Post: #26

(03-20-2015 11:13 PM)scotian Wrote:  One thing that interests me is how Brits are received in Canada compared to Oz, in Canada people with a British accent are often thought of as being more sophisticated and smarter, whereas in Oz there's legitimate Pom discrimination.

This is true about how Brits are received in Australia. When we hear a British accent we just think "Ahh, just another whinging pom"

Post: #27

(03-20-2015 11:30 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  I really don't know why the US and Anglo Canada never became one country. 90% of Canadians already live within earshot of the border anyway.

I think they have always been too loyal to the crown so it was never a real possibility.

Post: #28

(03-21-2015 02:17 AM)azulsombra Wrote:  

(03-20-2015 11:30 PM)speakeasy Wrote:  I really don't know why the US and Anglo Canada never became one country. 90% of Canadians already live within earshot of the border anyway.

I think they have always been too loyal to the crown so it was never a real possibility.

That and all those fucking frogs we have up here, je blauge mes amis!

Post: #29

(03-20-2015 11:49 PM)Biologist Wrote:  

(03-20-2015 11:13 PM)scotian Wrote:  One thing that interests me is how Brits are received in Canada compared to Oz, in Canada people with a British accent are often thought of as being more sophisticated and smarter, whereas in Oz there's legitimate Pom discrimination.

This is true about how Brits are received in Australia. When we hear a British accent we just think "Ahh, just another whinging pom"

How do you know a British Airways jet has landed at Tullamarine? You can still hear the whining thirty minutes after they turn the engines off.

Anyway, I second what some others have said. I think this would be fine between Canada, Australia and New Zealand. The problem with any open borders area is always that you're only as strong as your weakest link, which would be Britain. Britain is an absolute mess. If the other three countries could say yes to indigenous Britains only (perhaps minus the chavs), it might be one thing, but that would never get off the ground due to cries of racism/discrimination. Thus, since Britain refuses to have anything even remotely resembling a sensible immigration policy (or at least enforce one), it would be the back door for every gypsy, terrorist or welfare cheat into the three civilised nations. Screw that for a joke.

Post: #30

Australia and New Zealand already act like a mini EU with reciprocal freedom of movement and residency. Canada and Australia probably have more in common with each other than any other country : medium level population, resources and services based economy, multicultural but with stringent points based standards, origins in British Empire, low corruption, wealthy. The citizens of both countries would likely see the benefits of agreeing to allow freedom of movement.

Post: #31

There needs to be some sort of quality control in place however.

If a female "8 or above" emigrates, we expect similar in return, no exceptions.

2 4's won't cut it either...nor will your woolly four-legged friends Kiwi's.

Post: #32

This is a terrible idea. Using campy WASPY sentinism to lush forward a largely labor swap which is all that it would be. Why would you need more loose movement? There is few Canadians living in OZ, some Canadians in the UK but they have cockblockes us out for years so not as many as you would think.

Plus this is all based of a online petition which means nothing. This is what politics is to young people who make online potitions that go viral and yet have no effect on the system. Did the person who made the survey put a price on the labor? Or Tourist? You would have to monitor requests vs movements now to see if any natural balance would exsist. I can already see now Canadian and OZ people going to work in UK retail shops for crap wages to return home and convert it into supposed riches with a near 35% difference on the exchange. But if course non of that is factored in. It is all romance that sells the misty London streets with the bells dinging off Whitehall, or the bright and cheerful OZ with its beaches, Canada with its... Eh Hockey?

All just cheerful fluff. Plus I am always hesitsnt to get behind any mainstream movement. On my FB this topic is the most important of our age, so many comments on the posts, its a joke. All the while in Canada our Government is ramming though a terror and police law which is basically rbe Patriot Act 2.0.

I am all for easements on travel and stay but I don't think "free movement" is ideal. Canada has many more people whore are not of WASP Brit heritage, we have the Québécoise who ain't down for the crown, and sizeable Aborgonal population who isn't down for that shit either. Plus with "free movements" you just encourage the worst of your country to float around and loaf of your nation working crappy jobs and adding little value.

