(07-26-2016 05:01 AM)Mercenary Wrote:  Hydrogonian - can you find any examples of German peoples seriously challenging and overthrowing their rulers before 1945 or even 1933 ?

The question is, what rulers should we overthrown? Also to what do we compare it? The Russian revolution? French? The declaration of independence in the US?
If you want to know about resistance against Hitler, beside Stauffenberg there had be a few.

I think the influence of average IQ on the society can be easily explained.
Note, this is not my theory. Someone else posted it on this forums before (I think it was Anonymous Bosch).
That brilliant post put forward this theory, something that I’ve observed for many years but could never summarize or bring under words.

-People of below average IQ:
These people are not smart enough to understand abstract concepts. They only trust their instincts and their direct observations. That’s why these people are more likely to be conservative and vote right wing. They dislike mass immigration, LGBT propaganda, gay marriage, equality and positive discrimination hysteria etc… because their observations and gut feeling tells them that these things are bad or unnatural.

These people work as factory or construction workers, in a trade or they are unemployed when the economy is bad. They do not have a loud voice in the society.

People in this group are also most likely to engage in criminal behavior.

-People of above average IQ:
These people are smart enough to understand abstract concepts, but not smart enough to understand the limits of these concepts or their own intelligence. They are so proud of their own ability to understand abstract theories that they refuse to abandon a theory when reality proves it invalid. This is your typical university educated liberal.

These people study economy, law, humanities or liberal arts and they end up as politicians, in the media, in education or in the boardroom of companies. They have by far the loudest voice in our society.

-Very high IQ people:
These people understand abstract theories, as well as the limits these theories have. When confronted with contrary evidence, they abandon or rethink the theory.

Very smart people end up in medicine, engineering or hard sciences. These people are relatively few and, just like the below average IQ population, they do not have a loud voice in society.

This leaves us with the following situation:
Outside of the Western world, most countries are simply shitholes. This is because the average IQ of the inhabitants is not high enough to build a prosperous society with discipline, law and order.

In the Western world, the smarter the country, the greater the amount of easily indoctrinated “above average IQ” people. That’s why very developed nations like Sweden and Germany have been the most vulnerable to liberal indoctrination. Since the ruling class of a country consists mostly of these people, high IQ (prosperous) countries are almost doomed to swing to an ideological extreme; for instance the extreme political correctness with mass importation of criminal low IQ immigrants nowadays or the nazi regime in Germany in the 30’s and 40’s.

By the way, I completely agree that education doesn’t change IQ much. IQ is mainly a genetic treat and from very young age it is clearly visible which children are intelligent, average or dumb.

Hydrogonian - a lot of your examples are of Germans fighting other countries or external enemies. I'm talking about a situation in history where they killed and/or imprisoned their own rulers and created a new society. As for the attempts on Hitler's life....these mostly came after he started losing the war...not before. Even when they lost the first world war, they put the blame on everyone else except their own king. Did the Germans ever put Kaiser Wilhelm II on trial ? No. He fled like a rat in the winter of 1918 and died of old age in exile in the Netherlands in 1941.

Even today...all the old leaders and secret police rulers of communist east Germany (GDR) that killed and imprisoned thousands live comfortable lives with rich state pensions....

2 modern examples:

Egon Krenz (last leader of communist east Germany, lives a free man today)

Markus Wolf (Head of the east German secret police/Stasi...died a free man in his sleep in 2006)


Angela Merkel herself grew up in THAT east German communist background. She was a hardcore east German communist, before she became a "reformed" western slut.
The night the Berlin Wall fell, she did NOT even bother to go LOOK at what was happening because she wanted to have a fucking evening relaxing in the sauna.
That's a true story.

Quote:Angela Merkel 'took sauna' in East Germany as Wall fell

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...-fell.html

Think about how perverse that is.
That's like a prisoner (or prison warden) who has been inside so long, they are not even interesting in SEEING the prison gates burst wide open and the prisoners fleeing.
This is the batshit crazy childless woman we are dealing with.

All of the politics, and my take on the perspectives, surrounding your points I addressed in my last commentary; as well as variously in the previous commentaries.

