Post: #1

What is going on everyone wanted some advice.

I have a son who is 15 months old and me and the mother have not been together for 10 months. When we broke up she moved 7 hours away from me and we agreed that I could spend 7 days with my son a month in my hometown. We also agreed we would meet halfway.

Now she is giving me some bullshit about how we gotta spend time together for a weekend (including me buy the hotel) if I want her to meet me halfway. Every month it is getting harder to see my son. She is telling me if I want to see him then drive the entire 7 hours there and 7 hours back and that she doesn't have to meet me half way.

We haven't been to court yet but I think it might be time that I do. I'm paying her 800$ a month in child support and I think it's ridiculous. She lives in florida now and I make well into the 6 figures. I travel a lot for work and when I am in my hometown (4 days every other week) it would be just unfair to drive 14 combined hours.

Anybody going through or know anybody going through something similar?

Post: #2

If you're making well into six figures and are only paying $800.00 per month, you are probably getting off easy, but every state varies. Nevada is great for high income guys, because there is a statutory cap per child. Go online and try to run the child support guidelines for your state. If you really are paying too much (doubtful), you might want to push the issue and file for custody, or in the alternative, for visitation, and for child support. Also, try to figure out how far back retroactive support goes in your state, for example, whether you obligation begins on the date of filing or whether it goes back to the birth of the child or even before the birth of the child (yes, you read that right). If you do not incur an obligation until a Complaint for support is filed, you may very well want to leave it alone. Just to give you a heads up, almost every time the subjects of custody and divorce come up, a bunch of weirdos and bitter guys who I never see post elsewhere, come out of the woodwork and start posting all kinds of ridiculous and unhelpful stuff. I think some of them are guys who feel like they got screwed by the court system and the rest are just bollockses. I've only been doing this for a third of my life, so they definitely know better than me.

Post: #3

Thanks for the advice. I have no problem paying 800$ but I don't know anybody else paying that high of child support. Based on my gross income it is a good deal to pay that. Besides that however my main concern is her throwing in my face she doesn't have to meet me half way. If I do go to court will a judge allow her to drive half way every month. If not then I just rather get my son an entire month every couple of months. I'm self employed and work off contracts so it really isn't anything to me to take an entire month off.

Also does making 1099 help with hiding income? Do they take in account he expenses I have to pay to make the income?

Also btw guys that want kids.... think again. This is the thanks I get for supporting someone 100% financially for over a year.

Post: #4

A judge may allow her to drive half way, but it may help you that she was the one who moved out of state, thereby creating that transportation issue. One variation I have seen is that one parent drives the full distance to pick up the child at the beginning of the visitation period, then the other parent drives the full way to the other parent's residence at the end of the visitation period.

Your gross income is what matters in every state I have seen. Note that I use the term income. If you are self employed, the amount used for calculation should be the amount you earn after business expenses, but before taxes.

Post: #5

This is more a general observation.

I am amazed guys that have the smarts to make well into 6 figures self employed and can take a month off because of flexibility also have such terrible judgement in picking a mother or knocking up the wrong girl.

It is a mystery of the universe if I have ever seen one.

It must be because of a narrow focus in few areas of life, I have no other answer.

Post: #6

(08-18-2016 10:02 PM)Travesty Wrote:  This is more a general observation.

I am amazed guys that have the smarts to make well into 6 figures self employed and can take a month off because of flexibility also have such terrible judgement in picking a mother or knocking up the wrong girl.

It is a mystery of the universe if I have ever seen one.

No judgement will protect you 100% from divorce no matter how smart you are and how well you think you understand women.

Another point is that in a high cost of living area, 6 figures and 4 weeks of vacation is not that unusual these days for a professional job. People who can earn that kind of income are not completely dumb, but they are not Einsteins either.

Post: #7

Would you suggest he involve the court just to hold her accountable to a reasonably equal standard? I understand that depending on state laws, self-employed men may be allowed a different support guideline due to the nature of their income. The most negative possibility is the court may require him to open a new bank account solely for loading support funds into it. That may work out better for him, even if the amount of money per month goes up.

Aside from treating the child well when you have him (which is between you and the baby(and something you'll want to do anyway) and paying her what you're legally bound to, you're not held accountable to her in any other way. Welcome to telling her "no" again, which feels freeing after having to accommodate a woman just to keep the arrangement out of the legal system.

Post: #8

(08-18-2016 10:02 PM)Travesty Wrote:  This is more a general observation.

I am amazed guys that have the smarts to make well into 6 figures self employed and can take a month off because of flexibility also have such terrible judgement in picking a mother or knocking up the wrong girl.