Post: #33

I got a 2 year working visa for the UK back in the mid 90s.That is gone I'm told.Although I'm sure there is a scheme were military members can swap and become citizens..I know a couple who did this to join the British army and a mate joined the Canadian army.
I use to ask Brits in Australia back in the day if they were legal or illegal as alot over stayed their visas .
Now for a Brit to get a second year here they have to go work in agriculture for 3 months...bloody forced labour..
Also Australia opened up working visas for the French so there are alot of young French getting around here now.I was trying to seduce a young French woman who told me Canada got tough on work visas so now they come here...
I also have started meeting alot of young Americans mostly NYC who moved here or are on work visas.And no they are not fat women....rather thin and attractive actually.
NZ is just another Aussie state

Post: #34

(03-21-2015 08:42 AM)Green-On-GO Wrote:  Although I'm sure there is a scheme were military members can swap and become citizens.

There is. I was involved in the recruitment process during my time in the Army last decade. We'd recruit current and ex-serving military personnel world-wide actually. There's a special labour agreement nomination that they fall under through the department of immigration, whereby they could emigrate and bring over their immediate family too.

Most applicants tended to be from the UK though, purely because their skill-set translated well to the Australian Army's requirements, which meant their application was likely to be successful and they could come over at their substantive rank or one below.

We had an enhanced process where we'd visit London with a team (medical officer, psychologist, WO1 career managers) once annually for about 4 weeks. They were good times. I'd have the evenings and weekends to myself and go wherever I liked, and the daily allowances were ridiculously good, not to mention we flew business class and stayed in 5 star accommodation.

Post: #35

(03-19-2015 04:41 PM)britchard Wrote:  Should be the whole of the commonwealth. Free movement to the Maldives and South Africa too sounds good.

We have shitty countries in the Commonwealth too; you wouldn't want thousands of Mozambicans (for example) at Heathrow. Generally, I think all Commonwealth member-states should make it very easy for Commonwealth citizens to relocate between countries if they fulfil a series of requirements; the process should be very easy and involve very little bureaucracy but not a right per se.

---

This makes me very happy even though I'm not a Commonwealth citizen...yet. Sure, it probably won't materialise but the basic premise seems very good.

Oh yes, I'm so privileged you literally can't even.
Interested in joining the FFL? I tried (and failed).

Post: #36

(03-21-2015 02:31 AM)Feisbook Control Wrote:  

(03-20-2015 11:49 PM)Biologist Wrote:  

(03-20-2015 11:13 PM)scotian Wrote:  One thing that interests me is how Brits are received in Canada compared to Oz, in Canada people with a British accent are often thought of as being more sophisticated and smarter, whereas in Oz there's legitimate Pom discrimination.

This is true about how Brits are received in Australia. When we hear a British accent we just think "Ahh, just another whinging pom"

How do you know a British Airways jet has landed at Tullamarine? You can still hear the whining thirty minutes after they turn the engines off.

Anyway, I second what some others have said. I think this would be fine between Canada, Australia and New Zealand. The problem with any open borders area is always that you're only as strong as your weakest link, which would be Britain. Britain is an absolute mess. If the other three countries could say yes to indigenous Britains only (perhaps minus the chavs), it might be one thing, but that would never get off the ground due to cries of racism/discrimination. Thus, since Britain refuses to have anything even remotely resembling a sensible immigration policy (or at least enforce one), it would be the back door for every gypsy, terrorist or welfare cheat into the three civilised nations. Screw that for a joke.

Do you really think the chavs and welfare cheats will go to Canada, Australia or New Zealand? Yes, the government is generous but most of these people couldn't save enough money to pay for the aeroplane ticket! I doubt these people have any interest in travel. Trust me, if this materialises you'll only get the best of Britain.

Oh yes, I'm so privileged you literally can't even.
Interested in joining the FFL? I tried (and failed).

