Post: #26

I don't know if homey is good or not... but Patrice was also a fat fuck... just sayin!

Post: #27

(12-02-2016 12:38 PM)Captain Gh Wrote:  I don't know if homey is good or not... but Patrice was also a fat fuck... just sayin!

Yeah, Patrice was fat but I have no doubt he could spit some great game, it's always fun listening to his material, even if I don't agree with every word of it.

Keep in mind though he was a D-list celebrity and into the swinging scene; I remember him saying some questionable (at least to me) stuff like "You need to be okay with watching your bitch get banged by another guy" and things along those lines.

Though I suppose there are worse perversions to be into in the grand scheme of things.

Post: #28

Two thoughts:

1) He's a poor speaker. He speaks too fast, swallows words, holds his hands in his pockets. Also, he looks like shit, which is important in public speaking, whether we want to admit it or not.

2) As has been mentioned before, he talks a lot but he never really says anything. It's all pickup mumbo-jumbo designed to make newbies feel like approaching girls is some gargantuan and complex undertaking. The problem is, every newbie already feels this way, so there's really no need to complicate things even further. But then again, RSD wouldn't make any money if it didn't make unintelligible science out of basic human interaction.

He may have some quality insights into social circle game, but those bits of knowledge probably just get lost in his endless talk.

Post: #29

This guy has two options for picking up girls. Or he pays...or he pays. No chance for him.

No matter if he is tall and relatively good looking, he is a real fat ass, and I am quite sure 99,99% of Western girls feel disgusted towards him approaching or even talk to them in a social environment. He is the guy who sees his friends getting laid, and wonders why he does not, since his mother always told him how handsome he is. By the way he talks he probably has a distorted view of himself.

These kind of guys have issues with themselves, and personally, all my conflicts with men in working environment have been with this kind of specimen, they tend to be jeleous, over the top ambitious, and willing to fuck you up at the minimum stuff that they can.

In sum, all he has is salesmen qualities, but he is a scammer. Otherwise he would not be fooling kids in RSD.

I give him credit for one thing that I can learn from him... How not to be.

Post: #30

Lots of hate here. I understand a lot of RVF members are americans and come from the "gym and 6pack at all cost" culture, but beauty is not that important and can be compensated with game. Really look closely Neil Strauss for example : his style was on point (when it's not too much peacock) but his face is extremely average, not much muscles, even has some beta look. Girl react more on behaviour, not looks like us guys do. That's the beauty of game : anyone can become good if you work hard enough. In a club, for the handsome guy VS the fat guy with 3 hot girls as preselection, guess what : the fat guy will be more attractive (supposedly of course they both have the same level of game).
Now regarding luke, I'm still skeptical. I don't trust PUA "guru" anymore (bad personal experience) and RSD has always had some shady stories, but maybe there is some good to be found. Let's just put our ego aside - maybe a fat guy like that pulls more than we do, who knows...

P.S. I still advise members to work for being as good-looking as possible of course; not just for girls but yourself too!

Post: #31

I would only learn game from an old, fat, or ugly guy. Or any combo of the three.

Im serious.

Not talking about this one in particular, no idea what he preaches but some said networking and social circles, which i hate.
Its easy to preach "oh change your whole life, get an awesome job, have lots of friends, look great". And yes thats the optimal advice.

But i never considered that game. At least not game which would be interesting to me.
To me, game was this: 40 year old balding dad bod dude in decent but unremarkable clothes goes into a bar. Sees a stunning woman in a long tight dress. Goes up and talks his way into bed with her.

Post: #32

^^ Speaking for myself, I am not American or come from the "6 pack at all cost" culture...

The fat guy with 3 girls can be covered in gold and still he will not be more attractive than the handsome guy. Or he is a millionaire or no chance for him...also any girl he bangs is one step away of dumping or betray him, even if he owns Las Vegas...

Many years ago there was a time I had more 10kg than what I carry now and whitout muscle, and the difference in results is just brutal...my game can be better now, but certainly back then I was much more pushy and focused to get the bang, I would go miles for that, and nowadays the effort I put is minimum.

His fatness puts him imediatelly out of the dating market.
Rather have average game, average looks, average energy, average social skills, average money...than have above average and being a sloppy fat ass.