It is a mystery of the universe if I have ever seen one.

It must be because of a narrow focus in few areas of life, I have no other answer.

I've seen countless high income guys and supposedly high intelligence guys make some of the worst decisions in their personal lives and pay for it dearly. I'm thinking pressure from idiot family members and "friends" plays a huge role in that. Thankfully, don't have any of that in my life and never did.

Post: #9

Op/Newface I'll split my opinions into four parts

Let me give you my background. 12 years ago I divorced my first wife while she was still pregnant. You'd better believe I cheated on her a lot, she then later dated my best friend so were are morally even in my opinion. I've been doing, what you're doing for a looong time.

Opinion #1 Parenting: Get ready, its going to suck. The first year or two with my ex wife was pretty amicable, but then each year afterwards she became more and more of a cunt. I will also tell you that there is a correlation between her cuntiness and being a bitch about your kid and how well your life is going. I got fit, I went back to school and was banging hot young girls and it made her crazy...so she fucked around with child support demands and seeing the kid and vice versa...when I was having a rough time she'd be more amicable. So here's what I learned...pretend your life is terrible when you interact with her.

Opinion #2 Distance: Do what you can and don't beat yourself up over it. I have to fly and travel across an international border to see my kid because she won't let him leave her hometown. I go when I can, and use skype and the phone in the meantime. I also have a calendar where for the past 10 years I've been counting down until he is 16 and can drive and get on a plane by himself.

Opinon #3 Child Support: Oh there are definitely some ways you can mess around with child support calculations, but that is all illegal and will get you financially raped if uncovered.

Option #4 Legal: You make well into the six figures and have yet to hire a lawyer? Get your fucking head examined and hire two of them TODAY. You should have had a lawyer 15 months ago.

Summary: Get lawyers, don't fuck around with your child support...yet, see your kid when you can and expect her to be a retard and make it difficult for you. Tell her how your life sucks, even if it doesn't, how you can't get a date, and really regret breaking up with her...keep that facade that your life is over going until you get two lawyers.

Last...keep perspective. The kid isn't going to die, any contact is better than none, and remember that every year they get older Mom can do less to control them.

Oh and listen to Merenguero...he is giving you the kind of advice you should have been paying for 15 months ago.

Post: #10

(08-18-2016 09:55 PM)Merenguero Wrote:  A judge may allow her to drive half way, but it may help you that she was the one who moved out of state, thereby creating that transportation issue. One variation I have seen is that one parent drives the full distance to pick up the child at the beginning of the visitation period, then the other parent drives the full way to the other parent's residence at the end of the visitation period.

Your gross income is what matters in every state I have seen. Note that I use the term income. If you are self employed, the amount used for calculation should be the amount you earn after business expenses, but before taxes.

My question is how do they go about proving my business income and my expenses. All my pay is 1099.

All of my money goes into my business account, i pay my expenses using my personal account and i just transfer all of my funds to my personal account a couple times a month.

And since i work off contracts, can't I just take a couple months off. Get a low paying job and just put myself on child support?

All just thoughts in my mind. I'm tired of dealing with this bullshit.

And Travesty, when I met her I was making 36k per year and barely surviving. This was 4 years ago. Still it was a bad choice in a woman. 2 years ago I found a better gig that required me to travel a lot but paid way more.

EDIT

Also she wants to get back together with me and she has been trying for ten months. She however has no respect for me so I rather not do that. Plus she doesn't want to move back to my hometown until next june. and long distance relationships really don't work.

Post: #11

And also that it's not so bad and the end of the world like some draw it up as. Having a kid itself cancels out and surpasses a lot of the negatives that come along with such a situation. Do what Howard said

Post: #12

Man from all the f*cktop things I've read about Florida on here... you really have to thing about it. I know you want to see your son and all... but if she's giving you problem 15 months in... I'm afraid that shit will get worse down the line. I would personally take the hit about driving all that time to keep it at $800 a month since i think you're getting a HUGE break on that. But if you find yourself too unhappy about not seeing your kid... and willing to shell out more $$$ to her, then go ahead to the court. There's no right or wrong answer on this one, it really depends on you.

Post: #13

(08-18-2016 10:17 PM)NewDayNewFace Wrote:  

(08-18-2016 09:55 PM)Merenguero Wrote:  A judge may allow her to drive half way, but it may help you that she was the one who moved out of state, thereby creating that transportation issue. One variation I have seen is that one parent drives the full distance to pick up the child at the beginning of the visitation period, then the other parent drives the full way to the other parent's residence at the end of the visitation period.