Post: #37

Prior to the 1960's there was no Australian or NZ passport, we travelled on British empire passports. Cant speak for Canadia.

It was a view of a citizen of empire.

The British abolished it so they could fit in with Europe. Maybe its just a case of chickens coming home to roost.

Post: #38

(03-22-2015 01:07 AM)Porfirio Rubirosa Wrote:  

(03-21-2015 02:31 AM)Feisbook Control Wrote:  

(03-20-2015 11:49 PM)Biologist Wrote:  

(03-20-2015 11:13 PM)scotian Wrote:  One thing that interests me is how Brits are received in Canada compared to Oz, in Canada people with a British accent are often thought of as being more sophisticated and smarter, whereas in Oz there's legitimate Pom discrimination.

This is true about how Brits are received in Australia. When we hear a British accent we just think "Ahh, just another whinging pom"

How do you know a British Airways jet has landed at Tullamarine? You can still hear the whining thirty minutes after they turn the engines off.

Anyway, I second what some others have said. I think this would be fine between Canada, Australia and New Zealand. The problem with any open borders area is always that you're only as strong as your weakest link, which would be Britain. Britain is an absolute mess. If the other three countries could say yes to indigenous Britains only (perhaps minus the chavs), it might be one thing, but that would never get off the ground due to cries of racism/discrimination. Thus, since Britain refuses to have anything even remotely resembling a sensible immigration policy (or at least enforce one), it would be the back door for every gypsy, terrorist or welfare cheat into the three civilised nations. Screw that for a joke.

Do you really think the chavs and welfare cheats will go to Canada, Australia or New Zealand? Yes, the government is generous but most of these people couldn't save enough money to pay for the aeroplane ticket! I doubt these people have any interest in travel. Trust me, if this materialises you'll only get the best of Britain.

Yes, I do. Why? Because there are already plenty of people like that in those countries. There's also a perfect example for you with Europe. There is a reason why immigrants -- illegal or legal -- all want to end up in Britain, Sweden and Denmark, rather than Bulgaria, for example, despite the fact that Bulgaria is closer and easier to get into. Further proof exists in the numbers of people who travel from the Middle East via Indonesia by people smugglers on rickety boats to get into Australia. Even with legal immigration, people use countries as a stepping stone. My father has German friends in Australia who couldn't get into Australia initially. So, they moved to New Zealand first, and then once they satisfied whatever the requirements were there (permanent residency or citizenship, I suppose), they moved to Australia. Tons of Pacific Islanders do the same thing with Australia. So I have absolutely no doubt at all that this kind of deal with Britain would be a back door for all sorts of miscreants into Australia.

Post: #39

Quote:Also Australia opened up working visas for the French so there are alot of young French getting around here now.I was trying to seduce a young French woman who told me Canada got tough on work visas so now they come here...

Canada has been getting tougher with work visas from Europe because Europe's economy is in tatters, and we seem to be getting plenty of European riff raff. We might as well be getting 10,000 Mozambicans because we're already getting 10,000 barely literate folks from rural Poland, Hungary, Romania etc.

I can't see a Canada, NZ, UK labour agreement. It won't be too bad in general, but standards regarding skills need to be smoothed out. Also I can't see how Canada and Australia's points systems will work with the UK's ambiguous system of immigration that no one seems to understand anymore.

Beyond short term labour exchange, Canada won't benefit from this arrangement, it will just become a backdoor for unchecked EU migration. There's only so many burger flipping, and ditch digging jobs available unfortunately.

Post: #40

^^ Completely agree with DD.

Post: #41

(03-22-2015 01:00 AM)Porfirio Rubirosa Wrote:  

(03-19-2015 04:41 PM)britchard Wrote:  Should be the whole of the commonwealth. Free movement to the Maldives and South Africa too sounds good.

We have shitty countries in the Commonwealth too; you wouldn't want thousands of Mozambicans (for example) at Heathrow. Generally, I think all Commonwealth member-states should make it very easy for Commonwealth citizens to relocate between countries if they fulfil a series of requirements; the process should be very easy and involve very little bureaucracy but not a right per se.

