Post: #1

In regards to this thing that we do.... is there really a difference between those who engage in P4P, and those who pay to wine and dine whores in the hopes of getting a crack at some hole? What are the advantages / disadvantages of both?

Post: #2

P4P would seem to get the nod for better use of time.

Non-p4p gives some the pleasure of the conquest in addition to the act.

All personal preference I guess.

Post: #3

I prefer going to the club, meeting a female, spend zero money on her.

SNL her ass and send her on her way in the morning.

Post: #4

There's no negatives for a man with the resources to simply pay for what he wants. If the goal is pussy, then more power to him if he can skip over the rituals to get to it. For the gamesman, the disadvantage is that he may invest with no immediate return, or no return at all. The advantage is the feeling he gets from the conquest - that his investment of time, money and effort paid off. The ultimate is securing the conquest with little or NO financial investment of course, where you can sell the bang with just your winning personality...HA HA!

Post: #5

P4P sets up an expectation that there will be an exchange in money EVERY time.

Wine & dine (controlled) gives a chance that banging will be free thereafter.

I have done both but like I have said before. It doesn't matter if you have banged the baddest chicks using P4P. You will STILL strive for finding a bad chick to bang without P4P.

Post: #6

If I had crazy money in the bank and lots of leisure, I'd mostly run game and augment it with p4p.

If I had crazy money in the bank but no leisure, it's probably be mostly p4p.

As I am poor, p4p is not an option ($500 an hour? That's nearly half my rent!) so it's all game.


I don't have this huge hate or obvious disdain for p4p or game, but do what's best for you. If you're working 85 hours a week and making money but too drained to go out and pull then go ahead and set up an escort, just like if you're working <40 hours a week and making average money and you're gaming and learning.

End game, if you have social skills and decent game though, game costs less than paying for an escort.

Post: #7

Anybody can do P4P. Some might argue that P4P has a greater tendency to be mechanical and business oriented (clock watching), depending on the situation. It can also be great, especially if you don't have a lot of time and sex is your only objective!

Non P4P can be anything from Blockbuster and a pizza to being a Gigalo. There is also the grey area where a pro or semi-pro is feeling you and gives you the goods for free cause she already made her money off some other dude. Money isn't the only thing that will get you the goods. Sometimes swagger, convo, dance, style ... there is a lot that might make P4P unnecessary if you have chicks on your tip.

Post: #8

^^ 500/hr? there are hoes on backpage for like $100/hh and $150-200/hr.

Post: #9

Funny thing about p4p is that i would never do it in the western world but whenever i am in latin america and i approach a normal looking chick and next day she comes to my house and when i think that i am going to fuck her..she comes up with all problems that she has and asks me if i can help her out...im like ok..but what would i gain for helping you? She doesnt say anything and next minute we are fucking and latter i throw her some changes.


I wouldnt advise guys with basic game to do p4p but when you are mad confident, you fuck a lot wherever you go, you just think you dont want to waste time anymore, you want to fuck and move on..if you have the cash and these semi pros are asking you for little change, spend it. This is what many guys dont understand when Charlie sheen spends 10k to fuck a normal chick, this dude doesnt want to waste time..he wants to fuck and move on..and im sure 10k doesnt make a difference to his bank account.

Paying for everything in my opinion is a sucker move..unless she was my long term bitch and she is always with me and im also making over 250k per year..then i wouldnt mind spending money on her.

I just love how hooligan harry puts it, money only matters to those who dont have it..thats why im suspicious about some guys who claim to make a certain amount of money but latter act like they dont want to spend..wtf

Post: #10

(12-19-2011 11:05 PM)Dash Global Wrote:  I prefer going to the club, meeting a female, spend zero money on her.

SNL her ass and send her on her way in the morning.

Are these whores subpar? How often are you fucking these women for "free", when you meet them in the club?I think if she knows she's hot, you're gonna have to put out ...drinks, dinner, something. Even the large sows in the club require some form of payment

Post: #11

Thing about P4P that has always bothered me is this: whores are always fucking some dude for free.

