Post: #51

An Alpha man needs to have more value than simply being a US citizen. It might work as a good opener when traveling to a foreign country but most global women are looking for more than an unattractive dude with US citizenship. Its so lame when guys think all it takes to date a foreign girl is a US passport. The 9's and 10's will want way more than just US citizenship. There are plenty of poor US expats and Expats looking for a hookup that foreign girls are more discerning when it comes to hookups.

If you are poor and unemployed, then you are not an Alpha man in a woman's eyes. But you can still get women by using Beta-emotional game. This is the "guitar-playing/starving artist" guy that really connects with a woman because he is relaxed from not-working (hippie) and is very sensual. Don't talk about yourself at all but focus more on making a woman feel great about herself and her life. You have no job so you are economically lower-status than her so take a servant mindset by trying really hard to please a woman.

On the other hand, if a woman wants a mature, wise, older, rich, employed Alpha man. Then create the image that you are a perfect Alpha guy - with lots of women begging to be around him and in his presence. You're a 45 year old George Clooney/MR BIG that has everything going for him, social leader, confident, lots of women around.

Post: #52

(10-01-2016 01:41 AM)nidall Wrote:  

Quote:As they get a closer look, you have some mannerism or failure to relate which seems to come from some long established behavior patterns.

I agree. But its not a mannerism as much as it is a failure to connect. This is the mystery that I need to resolve. What do you suggest I do about this specifically?

I think this was from "finishing schools" which taught how to socialize:
"To be interesting, you must be INTERESTED"

In the title you reveal your view of them: "Conceited girls ignore me"
The problem isn't you, it's that THEY are conceited. Well, it's good you're smart enough to see, with a large number of failures, the problem isn't with them-- it's you.

1) Girl should be talking 80%+ of the time.
2) She should feel you are interested. It's hard to really fake.
3) If you're in USA 20 year age gap is huge without compensation.
What's unusual and interesting about you that might signal fun

I have a feeling you look at girls as a car you can work on.
You actually have to take some interest in her as a person, know what she cares about and like her for that.

In all this "alpha game" propaganda the idea is to lead, be indifferent, all this tough guy stuff, but they can feel if you're really an iceberg, and don't like it. How many fights have you gotten into in your life? Strength can get you the interview, but that alone doesn't get you love.

Superficially, you're willing to take criticism, but also you're kind of placing blame on them " NOT a mannerism" but "failure to connect".
It's called "Yes, but" responses

So behaviorally, you should be asking leading questions about the subjects she is interested in. Find out who she is.

Do you avoid toxic subjects like violence, racism, politics, to some extent team sports?

Post: #53

A 20-yr age gap is not 'huge' to any of the college girls I've met this year. No compensation, just drinks.

Post: #54

(10-01-2016 03:05 PM)DonnyGately Wrote:  A 20-yr age gap is not 'huge' to any of the college girls I've met this year. No compensation, just drinks.

So you are a good person to help OP . What do you talk about with them? What are they seeing in you? Do you think he's punching above his weight with the true top 1%? I saw my value plummet with them at 50 so I'm out of touch.

Post: #55

(10-01-2016 01:26 PM)jcrew247 Wrote:  An Alpha man needs to have more value than simply being a US citizen. It might work as a good opener when traveling to a foreign country but most global women are looking for more than an unattractive dude with US citizenship...

You failed to read the entire post.

Quote:In the title you reveal your view of them: "Conceited girls ignore me"
The problem isn't you, it's that THEY are conceited. Well, it's good you're smart enough to see

Yes they are conceited. But a 9 or 10 will be conceited because theyre a 9 or 10. The solution is how to get them to drop this conceitedness and have them open more.

Quote: What's unusual and interesting about you that might signal fun.

This is the key! This is whats missing. This I know would be a big game changer.

Quote:I have a feeling you look at girls as a car you can work on.

No youre wrong. Quite the opposite.

Quote: How many fights have you gotten into in your life?

What?? That makes no sense. Don’t get it.

Quote:Superficially, you're willing to take criticism, but also you're kind of placing blame on them " NOT a mannerism" but "failure to connect".