Your gross income is what matters in every state I have seen. Note that I use the term income. If you are self employed, the amount used for calculation should be the amount you earn after business expenses, but before taxes.

My question is how do they go about proving my business income and my expenses. All my pay is 1099.

All of my money goes into my business account, i pay my expenses using my personal account and i just transfer all of my funds to my personal account a couple times a month.

And since i work off contracts, can't I just take a couple months off. Get a low paying job and just put myself on child support?

All just thoughts in my mind. I'm tired of dealing with this bullshit.

And Travesty, when I met her I was making 36k per year and barely surviving. This was 4 years ago. Still it was a bad choice in a woman. 2 years ago I found a better gig that required me to travel a lot but paid way more.

EDIT

Also she wants to get back together with me and she has been trying for ten months. She however has no respect for me so I rather not do that. Plus she doesn't want to move back to my hometown until next june. and long distance relationships really don't work.

1. They find out your income by subpeonaing your tax returns
2. If you quit working and take a shit job they will "Impute" ie. make an unfounded guess on how much money you should be making if you were working to your maximum capability. (Been there)

3. If she wants to get back with you then definitely take my advice on pretending your life is shit. If it looks like you are doing well and moving on she will become desperate and do stupid, illegal and sometimes dangerous things to try to get revenge on you or entrap you. "Pretending like your life is shit" also includes keeping your facebook, intsagram etc. accounts very low key. No pictures with cute girls, partying etc. She will see it. Spurned Bitches are cyber stalkers.

Post: #14

I concur with needing a lawyer. Even I who am not a lawyer know about "imputed income", this idea you have about deliberately lowering your income may not work.

I counseled a carpenter in a low income area who reported his rather low income in a child support case, a court clerk unilaterally and in minutes decided to the effect that "You're in a union and should be making more than that." and calculated his child support according to what she thought he SHOULD be making ( but wasn't-- he had no real reason to lie to me, I was a social worker and honestly I don't think he was planning to drag me into court.)

He was actually hoping to get a minimum wage full time job so he could contest the child support because that would have worked out better for him. I think the idea was if you're working full time on the books, it's hard to argue you're also really making a lot of money on the side. Again, with that I have no idea if it's true.

Post: #15

Thanks Dr. Howard. Advice is really good. I'm one step ahead of you. I don't have a facebook or instagram period.

As far as my tax returns are concerned. Do they go off of gross or adjusted income? Because with my adjustment last year it wasn't too high. It will be way higher this year. So theoretically it would be better to put myself on child support this year before I do my next tax return.

All the advice is really great guys. Like Dr. Howard says I think I need to invest a little bit in a lawyer as well. I'm fine ith paying 800$ , my main concern has always been I just don't wanna drive 14 hours every time I pick him up or drop him off. That's just ridiculous to me.

Post: #16

^^^
Agreed. Trying to hide your income or understating your income will likely only screw you down the road. If subpoenaing your tax returns doesn't do the trick, then subpoenaing your bank records often does. If you are hiding cash, then some investigation into your expenses and whether they are being paid can help tell the real story. Nothing looks more suspicious than a person claiming that his monthly expenses are one, three, or ten thousand more than his monthly income. Tell the truth. Anything else will likely screw you down the road.

Post: #17

New Day:
Gross income in every state I have seen. Maybe not all states.

Post: #18

You have money, spend some of it to get professional advice and you can also afford to fly. $800 a month isn't a lot, you could be paying a lot more. The court system is skewed in favor of the woman and her lawyer will surely take full advantage of that. You're thinking emotionally, bad move, this is a chess game.

PS. Lawyers win here no matter what the outcome, don't let your emotions cause the both of you to throw money away.

Post: #19

(08-18-2016 10:35 PM)NewDayNewFace Wrote:  Thanks Dr. Howard. Advice is really good. I'm one step ahead of you. I don't have a facebook or instagram period.

As far as my tax returns are concerned. Do they go off of gross or adjusted income? Because with my adjustment last year it wasn't too high. It will be way higher this year. So theoretically it would be better to put myself on child support this year before I do my next tax return.

All the advice is really great guys. Like Dr. Howard says I think I need to invest a little bit in a lawyer as well. I'm fine ith paying 800$ , my main concern has always been I just don't wanna drive 14 hours every time I pick him up or drop him off. That's just ridiculous to me.

Its always going to be ridiculous, even if you have court orders she's still going to be a bitch about whatever she can be a bitch about.

