Post: #1

I heard someone (maybe Roosh) say that men living in Toronto typically need to date down if they want to have a girlfriend. Ex. a guy who's a 7 dating a girl who's a 6.

I've found this is very much the case for myself, and as an 8 or so have found myself dating 6's, including one long term relationship. I've been able to get 8's and 9's for short term only. They eventually flake out, go crazy, or decide they can do better (though 6's and 7's do these things as well).

Anyone have experience dating down? What are your thoughts on the economics of it, especially for guys living places like Toronto.

Post: #2

(12-10-2015 01:23 AM)R_Niko Wrote:  What are your thoughts on the economics of it

What do you mean by this?

Post: #3

(12-10-2015 01:46 AM)GlobalMan Wrote:  

(12-10-2015 01:23 AM)R_Niko Wrote:  What are your thoughts on the economics of it

What do you mean by this?

Pussy economics, as in the supply of HB 5+ woman vs number of men with functioning cocks in a given area.

So if you are in an area such as Toronto that is ravaged by feminism and obesity, you are in the pussy economic equivalent of Venezuela right now.

Seeing male 8's with 5's will be the norm here.

Post: #4

(12-10-2015 05:35 AM)Gregmo Wrote:  

(12-10-2015 01:46 AM)GlobalMan Wrote:  

(12-10-2015 01:23 AM)R_Niko Wrote:  What are your thoughts on the economics of it

What do you mean by this?

Pussy economics, as in the supply of HB 5+ woman vs number of men with functioning cocks in a given area.

So if you are in an area such as Toronto that is ravaged by feminism and obesity, you are in the pussy economic equivalent of Venezuela right now.

Seeing male 8's with 5's will be the norm here.

Is there something preventing you from re-locating to a more "pussy rich" environment?

Post: #5

Can you post an example of what is a male 8?

Most likely you are deluded about how good looking you are.

Post: #6

(12-10-2015 01:23 AM)R_Niko Wrote:  I heard someone (maybe Roosh) say that men living in Toronto typically need to date down if they want to have a girlfriend. Ex. a guy who's a 7 dating a girl who's a 6.

I've found this is very much the case for myself, and as an 8 or so have found myself dating 6's, including one long term relationship. I've been able to get 8's and 9's for short term only. They eventually flake out, go crazy, or decide they can do better (though 6's and 7's do these things as well).

Anyone have experience dating down? What are your thoughts on the economics of it, especially for guys living places like Toronto.

Arbitrage, if you're selling, move product to a market where it's valued higher. If you're buying go to a market where you can buy better quality for a lower price.

Post: #7

Seems like the smv (1-10) of a guy is how many, how attractive, and how attracted girls are to him.

A guy 'dating down' simply makes me reassess his value (on the smv).

Which begs the question, can a woman date down? At it's face, yes. Of course. While men are attractive based on situation and circumstance, women can be rated basically in a vacuum. It's simply a matter of the right shapes, sizes, proportions, symmetry.

Women are the metric. We are the subject.

But, if a hottie is dating a fat loser who lives in his parent's basement, is she dating down? Based on the first premise, he's actually significantly more attractive because of her. Because of her, she's actually dating an attractive guy.

I'm just rambling now.

Post: #8

I don't know why you would want to turn a girl who you think is two points below you into your girlfriend.

If we are talking about dating and fucking one. Well, that's a completely different story and that's up to you.

Post: #9

Dating down can certainly build skills and confidence and give you a lot of experience with women.

Unfortunately, you're also basically just using someone.

At least if you're only dicking down, you can be more honest about your intentions and not lead them into something that may seem like the home stretch to them but is just "practice" for you. I mean, I guess it just depends on what you mean by "dating." I'd say try to keep it casual if you don't plan to stick around - fortunately, in America most relationships start out pretty casual anyhow, so your job is just to keep it from moving beyond that first level. Eventually she'll probably get tired of trying to move it forward with a guy who isn't really into it and you'll bicker about it until you go your separate ways (or until she convinces you).

Also, there's a major trap in dating down that you may easily underestimate. Once you spend some significant time with someone, you automatically begin to inflate their value in your own mind. You may even begin mentally attributing characteristics to them that they don't have - it's just a byproduct of getting attached to someone and forming a bond with them.

This is one reason why so many guys end up dating and then even marrying some girl that started out as a fuck buddy.

For a player, it's less likely - because he has a lot of options, and even if it starts to happen he'll (probably) shake his head straight eventually and run for the border. But if you're inexperienced with women already, which I'm assuming is the case if you're considering this, the risk of this happening with a lower-value women for the long-term goes up significantly.

Beyond All Seas

"The individual has always had to struggle to keep from being overwhelmed by the tribe.
To be your own man is a hard business. If you try it, you'll be lonely often, and sometimes
frightened. But no price is too high to pay for the privilege of owning yourself." - Kipling

Post: #10

(12-11-2015 05:45 PM)Beyond Borders Wrote:  Also, there's a major trap in dating down that you may easily underestimate. Once you spend some significant time with someone, you automatically begin to inflate their value in your own mind. You may even begin mentally attributing characteristics to them that they don't have - it's just a byproduct of getting attached to someone and forming a bond with them.

This is the worth reading again for beginners and intermediates.

jariel wrote about this.

Don't let jump off girls waste your time - it is the most common trap and the easiest to fall for.

Post: #11

I wonder what the mechanism by which Canadian women have priced themselves up in the market (by being able to obtain 2-3 SMV higher)?

And why is it that Russian women have lowered their value by accepting SMV 4-5 lower?


Given that the male-female ratios in both countries are almost 50-50 +- a few percentile points?