Post: #26

(01-13-2015 03:08 AM)lowside Wrote:  If there were one single book that covers the topic discussed in this thread in detail, which one would it be?

Those 2 books cover everything really. Steve Keen is still an economics professor at a n Australian university.

My personal "fairy-tale" views:

http://realcurrencies.wordpress.com/inte...economics/ (and I don't agree with everything the blogger and currency reformer proposes - I just like his concise view on money and economics)

Fairy tale not because they will not work, but because the powers that be would rather fight against those ideas by killing hundreds of millions than ever accept them to come to fruition.

Post: #27

Keen is worth listening too. He's not necessarily right, but he's certainly no more wrong than the macroeconomists shaping government policy and he has better incentives to get it right than those economists do.

Post: #28

OP, it's likely you had some good points in there somewhere.
However, the guy you hold up as an oracle believes that vaccination is a two-hundred year old conspiracy to spread cancer.
That's a pretty big turd in the swimming pool. I'd rather not take a dip.

Post: #29

(01-20-2015 07:34 AM)dispenser Wrote:  OP, it's likely you had some good points in there somewhere.
However, the guy you hold up as an oracle believes that vaccination is a two-hundred year old conspiracy to spread cancer.
That's a pretty big turd in the swimming pool. I'd rather not take a dip.

First of all I share his views on vaccinations as do 3 other nobel price laureates of medicine and chemistry (MDs and PhDs with far superior medical knowledge than me & you unless you have a Nobel price in your name). There are countless other MDs - even high level ones, ex CDC workers and, ex pharma employees, MDs who hold multi-million dollar patents - all of them opposing vaccinations - it is not just some uniform opinion presented to the public via academia. And I did not come to that decision by watching a Youtube video but after weeks and actually months of intensive research. In fact I can easily claim that I know more about vaccinations than 90% of MDs - not because I know so much, but because MDs are deliberately under-educated in that regard - it makes the lies more difficult to question. Whether it is a "conspiracy" or a useful medical error - that's someone else's opinion.

But suit yourself - besides what you claim is the usual politically correct feminist full-ass-raping crap: "Believe in everything I believe in or you are a turd! If you just believe in one fucking little element that differs from my opinion, then 99% of the rest I agreed with must be bullshit too!" That is literally how SJW and PC Newspeak minions think and debate. The author's expertise and blog is about economics and more exactly interest free economics - try debating him on that merit and you will find it very hard to discredit his viewpoints.

Even Keynes has visited Woergl researching how powerful interest-free economics is and can be. You don't have to agree with everything that a person believes in order to realize the truth in other points. In fact - if you agree on 100% of points any other thinker has, then I am afraid that that very person is not a deep thinker, because the great minds in history have all had their differences and just worked together on some points.

Post: #30

Interesting thoughts.

After reading comments about Scandinavian countries and the social programs...The U.S. is an anomaly compared to the rest of the world because of demographics.
- Not only is it the third largest country in the world (lending itself to geo-cultural diversity) (after tundra-laden Russia and Canada)
- It's also the most diverse by race and cultures
- Throw in the freedoms the states have in the U.S., the freedom of religion (which would lend itself to religious diversity)...

Doesn't make a good candidate for "let's all share everything"

Example, national health care. It's not that it can't work (Asian countries), it's that it can't work in the U.S.

(credit heartiste for first pointing out the challenges the U.S. faces due to diversity)

Post: #31

(01-20-2015 08:45 AM)heavy Wrote:  ...

Doesn't make a good candidate for "let's all share everything"

Example, national health care. It's not that it can't work (Asian countries), it's that it can't work in the U.S.

(credit heartiste for first pointing out the challenges the U.S. faces due to diversity)

A national health care system could probably work in the US too, but not in the way it was set up via Obamacare. The HMOs basically wrote the thing themselves! How could that crap ever work?

And to be honest I don't know the way out of the current medical system - it essentially needs a complete reboot similar to the economic monetary system in place.

Post: #32

I really didn't mean to derail your thread, so I'll try to keep on topic using healthcare as an example...Texas and other states are pretty pissed off they're forced into national healthcare.

That's due to the diversity (geo-cultural, race, etc) I mentioned.

There's also the fact that the western European ancestry that makes up most of our population are descendants of risky rugged individualists. Reading about Asia and their socialist tendencies, I now see that an individualist society isn't necessarily *right* and socialism wrong, but a matter of which is appropriate for certain populations.

Post: #33

Zelcorpion:
Certain illnesses only occur once, and after that, the body can fight them off.
This is the principle behind vaccination. I see no problem with it.

Post: #34

(01-20-2015 11:38 AM)dispenser Wrote:  Zelcorpion:
Certain illnesses only occur once, and after that, the body can fight them off.
This is the principle behind vaccination. I see no problem with it.

I'll let Zelcorpion respond as he's much more knowledgeable than me on the subject, but principle and practice are two different things.

Post: #35

It is always good to hear others' opinion. I am not supporting any of the opinions here. Just stating...

