Post: #26

(07-18-2016 03:07 AM)The Black Knight Wrote:  

(07-18-2016 12:27 AM)Suits Wrote:  So, leave the USA/Western World and exchange it for a third-world hellhole that is even more corrupt, not to mention uniformly discriminates against foreigners?

We've had this conversation before and when it gets down to discussing where to actually go, the options are not good. Even with the cucks that currently lead us, the US and Canada are still a superior places to live for most. Check out this thread: /thread-54969.html

Under the current and past circumstances, that might have been the case. Although, there seems to be quite a bit of people who would disagree that the US and Canada are "superior" places to live. But part of the reason I started this thread was to get a take on what people would potentially do in a President Hillary world where the circumstances are likely to be very different.

Would that push them over the edge? Would they seriously start looking at expat options? Would it tip the scales with regards to cost/benefit in leaving the western world?

As obnoxious as it is to deal with political correctness every day in the West, at least Canada and the US have a long way to fall before moving to a third world hole will be a better option for most people.

It may be hard to understand how many disadvantages come with living in a third world country, unless you've actually done it long term.

Once you're through the honeymoon period, it can get tough.

It depends somewhat on where you go, but a general rule of thumb is that the more comfortable a place is, the more horrible the employment options are.

This can be dealt with if you work for yourself doing work that can be done from anywhere with a laptop and an Internet connection.

However, there are other issues that are not so easily cured. In most places, it can be incredibly hard to find people that you can truly related with and finding real friends can be a challenge once you've travelled. It can be bad enough just being red-pill, but do some serious exploring of the world and discover that you no longer can related with 99% of the people you meet both abroad and where you came from in the first place.

That's tough.

Quote:

Quote:I actually have left and it's hard. I just spent a week and a half in the US and Canada and it was heaven. People were friendly and civilized in a way that I virtually never get to experience in China.

I still choose to live in the US because of the opportunities to have a better standard of living, but I wouldn't have left Canada for purely political reasons. China is far worse when it comes to politics.

The US has become pretty corrupt, that that's par for the course most places in the world.

Suits, I'm a bit confused. I know China is no picnic is some regards but I thought you were a huge pro-China guy? Are you living in China or the US now?

I'm living in China. It sucks. If guys want to come here, I'd like to see them succeed and will do my best to help them, but I'm no pro-China guy. This place is horrible.

My higher standard of living here is directly related to the fact that I speak Chinese better than 95% of expats and that I have competitive skills that are rare and desirable.

For those who are capable of it, it would take 2-3 years in China to be able to acquire the skills and experience that make me competitive and allow me to have a superior lifestyle to what I would have in Canada (or even the US).

You couldn't just walk off a plane and enjoy the lifestyle that I do (which is nothing impressive, by the way).

The fact of the matter is that I've been visiting China since 2006 and as I built Asia-specific skills, I wasn't developing skills that would be very useful in the West. Therefore, my comparative level of competitiveness in China has more to do with my uselessness in Canada and the US than being some sort of China expert.

If I was in Canada, I would have no idea where to start, short of trying to find someone who would actually employ me. I'd probably end up stuck with a part-time retail sales job that paid minimum wage.

Quote:Also, I should re-emphasis that I've been in the line of fire and have dealt with the real consequences of the current system; similar to some of the stuff I outlined in the case history section. This isn't a situation where I disagree with a few political points with a politician and therefore, fuck everything and leave.

This is a situation where the culture has potentially degraded to the point of no return after years of decline; where things are so fucked up that any red pill man has to walk on thin ice constantly or they risk putting their professional, personal, and financially well-being at stake unless they are rich and/or in an anti-fragile position (and even then, that's no silver bullet). Things are already pretty bad today but salvageable.

China is honestly far more degraded than the US is. The people are absolutely inhuman here.

I can't speak for the rest of the world, but from what I hear, getting mugged is a routine concern in much of South America. Sounds like a great time.

Quote:But what's it say about America that after years of bullshit (i.e. like the stuff I outlined in the case study section) that they would turn their back on a legit successful good red pill man like Trump and vote for a militant feminist corrupt evil person like Hillary? This isn't two typical politicians with a few different point of views; this is two polar opposites that will have far-reaching effects on the USA and the world.

For me, I said a Trump lost would probably be the breaking point but it's still very up for debate in my mind and depends on various factors going forward. It's just as likely I stay and find a way to travel frequently and wait things out in a worst case scenario.