Wrong again! That statement puts the blame on me not being able to connect, not on them. You got to get out the mindset that it’s the woman’s fault all the time.

Quote: you should be asking leading questions about the subjects she is interested in. Find out who she is.

That’s exactly what I do.

Quote:Do you avoid toxic subjects like violence, racism, politics, to some extent team sports?

I depends. If the topic comes up and is of interest to her I discuss it as long as it doesn’t make the female uncomfortable.

Post: #56

(09-30-2016 12:31 AM)nidall Wrote:  After the date she texted me and said that I'm not the man I was hoping for.

How long have you been unemployed?
If you have money, spend a little on dinner and show off to her - don't be cheap on a girl you really like and want an LTR.
Being cheap works for hookups, but it might not work for high-class women who want marriage.

It sounds like the girl could tell you were lying about your life and job.
Maybe you should forget about dating until you find a part-time job, maybe as a bartender or some other cool place to meet women. Being 45 and unemployed is not cool. You don't want to give off a "loser vibe."

If you want to stay unemployed but be Alpha, then work out a lot and be an Alpha Jock that has a lot of muscles. She may not want to marry a poor dude, but she might be willing to sleep with a guy who is really fit.

Also, maybe you have a boring personality. Are you able to tell jokes and make her laugh?

Post: #57

(10-01-2016 05:10 PM)jcrew247 Wrote:  How long have you been unemployed?
If you have money, spend a little on dinner and show off to her - don't be cheap on a girl you really like and want an LTR.
Being cheap works for hookups, but it might not work for high-class women who want marriage.

Been unemployed for 4 years. Even though I'm not rich I still got enough to spend. And I do agree with you on not being cheap with these high class girls.

But this leads to my previoius post about the ukranian chick whom I took to the club and treated her to a restaurant the night I met her. After we left and was ready to go home she complained about being too cold. She wanted to take a cab. But I reassured her that the subway was 4 blocks away. At this point I really didnt want to spend any more money, I admit. When we got to the subway I asked for her cell and she left without saying thanks or whatever. Days afterwards I texted her and she never responded. I think she got turned off with me not getting her a cab when she was cold.

Quote:Being 45 and unemployed is not cool. You don't want to give off a "loser vibe."

I agree. I'm working on it.

Quote:Also, maybe you have a boring personality. Are you able to tell jokes and make her laugh?

I'm able to make her laugh. But I think what a previous poster said was correct, that I fail to connect emotionally. He also said that I should inject something interesting about me that might signal fun.

Post: #58

There's no mystery here, you're poor and jobless and these girls know it, and are staying away because they expected a rich older dude.

Are you just living off savings? Or do you have investment income or disability? Do you drive a car?

You say you want a Traditional Foreign Woman and they want a Traditional Responsible Man - which means they want a guy with a job and money. Traditional Values means a Man works and takes care of a housewife.

As for future dates with women, I wouldn't lie about being unemployed - they seem to have sensed it. It would stop attracting gold-diggers. Find other minimum-wage girls who don't expect a man to be rich. Talk about passionate things like music instead of jobs and money.

Post: #59

(09-11-2016 07:47 PM)BrewDog Wrote:  "Excuse me," sounds like you're about to ask her for money or some other con. Drop it. Homeless beggars say, "Excuse me" and my senses always tell me to walk away from him or her.

This is much better: "Hi, can you tell me where the Colosseum is?"

That question says you don't want money or to tell a story about your car breaking down and you need gas money; you merely need a second of her time for directions. And it'll open up conversation if she's amenable. If she isn't, then fuck it. Try another chick.

I was actually sorry to see this guy go and agree with this part of his post. "Excuse me" and "Can I ask you a question"? are the two most common beggar/scammer openers. I say avoid saying both of those things. Spend a few hours in downtown Baltimore and you wil hear those two openers plenty of times.

Post: #60

(10-01-2016 06:47 PM)jcrew247 Wrote:  There's no mystery here, you're poor and jobless and these girls know it, and are staying away because they expected a rich older dude.