Post: #33

(12-02-2016 06:50 AM)SlickyBoy Wrote:  Maybe the PAID girls come to you at your table in a Vegas club. My experience is most of what's in your average Vegas club nowadays are dudes and women who work there or are otherwise paid to be on site. Lame. Even Bilzerian himself is known to use P4P to augment his Instagram mirage lifestyle.

Disagree, having a table in Vegas is a huge status symbol, you're automatically deemed high value. The mega clubs also have little to no seating and drinks are mad expensive, so chicks want to sit there and listen to the music while drinking, easy way to build comfort in an environment where it can be difficult. Some nights at a club will be industry night when those in the industry get in for a free but on most nights the vast majority of those there are tourists. Never had a table, but a good friend was a promoter for Hakkasan, he would get a table twice a week. He told me it made it two times easier to pull, especially the hottest girls when he had a table then when he doesn't, none of them were payed. This is a guy who bangs a new one about every other night he goes out in Vegas.

Post: #34

Its not so much that he's overweight, but his overall appearance is quite slovenly. I'm a bigger dude myself, but I can dress my ass off and carry myself with extreme confidence.
In my opinion, you have to at least portray success in order to be perceived successful

Post: #35

(12-01-2016 10:10 PM)Repo Wrote:  Why do they all always talk so fast and say so much without really saying anything?

Because that is how Owen Cook talks. His personality dominates RSD and a lot of them talk like him, even Julian.

I would love to see a video of how Julian talked before he met Owen side by side with a video after he met him.


This is a testament to the power of a strong personality, when your life can improve trading out your personality for someone else's.

The fast double talk is, by the way, one of the principles of certain schools of hypnosis. The words exist to overwhelm the conscious mind, occupying it, making people more suggestible and willing to follow their feels.

Same principle as distracting a girl with random talk on the way to your place to keep her mind off the fact she is walking into unknown territory with a stranger.

Post: #36

''To me, game was this: 40 year old balding dad bod dude in decent but unremarkable clothes goes into a bar. Sees a stunning woman in a long tight dress. Goes up and talks his way into bed with her''

I completely agree that that would be what game is really about, but i'm just not sure that it's actually possible. I mean, game isn't some sort of black magic. It's just being normal, being fun, appearing confident etc. Just social skills. I think people over-estimate what is really possible with 'game'.

On another pickup forum I belong too, all of the posters have their pics in their profile, and it's not surprising that all of the guys getting laid are all genetically handsome. I imagine it's similar on this forum

I think all of the game in the world won't get you laid from a cold approach if the girl looks at you and thinks ''Yuk. He has a big nose and is way too short for me!'' for example.

slightly off topic, but what's the deal with speed of talk? I always assumed that talking slow showed a lack of anxiety and was 'better' in terms of game, but I notice that LOTS of online PUA's speak really fast. Not just the RSD guys, either. (and I mean 'in field' as opposed to when just addressing the camera)

Post: #37

No girl wants to be seen with a fat or unattractive guy. Much less if she's attractive. It doesn't matter if you own the world, just looked at this:




I experienced this, there was a time period were I balloned up to 190 and had quite the pouch.....I could tell the difference right away, girls were acting differently and not being receptive to my moves compared to before. Shit that worked when I was fit did not work anymore. I think I put 2-3x the effort and still didn't get results. As I started dropping the weight, girls started coming more receptive to me. Also, having a girl tell you that you're squishing her while fucking must be quite embarrassing.

Post: #38

Logistics don't just apply to how easy it is to transition from an interested girl to a bang location.

They apply just as much to the personality of the girl, the time in her life when you meet her, and the immediate environment you are both in just prior to meeting. Work, school, and vacation have gotten more guys laid than alcohol.

Chicks fuck ugly or loser dudes they work with because they have time to get comfortable with them and share positive moments and the "us against the world" mentality. Sometimes there are no other guys around at that moment, and the chick feels horny, and so decides to just fuck the dude from work that she is walking to the subway with. They are already pre-isolated and comfort-built and there are no mother hens around to discourage it.

Average dudes don't fuck up, and end up with their dicks in the chicks who, from a distance, are "out of their league" all the time. Getting loyalty or avoiding drama or getting to do it again... well, that is not what we are talking about.

For socially awkward people like me, I talked myself out of the above situations several times. After being aware of game I was able to finally experience this, but only with conscious effort to just go with the flow (something that does not come naturally to me).

I think the a priori concept of game is that woman act primarily upon their feelings in the moment. Change their mood, change their mind.