Thank you to everyone for your contributions thus far. All worthwhile stuff to consider and keep in mind.

And to be clear: I still think Trump has a very high chance of winning the election as of now. The cultural tide does appear to be turning and the stats/demographics in the battleground states are in Trump's favor. But between the cucks, globalists, white knights, libtards, the corrupt media, and the simpletons, I know the possibility of getting blindsided by some bad shit is always present. Believe me, I hope to God on November 9th, 2016, we can close this thread because my original question will be made obsolete.

A Trump presidency guarantees nothing.

Post: #27

(07-18-2016 05:06 AM)Suits Wrote:  However, there are other issues that are not so easily cured. In most places, it can be incredibly hard to find people that you can truly related with and finding real friends can be a challenge once you've travelled. It can be bad enough just being red-pill, but do some serious exploring of the world and discover that you no longer can related with 99% of the people you meet both abroad and where you came from in the first place.

That's tough.

I hear ya. This is a major concern I have with any kind of relocation. Don't know if you saw my last post but I mentioned frequent travel while still being based in the US might be the best overall move assuming you can't become location independent. Even if you can become location independent, I wonder if its still the best move to stay within your home country and just travel a lot/do some extended vacations to avoid becoming fully detached from your roots and own culture. To avoid this "stuck in limbo" feeling that seems prevalent among many expats that live outside their original culture for an extended period of time.

Quote:I'm living in China. It sucks. If guys want to come here, I'd like to see them succeed and will do my best to help them, but I'm no pro-China guy. This place is horrible.

[...]

China is honestly far more degraded than the US is. The people are absolutely inhuman here.

I can't speak for the rest of the world, but from what I hear, getting mugged is a routine concern in much of South America. Sounds like a great time.

Personally, China has never been on my list of possible relocation options for a whole host of reasons. I'm sorry you don't like it but I appreciate your real talk about life there.

Quote:A Trump presidency guarantees nothing.

Of course it doesn't but I don't want to be too depressing. The original question ("If Trump loses...") was a bit of a downer to begin with already.

Post: #28

I suspect that if Hillary wins and people start jumping ship to China they're going to find themselves in very dangerous territory if Hillary starts up some shit over the South China Sea trade routes, which she inevitably will.

Post: #29

(07-18-2016 05:46 AM)The Black Knight Wrote:  

(07-18-2016 05:06 AM)Suits Wrote:  However, there are other issues that are not so easily cured. In most places, it can be incredibly hard to find people that you can truly related with and finding real friends can be a challenge once you've travelled. It can be bad enough just being red-pill, but do some serious exploring of the world and discover that you no longer can related with 99% of the people you meet both abroad and where you came from in the first place.

That's tough.

I hear ya. This is a major concern I have with any kind of relocation. Don't know if you saw my last post but I mentioned frequent travel while still being based in the US might be the best overall move assuming you can't become location independent. Even if you can become location independent, I wonder if its still the best move to stay within your home country and just travel a lot/do some extended vacations to avoid becoming fully detached from your roots and own culture. To avoid this "stuck in limbo" feeling that seems prevalent among many expats that live outside their original culture for an extended period of time.

Quote:I'm living in China. It sucks. If guys want to come here, I'd like to see them succeed and will do my best to help them, but I'm no pro-China guy. This place is horrible.

[...]

China is honestly far more degraded than the US is. The people are absolutely inhuman here.

I can't speak for the rest of the world, but from what I hear, getting mugged is a routine concern in much of South America. Sounds like a great time.

Personally, China has never been on my list of possible relocation options for a whole host of reasons. I'm sorry you don't like it but I appreciate your real talk about life there.

Quote:A Trump presidency guarantees nothing.

Of course it doesn't but I don't want to be too depressing. The original question ("If Trump loses...") was a bit of a downer to begin with already.

If Trump loses, things will probably stay about the same. Hillary is Obama 2.0, but the real power isn't from the president. It's all the special interest groups who use their influence to determine what really happens. These folks don't particularly care who is president, because they've paid off both sides of the isle.

The Trump angle is curious, because he's one man that might be able to upset the current state of affairs in this regard, but it's assuming a lot to suggest that he'll be able to truly create change.

He's already chosen a VP pick that clearly wasn't his preference. Be prepared for his message to be consistently toned down over the next few months as he panders for votes.