From Wikipedia:

Criticisms

Some reviewers contend that Keen has not shown what he claims, that he misrepresents economic theory, and that he gets basic mathematics wrong.[12]

David Stern, "BOOK REVIEWS: Debunking Economics", Ecological Economics Volume 39, Issue 2, November 2001,pages 319–320 [1]

From Forbes..Another criticism.

http://www.forbes.com/sites/timworstall/...economics/

Post: #36

(01-20-2015 08:23 AM)Zelcorpion Wrote:  First of all I share his views on vaccinations as do 3 other nobel price laureates of medicine and chemistry (MDs and PhDs with far superior medical knowledge than me & you unless you have a Nobel price in your name). There are countless other MDs - even high level ones, ex CDC workers and, ex pharma employees, MDs who hold multi-million dollar patents - all of them opposing vaccinations - it is not just some uniform opinion presented to the public via academia. And I did not come to that decision by watching a Youtube video but after weeks and actually months of intensive research. In fact I can easily claim that I know more about vaccinations than 90% of MDs - not because I know so much, but because MDs are deliberately under-educated in that regard - it makes the lies more difficult to question. Whether it is a "conspiracy" or a useful medical error - that's someone else's opinion.

But suit yourself - besides what you claim is the usual politically correct feminist full-ass-raping crap: "Believe in everything I believe in or you are a turd! If you just believe in one fucking little element that differs from my opinion, then 99% of the rest I agreed with must be bullshit too!" That is literally how SJW and PC Newspeak minions think and debate. The author's expertise and blog is about economics and more exactly interest free economics - try debating him on that merit and you will find it very hard to discredit his viewpoints.

Even Keynes has visited Woergl researching how powerful interest-free economics is and can be. You don't have to agree with everything that a person believes in order to realize the truth in other points. In fact - if you agree on 100% of points any other thinker has, then I am afraid that that very person is not a deep thinker, because the great minds in history have all had their differences and just worked together on some points.

With all due respect, it is now difficult for me to take anything at all you say or post seriously. Vaccination is one of medicine's greatest achievements, right up there with antibiotics, and has prevented millions of deaths and untold human suffering. Grasping at hacks and quacks who falsify research and represent .0001% of the scientific community is truly foolish.
Anti vaxxers like you are the reason there is now a measles outbreak in the USA.
I really wish we had another Australia that was completely unpopulated. Anti vaxxers could go live there, and the problem would soon solve itself.

Post: #37

(01-23-2015 04:32 PM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  With all due respect, it is now difficult for me to take anything at all you say or post seriously. Vaccination is one of medicine's greatest achievements, right up there with antibiotics, and has prevented millions of deaths and untold human suffering. Grasping at hacks and quacks who falsify research and represent .0001% of the scientific community is truly foolish.
Anti vaxxers like you are the reason there is now a measles outbreak in the USA.
I really wish we had another Australia that was completely unpopulated. Anti vaxxers could go live there, and the problem would soon solve itself.

Good luck with that - btw - your language is entirely hate and propaganda-laden just like their lobby is using.

Also - being Red Pill might give some guys the inclination to simply question everything. Truth should not be afraid of questions. Don't want to derail the thread here since I already had minor battles over the subject with some MDs here, but I severely doubt that you did as much research as I did - here some of my input:

Recent studies I found:
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3170075/
http://archpedi.jamanetwork.com/article....id=1558057

Excellent article by the Ecologist (major magazine with huge professional staff of journalists):
http://www.theecologist.org/investigatio...ccine.html
Here the article in full in pdf:
http://www.vaclib.org/basic/polio/polio1.pdf
http://www.vaclib.org/basic/polio/polio2.pdf

And here a little compilation of links on which basis I came to my conclusions - I did a 90-page-presentation on the topic later on.

Personally I give a rat's ass whether someone vaccinates or not and my recommendation is to pay off a doctor or nurse and vaccinate the sink, since the benefits of vaccines do not justify the risks. When many MDs start researching for real the first time they are quickly horrified about the entire topic. Why is it so fucking difficult to keep an open mind? Is Red Pill just being against feminism, but the rest that the political-economic-academic establishment pisses out is nothing but the truth? Good luck with that.

Here a small part of what I went through (and by the way - some 5 years ago I was a firm believer in vaccinations - only recently have I started questioning things and just researched stuff and kept an open mind).

And also - keep it civil. PM me if you want, but keep it away from the thread, because it's off-topic.
______________________

LINKS –VACCINATIONS
(if links no longer available – check youtube, Google with site title or film title)
- BLACK – ENGLISH - – GReeN– DEUTSCH