Consider PM'ing member El Mech and Ghost Tiger. They have actual experience in being a Dad and going to court and getting custody. They may have good perspective for you on top of Menengeuro's legal perspective

Post: #20

Judges don't give a shit about who banged who or why. They care about the kids. And consistency in their lives.

Questions for the OP, because this sticks out at me:

Quote:we agreed that I could spend 7 days with my son a month in my hometown. We also agreed we would meet halfway.

- Is this an ex-wife or a baby mama ? Regardless of the answer, is your name on the bc ?

If the baby was conceived during the marriage, then legally the kid is your responsibility. If this is a baby mama, and your name ain't on the bc, then you have no legal standing, and may need to prove paternity.

- This $800 a month.. have you been ordered by the court to pay it, or are you giving her the money "just because" ? Have you been to court at all yet ? For anything ?

If you're giving her money just because, stop. Buy clothes and toys for the kid, but YOU buy them. Ship them down if you have to. But unless you have a court order telling you to give her $800/month, stop it.

You're setting a precedent for possibly paying her more than what the calculation could be (assuming you impute HER income). Or worse, paying CS for a child that's not your responsibility.

Post: #21

If you make well into six figures, get off the internet and call,a lawyer about this RIGHT NOW!!!

I bet this guy can help:



Also, considering your high income, why is the transportation and hotel an issue? Do they have airports near you?

Aloha!

Post: #22

This is from another thread I posted in: ( /thread-57398...pid1372469 )

The Black Knight Wrote:

(08-10-2016 03:15 PM)Comte De St. Germain Wrote:  Just as I've seen women fuck over men in divorce rapes, I have more than a few guys who I've mentored under that went through hard times with their wife sticking right by them through thick and thin with crippling debt.

Women aren't so simple that we can paint the broad stroke that marriage is evil and that women are Satan incarnate. It's why I still hold true the mantra that us men will never ever be able to understand women nor should we try too.

OP you clearly are lacking in life experience if you're using such broad terms right here. There is no mathematical consistency or logical proof that will ever predict a woman's actions, or even at that a man's actions.

In the US, marriage IS evil in certain states given individual state laws that incentivizes non-desirable and destructive behavior. Any man (or person for that matter) that attempts a marriage and ends up being the higher earner of the two is putting themselves at enormous financial risk in certain states.

A few examples:

1. Some states have no caps on child support. Some cap at like 13,000/year max (Nevada). In states with no caps, women will sell abortions to rich men they've trapped. Pay them 150k now or you will pay 1 million+ over 18 years. They will also obviously fight tooth and nail for full custody to get max pay out.

1a. In some states, child support is paid out as a percentage of each persons incomes and time with children. In some other states, it's paid out entirely by non-custody parent.

2. Division of property, what is consider marital property, and pre-nup/post-nup recognition/enforcement varies from state to state.

3. Some states assume joint custody with children. Some automatically give the non-breadwinner custody. Some assume the woman regardless of situation should get full custody.

I'm of the strong opinion that one of the most important aspects to consider when settling down with a woman is what degree of real leverage you can maintain over your partner. Women already have enormous cultural and legal advantages in the US by and large so us current/future providers need every little bit of help we can get.

In certain states, the marriage/child support laws are beyond the pale and are straight up evil if you are looking to be the provider in the relationship (ex: Massachusetts). In other states, they are actually somewhat in the realm of being reasonable (ex: Texas).

For me at least, I've written off certain states for work and having a family solely because of the marriage/child support laws. The risk and lack of leverage is simply too high. I also believe the less incentives a woman has to blow up a marriage, the higher the odds of a marriage staying intact regardless of the woman or game. Women are impulsive, selfish, and emotional and many will cave in a time of weakness or struggle if they have an easily accessible lucrative exit option.

The point is that if anyone here decides to get married in the US, make sure you have a VERY thorough understanding of your states marriage and child support laws.

The following is a FANTASTIC source of info for each US state (and some overseas locations). EVERY man on this forum should check this site out and read up; if only to get a sense in detail how shit really works. I can't recommend it enough; it was a total game-changer for me:

http://www.realworlddivorce.com/

Out of all of the aforementioned, check that link out! It has situations for every state with men who make six figures and are dealing with various female/kids situations. They use the same situations across all the states so you can compare and contrast easily how little/much you can get screwed in certain states.

Once you are done viewing that, get your ass a lawyer ASAP.