I disagree with your assertion that you can discern some type of personalty fault in a people who are willing to resist rule, to the death, by the:

Romans,
Charlemagne,
the Globalists under Napoleon, and if we're being honest
the Globalists during WWI and WWII

because they didn't kill enough of their own Kings.

In fact, such internal revolution has been the hallmark of the globalists. The many examples in European history being obvious.

Are we to revere the personality characteristics of Russians because they allowed themselves to be seduced by communism, and then overthrew and slaughtered the Romanovs?

The Russian Revolution is an example of the unlawful revolutionary overthrow of a Royal Family, and the horrors of the Soviet Union were the result.

Since were are speaking to the personality characteristics of a people as supposedly revealed merely by their willingness to overthrow rulers that come see as bad, then it should be concluded that the Russians willingness to slaughter the Romanov's was a good thing.

I know all about comrade Merkel and her Stasi crony involvement in modern Germany.

You're also logically linking Allied (enemy) perspectives on WWI and WWII and your sense of what the Germans supposedly should have done to revolt against Hitler or the Kaiser.

Both of those wars were for their own interests, and did not warrant a revolution against their leader other than from an armchair general perspective 75 years later. If Britain had lost, would it make the same sense, seventy five years later, to say that they should have rebelled against their government to surrender and halt further loss?

In fact, as I pointed out, the Third Reich was the revolution. WWI was also a war for their interests. Thinking otherwise is merely not being flexible enough in your historical thought to realize the reality of the two situations for the Germans.

Low IQ people are not 'right wing' give me a break, they're just socially conservative, which is the natural order of things. However, they love themselves a big government and will willingly enslave themselves for 'security'.

I've often wondered, what kind of IQ is necessary for the basics of civilization, lets say a civilization like Maya, Sumeria, etc. What kind of IQ is necessary for something like Egyptian, ancient Chinese and Greek? What kind is needed for something like Rome? We have to realize that except for China, nowhere else in the world did they reach something like the level of Roman civilization until modern times. All Meso-American societies where essentially stone age.

Then there's the really difficult question, what kind of IQ is needed for a high tech society such as ours?

(07-26-2016 11:24 AM)hydrogonian Wrote:  I'll just end my commentary, other than a reply coming in regard to Mercenary's historical assertions, by stating that I think you guys are using a lot of unwarranted conjecture and de-contextualized assertions about the nature of Germans and the nature of intelligence.

You're not going to do better with lower IQ populations. You aren't. Witness the DNC. Witness the lower IQ European nations. Witness the lower IQ nations elsewhere.

And Germany is not a "perfect R-selected society". C'mon. I can't really have this conversation if I have to refute such baseless perspectives. Respectfully, and no offense.

My coming historical post will refute, imo, any generalization that comes from butt-hurt over their current larger political effect as "followers" in a militarily, legally, and psychologically controlled nation occupied by communists / internationalists.

You guys keep omitting the psychological conditions that they have been under for two generations now.

Also, you are omitting their legal restrictions. I doubt any of you would sacrifice your lives to revolt under any circumstance that they have yet been under, and in Germany it takes very little true "revolt" for you to ruin your life in this day.

Generalizing them negatively shows not enough analysis and it seems, to me, that it comes from an easy place where you can yell at the stronger dog while he is tied to his leash.

I know the Germans - I lived there for extended periods of my life. I speak fluent German without an accent, several accents actually. How about you?

(07-26-2016 11:58 AM)PhDre Wrote:  This leaves us with the following situation:
Outside of the Western world, most countries are simply shitholes. This is because the average IQ of the inhabitants is not high enough to build a prosperous society with discipline, law and order.

In the Western world, the smarter the country, the greater the amount of easily indoctrinated “above average IQ” people. That’s why very developed nations like Sweden and Germany have been the most vulnerable to liberal indoctrination. Since the ruling class of a country consists mostly of these people, high IQ (prosperous) countries are almost doomed to swing to an ideological extreme; for instance the extreme political correctness with mass importation of criminal low IQ immigrants nowadays or the nazi regime in Germany in the 30’s and 40’s.