I've read the information on his website and much of it makes sense to me, but there's a big difference between what political candidates campaign with and what they end up doing in the end (and what they can realistically do).

There's a ton of forum members who have already moved abroad semi-permanently and settled outside the West, but literally none of them did it because of one election result. Rather, their reasons were a lot more detailed than that and have more to do with long term trends (include long term political trends).

If moving abroad is the right choice for you, it'll be the right choice right now and after the 2016 presidential election votes are tallied, regardless of who wins.

If one presidential election is the tie breaker for you, you simply aren't factoring enough into your decision.

Learning to live with Hillary in the Whitehouse is probably going to be easier in the end than the 3-4 year process of moving abroad and somewhat adjusting to life there.

Post: #30

A Trump presidency will not mean enough to keep me from moving to Asia this or next year, unless he lowers taxes so much that I can afford to save money with one income source. I have other reasons for that decision. On the other hand, I think a Hillary presidency would be possibly bad enough to keep me from coming back for a few months at a time. It may take her a few years to tear up the country, so initially it may not be much different than now. I don't like having to transfer all my guns to my family members or leaving them in storage, but it will be okay. I will miss hunting, fishing, and smoked BBQ brisket more than anything.

The only way I do not leave is if a certain business venture or two I am apart of takes off, then I would either have to come back or not leave at all. Other than that, my mind is made up.

Post: #31

If Trump wins, I will re-enlist.

If Hillary wins I will retire at 20 years of service TO THE DAY and move to the American Redoubt.

Post: #32

Redoubt?

Post: #33

(07-18-2016 09:38 AM)Kid Twist Wrote:  Redoubt?

It's an area in America that's supposed to be a sort of fallback for escaping the social/moral/financial collapse of the rest of America.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Redoubt

Notable that the Feds are doing their level best to flood it with as many muslim immigrants as possible.

Post: #34

(07-18-2016 05:06 AM)Suits Wrote:  China is honestly far more degraded than the US is. The people are absolutely inhuman here.

I absolutely agree I've heard this common sentiment but i'd love to hear some first hand accounts from a RVFer. Plesae share...

Post: #35

I left the US before Obama was elected. Although, I am for Trump, there is a small chance, if he gets into a serious dispute with Mexico, it could force me back to the US, which I don't want.

Post: #36

(07-18-2016 10:13 AM)markus85 Wrote:  

(07-18-2016 05:06 AM)Suits Wrote:  China is honestly far more degraded than the US is. The people are absolutely inhuman here.

I absolutely agree I've heard this common sentiment but i'd love to hear some first hand accounts from a RVFer. Plesae share...

My sentiment exactly. Inhuman is exactly right.

Post: #37

The only parts of the world that are worth moving to for the lifestyle/ cultural-political environment are those that either:

1. You already belong to and thus can maneuver in or
2. Have a high development index, and secondary to that have a respectable per capita GDP.

The problem with those that fall under #2 is that they are all difficult to migrate to unless you either have some type of prequalified status (ie: your grandfather was a citizen) or you marry a local.

If you live in the USA then you've already won the lottery. As far as developed nations go, the forefathers saw to it to give us more resistance to communism than other culturally western nations have. Thus, legally speaking, things are not as bad here as they are in other developed nations save Japan (which generally provides a better environment for the Japanese than we enjoy in my opinion).

Also, given the expanse of the USA, there are places to go. Income is the biggest challenge here, but it's less of a challenge than is integrating into another nation. Also, if you move the the right place in this nation with the appropriate culture, you'll generally have a better time with the women here than in other places. I admit to the ease of falling into relationships in Asia, but I submit that most of those relationships quickly go South more often than not. The chances for anything meaningful and long term are better here.

In Asia, I only see Japan and Singapore as options; but I'd wager than most men will be unhappy in either place after the honeymoon period wears off. Japan is for the Japanese, according to the Japanese, and Singapore is probably too hot, small, and foreign for most men's long-term taste.

There are a few places in the developed West that would be good alternative options, with some trade-offs, in that they are still somewhat uncucked, but, again, the immigration options are few.

If you want to test the waters, sign up for a one year ESL contract i n South Korea. That route is the financially and logistically easiest entry to Asia. Then, note your mental relief when you visit the States after that year. The convenience of being able to communicate and travel easier, alone, relieves a large amount of mental stress. You'll have acquired new perspective on living abroad.

