Post: #1

To quote Gordon Ramsay, "let the knife do the work." Online text game is incredibly easy, because it's your profile that actually does all the work.

I remember when I first started doing online dating. At the recommendation of a female friend (LOL), I opened up an OkCupid profile. I wasn't really sure what to say on it, so I followed OkCupid's directions. My profile was long, had lots of pictures, and talked about everything from my affinity for Hemmingway novels to how I secretly grew up on Dawson's Creek. Awww, what a sweet, deep guy! Oh and I'm a lawyer who does lawyerly things like wears a suit.

I'd send out hundreds of messages a day, usually crafted by looking closely at her profile, and sending something along the lines of "Hey! I see you went to Egypt last summer. How was it?" or "You're into Hemmingway too? Great picture of Italy!"

Most of the time I wouldn't get a reply, or the conversations would dry up quickly.

At first I thought the problem was my text game. I needed to become better at messaging. Be more witty, more interesting, more deep, yadda yadda. Pay closer attention to her profile and really spark her interest. I spent a lot of time thinking about what to text next.

What I learned was the opposite - the quality of your profile actually dictates the entire interaction. If she finds your profile attractive, you can literally message her "purple monkey dishwasher" and probably get a response.

These were the changes I made to mine after tons of research, trial, and error:

- Only use one or two pictures. With your shirt on. Preferably doing something interesting. Do NOT smile in your picture. Observation: I got way less replies when wearing a lawyer suit. I got way more replies to pictures of me dressed casual. Mine had two pictures.
- Have a red pill profile that says you are interesting, travel a lot, and selective about who you spend your time with. "During the day I'm an attorney, but I'd rather be sleeping in the woods or on a beach in the Caribbean, which is where you'll often find me. If adventure isn't your speed, we're probably not a good fit for each other."
- Don't obsess over your job, but if you do something high status or cool, put it in there. If you don't have a high status job, focus on your hobbies that are interesting. If you have neither, chances are you're not getting poon unless you're good looking.
- Less is more. Give them just enough to let them know you're a high status male and nothing else. Interesting hobbies (MMA, Crossfit, etc.), some travel, cool job if you have one. No emocons, long missives, or any shit that emasculates you. She really only cares if you're good looking and if you're high status. That's all she is looking for. Everything else is just a chance to fuck up.
- Ignore shit tests like "only message me if..." or "I only respond to messages that say blah blah blah." Yeah, right.
- Mirror "everygirl's" profile with what you're "looking for." Mine basically said "I'm looking to meet a girl who loves to travel and is into adventure. She is the type of lady who can enjoy a fine dinner at SteakHouse or ethnic food off the beaten path and have a great time, but doesn't mind staying in and watching a movie sometimes. A woman who is just as comfortable hiking the Appalachian trail, kayaking, and sleeping under the stars as she is going to the Caribbean. Love of physical activity is a must." While that sounds very specific, it's actually not. It's just mirroring, and also meant to dissuade fatties.

After those modifications, I would actually get affirmative messages like "You're exactly what I'm looking for" a good bit.

Rather than spend all day sending messages after creeping her profile, I would just spam this line out and got tons of replies: "hey. i'm sort of new to this site. so... what's the dumbest thing anyone has ever said to you on here?" That led to a TON of responses, most of which were funny. It made the interaction really easy, while at the same time sending the message of "I'm not a creep."

I'd spam that out=on Sunday evenings or Monday mornings, because that's when she's at home fucking around on her computer. I didn't bother to read profiles ever, and found that doing so was completely unnecessary anyway. All that mattered was having a good profile, a good opener, and applying solid text game.

After she responds, standard text game always applies. No emocons, short and laconic. After a few messages, don't be afraid to send something like "you seem alright. lets grab drinks at Taco Joint tuesday night and talk about punta cana. i promise not to ask to lick your feet at the end. maybe." You've already done the work by creating a solid profile and starting the interaction off in a good way. No one goes into online dating looking for a pen pal. I was closing about 65% to 70% of my interactions.

I haven't done online dating since last year because I have enough of a book at this juncture, and find that cold approaches are far more efficient. But I got tons of bangs from OkCupid basically just by doing that. I actually met my last mini-LTR from OkCupid, who was a solid 8.