Whoa whoa hold on here and now. Before we go further with this lets get one thing straight right now. DO NOT assume things about me which arent true without asking. I am unemployed but I'm not poor. I got circumstance beyond my control thats made me unemployed which you cannot begin to understand. All i can say is that this unemployment is temporary.

Quote:Are you just living off savings? Or do you have investment income or disability? Do you drive a car?

I'm living off savings and I got some investment income but not a lot. I dont need a car where I live. I take the subway. Lets just say that I got some income coming in from other sources which keep me afloat for the time being.

Quote:As for future dates with women, I wouldn't lie about being unemployed - they seem to have sensed it. Find other minimum-wage girls who don't expect a man to be rich. Talk about passionate things like music instead of jobs and money.

I have to lie about being unemployed. I've tried telling them the truith and they werent feeling that. But I dont think the job aspect has anything to do with why these fine girls aent digging me.

I think its because of what we touched upon before: that I dont connect emotionally. For example, this past summer I connected with a girl who was less than half my age. She was very fine and beautiful. But we connected on a very deep level. She was VERY much feeling me as a result. Unfortunately, she had to go back to her home country.

No doubt I really think its a lack on connect. As I said before this is key!

Post: #61

What did you do before becoming unemployed and what did you do for the 4 years?

Post: #62

(10-02-2016 02:29 PM)Off The Reservation Wrote:  What did you do before becoming unemployed and what did you do for the 4 years?

I used to work for a huge hardware company. For the past 4 years I've tried looking for jobs, going on interviews. I've done some temp work like freelancing.. But because of factors that I cant explain here I've been unable to land a permanent job.

Post: #63

I don't know what personal problems you might be having or maybe even medical things. But if you are being too shady and not being honest, then girls will sense it and it will be a major turnoff. Seems like you're feeling depressed about life in general and that's turning off women. Women want to be around happy positive men.

I would say try to get a temp job or waitering job. Its social and you meet a lot of people and build up your social skills. You say you have a business degree, so work on your salesmanship - just like everything in life, it all starts with sales and dating women is one of most difficult sales jobs. You gotta make women believe in yourself and in a future with you. You gotta sell them dreams and fantasies or at least excite them emotionally.

Maybe take a sales job selling women's shoes - it worked for george clooney. If you want to meet foreign girls - take a job as an ESL tutor.

Post: #64

(10-02-2016 03:22 PM)jcrew247 Wrote:  But if you are being too shady and not being honest, then girls will sense it and it will be a major turnoff. Seems like you're feeling depressed about life in general and that's turning off women. Women want to be around happy positive men.

Yes this I know for a fact is true. Once one feels whole, with a job and feeling good about himself then girls will become attracted. I've felt that phenomenon before and it works.

Quote:You say you have a business degree, so work on your salesmanship - just like everything in life, it all starts with sales and dating women is one of most difficult sales jobs. You gotta make women believe in yourself and in a future with you. You gotta sell them dreams and fantasies or at least excite them emotionally.

The part about what you said: "You gotta make women believe in yourself and in a future with you" is very key. This I got to keep in mind and convey this value to them.

Trust me I'm working on this. I'm actually trying to get a job and think positive about myself. My situation is difficult but not impossible to overcome. Having a strong belief in yourself and thinking positive is very difficult. But not impossible to do to get where you want to be. It takes work no doubt about that.

Post: #65

Not sure if this will work, but if you want to meet immigrants who are close to their parents and wouldn't be turned off by someone living with their parents, you might want to go to a ethnic catholic church and see if there are any hot women. These women are more traditional and have strong family values, so they will like that you care about your parents.

Post: #66

(10-01-2016 03:32 PM)iknowexactly Wrote:  

(10-01-2016 03:05 PM)DonnyGately Wrote:  A 20-yr age gap is not 'huge' to any of the college girls I've met this year. No compensation, just drinks.

So you are a good person to help OP . What do you talk about with them? What are they seeing in you? Do you think he's punching above his weight with the true top 1%? I saw my value plummet with them at 50 so I'm out of touch.

I can talk about anything: music, career stuff, travels, art, it depends on each girl. If she likes talking about Nabokov I'll share my thoughts on his greatest works.