Post: #38

Living in Japan can be tough. The work pressure and pace can be more intense than in the US. If you can endure that then fine, but Japan has high suicide rate for a reason.

Singapore or Dubai can be good. But the US is still one of the best places to live. You may hate its current politics and culture, and admire SEA traditional culture, but you probably wouldn't like the bureaucracy there, which is far more corrupt and inefficient than in the US with a few exceptions. I've to wait some years to see how events unfold before deciding what country to settle in. If the US is not beset by chaos, then sure, why not.

Post: #39

I planned on leaving before the election was even a concern, not necessarily permanently, but with the possibility to travel for as long as I want.

I think regardless of who wins the election, we are in a downward spiral that's going to be hard to correct. Enough damage has been done that at this point it can't be undone without destruction. That may not apply to every part of the country to the same degree, but where I am it's totally effected by the problems we discuss here and I'm not in a major liberal city like Boston or Seattle.

The culture has become rotten. Sure I can own an AR15, speak my mind, buy cheap gas and delve into the largest consumer culture in the world, but is it really all that awesome? We have the highest rates of obesity, down syndrome, autism and many other disorders and diseases, high rates of depression, suicide, cancer, and infertility, a heroin epidemic, cities with extremely high crime rates. The infrastructure is falling apart in many states like Massachusetts and New York where the "highest quality of life" supposedly exists. Public transportation systems are highly lacking behind Asian and European countries.

Throw the political narrative, social unrest and the cancer that is feminism on top of that, and a "third world shithole" starts to look like a better option for a single guy with nothing tying him down.

Post: #40

I achieved my dream of permanent relocation to Ukraine about a year ago and have absolutely no interest in stepping foot on American soil anytime soon, not even to visit family.

As an American living in Ukraine I am treated like high society. I have amazing earning potential here doing what I love. I can say just about anything I want in the workplace and no one will bat an eye.

Oh yeah and the women...

All that said I must admit that this is the first election where I am genuinely afraid. If Trump loses the entire fucking world is going down with him. Failure is not an option.

Post: #41

Lay low and network with likeminded people. Only way to survive is in groups.

Post: #42

(07-18-2016 09:47 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

(07-18-2016 09:38 AM)Kid Twist Wrote:  Redoubt?

It's an area in America that's supposed to be a sort of fallback for escaping the social/moral/financial collapse of the rest of America.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Redoubt

Notable that the Feds are doing their level best to flood it with as many muslim immigrants as possible.

Correct, as a matter of fact I am putting boot to ass this week and taking a road trip there to look at properties. Best case is I buy a small place and pay it off within 5 yrs and keep it as an asset if things magically turn around in a new American Renaissance. Worst case, well...

Apologies for the drive by post this morning, but no I will not be leaving my country come what may. I agree that this may be the final battle for the very soul of this country. So much is either lost or has degenerated/atrophied during the post WW2 era. This country is in a death spiral, and sometimes Im not sure we can recover but instead muddle through to the next crisis. So much is riding on this election and yet most people do not even realize it and are caught up in trivialities or the latest cause du jour. That is what is most troubling for me, to watch what are by many measures good people not see the forest for the trees while in the middle of a damn forest fire. Oh well, you don't have to outrun the bear you just have to outrun the guy next to you.

Where could I move to that is safe from the marxist scourge of cultural degeneracy and government tyranny? How long will it remain so? Is it a good investment to upend my life only to have the same thing happen 30 years hence when I am too old to do anything but submit? My military career has given me a rare look at many countries and cultures and I can say that very few would tempt me to leave the US for the overarching reason that even at its worst the US is still a far better place to be overall than nearly anywhere else. The sheer size and scope of geography, political affiliation, industry, and influence to name a few are simply without peer in modern times. So I will stay, and make my stand if necessary in a location that provides the best assurance of long term survival and prosperity.

One final thought. There is still one thing that sets us apart from most every other nation on earth and is truly the meaning of "American Exceptionalism". We are armed like no other people in the history of mankind. Despite the will of forces to the contrary, the Pandora's Box of gun ownership has been opened since the sunsetting of the 1994 AWB. That alone gives me hope for the future. However, if the tides were to turn and gun registration is passed in this country, that will be the death knell for these united States. Historical precedence shows within 10 years there will be a move to disarm the citizenry and we all know what happens next. Yugoslavia writ large.

