Post: #26

Paul Carter had an interesting post on this a while ago. From the article:

Quote: "The reason why I say there's a certain amount of being willfully ignorant by many of us (at times, myself included) is because we narrow down the cause of obesity to nothing more than a lack of discipline. And at the heart of it, that indeed is how someone generally becomes obese. But what keeps them obese, or causes them to become obese again after losing weight, is probably a little more than that.

I don't think I'm reaching here when I write that food can most certainly be a drug. At least for many it most certainly looks like a drug, insofar as how the body ends up reacting to it. However food addiction is still a controversial topic in the dieting and health industry.

What we do know is, certain foods like cheese, chocolate, shitty cuts of meat, etc tends to release dopamine, the feel good chemical in the body, in massive amounts. This is what's known as the "reward system". You eat shitty food, and the body releases massive amounts of dopamine to let you know "hey, I like this shit. Feels good, man. Eat more of it."

Over time, just like any addiction, the body ends up lowering the amount of dopamine released by eating these foods, and the dopamine receptors down regulate to basically keep the body in balance. So now, in order to get that same "feel good" reward system that you got before, you have to eat more junk food to make that happen.

Now ol fatty-in-the-making has to eat more of what he or she craved before, in order to "feel better" than they once had to. So instead of eating a small slice of cheese cake, now one needs two slices, or some ice cream to go with it as well. And that's after a meal that's already laden with fat and sugar.

And the cycle begins. Just like with drug addiction. "

Full article (plus many more great ones) at: http://www.lift-run-bang.com/2014/05/if-...youre.html

Post: #27

(07-23-2015 01:04 AM)dads Wrote:  

(07-22-2015 07:44 PM)demolition Wrote:  I'll agree with you guys that I think what food companies do to produce the most tasty & addictive foods is insidious, but what is there as a recourse on the social scale? You can't tell a company, "Your food tastes too good, you need to make it taste worse." That is absurd and impossible.

Actually, you can. Tell me why what happened with Tobacco can't happen with processed food.

Food is required to live, tobacco is not. In addition, what the government has generally believed to be healthy (low fat, high carbohydrate) foods are actually part of the problem. In circumstances like this I'd rather the government butt out.

The exception might be to take the opposite approach: Instead of penalizing unhealthy foods, subsidize known healthy foods. Personally I think any American should be able to walk into any grocery store in the nation and come out with fresh or frozen broccoli & spinach, and other green vegetables for no cost.

(07-23-2015 04:43 AM)GlobalMan Wrote:  TL;DR Putting obese people in gyms will do nothing towards losing weight. Its all about diet.

100% absolute truth. Guys here actually care about their physique, and for a man, building a good physique is the result of hard work. But the only thing most people need to not be fat is to eat well.

Post: #28

(07-23-2015 05:27 PM)demolition Wrote:  

(07-23-2015 01:04 AM)dads Wrote:  

(07-22-2015 07:44 PM)demolition Wrote:  I'll agree with you guys that I think what food companies do to produce the most tasty & addictive foods is insidious, but what is there as a recourse on the social scale? You can't tell a company, "Your food tastes too good, you need to make it taste worse." That is absurd and impossible.

Actually, you can. Tell me why what happened with Tobacco can't happen with processed food.

Food is required to live, tobacco is not. In addition, what the government has generally believed to be healthy (low fat, high carbohydrate) foods are actually part of the problem. In circumstances like this I'd rather the government butt out.

The exception might be to take the opposite approach: Instead of penalizing unhealthy foods, subsidize known healthy foods. Personally I think any American should be able to walk into any grocery store in the nation and come out with fresh or frozen broccoli & spinach, and other green vegetables for no cost.

(07-23-2015 04:43 AM)GlobalMan Wrote:  TL;DR Putting obese people in gyms will do nothing towards losing weight. Its all about diet.

100% absolute truth. Guys here actually care about their physique, and for a man, building a good physique is the result of hard work. But the only thing most people need to not be fat is to eat well.

You're solution is akin to subsidizing gum to prevent people from smoking. The problem is that these people are addicted to processed foods, just offering an alternative isn't going to stop them from choosing to eat like garbage.

You are correct though. Food is required to live, and tobacco is not. But I'm not saying regulate FOOD. I'm saying regulate processed foods. Poultry, beef and apples are required to live, not Doritos, Hot Pockets and Lucky Charms.

