Post: #26

I stop reading at "women say"

Post: #27

What women say and do are completely different. Think of all the examples where this is case.

"I want a nice guy that will treat me right"
Fucks an asshole

"We are not having sex tonight"
First chance she gets those panties drop

"I've only had sex with ______________ guys."
Multiply it by at least 3

There are many more examples.

Action of the women is what you pay attention to. They want to the fuck the guys that have the highest value. Even though being in shape is important its not the only aspect of game.

There are many other ways to have value. It's a complicated formula that can be concoted in many different ways but the end goal is the same. You are attempting to portray your value to the opposite sex to get laid.

Post: #28

I read a similar article in the girls section of one of the major papers here and had a good laugh.
As has been pointed out but numerous people in this post it's about what girls do and not what they say.
However what this "fad" is aimed at is not ONS but relationships. A couple of previous posters have also pointed this out and the fact that it is based on female insecurity. If a girl doesn't like eating healthy and staying in shape then she's going to feel crap and unattractive if she dates a guy who does. Every time he passes on the post dinner icecream/chocolate/etc it will feel like a little dig at her.
It will also mean the guy won't be getting envious looks from other women so she can feel secure that he won't be straying and will stick around to be a good Beta Provider.

"dad bod" = I want a guy who doesn't make me feel insecure and guilty about being out of shape

Post: #29

I recall that video posted by Zelcorpion of the jacked guy walking around painted like the hulk, and his friend with a dad bod, talking to girls... One girl said she would not consider the dad bod for a ONS but would consider him for a LTR.

It's interesting how men and women are kind of opposite on this. (Higher/lower standards for hookups vs. relationships.)

Post: #30

I've been rolling with a friend who has an extremely good looking physique(he's ripped as fuck).

He gets a lot of female attention. Girls are very interested in him right off the bat. Getting ripped and muscular is a major asset and something every guy should work towards.

Post: #31

(09-12-2015 11:32 PM)Isaac Jordan Wrote:  

Quote:The dad bod craze is not about physical appearance or a man's body type. With the exception of a few deviants, most girls are not going to say the guy whose body looks like really beat mashed potatoes is hotter than the guy who looks like a fucking Greek god. What they're really saying is, I'm attracted to the human version of a melted ice cream cone for the same reason I like getting all my life advice from Elite Daily articles: it's easy, it's all about me, and it tells me exactly what I want to hear. It's an attraction to the physical manifestation of complacency.

I've never seen this guy before. I'm not sure if he's really intelligent or he just posted a perfectly accurate, prophetic video by accident, but this is about as brilliant a summation of this issue as you can possibly get.

Post: #32

(09-13-2015 09:07 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  I recall that video posted by Zelcorpion of the jacked guy walking around painted like the hulk, and his friend with a dad bod, talking to girls... One girl said she would not consider the dad bod for a ONS but would consider him for a LTR.

It's interesting how men and women are kind of opposite on this. (Higher/lower standards for hookups vs. relationships.)

It's a biological instinct. The in shape/athletic/alpha looking male represents risk. Subconsciously females know he has options so a long term relationship presents as a potential hazard in her mindset.

The dad bod/out of shape/less attractive male represents stability. It appeals to the subconscious probability of being taken care of. This is the last place any man wants to be. It's like volunteering for a gun fight armed with a fork.

If a long term relationship is what one is after, it's much easier to convince a girl that you can be loyal than to hold onto a girl when she holds the balance of power.

Post: #33

(09-12-2015 10:48 PM)thedarkknight Wrote:  I've noticed that quite a few girls have told me they prefer chubby average-looking guys over ripped ones. Has anyone else noticed this? Is this just a case of everyone liking different things or are there other,more ego-attacking reasons why a woman would say such a thing?

Thanks

When you say "quite a few girls" what do you mean? Two or three of your female Facebook friends posting #DadBod memes? Realistically, girls don't want that shit. It's bullshit social media content really. Take it as ironic humor that girls regurgitate because they think they're supposed to in order to be socially aware and move on.