What they see in me: older, well-dressed, experienced, mature, likely dominant, likely well-traveled, not thirsty, relaxed, casual, successful.

Post: #67

(10-03-2016 01:10 PM)jcrew247 Wrote:  Not sure if this will work, but if you want to meet immigrants who are close to their parents and wouldn't be turned off by someone living with their parents, you might want to go to a ethnic catholic church and see if there are any hot women. These women are more traditional and have strong family values, so they will like that you care about your parents.

Yeah this was suggested to me before. I've actually been to a church like this before. I've seen a couple of fine ones there - just a couple! But I wasnt there to make my moves on them. But to be honest with you its not my style. Good suggestion though.

Post: #68

(10-02-2016 03:08 PM)nidall Wrote:  

(10-02-2016 02:29 PM)Off The Reservation Wrote:  What did you do before becoming unemployed and what did you do for the 4 years?

I used to work for a huge hardware company. For the past 4 years I've tried looking for jobs, going on interviews. I've done some temp work like freelancing.. But because of factors that I cant explain here I've been unable to land a permanent job.

I had thought you were younger, like in your 20s or something when I first read this. Subsequent answers have given a better picture.

Respectfully, I suggest that you forget about, and never repeat this story about why you lost your job for whatever reason or situation. Whatever that was that's past, and shouldn't hold you back like it obviously is now. Even if you are now faced with limitations, and I am not saying you are or are not, it is what you do with what you have that matters. For example if you were injured at the hardware place, you should now work in some other capacity.

Faking that you have a job / lying to girls or anyone about it is just plain poison to your outlook on life and it is likely visible to 95% of the girls you talk to, like it is in your posts. Your ability to deceive yourself does not work in the outside world very well. No matter how skilled you are at telling yourself lies that skill does not automatically translate into lying well to others. And if you want to learn to lie to others well, then you have an even bigger problem.

You see, you don't realize that you reveal how depressing it must be to tell the little finance lie and then justify it to RVF by adding that you have such and such degree while the reality is that the job you lost was hardware. Personally I'd prefer hardware btw I am not knocking it, but you seem like you need to boost the fake resume.

I am about the same age as you and I can tell you whatever failures you have experienced can either be continued sources of evasion or be teachers. I suggest (not only because of your interest in finance) that you read Ray Dalio's excellent free book Principles because he specifically talks about how to use mistakes.

Lengthy unemployment is dangerous. By unemployment I do not mean literally job employment vs not, I mean not doing anything. Employment usually solves that problem, but there are other options as well. There are things you can do, and you must change the narrative that is playing in your head. Whatever small money or income you have may allow you to survive but is that all you want? Your situation will only deteriorate. You keep talking about what you could do three or four years ago and it never occurred to you this goes along with your job loss? You say you are not poor and that unemployment is temporary? So since 4 years is temporary to you then all your numerical evaluations are also cast into doubt.

I hope you get your 9s and 10s but that is not your issue. It is a red herring for you!

Post: #69

(10-08-2016 12:43 AM)Off The Reservation Wrote:  Respectfully, I suggest that you forget about, and never repeat this story about why you lost your job for whatever reason or situation. Whatever that was that's past, and shouldn't hold you back like it obviously is now.

Why do you say this? Because you think that by repeating my situation that it will hold me back?

Quote:Lengthy unemployment is dangerous. By unemployment I do not mean literally job employment vs not, I mean not doing anything.

I agree 110%. The problem is that I've been interviewing for a long time and I cant get anything. I got a BBA. Obviously my resume is good enough to get me interviews. I answer interview questions well, I'm presentable and well versed. But I'm not able to get jobs. A counselor once told me that I may be doing something wrong during the interviews. But I really dont know what i'm doing wrong.

Quote:Whatever small money or income you have may allow you to survive but is that all you want? Your situation will only deteriorate.

Yes this is true. Thats why I'm interviewing for jobs.

Quote:You keep talking about what you could do three or four years ago and it never occurred to you this goes along with your job loss?

I dont understand your point if there is one.

Quote:You say you are not poor and that unemployment is temporary?