Whether it is their pimp, dirt bag boyfriend, or some random dude at a bar/club they met.

Yet they expect YOU to pay. That is chump status. Plain and simple.

Post: #12

(12-20-2011 10:41 AM)Pusscrook Wrote:  

(12-19-2011 11:05 PM)Dash Global Wrote:  I prefer going to the club, meeting a female, spend zero money on her.

SNL her ass and send her on her way in the morning.

Are these whores subpar? How often are you fucking these women for "free", when you meet them in the club?I think if she knows she's hot, you're gonna have to put out ...drinks, dinner, something. Even the large sows in the club require some form of payment

Pusscrook, you of all people should know that even indirect payment is not always necessary!

I'm more concerned with the money I spend on nightlife than the money I spend directly on buying girls drinks or food.

Post: #13

(12-20-2011 10:50 AM)Caligula Wrote:  

(12-20-2011 10:41 AM)Pusscrook Wrote:  

(12-19-2011 11:05 PM)Dash Global Wrote:  I prefer going to the club, meeting a female, spend zero money on her.

SNL her ass and send her on her way in the morning.

Are these whores subpar? How often are you fucking these women for "free", when you meet them in the club?I think if she knows she's hot, you're gonna have to put out ...drinks, dinner, something. Even the large sows in the club require some form of payment

Pusscrook, you of all people should know that even indirect payment is not always necessary!

I'm more concerned with the money I spend on nightlife than the money I spend directly on buying girls drinks or food.

Yes sir, I am aware of this, I was just wondering how often he fucks a chick, scott free.

Post: #14

I get better orgasms from picking up women than p4p.
End of story, that's all I care about.

Post: #15

I think of it like this. Let's say there's a mountain that you want to climb. There's three ways to get to the top of the mountain:

1. You can pay for a helicopter ride
2. You can pay some tour operator for an all-inclusive mountain-climbing package tour
3. You can just head out, hire your own guide, buy your own gear, buy a guidebook and find your own route

The helicopter is like buying a whore. It's the most direct route and likely the most expensive. Barring whatever you've done to earn the money, it's the least amount of effort and will likely be a first-class experience (provided you're going with a legit helicopter operator and not some $10 crack helicopter.)The package tour is like traditional dating. Most people feel safest this way. It's low risks and you're going to make a lot of unnecessary stops, but provided you've paid enough and selected the right tour operator you're probably going to make it to the top. The last option is the most like game. You're own your own, maybe you've got a wingman with you, but you're going your own way. It's the cheapest and the most adventurous. And, if your climbing skills aren't up to snuff, there's no guarantee that you won't end up huddled up, alone and cold on the side of some mountain. You go that way though, cause there's something a little sweeter about taking on the mountain on your own terms.

Personally, I opt for option 3. The helicopter is sometimes tempting, but the climb is half the fun for me.

Post: #16

(10-26-2011 07:25 PM)Dash Global Wrote:  Finally got that K flag last night!

This gaming females online that live in different cities is really appearing to have a high ROI.

Most of them dont have cars so they are forced to spend the night. And after that it is a rap!

This chick last night broke the bank though.

Took her to a restaurant and she ordered the most expensive shit!

Im sitting there watching EVERYTHING on the menu get brought to the table. I was like WTF.

Then we go to a bar after and she is ordering top shelf mix drinks.

At this point im thinking this bitch BETTER put out tonight.

Smashed twice over the course of the night!

And what is up with Asian chicks not caring about a guy using protection!?!?!?

Dash, do you mean spending zero money like this?

In 99.99 percent of the time, you always pay for it one way or the other.

Post: #17

(12-20-2011 08:08 PM)morpheus Wrote:  

(10-26-2011 07:25 PM)Dash Global Wrote:  Finally got that K flag last night!

This gaming females online that live in different cities is really appearing to have a high ROI.