By the way, I completely agree that education doesn’t change IQ much. IQ is mainly a genetic treat and from very young age it is clearly visible which children are intelligent, average or dumb.

That's actually quite a brilliant analysis. Thanks for taking the time to share it here.

(07-26-2016 12:10 PM)Mercenary Wrote:  Hydrogonian - a lot of your examples are of Germans fighting other countries or external enemies. I'm talking about a situation in history where they killed and/or imprisoned their own rulers and created a new society. As for the attempts on Hitler's life....these mostly came after he started losing the war...not before. Even when they lost the first world war, they put the blame on everyone else except their own king. Did the Germans ever put Kaiser Wilhelm II on trial ? No. He fled like a rat in the winter of 1918 and died of old age in exile in the Netherlands in 1941.

Even today...all the old leaders and secret police rulers of communist east Germany (GDR) that killed and imprisoned thousands live comfortable lives with rich state pensions....

2 modern examples:

Egon Krenz (last leader of communist east Germany, lives a free man today)

Markus Wolf (Head of the east German secret police/Stasi...died a free man in his sleep in 2006)


Angela Merkel herself grew up in THAT east German communist background. She was a hardcore east German communist, before she became a "reformed" western slut.
The night the Berlin Wall fell, she did NOT even bother to go LOOK at what was happening because she wanted to have a fucking evening relaxing in the sauna.
That's a true story.

Quote:Angela Merkel 'took sauna' in East Germany as Wall fell

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...-fell.html

Think about how perverse that is.
That's like a prisoner (or prison warden) who has been inside so long, they are not even interesting in SEEING the prison gates burst wide open and the prisoners fleeing.
This is the batshit crazy childless woman we are dealing with.

THANK YOU! Let me add another name - Anetta Kahane.

(07-26-2016 12:11 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  Both of those wars were for their own interests, and did not warrant a revolution against their leader other than from an armchair general perspective 75 years later. If Britain had lost, would it make the same sense, seventy five years later, to say that they should have rebelled against their government to surrender and halt further loss?

In fact, as I pointed out, the Third Reich was the revolution. WWI was also a war for their interests. Thinking otherwise is merely not being flexible enough in your historical thought to realize the reality of the two situations for the Germans.

Good points there I must say. Interesting perspective regarding the Third Reich being the revolution. However would you not say that after WW1 Germany did excel at creating a K-selected society? I mean, the gender roles and societal values espoused by the NS party would make the average forum reader's heart bounce (I'm not talking about killing Jews of course). And today it's Cuck Central - less than one century later.

I maintain that the Germans tend to swing to from one extreme to the other.

(07-26-2016 01:00 PM)redpillage Wrote:  

(07-26-2016 11:24 AM)hydrogonian Wrote:  I'll just end my commentary, other than a reply coming in regard to Mercenary's historical assertions, by stating that I think you guys are using a lot of unwarranted conjecture and de-contextualized assertions about the nature of Germans and the nature of intelligence.

You're not going to do better with lower IQ populations. You aren't. Witness the DNC. Witness the lower IQ European nations. Witness the lower IQ nations elsewhere.

And Germany is not a "perfect R-selected society". C'mon. I can't really have this conversation if I have to refute such baseless perspectives. Respectfully, and no offense.

My coming historical post will refute, imo, any generalization that comes from butt-hurt over their current larger political effect as "followers" in a militarily, legally, and psychologically controlled nation occupied by communists / internationalists.

You guys keep omitting the psychological conditions that they have been under for two generations now.

Also, you are omitting their legal restrictions. I doubt any of you would sacrifice your lives to revolt under any circumstance that they have yet been under, and in Germany it takes very little true "revolt" for you to ruin your life in this day.

Generalizing them negatively shows not enough analysis and it seems, to me, that it comes from an easy place where you can yell at the stronger dog while he is tied to his leash.

I know the Germans - I lived there for extended periods of my life. I speak fluent German without an accent, several accents actually. How about you?