For in depth help, the book I found most helpful on the subject was "Cracking OkCupid":

http://www.amazon.com/Cracking-OKCupid-M...B00TMI22G6

Go forth and plunder.

Unfaithfully yours,
Hank Moody

Post: #2

purple monkey dishwasher....that's gold Hank Moody

I get lazy with profiles and sometimes just write my height.

For me, this is a good reminder that you always have to sell yourself.

Post: #3

(04-22-2016 03:42 PM)HankMoody Wrote:  If she finds your profile attractive, you can literally message her "purple monkey dishwasher" and probably get a response.

Post: #4

Solid advice Hank. I like online because its more efficient, you know shes looking and you know shes interested if she replies.

Like day game, its all about how looks, so choose those pictures carefully.

Beware the time waster who wants to chat, call, email but not meet up, I have found a lot of married women just looking to get their emotional needs met with no intention of meeting up.

Post: #5

(04-22-2016 03:42 PM)HankMoody Wrote:  Only use one or two pictures. Do NOT smile in your picture.

I never smile in the pics. I have picture of me in black-and-white leaning against a wall looking "moody", no smile. This gets a lot of positive responses, and it is admittedly a pretty good picture of me, but about two weekends ago I had a POF date with a chick who said she had originally seen me on Tinder. When I asked if she had swiped right she said she no. She had "deliberated" but ultimately decided that I looked "too sinister". Yikes!

Post: #6

My online dating profile has maybe three sentences that could be interpreted as "DHV" stuff. The rest is all goofy bullshit. Well-written goofy bullshit.

Then I just rely on pretty solid "text game" and being better at stringing sentences together than the rest of the guys. Good grief, some girls I've hooked up with have showed me their inbox. Good. Grief.

Quote:"I'm looking to meet a girl who loves to travel and is into adventure. She is the type of lady who can enjoy a fine dinner at SteakHouse or ethnic food off the beaten path and have a great time, but doesn't mind staying in and watching a movie sometimes. A woman who is just as comfortable hiking the Appalachian trail, kayaking, and sleeping under the stars as she is going to the Caribbean. Love of physical activity is a must."

You could not pay me enough to put this "mirroring" gobbledygook in my profile!

Basically comes down to different online game "styles." Because Hank is like, a lawyer, that actually does the things he lists in his profile, type of profile is congruous to who he is. Anything else would come off as strange.

But that's probably not me, or who many other readers of this thread might be. The style of online "game" I run is more like "asshole yet lovable cad alcoholic failed professional musician who you hooked up with in a club bathroom one time behind your boyfriend's back and pined over for months" style game. I've met up with a lot of really attractive girls from online this way, and while I didn't bang all of them, I banged a few. Most didn't really understand what I do for a living, and even when I tried to explain it to them, they didn't really care. I never even showed many of them my place. Hell, I could even be homeless for all some of them know.

You gotta like...know your demographic.

Quote:Like day game, its all about how looks, so choose those pictures carefully.

They'll get you so far. But when it comes down to it, when you've got a chick hitting you up in response to your message, so long as she's a girl who isn't just a hardcore serial dater or attention whore, it's what words you string together that pop up on her screen that will make the difference on whether you get her out or she decides you're weird and vanishes. aka "game."

You shouldn't really think of your online dating profile as some kind of super-DHV blah blah whiteboard where you try to be so awesome that you're everything to every bitch. Your online dating profile is a SCREENING tool. Your online dating profile is designed to attract only those who you have the highest probability of banging.

Every bitch who you send an opening message to, who then visits your player profile and bounces, is a bitch who didn't waste your time.

Quote:She really only cares if you're good looking and if you're high status.

This is honestly nonsense, at least around here. Basically game-denialism.

Post: #7

Solid datasheet. My POF Profile is virtually an entire joke but it attracts a lot of interest from girls. I have some girls cold opening me on this dating site and one of them asked me about the first date (I wrote that item like a joke).

Having an average profile description (I want a nice girl, I work as _____, I'm searching for a serious relationship) is not a good idea if you want to pipeline pussy from dating sites.

Post: #8

Regarding the efficiency of online dating...