But you often don't have to change their mind if their mind just says "I'm horny and he is in front of me." I wouldn't recommend it as a strategy for young men, but that doesn't mean it doesn't happen enough.

I guess what you guys are saying is that certain things are going to be more important in cold approach, and I can totally see that. Of course maximize your looks, for success in all areas of life. But you don't know that girl's past experiences. If you are self conscious about being bald, maybe the last best orgasm she got was from a bald dude, whereas the last hunky younger guy had whisky dick. It doesn't do you any good to start projecting your preferences or thoughts onto women.

I also don't get the hate on RSD here. I enjoy listening to Owen Cook's videos, and he has turned me on to a lot of good books and concepts beyond game. This guy Luke doesn't hold any interest to me right now, because I don't care about social circle game.

Post: #39

(12-02-2016 02:09 PM)subterfuge Wrote:  ''To me, game was this: 40 year old balding dad bod dude in decent but unremarkable clothes goes into a bar. Sees a stunning woman in a long tight dress. Goes up and talks his way into bed with her''

I completely agree that that would be what game is really about, but i'm just not sure that it's actually possible. I mean, game isn't some sort of black magic. It's just being normal, being fun, appearing confident etc. Just social skills. I think people over-estimate what is really possible with 'game'.

On another pickup forum I belong too, all of the posters have their pics in their profile, and it's not surprising that all of the guys getting laid are all genetically handsome. I imagine it's similar on this forum

I think all of the game in the world won't get you laid from a cold approach if the girl looks at you and thinks ''Yuk. He has a big nose and is way too short for me!'' for example.

I knew someone like that when i was younger. I wasnt aware enough to observe any details of his game but he was a short, bald, had a belly. My older friends used to call him "the tongue". He'd get introduced to girls on a night out. Most would remark hes obnoxious or repulsive. After a few nights out with the same group, he'd talk his way into hooking up with one.

He would also often get women to cheat on their husbands with him.

Mind you this was the Lebanon of the 90s, back then the pool of girls who would sleep around was limited.

Now the guy is religious and is popping babies with his wife. I think hes at 6 now, and lectures his friends how Jesus wants them to make as many babies as they can as their lifes purpose.


While my original description is extreme, i still think thats what game should aspire to. (Not to be fat and ugly, but to have a set of skills that would equip you to overcome that.

(12-02-2016 01:28 PM)Rocha Wrote:  ^^ Speaking for myself, I am not American or come from the "6 pack at all cost" culture...

The fat guy with 3 girls can be covered in gold and still he will not be more attractive than the handsome guy. Or he is a millionaire or no chance for him...also any girl he bangs is one step away of dumping or betray him, even if he owns Las Vegas...

Many years ago there was a time I had more 10kg than what I carry now and whitout muscle, and the difference in results is just brutal...my game can be better now, but certainly back then I was much more pushy and focused to get the bang, I would go miles for that, and nowadays the effort I put is minimum.

His fatness puts him imediatelly out of the dating market.
Rather have average game, average looks, average energy, average social skills, average money...than have above average and being a sloppy fat ass.

I dont necessarily disagree with most of your post (except maybe the last paragraph).

With everything else being same, of course looks will be an advantage. Even with slightly inferior game. Hell even with very inferior game.

But like you said, "you put more effort into it when you were at a disadvantage".



Even if he gets lower results, he will have to have superior game.

The good looking guy may get 9s and have X level of game.

The ugly guy may get 7s, but maybe he has to have 2X level of game to do that.


Now im not saying i want to be guy number 2, but WHO DO I WANT TO LEARN GAME FROM? guy number 2, everytime, because he had to develop a superior skill set to get equal or even inferior results.


Of course one should maximize his looks as well, but i wont go to a dating teacher for that.

Post: #40

I've already learned bunch of things from him and tried it myself. Probably because he has very similar "social" approach to game as me. He looks like piece of shit but it's not my business. In the end it's all about good content. I like that he's results oriented and speaks like a normal guy without self help woo woo shit.

Post: #41

My bottom line. I would never learn game with this guy.

Game and pick-up are not the same thing, though indissociable. Possibly I could learn something of the latter.

Having game is also messing with a woman's mind in a sense that she is submissive to your wishes, sends you nude pics, begs you to meet her, begs you to fuck her tonight, in sum craves for more...

Well, with all stars alligned, in a 5000$ Vegas table, surrounded with high value people, this fat slob can bang a hot chick that has built some comfort with him...but it will always be a pitty fuck...next day he will still be the fat slob who got lucky that night with her.