Most of them dont have cars so they are forced to spend the night. And after that it is a rap!

This chick last night broke the bank though.

Took her to a restaurant and she ordered the most expensive shit!

Im sitting there watching EVERYTHING on the menu get brought to the table. I was like WTF.

Then we go to a bar after and she is ordering top shelf mix drinks.

At this point im thinking this bitch BETTER put out tonight.

Smashed twice over the course of the night!

And what is up with Asian chicks not caring about a guy using protection!?!?!?

Dash, do you mean spending zero money like this?

In 99.99 percent of the time, you always pay for it one way or the other.

Woosaa

Post: #18

Often time P4P can be cheaper than gaming some girls. In Many latin american countries the price is between 20 and 100 dollars depending on the establishment and quality of the girl. Both are fun, one gives you a guarenteed return. With both you can have buyers remorse the next day. P4P you get a bad lay and your out your money. When wining and dining you could be out of your money and get nothing. P4P is more honest in my opinion your both there for a stated reason no lies.

Post: #19

(12-20-2011 08:44 PM)johnw28 Wrote:  Often time P4P can be cheaper than gaming some girls. In Many latin american countries the price is between 20 and 100 dollars depending on the establishment and quality of the girl. Both are fun, one gives you a guarenteed return. With both you can have buyers remorse the next day. P4P you get a bad lay and your out your money. When wining and dining you could be out of your money and get nothing. P4P is more honest in my opinion your both there for a stated reason no lies.

P4P is definitely cheaper long term, but how does one feel after you fuck a chick who you know has sucked at least 50 dicks that very day? I would think one would want to feel "special" in some way. Does wonders for the ego when you think you are the one who blows her mind.

Post: #20

I don't see how paying for sex is cheaper. Even at $50/lay you're paying $1500 per month. A girlfriend doesn't cost near that much unless you're a pushover and you place no value on the non-sex stuff you do together.

And realistically, most of our time (barring the guys who practically live abroad) is spent in our home country where you'll be paying multiples of that price

Post: #21

(12-20-2011 09:39 PM)Ehnulo Wrote:  I don't see how paying for sex is cheaper. Even at $50/lay you're paying $1500 per month. A girlfriend doesn't cost near that much unless you're a pushover and you place no value on the non-sex stuff you do together.

And realistically, most of our time (barring the guys who practically live abroad) is spent in our home country where you'll be paying multiples of that price

Why would you want to fuck everyday? This will get old and there is too much attachment to worry about. A girlfriend may/may not cost you near as much , but there is one thing you forgot to mention, which is the emotional trauma( and that day will come), which will cost you much more than the money you spend on the whore, eventually.

Post: #22

I have some hangups when it comes to p4p. Strippers can barely give me a boner, maybe that's weird but it's the way it is. I think it's the insincerity, which is why I know prostitutes aren't my bag. I'm also cheap, I'd rather indirectly pay for sex (drinks, etc.), as long as I think I've "earned it" I'm good.

Post: #23

Guys, we need to stop deluding ourselves: we always pay for it, no matter what, in one way or another. You don't pay just with money. Everything can be and is quantified if you really think about it with various forms of currencies: emotional currency, financial currency and temporal or time currency, which is by far, the most valuable and expensive form of all currencies (if you really want to take this a step further, 2nd only to our health, but that's for another post...).

See, money comes in a finite amount, even tough it has an infinite potential in the sense that one can always make more of it. Time, however, comes in a limited and finite amount for all of us and not even the most powerful and wealthiest person in the history of mankind can buy time back. Thus, why time is considered as the most precious currency. This is something that young pups or guys who have more time than money have a hard time grasping.

When you've reached a certain age or a certain level of success, where you truly understand the value of time and that time is more valuable than any amoun of money, money then becomes what it is really meant to be: a means to your ends. This is what 2 of the overall most successful guys in here, not just in game but overall, have been saying time after time: Hooligan Harry with "money matters only to those who dont have it" and The G when he says: "I dont' trip on pennies to make dollars". Truer and wiser words have rarely been spoken.