1. Documentaries
a. http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/shots-in-the-dark/ Shots
b. http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/vaccine-nation/
c. http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/vaccinati...den-truth/
d. http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/lethal-in...ccination/
e. http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/origins-aids/ - do not agree with the pretense of documentary – still some good indos tere
f. http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/selective...d-the-gmc/
g. http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/allergy-planet/
h. http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/dying-to-have-known/
i. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9WoMps4Pmpo Talk by Dr. Rebecca Carley
j. http://undergrounddocumentaries.com/kill...-syndrome/
k. http://undergrounddocumentaries.com/gary...-playlist/
l. http://undergrounddocumentaries.com/the-...l-version/
m. http://undergrounddocumentaries.com/vacc...l-lecture/
n. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1oYAVLDyR6Y Vaccines, What the CDC Documents and Science Reveal by Dr Sherri Tenpenny 2003 part 1 of 2) - YouTube Dr Sherri J Tenpenny presents Vaccines, What the CDC Documents and Science Reveal 2003 part 2 of 2 - YouTube
o. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jBazI6L_3Qo Dr. Sherri Tenpenny - Vaccines: The Benefits, The Risks, The Choices - YouTube
p. http://www.youtube.com/user/michaelleitn...query=impf Youtube Channel von Journalist Michael Leitner – Dutzende von Vortraegen, Filmen informationen – Impfsuche im Feld hier eingestellt
q. Dr. Claus Koehnlein (Internist, konwentioneller Onkologe) Vortraege – unter andem Viruswahn, HIV, Hepatitis C, Polio – nicht direkt nur ueber Impfungen – normaler Arzt, der im Gegensatz zu den meisten einfach nur Studien selbst gelesen, Dogmen hinterfragt hat - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kr-dzCO5VHI Milliardenprofite mit erfundenen Seuchen & http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AGUDOcennvw Viruswahn & weitere Clips : http://www.youtube.com/results?search_qu...Ob1vamQgvQ
r. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WJNSfBU1oxk Impf-Vortrag Teil 1 von 5 - YouTube
s. http://www.youtube.com/user/AutismMediaC...ture=watch – Autism media channel – hundreds of clips of parents with autistic children, interview with doctors etc. , many by Dr. Andrew Wakefield – a lot of information especially on mumps, measles, rubella
2. SITES with hundreds of references, information, scientific info –
a. http://search.mercola.com/search/pages/R...k=VACCINES Dr. Mercola – http://www.mercola.com – Vaccine search– weeks of reading material
b. http://www.whale.to/vaccines.html - excellent website - thousands of documents, books, links, references, vaccine descriptions, case studies etc.
c. http://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/graphs/#Scurvy – graphics, statistics –
d. http://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/ - lots of information
e. http://www.doctoryourself.com/vaccination.html - Dr. Andrew Saul - website
f. http://www.thecochranelibrary.com/view/0/index.html Cochrane library the most major more or less independent doctor cooperation In the World – still most of course financed by the known parties. However – a lot of information on megadose vitamin therapies, less on vaccines – but can be found as well. Cochrane doctors admit that they more or less discard 80-90% of studies due to conflict of interest or blatant manipulation.
g. http://www.dogsadversereactions.com/scie...amage.html Pet vaccinations
h. http://www.dogsadversereactions.com/index.htm - on pet health –
i. http://www.vaccinationcouncil.org/2009/0...cinations/ Dr. Lorrane Day article
j. http://www.vaccinationcouncil.org/ - hundreds, thousands of articles
k. http://vactruth.com/ hundreds of articles, links etc.
l. http://www.youtube.com/user/VaccineSafet...ture=watch Vaccine Safety Conference youtube channel
m. http://www.naturalnews.com/vaccines.html Health site with thousends of articles, scientific studiem as well as news
n. http://www.lifesitenews.com/search/ - “vaccine” search gives hundreds of news items
o. http://www.youtube.com/user/Experimental...ture=watch Channel of experimentalVaccines – dozens of good clips and links to info
p. http://www.youtube.com/user/iHealthTube?feature=watch ihealth youtube channel – many topics – vaccines, orthomolecular medicine etc.
q. http://www.ihealthtube.com/ many topics – vaccines, orthomolecular medicine etc.
r. http://www.ageofautism.com/vaccines/ - good site – vaccines of course not the Only cause of autism rise, but one of the main points
s. http://www.vaccineinitiative.org/ many good infos
t. http://www.forbes.com/sites/stevensalzbe...utism-one/ Luc Montagnier – AIDS virus nobel laureate joins anti-vaccination crowd!!!!
u. http://deathbyvaccination.com/ excellent website – a lot of information
v. http://thinktwice.com/ excellent website:
i. http://thinktwice.com/allvacs.htm all vaccines in detail
ii. http://thinktwice.com/studies.htm vaccine studies
iii. http://thinktwice.com/articles.htm vaccine articles
w. http://www.reversingvaccineinduceddiseas.../415825576 on Dr. Rebecca
x. http://www.reversingvaccineinduceddiseases.com/ website on reversing vaccine induced diseases
y. http://www.russellblaylockmd.com/ website of Dr. Russell Blaylock – neurosurgeon and now orthomolecular doctor
z. http://www.trackingvaccinations.com/ - excellent scientific review - MDs welcome to refute
aa. http://www.tetrahedron.org/articles/vacc...html#notes ARTICLE BY Dr. Leonard Horowitz
bb. http://www.tetrahedron.org/index.html many other topics aside from vaccines by Dr. Horowitz
cc. http://www.novaccine.com/ huge amount of scientific data, articles, links
dd. http://healthyprotocols.com/2_vaccine.htm excellent website - lots of infos http://healthyprotocols.com/2_vaccine_2.htm
ee. http://www.vaccinetruth.org/ - EXCELLENT WEBSITE – MANY LINKS, STUDIES, INFORMATION
ff. http://www.vaccinationnews.com/ GOOD WEBSITE
gg. http://www.efi-online.de/ Website mit Links, Infos von Efi Deutschland – Eltern fuer Impfaufklaerung
hh. http://www.impfkritik.de/ Unsummen an Informationen ueber Impfungen, Studien, Links, Referenzen, Vortraegen, etc.
ii. http://impfentscheid.eu/ eine weitere Impforganisation die die Thematik bestens untersucht
jj. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N_vI9OFN6c0 Vortrag von Rolf Kroon – „Sind geimpfte Kinder gesuender?“
kk. http://www.impf-report.de/ - Website mit hunderten von Dokumenten, infos etc.
ll. http://www.youtube.com/user/michaelleitner youtube channel von Michael Leitner – Unsummen von Filmen und Links
mm. http://www.youtube.com/user/infokriegerB...query=impf youtube channel mit vortraegen Und links
nn. http://www.youtube.com/user/FSchusterTV/...query=impf FSchusterTV – clips Und Vortraege & http://www.youtube.com/user/FSchuster1/v...query=impf
