I'd have enough money to rent a own studio apartment. But, the huge downside for me is what if i suck? What if I'm absolutely shit at sales and get fired? I'll be stuck renting an apartment and as I'll only have a non-STEM degree, getting a different job will be difficult. I also feel that I'd hate the grinding nature of the role and would probably burn out - it's unlikely i'd have the energy to work on a business on the side.

3) Stay at my job, finish the masters (and maybe get the professional qualification too?), then move to a sales role. That way, if I suck at sales, I have something to fall back on.

Which option do you think is best?

TLDR - Option 1,2 or 3?

Anyone?

35k is shit. Go 2. If that fails then you can go from there.

Solid career is #1. From here you can take risks with the capital. Buy RE, start niche sites, trade, try to write copy for your own biz (writing copy is essentially a high paid job if you "make it" ..even at the highest levels until you start an actual business.

Dropping 5k on a biz idea is great if you can replace it in a few months. if you're still in your mom's basement you'll be trying to write shit articles to pay her rent instead.

Alright, fair. Any tips on how to overcome the self-doubt though? Can't seem to shake off the thought that I can't handle really long, intense hours, as I've never worked 60+ hour weeks consecutively.

Post: #20

You seem to be lazy and weak willed. It’s not a very good thing if you want to be an entrepreneur, unless you are willing to become more disciplined. If you are lazy, take a monthly salary.
What’s your IQ like? The smarter you are the more risk you can afford to take.
You should also consider whether you would be a good salesman. You seem to lack confidence. Salesman is a very ungrateful job. I sit next to salespeople all day and I feel their pain.
I’d finish the masters and keep the current job. Town planning sounds boring but at least you have a skill. Keep your job 3-4 years, understand your industry and see if there are business opportunities. There must be. Be patient, life is longer than you think. Stop whining about lousy logistics, you live with your mom, I live with my _wife_.

And never ever follow your ‘passion’. That’s for girls.

https://youtu.be/CVEuPmVAb8o

Post: #21

(03-18-2018 03:00 PM)Montrose Wrote:  You seem to be lazy and weak willed. It’s not a very good thing if you want to be an entrepreneur, unless you are willing to become more disciplined. If you are lazy, take a monthly salary.
What’s your IQ like? The smarter you are the more risk you can afford to take.
You should also consider whether you would be a good salesman. You seem to lack confidence. Salesman is a very ungrateful job. I sit next to salespeople all day and I feel their pain.
I’d finish the masters and keep the current job. Town planning sounds boring but at least you have a skill. Keep your job 3-4 years, understand your industry and see if there are business opportunities. There must be. Be patient, life is longer than you think. Stop whining about lousy logistics, you live with your mom, I live with my _wife_.

And never ever follow your ‘passion’. That’s for girls.

https://youtu.be/CVEuPmVAb8o

I was depressed and smoked weed daily for the past ~4 years. It's only been since the past year where I've started to get out of my rut. But yeah, atm I'm pretty lazy, lack discipline, and am low on confidence. Although, that's something I'm trying to change.

People, other than my family, have said I'm smart, so I'd guess I have an above average IQ.

I can't stand having to be patient though... I want to be free by the time I'm ~35. The thought of working past then depresses the shit out of me.

Post: #22

(03-18-2018 02:28 PM)RedKurrant Wrote:  

(03-18-2018 10:36 AM)qwertyuiop Wrote:  

(03-18-2018 04:50 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  

(03-17-2018 03:18 AM)RedKurrant Wrote:  1) Stay at my job, finish the master's degree (which will mean, as of september 18, working part time and being on a wage of £13k for ~9 months, before going back on £23k), continue to hustle on the side - I'm starting to like this job now and as stated before, people have said I'm good at what I do. As I'd only have to work ~45 hours a week, I'd have plenty of time to work on my biz ideas too. But, the thing is I won't get a significant raise (e.g. £30k+) until I get my professional qualification (after i get the master's), so I'll be stuck on this wage till I'm 27 (almost 25 now). That also means I can't really afford to move out till then either, although my mum is wanting to build an extension to the house and has offered me my own living area. Still won't change the shit logistics though.

2) Look for a performance based role e.g. sales. This is obviously going to get me more money in comparison to the other option and will therefore be faster in providing enough capital to start a biz. It will also teach me a number of skills that relate to starting a business, and my game will improve too. Most of these jobs are in the bigger cities i.e. London/Manchester, so I'd be forced to move out, and I'd have enough money to rent a own studio apartment. But, the huge downside for me is what if i suck? What if I'm absolutely shit at sales and get fired? I'll be stuck renting an apartment and as I'll only have a non-STEM degree, getting a different job will be difficult. I also feel that I'd hate the grinding nature of the role and would probably burn out - it's unlikely i'd have the energy to work on a business on the side.

3) Stay at my job, finish the masters (and maybe get the professional qualification too?), then move to a sales role. That way, if I suck at sales, I have something to fall back on.

Which option do you think is best?

TLDR - Option 1,2 or 3?

Anyone?

35k is shit. Go 2. If that fails then you can go from there.

Solid career is #1. From here you can take risks with the capital. Buy RE, start niche sites, trade, try to write copy for your own biz (writing copy is essentially a high paid job if you "make it" ..even at the highest levels until you start an actual business.

Dropping 5k on a biz idea is great if you can replace it in a few months. if you're still in your mom's basement you'll be trying to write shit articles to pay her rent instead.

Alright, fair. Any tips on how to overcome the self-doubt though? Can't seem to shake off the thought that I can't handle really long, intense hours, as I've never worked 60+ hour weeks consecutively.

Do it? Self doubt?

No one in my tech sales office knew if they were going to do well in sales or not including me. I took a shot and it worked out well. They just jumped in as well and most of them did well.

You get used to 60 hours a week. However if you can't work 60 I'm unsure how you expect to start a biz where you'll be working AFTER you work until the early AM.

If you expect to be successful in any form you have to work a lot -- at least in the US. No way around it unless you're a trust fund kid "investor" who just lives off interest.

Not trying to be harsh just realistic.

Advice from other posters is good as well -- everyone gives advice from their own experiences.