Online, you have to spend a lot of time messaging, hoping to get a response, let alone an in person meeting. Then when you meet, the attraction simply might not exist on either end, but you're stuck hanging out. Even though you worked hard to get a date. It's a relatively large time investment which often leads to little return.

With cold approaches you've skipped all that drama, and there is no time investment. You're already out and having drinks with her. It's starting at step 3, instead of step 1, with no effort. You can literally walk up to any chick and suddenly be on a date with her. Plus you can cut it off at any point if it feels like the attraction isn't there.

Post: #9

(04-22-2016 10:05 PM)HankMoody Wrote:  With cold approaches you've skipped all that drama, and there is no time investment. You're already out and having drinks with her. It's starting at step 3, instead of step 1, with no effort. You can literally walk up to any chick and suddenly be on a date with her. Plus you can cut it off at any point if it feels like the attraction isn't there.

But cold approaches are a waste of time when one out of every two girls in the city has an online dating profile.

"I'm sorry, who are you again? Do I know you from Facebook? Did I already screen you through OKCupid? No? I got fifty yous waiting in my message box."

Women in New England fucking freeze up completely in response to the "cold approach." And it's not for lack of trying. They literally have no idea what to do with you.

You may think you're on a date with some rando you approach outside a bar in the South End. You're definitely not.

Quote:but you're stuck hanging out.

Nope, you get her out on a date near a place you already want to be, you get the sense in about fifteen minutes if she's into you or not by what she's saying and her body language, and after fifteen minutes go by and you're fairly convinced it's a waste of time you look her in the eye and say "Hey, it's been fun, but I gotta go. Seeya."

Then you get up and go do something else. Easy.

I think I remember a post a while back you made called "a good date" about some online hoe you were really into that you took out to dinner and tried to game that way and she never followed up on your text messages. Though I complain about online dating from time to time (who wouldn't!) the reason I'm not completely fed up with it and am still pulling lays from it after ~9 months is that I approach it the "right way", i.e. always have my hand on the eject lever, and never spend more than about ten bucks on a date.

Post: #10

Online game is great for guys who don't like going out.

It's also great for pussy-by-delivery. It's the only way to get a fresh girl over to your house without ever leaving your house (and not paying for it...).

There have been a few occasions where I just sat on my couch messaging on an app, and without ever leaving the couch, had a female show up at my door and ended up having sex that night. Never got dressed, never left the house, never even psychically saw the girl or spoke to her before she came to my place.

I agree to be a socially well-calibrated man of the world, you can't have online game be the only way you meet and date women, but it is certainly an avenue that has it's merits. The biggest downside is that it is a little "fake life" and can easily become a crutch for the less-social types.

Post: #11

^ Exactly, I can pull the same type of girl from online game around here with a few hours worth of effort over a couple days that would take me weeks, months to pull running night game. Have I ever pulled a girl from night game approaches around here? Nope, not once. There usually aren't even any good "targets."

http://www.rooshv.com/the-approachable-girl-metric

Every venue around here will fail to score above a "1" pretty much immediately, even on weekends. You can look in the window and fail any place you care to mention right away. Most spots on a weekend night will get a "0" unless there are over 100 people.

If I text with them a few times online and they agree to meet me at the very same venue? Whole different story.

They never wanted guys to approach them at bars and nightclubs in the first place. The only reason they allowed it was because there were no other options. Now that there are, they're shutting that avenue down.

Post: #12

Believe it or not, looking back on my history of online game, I think I have the best luck trying to pull girls the same night we start messaging. You have to take advantage of hot/cold aspect when gaming online.

When you meet a girl in person you can work magic and get a girl "in the mood" so to speak - online a girl can easily ignore where she can't do that so subtly in real life approach. She responds/cold messages you deliberately and is (generally) in the mood to experience you. She may be in the mood to meet you that night and that "strike while the iron is hot" theory is no joke.

The last two OKC dates I went on I made within an hour of first messaging the girl. Went on the app, saw a girl I liked that was online, messaged her, we chatted back and forth a few, and then made plans to meet up right away. One of those quick dates ended in a bang.

Post: #13

Did this post merit its own thread?