oo. http://drjimmyscott.com/?tag=orthomolecular excellent article on vaccination from orthomolecular viewpoint Dr. Damien Downing
pp. http://orthomolecular.org/index.shtml huge resource databank on orthomolecular medicine and of course vaccinations among other topics
qq. http://www.medalerts.org/vaersdb/ National Vaccine Information Center / huge databank
rr. http://www.vaccineepidemic.com/ resources, links, books
ss. http://pl.scribd.com/doc/2887572/Simpson...Searchable scientific review of vaccine safety
tt. http://www.nvic.org/ National Vaccine Information Center – excellent non-profit vaccine information company & http://www.youtube.com/user/NVICstandup?feature=watch NVIC youtube channel
3. Books –
a. http://www.callous-disregard.com/ - Andrew Wakefield
b. http://www.doctoryourself.com/ - books on site –
c. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/1620878...ctrucom-20 The Thinking Mom’s revolution
d. http://www.amazon.com/Vaccine-Government...+vaccine+a Vaccine A by Gary Matsumoto on Gulf War 1 vaccinations and over 43000 damaged soldiers
e. http://elliotlakenews.wordpress.com/2007...-epidemic/ 1918 FLU PANDEMIC CAUSED BY WWI vaccines – Murder by Injection by Eustace Mullins
f. http://www.whale.to/vaccines/books.html - hundreds of books on vaccinations recommended starting In the 1920s!!!!
g. http://www.amazon.com/Vaccination-The-Si...B000XZKQ0Q Vaccination the silent Killer 1977 http://wilhelminactfc.jimdo.com/2013/05/...ad-online/ 1918 spanish influenza
h. http://spktruth2power.wordpress.com/2009...d-disease/ 1918 pandemic
i. http://thinktwice.com/gulfwar.htm gulf war syndrome
j. http://thinkchoice.com/vaccine.htm several books listed again
k. http://healthyprotocols.com/2_vaccine.htm & http://healthyprotocols.com/2_vaccine_2.htm book recommendations
l. http://www.sayingnotovaccines.blogspot.com/ LINKS TO BOOKS BY DR. SHERRI TENPENNY
m. http://www.vaccineepidemic.com/ Vaccine Epidemic and other books
4. Vaccines ingredients product leaflets – Szczepionki – ulotki szczegółowo
a. http://vactruth.com/vaccine-inserts/ Vaccine inserts with product names
b. http://www.whale.to/vaccines/pack.html vaccines package inserts plus data sheets – hundreds of products – around the world
c. http://www.whale.to/vaccines/ingredients.html list of vaccine ingredients
d. http://www.novaccine.com/vaccine-ingredients/ excellent information on many vaccines and ingredients –
e. http://www.novaccine.com/specific-vaccines/ links to leaflets and studies
5. Best scientific information –
a. http://search.mercola.com/search/pages/R...k=VACCINES Dr. Mercola – http://www.mercola.com – Vaccine search– weeks of reading material
b. http://www.whale.to/vaccines.html - excellent website - thousands of documents, books, links, references, vaccine descriptions, case studies etc.
c. http://deathbyvaccination.com/ excellent website – a lot of information
d. http://www.drcarley.com/ - website currently offline – copied information in additional pdf-document https://www.youtube.com/results?search_q...Bz-Vqi59gM – Dr. Rebecca Carley talks on youtube
e. http://www.trackingvaccinations.com/ - excellent scientific review - MDs welcome to refute
f. http://www.whale.to/vaccines/scheibner1.html review of Japan 1975 where doctors refused to vaccinate before age 2!!! Not parents, doctors!
g. http://thinktwice.com/studies.htm vaccine studies
h. http://archpedi.jamanetwork.com/article....id=1558057
i. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3170075/
j. http://www.impf-info.de/index.php?option...Itemid=324
k. http://www.novaccine.com/ huge amount of scientific data, articles, links
l. http://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/g...csTable_21 statistics data, vaccines did not save us
m. http://www.reversingvaccineinduceddiseas.../414591608 VACCINE INDUCED DISEASES REBECCA CARLEY
n. http://www.regardingcaroline.com/pubmed.html vACCINES not proven to be dangerous? Well simple intelligent mother finds plenty of PUBMED-official-studies (apart from Dr. Wakefield case study):
i. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12145534 Abnormal measles-mumps-rubella antibodies and CNS autoimmunity in
children with autism.
ii. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/9756729 Serological association of measles virus and human herpes virus-6
with brain auto-antibodies in autism.
iii. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21993250 Hypothesis: conjugate vaccines may predispose children to autism
spectrum disorders.
iv. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/10714532 Effects of diphtheria-tetanus-pertussis or tetanus vaccination on
allergies and allergy-related respiratory symptoms among children and adolescents in the United States.
v. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles...erence-sec Neurological Complications of Pertussis Immunization
vi. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21058170 Hepatitis B vaccination of male neonates and autism diagnosis, NHIS
1997-2002.
vii. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22099159 Do aluminum vaccine adjuvants contribute to the rising prevalence of
autism?
viii. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles...ool=pubmed Aluminum hydroxide injections lead to motor deficits and motor
neuron degeneration.
ix. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21568886 http://vaccinexchange.files.wordpress.co...ished2.pdf Aluminum Vaccine Adjuvants: Are they Safe?
x. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21350943 Integrating experimental (in vitro and in vivo) neurotoxicity studies of
low-dose thimerosal relevant to vaccines.
xi. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15764492 Neurodevelopmental disorders following thimerosal-containing
childhood immunizations: a follow-up analysis.
xii. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20803069 Neonatal administration of thimerosal causes persistent changes in
mu opioid receptors in the rat brain
xiii. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21549155 Persistent behavioral impairments and alterations of brain dopamine
system after early postnatal administration of thimerosal in rats.
xiv. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22015705 Maternal Thimerosal Exposure Results in Aberrant Cerebellar
Oxidative Stress, Thyroid Hormone Metabolism, and Motor Behavior in Rat Pups; Sex- and Strain-Dependent Effects.
xv. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22015977 Administration of thimerosal to infant rats increases overflow of
glutamate and aspartate in the prefrontal cortex: protective role of dehydroepiandrosterone sulfate.
http://www.jpands.org/vol11no2/ayoub.pdf Influenza Vaccination During Pregnancy: A Critical Assessment of the Recommendations of the Advisory Committee on Immunization Practices (ACIP)
6. Video clips – additional information - (topic right to link or seen at link-text)
a. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pla...xpHl3hWI#! Vaccine info short
b. http://www.salem-news.com/articles/novem...ted-se.php
c. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articl..._DNL_art_1 Autism rise from 1988
d. http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnew...oland.html - Polish trial homeless Heath –
e. http://www.rand.org/pubs/technical_reports/TR1169.html Rand publication on vaccine coverage improvement – as people more and more refuse vaccines – counterstrategies
f. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g6obCgcGF...AAAAAAAQAA Dr. Russell Blaylock interview
g. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u9DkcpEEBPI Dr. Blaylock talk
h. http://www.infowars.com/131-children-vac...in-malawi/
i. http://foodfreedomgroup.com/2012/03/03/i...-vaccines/
j. http://www.naturalnews.com/035398_hospit...eedom.html
k. http://www.infowars.com/fda-admits-in-co...n-mercury/
l. http://coto2.wordpress.com/2011/07/17/mu...ger-story/
m. http://www.naturalnews.com/035256_Profes...Court.html
n. http://www.infowars.com/paralysis-cases-...-in-india/
o. http://www.infowars.com/vaccine-failure-...accinated/
p. http://vactruth.com/2012/03/30/babies-sl...accinated/
q. http://www.lifesitenews.com/news/archive...r/10042306 study confirms autism boom – correlates with aborted fetal DNA in vaccines
r. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articl..._DNL_art_2
s. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2IzYznyWaIE Pentagon conference – vaccines used to modify humans – more docile etc.
t. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dHsD93HpjJ4 VACCINE DAMAGE AFTER HEPATITIS B – LIVER DAMAGE
u. http://vactruth.com/2013/03/23/autism-an...dium=email 2 studies show link between inflammation and autism
v. http://vactruth.com/2013/04/02/who-suspe...dium=email WHO reluctant to suspend vaccine after 26 children die in developing countries
w. http://www.judicialwatch.org/press-room/...pensating/
x. http://www.naturalnews.com/039364_health...fects.html
y. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5CVLhlckoGU VACCINE LINK TO CHILDHOOD CANCER
z. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sBimZjFGzSA POLIO PROPAGANDA from the 50s
aa. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mcK1YPzCU1w ALL VACCINES CAUSE NEUROLOGICAL DAMAGE
bb. http://vactruth.com/2013/04/06/media-pro...dium=email media tricks on vaccinations
cc. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4timD8iVkk vaccines causing cancer and heart disease
dd. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articl...n=20130402 anthrax vaccine to be tested on American children
ee. http://www.smh.com.au/opinion/political-...2hn29.html
ff. http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/australian...6618581985
gg. http://vactruth.com/2013/04/13/thinking-...dium=email on the Thinking Mom’s Revolution – book report
hh. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RchdcuCSugs Autism: absolutely vaccine induced
ii. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l7AyQj4xu2A ALUMINUM IN VACCINES LINKED TO AUTISM
jj. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articl...cines.aspx
kk. http://www.ageofautism.com/2011/04/danis...fraud.html
ll. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articl...ldren.aspx - japan halts 2 vaccines
mm. http://articles.mercola.com/sites/articl...ccine.aspx universal childhood immunizations
nn. http://www.vaccineinitiative.org/?p=332 Gulf War Syndrome –on experimental vaccines on Gulf War I soldiers with over 42000 severely damaged men and their children
oo. http://vactruth.com/2013/04/26/police-st...dium=email Vaccination status Police tracking In USA
pp. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=II_zIB9MTHA HIV vaccines infect over 10%
qq. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ja-Ylni08vk 1700 children threatened with suspension if not vaccinated – USA
rr. http://www.youtube.com/all_comments?v=TCgkfKlPZYw Elary vaccines do not help infants
ss. http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pla...i7YYAID4#! Cervarix vaccine’s promotional flaws
tt. http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/02/2...AG20130227
uu. http://truth11.com/2013/01/30/flu-vaccin...-children/
vv. http://vactruth.com/2012/08/30/governmen...ne-unsafe/
ww. http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml...1014a1.htm cdc document admitting polio contamination of unvaccinated US Amish children – polio strain is man-made and given either through epigenetic transfer by parents or contamination by vaccinated population!
xx. http://vtdigger.org/2012/10/08/90-percen...-children/ 90% of whopping cough cases are fully vaccinated! – (whopping cough vaccine is attenuated life virus and shedding of virus up to 21 days is normal!)
yy. http://www.askdrsears.com/topics/vaccine...ine-recall
zz. http://deathbyvaccination.com/PowderMed_...MPANY.html alternative vaccination technology bought up and discarded by global corporation
aaa. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrYp9AcYWMg MOBILE VACCINATION SQUADS IN USA
bbb. http://natomas.news10.net/news/community...d-students AGAIN VACCINATIONS DOOR TO DOOR
ccc. http://www.tetrahedron.org/articles/vacc...html#notes VACCINATION INEFFICACY
ddd. http://casereports.bmj.com/content/2012/bcr-2012-006879 PREMATURE OVARIAN FAILURE AFTER HPV VACCINATION
eee. http://www.whale.to/a/children1.html unvaccinated children healthier
fff. http://www.examiner.com/article/congress...vaccinated - let me save you the trouble – congressman will not Get study
ggg. http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/opin...54630726/1 unvaccinated child threat is scare tactic!
hhh. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pPkewVOZ-Is debunking polio vaccine
iii. http://vactruth.com/2013/05/19/menafriva...-408231625 African children are labrats
jjj. http://www.ftd.de/politik/deutschland/:s...24740.html
kkk. http://derstandard.at/2740842 Interview im STANDARD!!! von Dr. Johann Loibner
lll. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZjfXu9ReNDk Bloß nicht impfen lassen! - YouTube
mmm. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zf8oc-6Ep0I Impfkritischer Apotheker mit Courage - YouTube
nnn. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QH7rx-jcov0 WIR IMPFEN NICHT! Immer mehr sagen nein zur Impferei - YouTube
ooo. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wo25E4uz35g Impfschwindel, Pharmaprofite und die WHO - YouTube
ppp. http://www.youtube.com/user/RathausCafe/...query=impf RAthauscafe youtube-channel thema impfen – videos, Vortraege
7. Vitamin C Klenner /
a. http://www.doctoryourself.com/klenner_table.html - Dr. Klenner-Prokoll,
b. http://www.doctoryourself.com/ckorea2008.html vitamin c for decades /
c. http://www.doctoryourself.com/titration.html Vitamin C Titration - Sättigung je nach Kranheit –
d. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQnNCFoLEw4 Dr. Sherri Tenpenny vaccines presumptions wrong –