From what I can tell, you are getting off really light right now. $9000/year in child support for a man making six figures is very low. Here is an example from the website on Massachusetts:

Quote:Scenario 4: 1.75-year marriage with 8-month-old child

A 25-year-old woman marries a 40-year-old never-married medical doctor earning $275,000 per year. She had been earning $50,000 per year working as a receptionist in a medical office. She has a child after a year of marriage, quitting her job during the 7th month of pregnancy due to fatigue. She files for divorce when the child is 8 months old (after 1.75 years of marriage), alleging that the father did not participate in the infant's care, e.g., he did not change diapers or get up in the middle of the night to soothe the baby. The mother will allege that the father was verbally demanding and abusive, though there won't be any witnesses to corroborate. The father had savings of $2 million that he accumulated prior to the marriage but there was no significant accumulation of assets during the less-than-two-year marriage. The mother seeks a division of assets as well as alimony.

"Seek and ye shall find works only if one believes in God and then finds her. It does not work that way in a divorce courtroom in Massachusetts," notes Nissenbaum, "Statutory provisions say this wife can get alimony only for half the time between the date of marriage and the service of the summons of the complaint for divorce. That means the wife will get alimony for about 10 months. She might get an award of rehabilitative alimony – which could be a lump sum or be paid over longer than 10 months." What about a substantial property division? "In a short marriage, the court tries to put the parties back into the situation they were in prior to the marriage. Thus it is not likely that wife will be awarded any part of husband's pre-marital assets, although to be practical and avoid paying lawyers, perhaps the wife would be given $100,000 or more in a lump sum. After all she needs a place for her and the baby to live in."

Nissenbaum thought that the wife would surely get custody and tax-free child support of approximately $43,316 per year ($952,952 over the next 20 years "so long as the child lived with her and was primarily dependent on the parents for support").

Source: http://www.realworlddivorce.com/Massachusetts

When you get a lawyer, my number one question would be:

Does child support payments start from date of filing or from an earlier date like child birth in BOTH states? I say both because she could file in your state or her own and if one state is far more generous than the other, you can bet she will go there.

If it starts at when a claim is filed in BOTH states and she continues to go along with this unofficial low payment plan, you could ultimately save yourself $10,000+ every year for the next two-ish decades. This would put more money in your pocket to take trains/buses/planes. In some states, chicks can hit you up with an accident baby 15 years later, file for child support, and get child support back-pay all the way from the child's BIRTH! Imagine finding out you owed 15 years in back child support all of a sudden? That could easily be six figures out the door just like that.

Suffice to say, the family laws in some states are straight up evil and insane.

Anyhow, get a lawyer to sort this out and think of the best angle of attack ASAP.

Post: #23

Just got back from the Islands just now. Too tired to write about gaining custody and raising my kids.
Will weigh in tomorrow.

Post: #24

These threads are always fucking terrifying.

Post: #25

Thanks for the replies everybody they are very helpful and insightful.

(08-19-2016 12:21 AM)Sam Malone Wrote:  Judges don't give a shit about who banged who or why. They care about the kids. And consistency in their lives.

Questions for the OP, because this sticks out at me:

Quote:we agreed that I could spend 7 days with my son a month in my hometown. We also agreed we would meet halfway.

- Is this an ex-wife or a baby mama ? Regardless of the answer, is your name on the bc ?

If the baby was conceived during the marriage, then legally the kid is your responsibility. If this is a baby mama, and your name ain't on the bc, then you have no legal standing, and may need to prove paternity.

- This $800 a month.. have you been ordered by the court to pay it, or are you giving her the money "just because" ? Have you been to court at all yet ? For anything ?

If you're giving her money just because, stop. Buy clothes and toys for the kid, but YOU buy them. Ship them down if you have to. But unless you have a court order telling you to give her $800/month, stop it.

You're setting a precedent for possibly paying her more than what the calculation could be (assuming you impute HER income). Or worse, paying CS for a child that's not your responsibility.

We were not married Thank GOD. Almost did but I knew where it would lead if I did that mess. When my son was born I signed the birth certificate. I haven't been ordered by the court 800$. When we first broke up all of her bills together excluding rent was around that number so that is the number she wanted.

Even before my son was born things were rocky. Everytime I paid her a check or anything after my son was born I wrote Child Support on it. Everytime.

To Kona:

Since I travel a lot for work I live with my parents. When I was in a relationship I had a big house with my ex. When we broke up I dumped the house because I didn't need it. Transportation and hotel is an issue because I'm independent in what I do. Every contract I have is normally in a different state and I fly back 4 days every two weeks. Going forward I may just time it where I fly to Florida pick my son up, then go to my hometown. But anyway she has signed a contract I wrote last month stating she would meet me or my parents half way so he can spend time with me and my side of the family.