---

This makes me very happy even though I'm not a Commonwealth citizen...yet. Sure, it probably won't materialise but the basic premise seems very good.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.
Canada isn't opening the doors for Caribbean commonwealth countries. Many need a visa to visit and good luck getting rights to be able to live in Canada.
There will be loopholes in this arrangement, which will allow the people they want to move easier access.

Post: #42

(03-22-2015 02:49 PM)rudebwoy Wrote:  

(03-22-2015 01:00 AM)Porfirio Rubirosa Wrote:  

(03-19-2015 04:41 PM)britchard Wrote:  Should be the whole of the commonwealth. Free movement to the Maldives and South Africa too sounds good.

We have shitty countries in the Commonwealth too; you wouldn't want thousands of Mozambicans (for example) at Heathrow. Generally, I think all Commonwealth member-states should make it very easy for Commonwealth citizens to relocate between countries if they fulfil a series of requirements; the process should be very easy and involve very little bureaucracy but not a right per se.

I don't think you know what you are talking about.
Canada isn't opening the doors for Caribbean commonwealth countries. Many need a visa to visit and good luck getting rights to be able to live in Canada.
There will be loopholes in this arrangement, which will allow the people they want to move easier access.

I don't know where you're getting that from; I never said anything along those lines. I simply responded to @britchard who suggested all Commonwealth member-states should be involved in this.

Oh yes, I'm so privileged you literally can't even.
Interested in joining the FFL? I tried (and failed).

Post: #43

(03-22-2015 11:42 AM)DjembaDjemba Wrote:  I can't see a Canada, NZ, UK labour agreement. It won't be too bad in general, but standards regarding skills need to be smoothed out. Also I can't see how Canada and Australia's points systems will work with the UK's ambiguous system of immigration that no one seems to understand anymore.

Beyond short term labour exchange, Canada won't benefit from this arrangement, it will just become a backdoor for unchecked EU migration. There's only so many burger flipping, and ditch digging jobs available unfortunately.

My trade qualifications can take me into both Canada & New Zealand to start work immediately, albeit red seal tests have to be sat in Canada after a while, but in Australia I can only go in and work as an apprentice, go to night school for say two years, then sit their trade tests. Pretty stringent requirements from the Aussies if you want to get into their trades, even if you do have 20+ years experience!

British immigration system don't seem to have a check on these qualifications, have seen Poles (nothing against the Poles) here working on site when they first arrive as painters, a year later i've come across same guy's working as joiners, plumbers & electricians. Have to admire their initiative but does fuck all good for proper tradesmens rates & jobs!! Thats what open borders policy within the EU gets you, so think if the Commonwealth policy was open, who knows what the fuck would happen!! Suppose thats why UKIP are making so much ground at the moment!

Post: #44

Salty Wrote:British immigration system don't seem to have a check on these qualifications, have seen Poles (nothing against the Poles) here working on site when they first arrive as painters, a year later i've come across same guy's working as joiners, plumbers & electricians. Have to admire their initiative but does fuck all good for proper tradesmens rates & jobs!!

...or for the standards of construction.

Post: #45

(03-22-2015 04:52 PM)DjembaDjemba Wrote:  

Salty Wrote:British immigration system don't seem to have a check on these qualifications, have seen Poles (nothing against the Poles) here working on site when they first arrive as painters, a year later i've come across same guy's working as joiners, plumbers & electricians. Have to admire their initiative but does fuck all good for proper tradesmens rates & jobs!!

...or for the standards of construction.

Yep, sure thing DD. Would also keep my eye on all those cheap Chinese TFW's sneaking in the back door over there too!! Gotta keep standards tight. starting with solid foundations!!

Language skills (written & verbal) should also play a huge part in the Commonwealth's big four immigration policy's along with required skill-sets, think you'd be lucky if half our worldwide immigrants had a grasp of the English language. Mind you, now when I think about half the natives nowadays............!