Post: #38

Posting a wall of bullshit including citations of numerous conspiracy and fringe websites including such medical luminaries as Alex Jones does not prove your point, unless your point is to make yourself look obsessed and unhinged.
Also, it is blue pill, not red pill. Red pill means seeing truth and evidence regardless of your personal desire/bias. Seeing things as they are and how they really work.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, not their own facts. The evidence is clear and irrefutable. Vaccines are a massive net positive for humanity.
Anti vaxxers, in my opinion deserve the same level of respect as 9/11 truthers or people who think the moon landings were faked.

Post: #39

(01-24-2015 05:51 PM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  Anti vaxxers, in my opinion deserve the same level of respect as 9/11 truthers or people who think the moon landings were faked.

Typical debating tactic throwing in legitimate concerns together with misogyny, anti-semitism and additional craziness. Discussion finished.

Post: #40

(01-24-2015 05:51 PM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  Posting a wall of bullshit including citations of numerous conspiracy and fringe websites including such medical luminaries as Alex Jones does not prove your point, unless your point is to make yourself look obsessed and unhinged.
Also, it is blue pill, not red pill. Red pill means seeing truth and evidence regardless of your personal desire/bias. Seeing things as they are and how they really work.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, not their own facts. The evidence is clear and irrefutable. Vaccines are a massive net positive for humanity.
Anti vaxxers, in my opinion deserve the same level of respect as 9/11 truthers or people who think the moon landings were faked.

This is a really embarrassing post. Zelcorpion just dropped a ton of links and you casually dismiss him, essentially calling him a fool. You claim to be red pill but are obviously completely wedded to your existing views, refusing to even consider the possibility that the issue might not be as black and white as you think. I noticed you took the same stance in the religion thread, basically saying you think any religious person is an idiot. You strike me as a very close-minded person who has a far too-high opinion of his own knowledge and understanding.

All the smartest people I know recognize that ultimately they know very little. True wisdom and understanding bring with them large doses of intellectual humility. You don't seem to have an ounce. I think that pretty much says it all about how far off your self-perceived understanding of the world is from reality.

Post: #41

(01-25-2015 10:42 AM)scorpion Wrote:  Zelcorpion just dropped a ton of links and you casually dismiss him.

The problem is the vast majority of links he provided are garbage.

The studies he found were from very low-level journals.

The majority of links he posted were from youtube.

A number of links he provided were from infowars.

I mean, provide some real links and maybe I, along with others, will actually take the time to read them.

I read about 5 or 6 of the 'better' ones and they were all completely mediocre.

Being open-minded and looking for truth is also about looking to the right places for your information. Making statements based on information you gathered from random documentaries, youtube, and websites like infowars is ridiculous.

Give me 10 peer-reviewed and well cited studies from reputable journals and I'll take a look. Something tells me that this task will be incredibly hard to perform.

Post: #42

(01-25-2015 12:37 PM)Americas Wrote:  

(01-25-2015 10:42 AM)scorpion Wrote:  Zelcorpion just dropped a ton of links and you casually dismiss him.

...

Give me 10 peer-reviewed and well cited studies from reputable journals and I'll take a look. Something tells me that this task will be incredibly hard to perform.

Yes that will be hard to come by. Journals are 80%+ dependent on pharma money.
In the links you find literally dozens and dozens of MDs who specify exactly why they don't agree with the current perception of vaccines.