Guys, there is a wealth of wisdom behind those words. Really think about it. What do they mean by that? What they mean is that it doesn't matter if you have to buy a lizard a couple of drinks to get her juices flowing and get you faster to the bang. Just to clarify, it doesn't mean also to be a sucker and buying drink after drink for every reptile you meet, common sense applies here. It simply means don't be a cheapo who won't buy a girl a drink or goes dutch and as a result, loses the bang, hence the not tripping on pennies to make dollars.

So you want to feel special and that you have earned it? Fair enough, but at what cost? Hours of going through shit test after shit test, putting up with a shit crap of BS from her, spending hours and money on wining and dining the reptile for no guarantees of result at the end of the night? And if you do get lucky at the end of the night you'll feel that you've earned it. Just like the guy the day before you and the dude after you the next day for slamming it. So much for exclusivity, hey..

Paying a girl a few bucks is merely another form of greasing someone's hands to speed up the process of an action you want done. Nothing more, nothing less. There's always an exchange, a give and take. Some prefer to do it indirectly via wining and dining, not to mention all the BS and hoops one has to go through for an x amount of hours and valuable time lost for ever and others, may opt for a more direct approach by skipping all the bullshit and go straight to the point, which in turn saves both money, emotional BS to go through to and of course, most importantly, time.

Ask any experienced and successful man and he'll tell you without hesitation that the most expensive pussy is the so called "free" one. There's no such thing as free lunch as the saying goes and there certainly ain't no such thing as free pussy, specially here in Murka. As the saying goes, you don't pay a woman to have sex with her, but to have her leave after you're done.

Don't get me wrong, I'm not condemning game, quite the opposite. Game is a very valuable skill (I'd go as far as saying a survival skill). I do enjoy te thrill of the chase, courting and having fun with a girl in a club, just like any guy out there. However, I am not deluded that it will be free as there will always be a cost involved to it, whether directly or indirectly, be it with money, emotional or time. Let me ask you this: which would you choose? between spending say 200 bucks on a night out, wining and dining a reptile, with no garantee of her putting out at the end of it, or paying 100 bucks for a hot chick to get it straight to biz and without any of the drama, lost time, shit tests and bses to get through?

Post: #24

(12-20-2011 10:49 AM)Easy E Wrote:  Thing about P4P that has always bothered me is this: whores are always fucking some dude for free.

Whether it is their pimp, dirt bag boyfriend, or some random dude at a bar/club they met.

Yet they expect YOU to pay. That is chump status. Plain and simple.

In exchange for the "free pussy" that guy has to listen to all of her shit. He has to listen to her talk about how much she hates her life and should have been a model because "I look way better than those bitches in vogue." He has to put up with the CONSTANT barrage of shit tests from a woman who, by the very nature of her job, is a master at manipulating men.

He also has to deal with the frequent times when she comes home from "work" and is too exhausted to fuck him because she has been getting piped from strangers all day.

Let me tell you how much stress it is. I know several dudes that are knowingly dating hookers. In EVERY case, the girl is paying the bills and supporting the dude. The girls do this because THEY HAVE TO if they want to keep the guy. Few guys are going to put up with the added emotional work that comes with dating a hooker while knowing that she is banging other guys UNLESS they are getting paid from it.

Post: #25

(12-20-2011 10:07 PM)Gmac Wrote:  I have some hangups when it comes to p4p. Strippers can barely give me a boner, maybe that's weird but it's the way it is. I think it's the insincerity, which is why I know prostitutes aren't my bag. I'm also cheap, I'd rather indirectly pay for sex (drinks, etc.), as long as I think I've "earned it" I'm good.

to argue about the correlation between "P4P and insincerity" would be useless, as all prostitutes are in it to bamboozling the needy, but whores today, are just are insincere, and since we seek approval via true love, how do we distinguish reality between P4P and whores who you have to eventually pay for everything else?