All other things being equal, the only reason a girl would prefer an out of shape, unattractive male over a good looking one is because he is "safe." Girls can get very insecure about competition. I've dated a girl who felt insecure because I was better looking than her, and because she knew I had dated better looking, sexier women than her. It made her feel inadequate and likely made the prospect of a LTR with me seem like a liability.

These are the same girls that think its cool or cute to be a "cat lady" or boast about how they are an "old soul" and this and that. It's cool to be mediocre, unimpressed by shit, sarcastic and cynical, etc. It's just bullshit pop-culture stuff they they see and read and spit back out. Pay attention to what they do not what they say.

Besides, another thing to realize about shit you see on FB or twitter - these aren't "majority" trends. Just because you see a girl or two say how much they like tubby guys, does not speak for the 4 Billion others who don't.

Post: #34

They may like or don't like but if a man has his shit together he will still be able to get some even if he looks like Pierre Woodman. Especially if the girls are eastern european. Because they know if you know their worth.

Post: #35

Russian joke for those that can read:
- Хочу богатого, умного, красивого мужчину, и чтобы обязательно щедрого, и чтобы катал меня на красивом большом автомобиле, и чтобы всегда и во всём со мной соглашался, и чтобы проводил время только со мной, и чтобы на других не смотрел, чтобы дышал мной, и каждый день в нашем красивом большом и светлом доме пахло свежими цветами!
- А ты ему за это что?
- Писечку.

Post: #36

Also there is a "busted dudes" thread that discusses this topic

Post: #37

(09-13-2015 09:07 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  I recall that video posted by Zelcorpion of the jacked guy walking around painted like the hulk, and his friend with a dad bod, talking to girls... One girl said she would not consider the dad bod for a ONS but would consider him for a LTR.

It's interesting how men and women are kind of opposite on this. (Higher/lower standards for hookups vs. relationships.)

Exactly, and this is a fascinating observation to me, one that I first saw pointed out by a commenter on Private Man's blog.

The subset of women that a man will have casual sex with is much larger than the subset of women he would marry, because the standard is naturally lower since he's just looking for sex and is not required to invest resources in her.

But for women the subset of men that women will have casual sex with is much smaller than the subset of men she would marry. She will have casual sex only if the guys sexual attractiveness traits are so high she does not require any exchange of resources by the male for her to give sex in return. All she instinctively wants from the casual sex guy is his genes.

This results in the rather astonishing outcome (to men at least), that a woman will be willing to marry, live with, have children with, a man that, if she went into a crowded nightclub looking for sex, would never be on the list of guys in the room that she would consider going home with that night. If you're over 30, you've seen this play out many times with people in your extended circle-a woman marries a guy that in terms of his looks and personality seems to be somewhat below her, but he's stable, earnest and makes a good income. This is very much a conscious calculation on the woman's mind in many cases, so think about what that says about her attitude toward him and the likely trajectory of the marriage in terms of how she treats him day to day, potential cheating, and divorce 10-20 years later. And the clueless man thinks he scored her because of his charm or she's his "soulmate" or he just got very lucky. But she never really looks at him with desire or admiration, it's more of a practical transaction to her. And these guys are mystified when the sex suddenly drops off after the marriage; it was there just as an enticement to get him to sign the contract; once he's locked in, he will get gradually be reduced to maintenance and procreative sex only.

If you want a demonstration of all this, next time you're in a crowded venue play "Marry, Fuck, Kill" with a girl. Girls love this game , and I've found are remarkably honest when playing it, especially after a few drinks. Over and over, out of the three guys you pick for her to judge, she will kill the dorkiest one, fuck the most alpha one or at least the best looking one, and marry the one who is decent looking but not too handsome and has a conservative, hard working middle class beta type look about him.

Alpha fucks, beta bucks is reality.

Post: #38

Remember guys, part of what women prefer is what they see as "high value". Some chicks who've only met dumb muscle heads will see huge muscles as a sign of being dumb, and if they value smart, find guys who don't look "smart" unattractive.

There are studies that show men usually overestimate how much muscle and leanness is required to be "hot" to women.