Post: #46

In the 1950s Australia had a severe population shortage, there was plenty of men here for work but not enough women. The then immigration minister proposed that Australia bring in women, women from Eastern Europe.

This idea was grand.

I would propose that the commonwealth open up a free movement zone between Canada, UK, Australia and New Zealand and banish its women to the far North of Canada so they can all get frostbite. I would then propose that all countries have a flood of Eastern European, Asian and South American women.

Wins all around.

Post: #47

(03-21-2015 08:32 AM)kosko Wrote:  This is a terrible idea. Using campy WASPY sentinism to lush forward a largely labor swap which is all that it would be. Why would you need more loose movement? There is few Canadians living in OZ, some Canadians in the UK but they have cockblockes us out for years so not as many as you would think.

Plus this is all based of a online petition which means nothing. This is what politics is to young people who make online potitions that go viral and yet have no effect on the system. Did the person who made the survey put a price on the labor? Or Tourist? You would have to monitor requests vs movements now to see if any natural balance would exsist. I can already see now Canadian and OZ people going to work in UK retail shops for crap wages to return home and convert it into supposed riches with a near 35% difference on the exchange. But if course non of that is factored in. It is all romance that sells the misty London streets with the bells dinging off Whitehall, or the bright and cheerful OZ with its beaches, Canada with its... Eh Hockey?

All just cheerful fluff. Plus I am always hesitsnt to get behind any mainstream movement. On my FB this topic is the most important of our age, so many comments on the posts, its a joke. All the while in Canada our Government is ramming though a terror and police law which is basically rbe Patriot Act 2.0.

I am all for easements on travel and stay but I don't think "free movement" is ideal. Canada has many more people whore are not of WASP Brit heritage, we have the Québécoise who ain't down for the crown, and sizeable Aborgonal population who isn't down for that shit either. Plus with "free movements" you just encourage the worst of your country to float around and loaf of your nation working crappy jobs and adding little value.

I think you hit the nail on the head esp with that last point. Having been here a short while the UK is tremendously expensive, especially in London, and is no place for people with families or trying to live on a budget without any state support. It's definitely more for short-termers who are just living day to day and barely getting by. They have all the cheap labour and immigrants they'd ever want and then some too here. It's unreal how many Spaniards, French, Italians and other EE workers are here filling up all the coffee shops and restaurants and doing the service industry jobs - they are everywhere, so why would they want/need more from anywhere?

As I understand the oil service jobs are dying out quickly in Canada for now so hard to see what benefit UK or other Commonwealth citizens would bring to Canada (which has an approaching housing crisis and retreating energy industry right now). Given the commodity cycle bust in Australia I can't see jobs growing there too much either at least right now.

I guess it's just a way to sell to the masses and toe the Progressive "global citizen" model but it's not really a very good economic idea.

(03-21-2015 08:05 AM)Windom Earle Wrote:  There needs to be some sort of quality control in place however.

If a female "8 or above" emigrates, we expect similar in return, no exceptions.

2 4's won't cut it either...nor will your woolly four-legged friends Kiwi's.

I don't think there really are too many 8s or above in any of these places esp NZ so it would be a wash! Might need to lower the bar to a "5" for reciprocity!

(03-26-2015 06:58 AM)CodyB Wrote:  In the 1950s Australia had a severe population shortage, there was plenty of men here for work but not enough women. The then immigration minister proposed that Australia bring in women, women from Eastern Europe.

This idea was grand.

so how did it all go downhill so fast & women in OZ get so fat & entitled then?

Post: #48

The only benefits I would see between the UK and NZ is the Welsh would be very happy.

Post: #49

So the plan is to turn the UK into a migration pipe between East Europe and Australia? Yeah sure Australia will sign up for that. They currently have a point based immigration system and pack off illegal immigrants to concentration camps that the UN claims commit torture.

Mildly relevant, lol: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Transportation_Act_1717. Nowadays the punishment would be going the other way though .