I was raised by Germans on both sides (father was adopted), and am half genetically German. Half Scottish. Full disclosure: my Father's father was German but married a girl from a British family and I feel that that side of the family's overall culture is more British. However, my mother's side is full-on Kraut, and I mean that in every sense of the word.

If you aren't German, and weren't raised by Germans, then you don't really know them. I can tell you that much. I would never claim to be as "German" as a native, but there are certain personality traits that do not die within the first few generations of immigrants (at least). I've been through it as far as being raised around those traits and their culture are concerned.

(07-26-2016 01:06 PM)redpillage Wrote:  THANK YOU! Let me add another name - Anetta Kahane.

Quote:Anetta Kahane (born 1954) is a German journalist and activist and the founder of the Amadeu Antonio Foundation.

From 1974 to 1982 Kahane worked with the code name "Victoria" as an unofficial employee of the Ministry for State Security (Stasi) in East Germany. Her Stasi files include more than 800 pages of reports. Kahane kept a watchful eye on many people such as artists, students from West Berlin universities or ZDF reporters.

In 2015 Amadeu Antonio Foundation was hired by German government to monitor Facebook for xenophobic comments in the height of the European migrant crisis. This decision was criticized by many right wing activists especially because of Kahane's past involvement with Stasi.

(07-26-2016 01:12 PM)redpillage Wrote:  I maintain that the Germans tend to swing to from one extreme to the other.

Your still ignoring the reality of modern political Germany, for some reason. They aren't in charge.

Germans are still people. They aren't super-human.

They are subject to psychological deformations and abuse.

I don't think that anyone would agree that they have free will as to how they choose to raise their children in terms of belief, or that they can comfortably align themselves with any expression of will that they wish as an adult.

Assuming that they have access to information to begin with. Not being superhuman also means that they don't have an innate repository of information stored in their minds. They are as good as who they are allowed to be at this point.

(07-26-2016 01:12 PM)redpillage Wrote:  

(07-26-2016 12:11 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  Both of those wars were for their own interests, and did not warrant a revolution against their leader other than from an armchair general perspective 75 years later. If Britain had lost, would it make the same sense, seventy five years later, to say that they should have rebelled against their government to surrender and halt further loss?

In fact, as I pointed out, the Third Reich was the revolution. WWI was also a war for their interests. Thinking otherwise is merely not being flexible enough in your historical thought to realize the reality of the two situations for the Germans.

Good points there I must say. Interesting perspective regarding the Third Reich being the revolution. However would you not say that after WW1 Germany did excel at creating a K-selected society? I mean, the gender roles and societal values espoused by the NS party would make the average forum reader's heart bounce (I'm not talking about killing Jews of course). And today it's Cuck Central - less than one century later.

I maintain that the Germans tend to swing to from one extreme to the other.

It all comes down to behavioral genetics. All groups of people, within and across racial groups, have certain characteristics which they exhibit wherever they go. The Germans seem to have an inborn regimental world view, which leads to them following authority rigidly, no matter who it may be. This is why we've seen Germany swing from hard right to hard left in such a relatively short amount of time.

(07-26-2016 01:12 PM)redpillage Wrote:  Good points there I must say. Interesting perspective regarding the Third Reich being the revolution. However would you not say that after WW1 Germany did excel at creating a K-selected society? I mean, the gender roles and societal values espoused by the NS party would make the average forum reader's heart bounce (I'm not talking about killing Jews of course). And today it's Cuck Central - less than one century later.

Okay, I see where the sticking point is.

I don't agree that things are as mirror opposite as you're making them out to be.

Most of what you see, in terms of cuck central, has to do with strict foreign influenced controls - somewhat similar in concept to how a horse is broken and controlled with leather and bits(laws).

Absent that control, my opinion is that you would see a slow and steady reversion to their potential as a society. Just as a horse would slowly learn to be free if it were released into the wild. It would be a psychological process, though. As I stated, Germans are human. Not super-human.

As for now, you are seeing them "be" themselves within a set of laws that misdirect their traits into political activities that are against their interests. They can't help but to be themselves anymore than you can't be yourself, and so they can't help but be be good at the society that they are allowed to have; but at the same time it can't be looked upon as a natural expression of a tendency toward extremes.