Yeah I'm not poor. I'm not living on a park bench as you ridiculously assume somehow. Its very simple to read a few sentences by someone and then judge and size his whole life not knowing all his circumstances. I appreciate your words but you cant judge others based on little info about them.

Quote:I hope you get your 9s and 10s but that is not your issue. It is a red herring for you!

I dont understand. Are you saying that trying to get 9s or 10s is misleading? I miss your point.

Post: #70

well, as far as not getting a job over 40 it could be due to (1) higher salary demands and (2) age-ism. A manager will probably make 50 to 75 k a year so they might not want to pay you that much. They might also want someone younger and cheaper to train.

Maybe you should just change industries altogether or teach english in a foreign country.

Its also much easier to find a job, when you already have a job. So get a temp job or a long-term temp contract. Most people just work freelance now anyways and work on 6 month contracts or projects. Most people in marketing work on projects and consulting. If you have any set of unique skills, go on some consulting job sites and make bids on jobs. Catering jobs are easy to get and lots of young hot girls work those jobs. Learn a new skill set or new language to make your resume look better. Use your free time wisely instead of playing video games. Girls love cooks, so get a job in a food truck.

Post: #71

OP relax ... there are easier ways. I don't do this anymore but can advise from a little experience.

DO NOT EVER use "excuse me" again during night game. A poster already said this above but I want to reiterate that you should use it as a rule.

You seem like you haven't read Roosh's "Bang." You need it. Buy it immediately.

From the book itself, a proper line at night would be: "You seem to be having the most fun here tonight." NOT TO BE preceded by "excuse me."

Another one passed on to me by fellow forum member Newgamer: "I was going to wear the exact same thing tonight." If she asks "why didn't you," then say "I didn't have matching heels"

Edit: I read the rest of the thread about you being older OP. While my advice still stands, I think for it to work you have to be extremely charming, confident and well dressed. I think you need to work on all 3 things, as I don't get the sense that you have enough of each.

Post: #72

Well, personally I don't want to have anything with bitchy women. Why would you? You can only get more drama and negativity. But when I was younger I wanted to break that bitchy shield and I know some people that still do it.

My line was straight up accusing her that she is having this mask because she is scared to show herself. And that I can't wait for her mask to fall off, since that usually happens after hard sex.

Post: #73

(10-08-2016 08:18 PM)Cobra Wrote:  DO NOT EVER use "excuse me" again during night game.

You seem like you haven't read Roosh's "Bang." You need it. Buy it immediately.

I never do night game as I said before. And I already read 'Bang'.

Quote:From the book itself, a proper line at night would be: "You seem to be having the most fun here tonight." NOT TO BE preceded by "excuse me."

I'll probably tweak it to use it in day game.

Quote:Another one passed on to me by fellow forum member Newgamer: "I was going to wear the exact same thing tonight." If she asks "why didn't you," then say "I didn't have matching heels"

Nahh.. sounds a bit too gay to use. I used it before and the results weren't good.

Quote: I think for it to work you have to be extremely charming, confident and well dressed. I think you need to work on all 3 things, as I don't get the sense that you have enough of each.

I completely agree. I'm working on the confident part the most since its the part that I need improving upon and thats most troublesome for me. Gaining confidence given my current circumstances isnt easy at all. Its like I'm living a curse. Bad things are haoppening to me which I cant explain. I dont mean to sound like a broken record. But the truth of the matter is that there are certain phenomena that I've been experiencing that you would NOT believe. Thinking positive may help, though I'm somewhat negative in my ways given my circumstances. It appears that god refuses to help me. I dont know who can help me.

Post: #74

On the topic of ignoring girls who ignore us, I am curious to know if there is a limit before they lose interest.

An ongoing experience of mine: There is this girl I know and I run into her often. She was giving me the eyes. Eventually she approached me and we started talking. My game was worse at that time so I started by talking about about work/study and she ended the convo. But she was still talking to me on later occasions so I assumed she was into me. After a few days, I asked her for her number and said we should meet up for dinner (another mistake). She said she will think about it and later that day she replied "We should hang out as a group with other friends." I took it as a No and deleted her number and didnt reply. This was about a year ago.