Or does it belong here:
How to get laid on okcupid like a boss

Post: #14

(04-23-2016 12:42 AM)XPQ22 Wrote:  

(04-22-2016 10:05 PM)HankMoody Wrote:  With cold approaches you've skipped all that drama, and there is no time investment. You're already out and having drinks with her. It's starting at step 3, instead of step 1, with no effort. You can literally walk up to any chick and suddenly be on a date with her. Plus you can cut it off at any point if it feels like the attraction isn't there.

But cold approaches are a waste of time when one out of every two girls in the city has an online dating profile.

"I'm sorry, who are you again? Do I know you from Facebook? Did I already screen you through OKCupid? No? I got fifty yous waiting in my message box."

Women in New England fucking freeze up completely in response to the "cold approach." And it's not for lack of trying. They literally have no idea what to do with you.

You may think you're on a date with some rando you approach outside a bar in the South End. You're definitely not.

Quote:but you're stuck hanging out.

Nope, you get her out on a date near a place you already want to be, you get the sense in about fifteen minutes if she's into you or not by what she's saying and her body language, and after fifteen minutes go by and you're fairly convinced it's a waste of time you look her in the eye and say "Hey, it's been fun, but I gotta go. Seeya."

Then you get up and go do something else. Easy.

I think I remember a post a while back you made called "a good date" about some online hoe you were really into that you took out to dinner and tried to game that way and she never followed up on your text messages. Though I complain about online dating from time to time (who wouldn't!) the reason I'm not completely fed up with it and am still pulling lays from it after ~9 months is that I approach it the "right way", i.e. always have my hand on the eject lever, and never spend more than about ten bucks on a date.

I don't use any of that PUA bullshit. Asking "Hey, I only have a second, but would I look cool with a diamond earring" to a stranger on the street? Fuck that.

My cold approach is way, way different, but it's taken a long time to build it up. I live in a neighborhood in a city on the east coast. I have become friends with all the bartenders and waitresses in the area. Every bar I hang out at, I'm greeted by first name and usually handed a Laphroaig on the rocks without asking. I hang out with most of the bartenders outside of the bar, because nothing is worse than hanging out with other lawyers. I've made an effort to become "the mayor" everywhere I go, by getting to know the owners, staff (down to the cooks) and regular patrons. This wasn't even a contrived effort, it's just sort of my personality.

If I'm alone, I'll walk up to the bar and start chatting with the bartender. "Hey, are we doing that thing on Sunday?" I make it clear that we're friends in the presence of women I want to chat with. If the owner is there, they'll usually come out and say hi and ask legal questions. I don't even need to say that I'm a lawyer, because someone always brings it up. DHV. Preselection. Blam.

From there, I'll subtly bring girls into the conversation involving the bartender, again making it known that we're friends outside of here. "Look at you, drinking a Miller Lite. Hey Susan, is even she allowed to drink that in here? Isn't this a classy joint?" "Oh Hank, stop being silly, I've seen you drink Miller Lite." "That's because you didn't have anything else in your fridge at the party!" From there I'll open a conversation with the girl more directly. "You from the neighborhood? This bar is the worst - the service is terrible!" (prompting a response from the bartender "Shut up Hank, you love me") yadda yadda yadda. This works best with girls who are alone and just sitting on their phone. The bartender becomes your wing. You're also bringing the girl into your cool fun world.

This approach probably won't work in everyone's geographic location. But if you live in a spot that has several bars around, designate a few good ones as "your spot" and get to know all the servers and regular patrons, it's pretty goddamn effective. Plus you get to go out, have a few drinks, and hang out with your friends.

Post: #15

Quote:But cold approaches are a waste of time when one out of every two girls in the city has an online dating profile.

"I'm sorry, who are you again? Do I know you from Facebook? Did I already screen you through OKCupid? No? I got fifty yous waiting in my message box."

Cold approaching is 1000x more of a DHV than some cheesy message sent over the internet, behind the safety of a computer screen.

Post: #16

Also, you can't bring ugly chicks into your regular bars. Ever. You always have to be seen with a hot girl on your arm. Don't chance meeting a girl from Tinder or OKC at a place you regularly frequent. Being seen with ugly chicks lowers your value.

On the flip side, if you're banging a hot chick, absolutely take her out to the bars you frequent regularly. Nothing increases your social status more than other people knowing you're banging hot chicks. Contrary to popular belief, being a known "womanizer" does not hurt you (except with fat, unhappy married chicks.)

Post: #17

(04-22-2016 08:31 PM)XPQ22 Wrote:  

Quote:She really only cares if you're good looking and if you're high status.

This is honestly nonsense, at least around here. Basically game-denialism.

Nope, online it's especially true. She can't magically detect your conversational abilities and in-person demeanor through your profile. Pictures are by far the most important piece of presentation in an online dating profile. I also view the profile text as a merely supplementary aspect -- it has to be clever or entertaining in some way, but even then I think that's only an extra 20-30% or so of attractiveness tops. I also second that messaging is only for arranging the first meeting. I can't remember a single instance where an extended conversation meant the difference between meeting a girl or not on an online dating website.

And this 'game denialism' concept would be a lot more solid if 'game' wasn't such a blurry concept itself.

Post: #18

(04-23-2016 12:18 PM)Phoenix Wrote:  She can't magically detect your conversational abilities and in-person demeanor through your profile.

No?

Number of times I've met up with a girl from online dating who seemed like a ditz in who wasn't able to write very well in her profile and then she turned out to be like, William Styron in real life: never

Do they not have the same ability?

Specifics of the points you list, no, probably not. However, I'd guess it's often not hard to get a general sense of whether you're dealing with a cool guy or a chode based on what he writes.

But if you're writing the same "I'm a really laid back guy who loves adventure, expensive craft beers, trips to art galleries and camping out under the stars" "DHV"-type stuff that everyone else is writing, they're definitely not going to have any idea. Even if all the words are strung together really well with great grammar and punctuation.

Get a lot of responses to your openers? Yeah, probably! Waste a lot of time on dates with girls who aren't down? Probably..

Post: #19

(04-23-2016 11:27 AM)HankMoody Wrote:  If I'm alone, I'll walk up to the bar and start chatting with the bartender. "Hey, are we doing that thing on Sunday?" I make it clear that we're friends in the presence of women I want to chat with. If the owner is there, they'll usually come out and say hi and ask legal questions. I don't even need to say that I'm a lawyer, because someone always brings it up. DHV. Preselection. Blam.

Barmaids can be hard to build rapport with! They've heard a lot of stuff. Particularly when I'm not much of a natural DHV anything...

On the rare occasions I go out solo, I usually go to places where nobody knows me. I go out to bars with girls who aren't particularly good looking from time to time, because nobody knows me anyway. I think one barmaid overheard the tattooed rocker girl I was out on a date with from OKC talk to me about anal sex.

"Excuse me...those whiskeys up there behind the bar? Why do you keep them in cages? Do they try to get out?"

After looking around the room for a while, look the bartender in her eyes and say in a serious, concerned tone: "These people have been drinking."

Barmaids seem to like me well enough. Two gave me their number at one point in the past, but one flaked and the other turned out to be a tranny. A fairly common issue around here, unfortunately.

In all of my adventures so far around here, talking to all sorts of men and women, I've so far talked to maybe one random guy in a night game venue I'd trust to be my wingman.

Post: #20

(04-23-2016 05:30 PM)XPQ22 Wrote:  

(04-23-2016 11:27 AM)HankMoody Wrote:  If I'm alone, I'll walk up to the bar and start chatting with the bartender. "Hey, are we doing that thing on Sunday?" I make it clear that we're friends in the presence of women I want to chat with. If the owner is there, they'll usually come out and say hi and ask legal questions. I don't even need to say that I'm a lawyer, because someone always brings it up. DHV. Preselection. Blam.

Barmaids can be hard to build rapport with! They've heard a lot of stuff. Particularly when I'm not much of a natural DHV anything...

On the rare occasions I go out solo, I usually go to places where nobody knows me. I go out to bars with girls who aren't particularly good looking from time to time, because nobody knows me anyway. I think one barmaid overheard the tattooed rocker girl I was out on a date with from OKC talk to me about anal sex.

"Excuse me...those whiskeys up there behind the bar? Why do you keep them in cages? Do they try to get out?"

After looking around the room for a while, look the bartender in her eyes and say in a serious, concerned tone: "These people have been drinking."

Barmaids seem to like me well enough. Two gave me their number at one point in the past, but one flaked and the other turned out to be a tranny. A fairly common issue around here, unfortunately.

In all of my adventures so far around here, talking to all sorts of men and women, I've so far talked to maybe one random guy in a night game venue I'd trust to be my wingman.

Barmaids are extremely easy to build rapport with. Tip well, don't be a dick, and engage them in meaningful conversation. Go long game with them. Build comfort and familiarity, while at the same time not being a beta orbiter.

If you can't engage barmaids to be your friend, you probably can't convince hot women to bang...

Post: #21

Brave man to put your successful online opener out there Hank; half of the online dating world is gonna be using it by next week.

I guard my online openers like gold in Fort Knox.

Post: #22

(04-23-2016 06:07 PM)HankMoody Wrote:  Barmaids are extremely easy to build rapport with. Tip well

Ah ok you could've stopped right there.

Barmaids are my friend and I tip like a buck fifty a night.

Quote:I guard my online openers like gold in Fort Knox.

Oh but I thought it didn't matter what you said in your opener! If she likes my pictures and profile "purple monkey dishwasher" is just fine!

I have no online openers to guard, because every one is different. What do they consist of? Usually stream-of-consciousness nonsense that involves something in her profile.

She likes Netflix?

"At the end of the day, the pawn and the queen go back in the same box. Netflix: the box"

She studies oceanography?

"There's an all-you-can-eat seafood buffet near you that has great oysters. I ate a lot of them. I'm sorry, ocean. I'm so sorry."

Yep, these type of openers get me laid. So long as one runs standard text game if she replies. "Guarding" online openers like Fort Knox as if these girls are something special and deserve gold. Yikes.

Post: #23

The problem basically seems to be that people are not thinking about how modern women view/use online dating sites.

One of the girls I'm currently banging (who I met on OKC) has female roommates who also do the online dating thing. So I've got a bit of an inside scoop on how they view it.

You know how some guys stay home on the weekends and play Skyrim on their computer? A fantasy-land of warriors, knights, and wizards? That's how modern women view online dating sites. It's a video game for girls full of drama, white knights, demons, flaking adventure and excitement, where sometimes one of the characters shows up in the real world and bangs them.

They build their character ("profile") and set out to have adventures. You're an NPC unless you can show them otherwise. You're the shopkeeper who sells them a white crystal and three life potions for 50 rupees.

Post: #24

In general, what's everyone's take on a profile pic where you're with a cute girl?

I've read opinions on the forum (and elsewhere) contradicting each other.

There's one such photo which I've recently started using as my main, and it seems to be having inconsistent results on the different apps/sites that I'm using. She's blonde and I'm not white, so there's no chance she could be taken for my sister. I'm looking pretty alpha in it; but smiling.

If it works against me, the photo makes it pretty obvious that it was taken in a club.

A (non-game aware) friend has told me to ditch that photo, or at least crop the girl out.

Post: #25

(04-23-2016 01:23 AM)General Stalin Wrote:  Believe it or not, looking back on my history of online game, I think I have the best luck trying to pull girls the same night we start messaging. You have to take advantage of hot/cold aspect when gaming online.

When you meet a girl in person you can work magic and get a girl "in the mood" so to speak - online a girl can easily ignore where she can't do that so subtly in real life approach. She responds/cold messages you deliberately and is (generally) in the mood to experience you. She may be in the mood to meet you that night and that "strike while the iron is hot" theory is no joke.

The last two OKC dates I went on I made within an hour of first messaging the girl. Went on the app, saw a girl I liked that was online, messaged her, we chatted back and forth a few, and then made plans to meet up right away. One of those quick dates ended in a bang.

Dead on. A girl went from basically propositioning me to doing a reversal (hang out, get comfortable, then consider). Fact is, that night of the first interaction (she messaged me), she was DTF, which just shows you that Stalin is right. It's irrational, hormonal, and impulsive in a given scenario. But it is out of the blue and because of logistics, I didn't pursue it (also was worried I might be set up). But I know for a fact now that she was looking for action, immediately. It's pretty funny to realize that that's how most of this crap is