Post: #39

Being overweight is a major DLV, but women are most likely to tolerate it when it's a robust big boned fat guy, with a large frame underneath, aka the bouncer or linebacker body. However when it's an average or small framed guy who's overweight, aka a 'chubby' guy, or a 'herb', then that's a death sentence - Incel Level 9000.

Post: #40

To play Devil's Advocate on this, along the lines Civpro is suggesting, I would personally say that a lot of the guys I know who get laid a lot are what I'd consider chubby. Obviously the definition varies, depending on your personal standards, which makes meaningful distinctions hard. However, most of the guys I know that are slaying it are rugby player types/bouncer type physiques. These guys aren't fat by any stretch, but they are probably carrying around a stone of fat more than they 'need' to, which I'd consider chubby.

These are the guys who are sinking 20 pints or so on a weekly basis, but who train and don't let themselves go to shit. They won't take anyone's breath away with their shirts off, but with clothes on, they look like big, strong, reasonably athletic dudes. This, and the ability to really get loose, is more like catnip to a chick than the good looking ripped guy who looks smaller in his clothes, even if he is carrying more LBM.

For example, I am currently 6'1, 13st11 with veins starting to show through on my abs (I have to be very lean for ab vascularity ~10%bf). I have no doubt that I would out-pull these guys on a beach somewhere, but you have to consider your environment. It's 3 years since I was last on a beach, I live in the South of the UK, and in public would usually be wearing a shirt or very occasionally a t-shirt. Consequently, I have no doubt that if I simply at until I had a stone of spare weight distributed across my body (including the half stone or so of muscle that would go with that), I would probably get more attention from girls, as 15 1/2 stone at 6'1 suddenly makes you a pretty big bloke. If my main physique aim was to get girls, I would put on some fat now to improve my success rate.

Size is king if you look like the kind of bloke who knows how to use it.

Post: #41

(09-16-2015 05:34 AM)H1N1 Wrote:  To play Devil's Advocate on this, along the lines Civpro is suggesting, I would personally say that a lot of the guys I know who get laid a lot are what I'd consider chubby. Obviously the definition varies, depending on your personal standards, which makes meaningful distinctions hard. However, most of the guys I know that are slaying it are rugby player types/bouncer type physiques. These guys aren't fat by any stretch, but they are probably carrying around a stone of fat more than they 'need' to, which I'd consider chubby.

These are the guys who are sinking 20 pints or so on a weekly basis, but who train and don't let themselves go to shit. They won't take anyone's breath away with their shirts off, but with clothes on, they look like big, strong, reasonably athletic dudes. This, and the ability to really get loose, is more like catnip to a chick than the good looking ripped guy who looks smaller in his clothes, even if he is carrying more LBM.

For example, I am currently 6'1, 13st11 with veins starting to show through on my abs (I have to be very lean for ab vascularity ~10%bf). I have no doubt that I would out-pull these guys on a beach somewhere, but you have to consider your environment. It's 3 years since I was last on a beach, I live in the South of the UK, and in public would usually be wearing a shirt or very occasionally a t-shirt. Consequently, I have no doubt that if I simply at until I had a stone of spare weight distributed across my body (including the half stone or so of muscle that would go with that), I would probably get more attention from girls, as 15 1/2 stone at 6'1 suddenly makes you a pretty big bloke. If my main physique aim was to get girls, I would put on some fat now to improve my success rate.

Size is king if you look like the kind of bloke who knows how to use it.

If you are shredded, that's a big boost for tinder if you can take good pictures.

Post: #42

(09-14-2015 11:51 AM)MrXY Wrote:  

(09-13-2015 09:07 PM)RexImperator Wrote:  I recall that video posted by Zelcorpion of the jacked guy walking around painted like the hulk, and his friend with a dad bod, talking to girls... One girl said she would not consider the dad bod for a ONS but would consider him for a LTR.

It's interesting how men and women are kind of opposite on this. (Higher/lower standards for hookups vs. relationships.)

Exactly, and this is a fascinating observation to me, one that I first saw pointed out by a commenter on Private Man's blog.