I intentionally ignored her and only talked to her out of necessity when I am with my circle of friends. It took a lot of discipline but I learnt that even refusing to acknowledge a girl who ignored you will only help you. After a while she started giving the same IOIs again from a distance but always avoided coming close to me. She did not attempt to talk to me but there was all kinds of IOIs whenever she was in my vicinity. I was still under the impression that she was trying to make me into an orbiter.

A few more months passed and she started to come closer to me whenever I was in the vicinity. All this time, I did not talk or communicate with her in any way. I must say I did some of the self improvement things mentioned in this forum like exercise, watched 'red pill' shows, improved posture reduced the smiling and increased approaches on other girls and I guess it showed. Some more time passed and now she positions herself so that she can see me when I come to class and then smiles upon seeing me. At this point, I started to think, that I could give it a second shot. I am still torn given Roosh philosophy of never getting rejected twice but I was debating maybe asking her to hang out with me when I am going for groceries or something.

But, it's hard to catch her alone. She is always with her friends. My first question is that, given that this is still day game, approaching her when she is alone would yield the best chance but Would a girl who is interested detach, herself from her friends if she thinks that she wants to talk to you? I can't ask her to hang out when she is with friends but since she knows my schedule, would she isolate herself in the day which is easier to do? I am wondering if this can be used as a gauge to see if she is really interested.

Very recently, she suddenly switched her sitting position in class so that she has her back to me and her friend is facing me. And, I responded by ignoring her again. What does this mean? Is this some kind of test?

A very long ramble, but what do you guys suggest I do? I am still waiting for the opportunity to catch her alone and ask her out but what do you think of her actions? It wont be a reject if she refuses a second time because its just shopping but still I dont want to waste any more time on her.

Post: #75

(10-18-2016 04:57 AM)Hazaer Wrote:  On the topic of ignoring girls who ignore us, I am curious to know if there is a limit before they lose interest.

An ongoing experience of mine: There is this girl I know and I run into her often. She was giving me the eyes. Eventually she approached me and we started talking. My game was worse at that time so I started by talking about about work/study and she ended the convo. But she was still talking to me on later occasions so I assumed she was into me. After a few days, I asked her for her number and said we should meet up for dinner (another mistake). She said she will think about it and later that day she replied "We should hang out as a group with other friends." I took it as a No and deleted her number and didnt reply. This was about a year ago.

I intentionally ignored her and only talked to her out of necessity when I am with my circle of friends. It took a lot of discipline but I learnt that even refusing to acknowledge a girl who ignored you will only help you. After a while she started giving the same IOIs again from a distance but always avoided coming close to me. She did not attempt to talk to me but there was all kinds of IOIs whenever she was in my vicinity. I was still under the impression that she was trying to make me into an orbiter.

A few more months passed and she started to come closer to me whenever I was in the vicinity. All this time, I did not talk or communicate with her in any way. I must say I did some of the self improvement things mentioned in this forum like exercise, watched 'red pill' shows, improved posture reduced the smiling and increased approaches on other girls and I guess it showed. Some more time passed and now she positions herself so that she can see me when I come to class and then smiles upon seeing me. At this point, I started to think, that I could give it a second shot. I am still torn given Roosh philosophy of never getting rejected twice but I was debating maybe asking her to hang out with me when I am going for groceries or something.

But, it's hard to catch her alone. She is always with her friends. My first question is that, given that this is still day game, approaching her when she is alone would yield the best chance but Would a girl who is interested detach, herself from her friends if she thinks that she wants to talk to you? I can't ask her to hang out when she is with friends but since she knows my schedule, would she isolate herself in the day which is easier to do? I am wondering if this can be used as a gauge to see if she is really interested.

Very recently, she suddenly switched her sitting position in class so that she has her back to me and her friend is facing me. And, I responded by ignoring her again. What does this mean? Is this some kind of test?

A very long ramble, but what do you guys suggest I do? I am still waiting for the opportunity to catch her alone and ask her out but what do you think of her actions? It wont be a reject if she refuses a second time because its just shopping but still I dont want to waste any more time on her.

Thank you for reading the long post guys.