Post: #29

More and more around here I keep reading the clarion call to "regulate" things. Let's all keep in mind that the organizations one is asking to do the regulating are functionally the same as the organizations pushing feminism, fat acceptance, and all other cultural evils we so decry. Let's also remember they have been forking the grain-heavy food pyramid down our throats, and subsidizing the hell out of the corn that goes into the high fructose corn syrup.

To paraphrase Fight Club: "we're a generation of men raised by the state... I'm wondering if more state is really the answer we need."

Nothing personal to you, dads. This discussion is one of many I have been seeing go that direction.

Post: #30

(07-24-2015 03:51 AM)TooFineAPoint Wrote:  More and more around here I keep reading the clarion call to "regulate" things. Let's all keep in mind that the organizations one is asking to do the regulating are functionally the same as the organizations pushing feminism, fat acceptance, and all other cultural evils we so decry. Let's also remember they have been forking the grain-heavy food pyramid down our throats, and subsidizing the hell out of the corn that goes into the high fructose corn syrup.

To paraphrase Fight Club: "we're a generation of men raised by the state... I'm wondering if more state is really the answer we need."

Nothing personal to you, dads. This discussion is one of many I have been seeing go that direction.

Trust me, I understand what you are saying. To me, I'm going against this mindset that it's all about "self-control" and everyone is "lazy". The government getting involved is the answer to the issue. I don't like that being the case, and I'm definitely not for the state having more power. However, it's a real solution to a real problem, as opposed to whatever John Burk and other's like him are doing with their videos.

Post: #31

The discussion is going around itself, as if some regulation and taxes along with a push for personal responsibility are mutually exclusive. People need to keep themselves from temptation and temptation needs to keep away from people.

Post: #32

(07-23-2015 05:15 AM)H1N1 Wrote:  Paul Carter had an interesting post on this a while ago. From the article:

Quote: "The reason why I say there's a certain amount of being willfully ignorant by many of us (at times, myself included) is because we narrow down the cause of obesity to nothing more than a lack of discipline. And at the heart of it, that indeed is how someone generally becomes obese. But what keeps them obese, or causes them to become obese again after losing weight, is probably a little more than that.

I don't think I'm reaching here when I write that food can most certainly be a drug. At least for many it most certainly looks like a drug, insofar as how the body ends up reacting to it. However food addiction is still a controversial topic in the dieting and health industry.

What we do know is, certain foods like cheese, chocolate, shitty cuts of meat, etc tends to release dopamine, the feel good chemical in the body, in massive amounts. This is what's known as the "reward system". You eat shitty food, and the body releases massive amounts of dopamine to let you know "hey, I like this shit. Feels good, man. Eat more of it."

Over time, just like any addiction, the body ends up lowering the amount of dopamine released by eating these foods, and the dopamine receptors down regulate to basically keep the body in balance. So now, in order to get that same "feel good" reward system that you got before, you have to eat more junk food to make that happen.

Now ol fatty-in-the-making has to eat more of what he or she craved before, in order to "feel better" than they once had to. So instead of eating a small slice of cheese cake, now one needs two slices, or some ice cream to go with it as well. And that's after a meal that's already laden with fat and sugar.

And the cycle begins. Just like with drug addiction. "

Full article (plus many more great ones) at: http://www.lift-run-bang.com/2014/05/if-...youre.html

That type of argument is akin to putting the cart before the horse.

Obesity is laziness and comfort taken to the extreme, we're at the point in our history where we can have any food desire satisfied. If a person is fat it is because of sheer lack of willpower. Nothing more, nothing less.

I've known a few fat to skinnies in my life and they all have one thing in common. They were fed up with the direction their life was going and decided to change it. I have nothing but respect for people like this.

You don't see this behavior in people who get gastric bypass surgery. You will mostly see a fat person trying to fool their body into eating the same amount of calories.

The only way obesity is going to end is either through external forces either by famine, shaming, etc.

Personally, shaming is in my opinion the most effective. If you're an obese kid you shouldn't be allowed to progress to the next grade at school. If you're an obese adult you should be barred from getting new work or if you have a job get put on some probation if you do get fat. Obviously gym culture should be instilled in all levels of society from grade school to the working adult world (gyms at every office).

Obesity costs all of us money and until the entire country starts taking this problem seriously it will only get worse.