The subset of women that a man will have casual sex with is much larger than the subset of women he would marry, because the standard is naturally lower since he's just looking for sex and is not required to invest resources in her.

But for women the subset of men that women will have casual sex with is much smaller than the subset of men she would marry. She will have casual sex only if the guys sexual attractiveness traits are so high she does not require any exchange of resources by the male for her to give sex in return. All she instinctively wants from the casual sex guy is his genes.

I read somewhere this statement: Men compromise on looks in the pursuit of sex, women compromise on looks in the pursuit of commitment. Women typically don't do 'slump busters'.

Post: #43

This thread has so much gold.

I will say some girls honesty feel more comfortable with a dad bod because a fit body makes them uncomfortable. And 0 girls will turn down a fit body over a fat one

Post: #44

"You will never hear anything true about woman from a woman." - Nietzsche.

Here's something from the Book of Pook on page 33 about him putting on some muscle:

Quote:155
I started out around 155 pounds at 6’3 height. This meant that I was very skinny. I was also considered a nice looking guy. Women loved me being tall.

At this point, I had to deal with a lot of fat chicks hitting on me. These girls were BIG and I wanted nothing to do with them. Ugly girls also would come to me. This was me not doing anything. This was what my body was attracting all alone. If I wanted to get a cuter girl, I had to work for it.

I have problems talking to women, not because I am scared or boring, but because I sense the women think I am ‘below’ them. And the truth is that they do.

I date average women.

165
Already, things have changed. The fat/ugly women still go for me but they don’t think I’m as easy. They want to enter oneitis with me. The ‘unworthy’ girls category would now all be staring at me. To the beautiful women, I’m just a typical guy. Cute girls now enjoy talking to me.

I still date average women and now some cute women

175
“You are looking very good,” my older female manager told me. The fat/ugly women no longer hit on me (thank goodness!) and people (out of the blue) are asking why I don’t have a girlfriend. Average girls are beginning to stare.

I date only cute women with some very attractive ones mixed in.

185
Average girls are now hitting on me. Very attractive women are checking me out. At this stage, every woman is happy to talk to me. They all secretly wonder if I’m gay. I date more very attractive women but still have the cute ones.

195
OK, when you don’t have a girlfriend at this stage, the ladies will whisper, “Is he gay?” all the time. One girl got bold about it and asked me point blankly, “Pook, you are cute and all. So why don’t you have a girlfriend?” I was stunned by her bluntness (rare among women).

Average women consider me out of their league. Cute ones try to become my ‘friend’.

I date only very attractive women. Beautiful women are still a bit of an anomalie.

205
When you get to this stage, something very strange happens. All the attention and staring women gave you is gone (mostly). Ugly/Fat women will despise you as will the average women. Most girls will be scared of you (cute girls, very attractive girls)

Let me give you some examples. One Very Beautiful girl was in several of my classes. I start talking to her and she has plenty of time to leave. But she doesn’t… she stays to keep talking to me. The girls now notice me, but are a bit scared to talk and act around me.

One cute girl is like a leech to me in one of my classes. She must sit right next to me, must ‘borrow my notes’, must talk to me 20 minutes after class everyday…

One Very Beautiful woman was a fitness instructor at my gym (think ‘well muscled’ with nice strong legs (those strong thighs come in handy with her dealings with the Pook-man!)). Every time I saw this girl, she always had a ‘satellite’ boy around her. Who does she end up with? Me.

Or the ultimate example: there was a girl I was in oneitis that drove me to this webpage. As I got bigger, her reactions to me changed as well. At 155, I was ‘average’. At 175, she knew something was up. I got her at 195.

Now I date some Very Attractive women but most are Very Beautiful Women.

I know many of you guys are saying the same thing, “I get beautiful women too and I am skinny!” But the thing is, all these examples here is based on attraction on the body alone. I am NOT working to get these women. My body is doing 99% of the attracting. I can just be a statue and get a response. (But of course, you have to take action. This is based on doing zilch.)