This "extreme" isn't them. It's them as a broken nation.

Hydrogonian, I agree that the 1933 was Germany's revolution but 1 thing has to be said:

That revolution lead by a foreigner.

Hitler was not German.
He was from Austria Hungary.

A German couldn't do it...they had to get an immigrant from outside to lead them to revolution.

Secondly...they voted him in.
No gates were stormed, no violent masses gathered in the streets and destroyed official buildings, no politicians were lynched in public.

It was all done officially on paper.
Very German.

(07-26-2016 01:35 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  

(07-26-2016 01:12 PM)redpillage Wrote:  Good points there I must say. Interesting perspective regarding the Third Reich being the revolution. However would you not say that after WW1 Germany did excel at creating a K-selected society? I mean, the gender roles and societal values espoused by the NS party would make the average forum reader's heart bounce (I'm not talking about killing Jews of course). And today it's Cuck Central - less than one century later.

Okay, I see where the sticking point is.

I don't agree that things are as mirror opposite as you're making them out to be.

Most of what you see, in terms of cuck central, has to do with strict foreign influenced controls - somewhat similar in concept to how a horse is broken and controlled with leather and bits(laws).

Absent that control, my opinion is that you would see a slow and steady reversion to their potential as a society. Just as a horse would slowly learn to be free if it were released into the wild. It would be a psychological process, though. As I stated, Germans are human. Not super-human.

As for now, you are seeing them "be" themselves within a set of laws that misdirect their traits into political activities that are against their interests. They can't help but to be themselves anymore than you can't be yourself, and so they can't help but be be good at the society that they are allowed to have; but at the same time it can't be looked upon as a natural expression of a tendency toward extremes.

This "extreme" isn't them. It's them as a broken nation.

But what is a nation? It's people. Foreign influence could never have caused them to become like this unless there was something within them which was willing to change. The Germans allowed this to happen. I'm not saying the Germans do not have the right to fight back, but they are not totally blameless for what has befallen them either.

(07-26-2016 01:46 PM)rw95 Wrote:  Foreign influence could never have caused them to become like this unless there was something within them which was willing to change. The Germans allowed this to happen. I'm not saying the Germans do not have the right to fight back, but they are not totally blameless for what has befallen them either.

Respectfully, you're wrong and need to read and research WWII more.

You're also over-estimating people in general, and under-estimating techniques of mass-control.

You aren't even "you", but a product of your environment and information to a large degree. You're only the hardware.

It seems like you guys need a convenient scapegoat, and are rationalizing that scapegoat in lieu of a rational view of history and what it means to be human and a large human population.

Besides they aren't close to being the worst in Europe. Not even the bottom five in terms of being cucked if we look at how people operate in their everyday lives.

(07-26-2016 01:38 PM)Mercenary Wrote:  Hydrogonian, I agree that the 1933 was Germany's revolution but 1 thing has to be said:

That revolution lead by a foreigner.

Hitler was not German.
He was from Austria Hungary.

A German couldn't do it...they had to get an immigrant from outside to lead them to revolution.

Secondly...they voted him in.
No gates were stormed, no violent masses gathered in the streets and destroyed official buildings, no politicians were lynched in public.

It was all done officially on paper.
Very German.

I can no longer discern your point.

(07-26-2016 01:21 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  Germans are still people. They aren't super-human.

Disagree.

(07-26-2016 12:11 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  In fact, as I pointed out, the Third Reich was the revolution. WWI was also a war for their interests. Thinking otherwise is merely not being flexible enough in your historical thought to realize the reality of the two situations for the Germans.

Therein lies the problem. The Third Reich was revolutionary because fascism, like Jacobinism and Bolshevism, is a utopian-revolutionary ideology that opposes tradition, not a conservative philosophy that defends tradition. That is precisely why that regime was not in the interests of Germany, and resulted in her utter ruin, a ruin invited by unhinged policy and a scorn for traditional governance.