What you desire is a public announcement by the highest echelons of money and power that vaccines may not be as good and as harmless as claimed. That is ridiculous - this will never come.

It is similar to the US president go out on TV and say that there is no pay gap, there is no rape culture and that men are on average more intelligent and there are by far more highly intelligent men out there - sorry girls. Oh - and he should add that girls have only been outperforming boys because they have been drugged, the education system has been ripped apart and completely feminized - otherwise boys would still outperform girls on real hard tests.

I could cite here the multitude of reasons I have come to my conclusions backed by opinions of MDs and even nobel price laureates of medicine and also of chemistry. But I guess those MDs are only quacks and they have outed themselves as quacks for going against the mainstream.

The same could be said about mega-dose levels of vitamin C that orthomolecular doctors were using for decades safely to cure all things from sore throats, colds, flu, in all kind of anti-viral treatments etc. I could literally explain to you how you can prove it to yourself next time you have a sore throat, cold or flu - it would take some pure vitamin C powder, Cathcart's dosage table and instructions and you would be amazed how it works - afterwards throwing away all your previous cold meds.
But guess what - the very same medical establishment claims that vitamin C is ineffective or even dangerous, because they have tested it out at doses of 30-500mg/day, while for colds 15.000 to 50.000mg/day are necessary. Oh - I am sure their studies which have proven "ineffectiveness" have been published at the biggest journals, while the ones that showed that it is highly effective have been rejected by most.

You know how it could quickly be made clear that vaccines are making us more healthy? Simple create a study where you compare millions of VACCINATED, also partly vaccinated against the millions of completely non-vaccinated - there are millions both in the US, Germany, Switzerland (vaccination rate of 70% in some areas there) etc. Even invite all so called quacks to those studies for participation. Do it big, go through all hospitalizations, deaths, hard data, sick-days, survey data only additionally - then publish the crap and blast it all round the world on all media outlets 24/7.
Do you even know why such a study, even a minor one is neither funded nor has been done so far?

I know pretty much why this will never happen, because they know exactly what they will find. The reasons are the same why vaccines are the only meds you cannot sue pharma companies for. Even despite not being able to sue companies, billions of dollars have been paid out to parents of children damaged by vaccines and all in secret special vaccination courts.
Do you know why children of MDs have the lowest vaccination rates in almost all countries in the world? Yes - not only alternative MDs make a cost-benefit analysis and then decide to rather deal with the measles than with the side-effects of vaccines which are far greater than it seems.

But please - let's rather agree to disagree. If you really believe like one poster here that all non-vaccinated moved to Australia would die out and all the improvements like clean drinking water, sanitary system, personal hygiene, hygiene in food production and preservation (meat), better availability of nutritious food all year round (since 1950s also for majority of population), better medical care (accidents, antibiotics) - all of this meant nothing, since vaccines saved us all, then I cannot help you. Explosions in population growth in some countries happened before any vaccines came on board.

But all of it matters not and I do not wish to take away anyone's right or desire to vaccinate - don't give me your arguments that my children will infect yours because of some mythical concepts like the inexact herd immunity (at first 66%, then 70, then 80 and now 95% and still it's not enough - also by the way that concept only applied to naturally contracted childhood diseases and even that is disputed today).

Suit yourself - I prefer not to comment on the topic of vaccines anymore. Be my guest and give your kid 60-80 vaccines until the age of 5 and try to meet some parents who don't vaccinate their kids at all and compare.

Post: #43

(01-25-2015 10:42 AM)scorpion Wrote:  

(01-24-2015 05:51 PM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  Posting a wall of bullshit including citations of numerous conspiracy and fringe websites including such medical luminaries as Alex Jones does not prove your point, unless your point is to make yourself look obsessed and unhinged.
Also, it is blue pill, not red pill. Red pill means seeing truth and evidence regardless of your personal desire/bias. Seeing things as they are and how they really work.
Everyone is entitled to their own opinions, not their own facts. The evidence is clear and irrefutable. Vaccines are a massive net positive for humanity.
Anti vaxxers, in my opinion deserve the same level of respect as 9/11 truthers or people who think the moon landings were faked.

This is a really embarrassing post. Zelcorpion just dropped a ton of links and you casually dismiss him, essentially calling him a fool. You claim to be red pill but are obviously completely wedded to your existing views, refusing to even consider the possibility that the issue might not be as black and white as you think. I noticed you took the same stance in the religion thread, basically saying you think any religious person is an idiot. You strike me as a very close-minded person who has a far too-high opinion of his own knowledge and understanding.

All the smartest people I know recognize that ultimately they know very little. True wisdom and understanding bring with them large doses of intellectual humility. You don't seem to have an ounce. I think that pretty much says it all about how far off your self-perceived understanding of the world is from reality.

I don't care if you have 150 rep points. Go ahead and get me banned.
The tent of ignorance and superstition is a large one.
And people who believe in an imaginary sky wizard that is in charge of everything fit there very well alongside anti vaxxers.
Quantity is not equal to quality.
In the case of anti vaxxers, posting a thousand worthless links is the same as posting one worthless link. The total sum of truth in both is zero.
Same goes for religion. Just because people repeat a lie a thousand times for a thousand years doesn't make it true. I could make up a religion right now, based on the fact that crickets are hyper intelligent beings from another dimension who flew here on space ships from the planet of panda people to wash away the sins of humanity because they feel guilty for betraying us in an intergalactic war 70 million years ago. And guess what? It has the same amount of objective truth as every other religion in the world - ZERO.