Post: #42

(12-02-2016 04:45 PM)Rocha Wrote:  My bottom line. I would never learn game with this guy.

Game and pick-up are not the same thing, though indissociable. Possibly I could learn something of the latter.

Having game is also messing with a woman's mind in a sense that she is submissive to your wishes, sends you nude pics, begs you to meet her, begs you to fuck her tonight, in sum craves for more...

Well, with all stars alligned, in a 5000$ Vegas table, surrounded with high value people, this fat slob can bang a hot chick that has built some comfort with him...but it will always be a pitty fuck...next day he will still be the fat slob who got lucky that night with her.

Some of you guys are pretty negative. You admitted you don't understand/would never use social circle game, then you put up a bunch of assumptions about social circle game.

You claim he has to have the stars aligned and it will be a pity fuck. That's nonsense. Just look at all the women that end up with guys without tons of money that are big but have a lot of body fat. There are plenty of women that still feel protected/overwhelmed with a guy of size. It's ridiculous to say this type of guy could only get a pity fuck if the stars aligned and all the social circle game is perfect.

Post: #43

Realize there's only real one rule to social circle game. Social capital aka how well you stack up in the groups you run in is king. All it boils down to because of that principle is that so long as everyone in the group finds you more valuable than themselves you can bang whoever you want. That's what it means to run the social circle, but that of it's own accord is a commitment that consumes time.

It's why I don't try to be king but try to be as high up as possible and always have the king's ear.

Everything else is relative and dependent on the situation. I'm skeptical of this guy, but that's as far as I go without a concrete ability to examine who he is and who he rolls with like you would if you met him randomly on a night out.

Guys who run mainly or a lot of social circle game always run in packs or find a pack on a night out by working the crowd(looking like you know everyone and that deserves a post of its own honestly though I'm fairly certain me and WIA have posted about it at some point before). I think I'm one of the few that don't as much anymore, but that more or less happened more regularly after I joined the forum.

Post: #44

(12-02-2016 05:38 PM)AneroidOcean Wrote:  

(12-02-2016 04:45 PM)Rocha Wrote:  My bottom line. I would never learn game with this guy.

Game and pick-up are not the same thing, though indissociable. Possibly I could learn something of the latter.

Having game is also messing with a woman's mind in a sense that she is submissive to your wishes, sends you nude pics, begs you to meet her, begs you to fuck her tonight, in sum craves for more...

Well, with all stars alligned, in a 5000$ Vegas table, surrounded with high value people, this fat slob can bang a hot chick that has built some comfort with him...but it will always be a pitty fuck...next day he will still be the fat slob who got lucky that night with her.

Some of you guys are pretty negative. You admitted you don't understand/would never use social circle game, then you put up a bunch of assumptions about social circle game.

You claim he has to have the stars aligned and it will be a pity fuck. That's nonsense. Just look at all the women that end up with guys without tons of money that are big but have a lot of body fat. There are plenty of women that still feel protected/overwhelmed with a guy of size. It's ridiculous to say this type of guy could only get a pity fuck if the stars aligned and all the social circle game is perfect.

Exceptions do not make the rule. And there is not that big amount of hot women who hang around guys like him...not even in FSU where money rules...

And this is not a guy of size, he is just (possibly) tall and clearly fat, with feminine mannerisms, with a posture that clearly shows hes not confident in himself, hands in pockets, pushing his shirt down...no, I can swallow it for any other guy except this one...look at his trousers for god sake...If even he had some style and knew how to dress...

I am not being negative in the sense of me enjoying firing rounds at him, would not do it to any other guy like him that crosses my path if he is a cool guy and is not trying to sell me BS, or if the guy does not ask for advice... If the guy asks for advice, then yes, he is in the line of fire...

This guy is in a position where I can shoot at will, he went public and is selling dreams to people, or scamming... That's my opinion, like it or not.

Picture below shows a guy of size in the right side, fat, yes, but strong, not the mangina in the video. I wonder when was the last time he has seen his dick while pissing.

   

Post: #45

So Aneroid, you're saying that with a social circle this guy can get laid?



Common man.

Post: #46

Guy has a good looking face, good hair, tall bone structure. He is like that chick that is fat you know would be a killer if she thinned out.