Bismarck, an emblematic figure of the old aristocracy, foresaw this in the 19th Century when Wilhelm II began to believe the dreams of global domination showered upon him by sycophants. He even predicted that it would come through some "damned foolish thing in the Balkans" which would "consume us all". A pity that such cooler heads and traditionalist minds were not listened to, and Germany embarked, seduced by utopianism, on two needless conflagrations from which Europe has yet to recover.

(07-26-2016 01:57 PM)hydrogonian Wrote:  I can no longer discern your point.

The point is that they have no history of great GERMAN leaders who lead masses to fight in the streets and overthrow corrupt rulers....no matter how bad it gets. Have the Germans ever had a native born Robespierre ? An Oliver Cromwell ? A Vladimir Lenin ? A Francisco Franco ? A Chiang Kai-shek ? No. All their changes of power were done by official decree on paper.

Many people don't know that 1918 to 1933 was the worst peacetime period for the Germans themselves as it could possibly get. There was widespread poverty, hyperinflation, numerous failed governments, German refugees in territories lost to Poland, mass unemployment. Their savings became worthless, they had no jobs, they lost their homes...people were starving. It was really, really bad, but nothing changed for 15 years until a butt hurt incel beta male Austro-Hungarian immigrant came in to lead a "revolution"....in reality, all he led was an political election to power which was rubber stamped by world war 1 general Paul von Hindenburg.

In 2016 and the years to come, unless someone comes in from outside, there will be no serious resistance against what is happening in Germany right now.
Even if the far right is voted into power tomorrow with 99% of the vote in Germany...seriously what will they do ?
The foreigners acting violent who have been welcomed into Germany in the last few years will not leave without being forced.
Who's going to force them to leave ?
No one.

If anybody really wants to know what psychological processes (collective guilt) were installed in the German public conscious, you should read this article
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denazifica...man_states and
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denazifica...tive_guilt

It is still in effect to this day.

I think this will be an interesting case to follow and learn how cucked on 1-10 scale Poland is.

Middle Eastern guy of Syrian origin (who grew up in Poland, but not sure about if born here) films and verbally attacks people collecting anti-immigration signatures close to Main Square in Krakow - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7BkQSAP-8Bc

Plus he says stuff like "Fucking Poland", etc...

No reaction from anyone, I guess it was probably smart, as it was a public place and unfortunately there's enough traitors in polish media/law enforcement/other parts of society who would be quick in judging well deserved ass kicking as racist and xenophobic attack.

But some people are claiming to officially inform Agencja Bezpieczenstwa Wewnetrznego (Domestic Security Agency) about him, plus he was found on Facebook and his business (Hostel or Kebab shop, not sure) is not a secret anymore either.

Let's see if anything will be done about him, legally or... not legally.

PS. It's kind of special moment to find people praising polish right wing government under "Die Welt" article, what a crazy times we live in - http://www.welt.de/politik/ausland/artic...hland.html

I’ve stopped following the ‘Old Media’ altogether and get all my information from this forum and the sites it recommends. Thanks guys. It is a blessing to be dutifully informed.

I believe this picture accurately sums the current situation and you can easily swap the brands on the lovely mans back.

(07-26-2016 02:40 PM)void Wrote:  If anybody really wants to know what psychological processes (collective guilt) were installed in the German public conscious, you should read this article
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denazifica...man_states and
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Denazifica...tive_guilt

It is still in effect to this day.

You want to know why Europe is cucked since WWII, read this
Citation from wikipedia:
"In practice, denazification was not limited to Germany and Austria; in every European country with a vigorous Nazi or Fascist party measures of denazification were carried out. In France the process was called épuration légale (English: legal cleansing). Prisoners of war held in detention in Allied countries were also subject to denazification qualifications before their repatriation.
Denazification was also practised in many countries which came under German occupation, including Belgium, Norway, Greece and Yugoslavia, because satellite regimes had been established in these countries with the support of local collaborators."

We will see if the current leftist politics will seal the fate of europe or not. The only thing we can say for sure, any culture that is not politically center or right will vanish, because it lacks selfpreservation.