Post: #45

(09-13-2015 12:36 AM)Menace Wrote:  When women say X, X is irrelevant. When women do X, then you can pay attention.

quoted for emphasis.

Post: #46

(09-12-2015 10:48 PM)thedarkknight Wrote:  I've noticed that quite a few girls have told me they prefer chubby average-looking guys over ripped ones. Has anyone else noticed this? Is this just a case of everyone liking different things or are there other,more ego-attacking reasons why a woman would say such a thing?

Thanks

Translation:
My (girl's) SMV has declined to the point where I can't get the ripped guys anymore, so I tell everyone I prefer what I can only get anymore.

Post: #47

(09-16-2015 09:30 PM)Tactician Wrote:  I know many of you guys are saying the same thing, “I get beautiful women too and I am skinny!” But the thing is, all these examples here is based on attraction on the body alone. I am NOT working to get these women. My body is doing 99% of the attracting. I can just be a statue and get a response. (But of course, you have to take action. This is based on doing zilch.)

For guys who think size doesn't make a difference:

I've been dealing with an abscess over the last three weeks, due to the incompetence of an Dentist in my previous town, who somehow missed the problem despite three years of six-monthly checkups, and having X-Rays.

Catastrophic pain started kicking in again about three weeks ago, so I managed to see a new dentist here. He quickly spotted the problem on the X-Rays, tried a filling and antibiotics to clean what was an obviously-infected abscess. No go. They eventually had to pull the tooth. Ah well, I'll tell girls I lost it in a fight until I can have a false one put in six months from now.

This process involved 5 different treatments. Here's me, in a great deal of pain but stoic, "Yeah, it's bad, what can ya do?", obviously-tired and in a foul mood at the previous incompetence, trying to get major dental work done, with my mouth so numbed I was drooling, but, through all this, being constantly-opened in personal conversation by whichever of his three younger dental assistants were rostered that day whenever he'd leave the room for a couple of minutes. Due to my mood, I'd only briefly speak then try to let the conversation naturally-fade, but they kept re-opening.

Obviously, the need to engage me wasn't my exhausted, haggard looks and my pissed-off personality, but the fact I'm currently sitting at a personal best of 108kgs (238 pounds). To put it bluntly, I've gone past Beast Mode: I'm fucking huge.

As they did the drilling / filling / extractions / wadding, each of the three women assisting rested their hands on my chest, and patted me comfortingly, holding it there for longer than necessary, even though I wasn't showing any visible discomfort - I know how to bear down on pain. Three women displayed the exact same response, which is highly-unusual when the health system discourages any kind of unnecessary hands-on contact due to it being legally-risky.

This sort of thing never happened at 80kgs (176 pounds). It's instinctual to non-broken women.

Women are more willing to engage you if you're big, and have this driving need to find any excuse to touch your muscles. Someone on the forum referred to it recently as being Swolested by women.

Keep lifting.

Post: #48

Women also prefer nice guys over bad boys!

Post: #49

(09-19-2015 04:49 AM)AnonymousBosch Wrote:  Someone on the forum referred to it recently as being Swolested by women.

Man, I hope I get swolested one day.

(09-19-2015 10:47 AM)easternwomenrule Wrote:  Women also prefer nice guys over bad boys!

Yeah man, they also like a guy who writes love letters, don't care about money, and like all sizes of dicks equally.

Post: #50

During one of my extended trips to Colombia I met Diana and we started dating. While I was there I became a pudgy fucker because I wasn't working out like I should.

When I went back to the states I immediately started working out and eating better. So a couple of months had passed, and one night I was talking to Diana on skype and took off my shirt to flex a little bit.

She was NOT impressed; she was actually repulsed. All she did was frown and tell me not to get any bigger. And I wasn't even that big. I had lost fat and gained some (not a lot) muscle.

She told me her preference in men was not too muscular or ripped, but not necessarily fat.

I have another ex who wasn't into the ripped look either (even though I was ripped when we met, but she told me later on that it wasn't her preference).

These two are probably in the minority, but I suppose it's proof that some women out there aren't really into ripped dudes.