He has good points about as G would say Locking Places Down and as WIA knows being a Social Magnate is THE way for building passive pussy (Running For Mayor I call it). In fact if you do look like this guy that is the BEST route you should take.

Direct day game and direct night game (dancing, fast makeouts etc with higher quality girls) is for guys in my experience is for guys with an edge in looks or just a that darker rough sexual energy which this guy lacks.

I think we should rate Game coaches on Charm 1/10 like we rate chicks on looks.

I would say he is a 6.8 on the Charm scale. As others said, beyond looks factor, he has some posture issues, talks too fast, dresses a little sloppy. That said at a bar with some drinks in him and in the chicks, he has a mouth that runs, if it doesn't fuck up, with a slight amount of confidence... is infinitely better than a great looking styled guy leaning against a wall in the corner stalk watching everyone in anxiety.

So he isn't perfect. Shy and anxious guys could still learn many things though so I wouldn't call him a fake, just lower tier coach.

I think he could get hot girls in social circle IF his social circle is big and he is a leader. He could get a few hot girls thinking him as the big teddy bear type. I think he would have a big pool though to get those niche girls that over look hit bitch tits. If he lost 30 lbs that social circle pool could be smaller which better results and so on.

Final statement, if I was a short ugly guy my goal would be to have mastered one or two great social skills at high high levels (dancing, DJ'ing, cooking, public speaking) then have a gigantic social circle I was extremely active in if I wanted to get the hottest girls possible for what I was given. Iron style and iron body is a given in that case, money doesn't hurt.

Post: #47

''Guy has a good looking face, good hair, tall bone structure. He is like that chick that is fat you know would be a killer if she thinned out.

haha. I thought the same thing! In fact, one girl compared him to Leonardo DiCaprio in one of his vids.

'' if I was a short ugly guy my goal would be to have mastered one or two great social skills at high high levels (dancing, DJ'ing, cooking, public speaking) then have a gigantic social circle I was extremely active in if I wanted to get the hottest girls possible for what I was given''

As someone who considers himself to not be very good looking, can you clarify? How would being good at cooking for example translate too a social circle? You mean like, going to cooking classes, getting good at cooking in the hope that the girls in the cooking class think that your 'skill' is sexy and gives you some sort of status in that particular group? (or have I miss-understood?)

Post: #48

(12-02-2016 02:00 PM)debeguiled Wrote:  

(12-01-2016 10:10 PM)Repo Wrote:  Why do they all always talk so fast and say so much without really saying anything?

Because that is how Owen Cook talks. His personality dominates RSD and a lot of them talk like him, even Julian.

I would love to see a video of how Julian talked before he met Owen side by side with a video after he met him.


This is a testament to the power of a strong personality, when your life can improve trading out your personality for someone else's.

The fast double talk is, by the way, one of the principles of certain schools of hypnosis. The words exist to overwhelm the conscious mind, occupying it, making people more suggestible and willing to follow their feels.

Totally wrong, talking fast is associated with compulsive liars, it is a need to speed up speech in order to over exaggerate.

http://www.compulsivelyingdisorder.com/s...ng-to-you/

Post: #49

Tried watching by skipping around. As has already been noted, he needs to slow down his speech.

I couldn't get over seeing his stomach and manboobs jiggle more when he waved his hands around.

Is he wearing motorcycle jeans?

I think he has a few good points about adding value to people through shared experiences, but I couldn't handle watching it.

Compare to how Roosh speaks in his recent periscopes/videos/podcasts. Cadence is much slower. Fundamentals are emphasized. Less word salad.

Post: #50

(12-02-2016 01:36 PM)AWright Wrote:  Disagree, having a table in Vegas is a huge status symbol...

If you want to spend a few grand to test that theory, go for it. The numbers are still against you in clubs, generally, especially Vegas.

Quote:... a good friend was a promoter for Hakkasan, he would get a table twice a week. He told me it made it two times easier to pull, especially the hottest girls when he had a table then when he doesn't, none of them were payed. This is a guy who bangs a new one about every other night he goes out in Vegas.

Two times already shitty odds is still mediocre, but it also sounds like he's already got some pre-selection going for him if he's a promoter so that helps too, at least with locals. Was he paying for the tables?

Even then I'd have to see El Fatso from the video pull it off to be convinced. He looks like a big bag of shit, really. Should learn to dress better at least. Also remember if talk is that guy's game, it is orders of magnitude more difficult to do in a club with loud music blaring.