If I had to: Switzerland
Nuclear option: Lebanon

Post: #43

(07-18-2016 01:21 PM)Adonis Wrote:  

(07-18-2016 09:47 AM)Leonard D Neubache Wrote:  

(07-18-2016 09:38 AM)Kid Twist Wrote:  Redoubt?

It's an area in America that's supposed to be a sort of fallback for escaping the social/moral/financial collapse of the rest of America.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Redoubt

Correct, as a matter of fact I am putting boot to ass this week and taking a road trip there to look at properties. Best case is I buy a small place and pay it off within 5 yrs and keep it as an asset if things magically turn around in a new American Renaissance. Worst case, well...

Interesting. I never heard of American Redoubt before reading the post here today. Oddly enough I was looking at a business opportunity inside the American Redoubt area just two days ago. I probably should take a trip up there and look around.

Post: #44

I left two yeas ago
If he gets elected I might go back though

#TRUMP2016

Post: #45

(07-18-2016 10:34 AM)Liberty Sea Wrote:  Singapore or Dubai can be good.

Singapore is better than Dubai by a long shot. They are similar in some ways but Singapore is actually civilized and developed. The U.A.E. is a slave nation built on oil money. This reflects in the arab culture with subservient people from the subcontinent which dominates there.

Post: #46

How long can Dubai truly last? What permanent resources are there to keep the city living?

Post: #47

(07-17-2016 10:08 PM)spokepoker Wrote:  No. I've built up a life, own land, own business. Why would I give that up? Why would I give anything up?
I will fight for what I have worked for. If they come for me, let them come and suffer the consequences.
Fuck running away.

It sounds good in theory, but remember that these Libtard Hitlery agents are violent and oppressive people..They have the capability to massacre an entire gender and then blame it on "misogyny".

The tyranny of the Left, including SJW and feminism is horrific. They have an entire police state at their disposal; a police state which they openly support for their false accusation industry.

On the bright side, if more men like you can stand up against these Hitlery fuckers, then ther will be change, but for now, these Libtards are in desperation to remain in power of their SJW narrative. Trump has to be elected at any cost. Hitlery will cause a mess in the USA because she is now known to be a corrupt twat who will even resort to mass murder if it means protecting her interest.

Post: #48

(07-18-2016 04:04 PM)spokepoker Wrote:  How long can Dubai truly last? What permanent resources are there to keep the city living?

Once the oil and credit dries up from their brother city-state Abu Dhabi they are done. That goes for most of the gulf arab nations though. Their ports and shitty tourist and ultra lux vanity projects aren't going to carry them into the next century.

Even trillions in cash can be burned through pretty fast when entire gulf arab nations are populated with largely ignorant people with below room temperature IQs. When the oil starts drying up you'll know because the corruption will rear its ugly head more and more.

You'll start seeing more unrest in those societies and more royals taking off with a large % of the GDP for greener pastures.

There will be an elite exodus once the well is sucked dry.

Post: #49

(07-18-2016 04:10 PM)RBerkley Wrote:  

(07-17-2016 10:08 PM)spokepoker Wrote:  No. I've built up a life, own land, own business. Why would I give that up? Why would I give anything up?
I will fight for what I have worked for. If they come for me, let them come and suffer the consequences.
Fuck running away.

It sounds good in theory, but remember that these Libtard Hitlery agents are violent and oppressive people..They have the capability to massacre an entire gender and then blame it on "misogyny".

The tyranny of the Left, including SJW and feminism is horrific. They have an entire police state at their disposal; a police state which they openly support for their false accusation industry.

On the bright side, if more men like you can stand up against these Hitlery fuckers, then ther will be change, but for now, these Libtards are in desperation to remain in power of their SJW narrative. Trump has to be elected at any cost. Hitlery will cause a mess in the USA because she is now known to be a corrupt twat who will even resort to mass murder if it means protecting her interest.

I still don't give a fuck. I've cast my vote in the primary, I will cast my vote in the general.
If Trump wins, great, I'll adapt and advance.
If Hillary wins, fine, I'll adapt, but I won't run. If my way of life comes under threat, I will defend it. If what I worked hard to achieve is threatened, I will defend it. If what I built is attacked, I will defend it. I won't be scared off, if I choose to set up somewhere else, it will not be under duress.

If I'm killed defending what is mine, then so be it, I won't be run off to have to live somewhere else.

Post: #50

Staying. I'll probably end up looking like this though: