Post: #1

If you haven't read it, Rollo has posted a new article talking about the meetup debacle:

http://therationalmale.com/2016/02/08/outrage-brokers/

Now, he's pretty uncharitable in this. This in particular struck me as pretty bad:

Quote:My concern isn’t how he handled this, it’s why he put himself (and other men who admire him) into this. My concern is that any genuineness he might’ve had about Neomasculinity is suspect of being just a vehicle for his own notoriety. If that’s the direction he’s chosen to go, if that’s how he’s decided to turn a dollar, I wish him good luck, but he’s become a dishonest broker of outrage at the expense (in some cases physically and financially) of the men who believed he was sincere.

He even mentions in the post that he wrote one guest post for ROK, so it seems that the relationship went bad after that post. There's lots of assuming bad intent in this article, which in my experience generally means that there's some beef. I don't ascribe the same intent he does to Roosh, and I wonder where it's coming from.

I respect both of these guys, and this is a beef that should really be squashed.

Post: #2

Roosh either unintentionally or intentionally pushed a button that made us realize how far gone the media is, and how numerous are our enemies. That ALONE is how "raised, red pill awareness" ought to be measured.

Roosh couldn't give a point by point, scientifically supported analysis like Rollo does, because the media wasn't giving him the platform to do so.

Post: #3

Malone,

I feel the same way. I read both guys regularly.

It's been incredibly disappointing to see so much of the Manosphere attack one of its own during the last couple of weeks. I have no problems with people dissociating themselves, so I understand why AVFM constantly corrected the media that claimed Roosh was a MRA. But just to throw him under the bus like they did (and are still doing) at the behest of the same media that also hates them, and to spread lies created by the same media machine that wouldn't hesitate to destroy them (AND they MAN SHAME by claiming Roosh lives in his mom's basement, the EXACT SAME insult usually thrown at them), is sad.

But I do take heart at how people like Mike and Obsidian (and even Vox Day) at least stood up to the bullies.

It's in the worst of times that you find out who has your back and who doesn't. This has been quite a revealing time, in terms of showing the character of many people within the Manosphere.

Post: #4

Rollo wrote two ROK articles about a year apart.

http://www.returnofkings.com/author/rollo-tomassi

I find the situation interesting, worthy of it's own debate.

Post: #5

(02-09-2016 09:49 AM)Malone Wrote:  

Quote:My concern isn’t how he handled this, it’s why he put himself (and other men who admire him) into this. My concern is that any genuineness he might’ve had about Neomasculinity is suspect of being just a vehicle for his own notoriety.

Absolute unmitigated bullshit. If Roosh had been doing this for notoriety in order to "turn a dollar", then WHY DID HE CANCEL IT? Imagine the notoriety he would have gained if he just simply let it happen. Think about the EFFORT it took him to shut it all down. THE VERY FACT that Roosh shut this down PROVES he put his fans ABOVE himself and his own financial gain. And full disclosure - I don't even know Roosh and I'm relatively new to this forum. This Rollo shit-head is just trolling for HIS OWN notoriety so HE can turn a dollar. What a crock of shit. I didn't know much about this guy before you posted this so thank you for this. Now I know he's an asshole. Kicking a man when he's down is the lowest form of cowardice. Disgusting.

Post: #6

Has Rollo been treated rudely by anyone in this forum or in the comments section at RoK? I thought I had seen him post in this forum before.

Post: #7

I've purchased products by both Roosh and Rollo. I cannot read Rollo anymore, because his writing is far too analytical and too much of a philosophical dick waving style.

Reddit's theredpill at one point sided with Rollo over Roosh. I can't remember the details of this, but it might be informative. Rollo went on his own speaking tour, I believe hitting Vegas.

I think Rollo wanted to separate hard from Roosh in order to make his own brand. Roosh called him out, on this forum, because Rollo posted here occasionally. I don't think he's been back.

Post: #8

I read both too - they definitely take very different approaches to their material, but it does seem like there might be a bit more at play here.

The last year I've been feeling that Rollo is very frequently repeating old articles in new packing but I guess that's hard to avoid unless you want to broaden the scope of your writing substantially, like Roosh has done in recent years.

Post: #9

Rollo sadly seems to have chosen the way of the cuckservative (or in this case, "cuck pill" might be more appropriate). It's a pity that he spends so much time and effort blasting Roosh over ideological purity or whatnot.

Post: #10

Meh I'm not too worried. I'm willing to bet money that Rollo's followers are the kind of men that the media likes to portray us as.

There's a reason I'm here and not sitting on my ass reading Rollo Tomasi.

Granted he's a great writer and the Rational Male once had its place, but his current audience I wouldn't associate with.

Post: #11

Did you read the comments under Rollo's article? The tone is slightly more favorable toward Roosh than Rollo.

Post: #12

(02-09-2016 10:17 AM)philosophical_recovery Wrote:  I've purchased products by both Roosh and Rollo. I cannot read Rollo anymore, because his writing is far too analytical and too much of a philosophical dick waving style.

Reddit's theredpill at one point sided with Rollo over Roosh. I can't remember the details of this, but it might be informative. Rollo went on his own speaking tour, I believe hitting Vegas.

I think Rollo wanted to separate hard from Roosh in order to make his own brand. Roosh called him out, on this forum, because Rollo posted here occasionally. I don't think he's been back.

I've criticized him on here for much the same reason. Many (if not all) of his ideas are absolutely brilliant. But he's so heavy-handed and humorless that it undercuts what he's trying to say.

I sometimes think that had I discovered Rollo at 18, I'd have seen the dating market as an impossibly dark, evil thing and would have just given up.

Heartiste can put across the exact same negative ideas, but he'll have you laughing along because of his sarcasm and wordplay. This is important. By contrast, reading Rollo sometimes feels like you're going before a drill sergeant.

A note to younger guys: If you come across this pedantic and serious to women you will fail with them. They'll be put off. Personality matters. People prefer comedies to college lectures.

***

On another note, this goes for women, too.

While I'm the first to say that women make horrific comedians, an even worse thing for a woman is to be a stone-faced nun. Sadly, too many of them are. Women walk around so uptight that they look like their head is going to explode, and then they wonder why they sit home alone each weekend. Gee, why could that be?

Post: #13

(02-09-2016 10:16 AM)C-Note Wrote:  Has Rollo been treated rudely by anyone in this forum or in the comments section at RoK?

I don't know but he has now. Fuck him. The cuck.

Post: #14

(02-09-2016 10:30 AM)Days of Broken Arrows Wrote:  A note to younger guys: If you come across this pedantic and serious to women you will fail with them. They'll be put off. Personality matters. People prefer comedies to college lectures.

Amen brother. Like Oscar Wilde said ... if you're going to tell 'em the truth, make 'em laugh, or they'll kill you.

Post: #15

Didn't he have a meltdown on here and get the ban hammer?

Post: #16

(02-09-2016 10:43 AM)Snowplow Wrote:  Didn't he have a meltdown on here and get the ban hammer?

His account appears to be in good standing and he has 15 rep points even though he only made 44 posts. His last post was 25 April 2015. Looks like he logged-in yesterday.

Post: #17

Well he did get one thing right: "Label a man a ‘rapist’ in the slightest degree of seriousness and you have carte blanche to kill him or destroy his life and livelihood. "

Post: #18

It started when Roosh started to have doubts about evolution and "denounced" Red Pill and founded Neomasculinity.

Rollo thought Roosh is going full cult leader and started to distance himself from Roosh.

Post: #19

(02-09-2016 11:00 AM)Hank Wrote:  It started when Roosh started to have doubts about evolution and "denounced" Red Pill and founded Neomasculinity.

Rollo thought Roosh is going full cult leader and started to distance himself from Roosh.

Well Rollo is going full cuck leader.

Post: #20

DoBA;

Agree. Rollo appeals strongly to the analytical, troubled side. I know of virgins approaching middle age that read Rollo. It definitely appeals to my angsty, gamma side.

The humorless point is crucial, and reminds me of the RVF guys like LoOz, Gio, and others who have a playful personality that gets the gina wet.

There seems to be a lot more self flagellation amongst Rollos followers.

(02-09-2016 10:30 AM)Days of Broken Arrows Wrote:  

(02-09-2016 10:17 AM)philosophical_recovery Wrote:  I've purchased products by both Roosh and Rollo. I cannot read Rollo anymore, because his writing is far too analytical and too much of a philosophical dick waving style.

Reddit's theredpill at one point sided with Rollo over Roosh. I can't remember the details of this, but it might be informative. Rollo went on his own speaking tour, I believe hitting Vegas.

I think Rollo wanted to separate hard from Roosh in order to make his own brand. Roosh called him out, on this forum, because Rollo posted here occasionally. I don't think he's been back.

I've criticized him on here for much the same reason. Many (if not all) of his ideas are absolutely brilliant. But he's so heavy-handed and humorless that it undercuts what he's trying to say.

I sometimes think that had I discovered Rollo at 18, I'd have seen the dating market as an impossibly dark, evil thing and would have just given up.

Heartiste can put across the exact same negative ideas, but he'll have you laughing along because of his sarcasm and wordplay. This is important. By contrast, reading Rollo sometimes feels like you're going before a drill sergeant.

A note to younger guys: If you come across this pedantic and serious to women you will fail with them. They'll be put off. Personality matters. People prefer comedies to college lectures.

***

On another note, this goes for women, too.

While I'm the first to say that women make horrific comedians, an even worse thing for a woman is to be a stone-faced nun. Sadly, too many of them are. Women walk around so uptight that they look like their head is going to explode, and then they wonder why they sit home alone each weekend. Gee, why could that be?

Post: #21

Rollo Tomassi's target audience is mainly married guys or guys in LTRs. So, he takes a different approach with a lot of focus on dread game.

Post: #22

Professional jealousy.
It happens in all areas of growth and success.
There is room at the top for everybody that puts forth a quality effort and no need to be bashing each other. The stakes are really high. This up and coming generation of teen guys need help and insight or they are going to be fucked before they even get started.
Roosh, Rollo and Heartiste are Washington, Jefferson and Adams of the 21st century.

Post: #23

Potentially OT but relevant in my eyes. Writers who publish books littered with spelling, grammatical, and punctuation errors greatly irritate me. Rollo's theory is pretty solid as a theoretical foundation in intersexual dynamics but his books, I and II, have evidently not been proofread. What kind of a man skips this fundamental step?

Aside from this, Rollo preaches but Roosh practices. Rollo comes across as obsessive and controlling whereas Roosh is a man of action, an on-the-ground leader, if you will.

Post: #24

(02-09-2016 11:14 AM)rpg Wrote:  Roosh, Rollo and Heartiste are Washington, Jefferson and Adams of the 21st century.

Fuck that. Rollo is Benedict Arnold. Fuck him.

Post: #25

I'm seriously disappointed in Rollo. This is a dishonest, back-stabbing article that I might have expected from AVFM.