Post: #44

Turning a matter of ideas into a personal clash is not rational.

Post: #45

(01-25-2015 12:37 PM)Americas Wrote:  Give me 10 peer-reviewed and well cited studies from reputable journals and I'll take a look. Something tells me that this task will be incredibly hard to perform.

Give me 10 peer-reviewed and well cited studies from reputable journals showing that game works.

Good luck.

And yet you're here.

What does that tell you about the supposed monopoly academia has on truth?

If you haven't realized by now that academia is as corrupt and dishonest as every other major institution in the West (i.e. media, banks, government, healthcare) then you haven't been paying attention.

Post: #46

(01-25-2015 01:18 PM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  I don't care if you have 150 rep points. Go ahead and get me banned.
The tent of ignorance and superstition is a large one.
And people who believe in an imaginary sky wizard that is in charge of everything fit there very well alongside anti vaxxers.
Quantity is not equal to quality.
In the case of anti vaxxers, posting a thousand worthless links is the same as posting one worthless link. The total sum of truth in both is zero.
Same goes for religion. Just because people repeat a lie a thousand times for a thousand years doesn't make it true. I could make up a religion right now, based on the fact that crickets are hyper intelligent beings from another dimension who flew here on space ships from the planet of panda people to wash away the sins of humanity because they feel guilty for betraying us in an intergalactic war 70 million years ago. And guess what? It has the same amount of objective truth as every other religion in the world - ZERO.

This is literally how you come across. It's almost as if the atheist-fedora meme was based on your posts.

Post: #47

My thoughts about this (economics) are that the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

I really do believe that trying to treat economics as "scientific" or like predictable mathematics is setting us up for disappointment. No human activity is completely predictable. I also get the uneasy feeling that a lot of these economists don't know any more than we do about what's going to happen. They get so wrapped up in equations and modeling that they miss the big picture.

On the other hand, we can't throw away economics...we do need it for many things, and in many situations its principles provide a good guideline for explaining commercial phenomena. It has earned its status as a discipline, but with some qualifiers.

For me, the best predictors of human behavior are history, biography, anthropology, and genetics. Economics does not for me have a good track record of predicting things.

Post: #48

(01-25-2015 01:56 PM)scorpion Wrote:  Give me 10 peer-reviewed and well cited studies from reputable journals showing that game works.

Good luck.

And yet you're here.

What does that tell you about the supposed monopoly academia has on truth?

Let's be serious, are we really comparing something like 'game' to the effectiveness of vaccinations?

Quote:If you haven't realized by now that academia is as corrupt and dishonest as every other major institution in the West (i.e. media, banks, government, healthcare) then you haven't been paying attention.

I think I have a pretty good idea what academia is and isn't, considering my profession is in academia.

Is academia perfect? No. Are there problems with academia? Yes. Hell, I am even willing to concede that Bio-medical academia is probably one of the worst of its branches because of it being heavily influenced by private funding.

However, one of my biggest problems with a layperson or someone on the internet dismissing anything that comes from academia is that they often have no clue what it is or how it functions. It is a collection of people who spent their whole lives incrementally researching things.

And therein lies the problem, academics spend their wholes lives researching things and publishing research that is rigorously tested/analyzed.

Is every academic credible? Hell no. But I'll take the truth that comes out in 90% of academic research over some cheap and two-bit sources from the internet.

(01-25-2015 02:36 PM)Quintus Curtius Wrote:  My thoughts about this (economics) are that the truth lies somewhere in the middle.

I really do believe that trying to treat economics as "scientific" or like predictable mathematics is setting us up for disappointment. No human activity is completely predictable. I also get the uneasy feeling that a lot of these economists don't know any more than we do about what's going to happen. They get so wrapped up in equations and modeling that they miss the big picture.

For me, the best predictors of human behavior are history, biography, anthropology, and genetics. Economics does not for me have a good track record of predicting things.

I don't necessarily disagree with your post. However, I do want to point out some things. For one, the role of economics is not necessarily to predict phenomenon but rather to explain it. In fact, most social sciences fall within this vein.

And while I agree that economics falls short in many respects because of its models that try to exclude as many variables as possible, economics isn't actually that concerned with 'the big picture.' Modern economics is actually probably the most narrow social science in current-day. This means that the questions that economists ask today are very narrow in scope. Take a look in any major economics journal and you will see articles that are so narrow in scope that most of them won't even be that interesting the average person. Something like "How Endogenous Growth Affects Brazilian Labour Laws from 1950-1970" is something you would expect to see in these journals.

And this is a problem that I see in a lot of arguments throughout the internet in relation to economics. A lot of people don't actually even know exactly what economics as a discipline is doing.

Post: #49

(01-25-2015 02:09 PM)scorpion Wrote:  

(01-25-2015 01:18 PM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  I don't care if you have 150 rep points. Go ahead and get me banned.
The tent of ignorance and superstition is a large one.
And people who believe in an imaginary sky wizard that is in charge of everything fit there very well alongside anti vaxxers.
Quantity is not equal to quality.
In the case of anti vaxxers, posting a thousand worthless links is the same as posting one worthless link. The total sum of truth in both is zero.
Same goes for religion. Just because people repeat a lie a thousand times for a thousand years doesn't make it true. I could make up a religion right now, based on the fact that crickets are hyper intelligent beings from another dimension who flew here on space ships from the planet of panda people to wash away the sins of humanity because they feel guilty for betraying us in an intergalactic war 70 million years ago. And guess what? It has the same amount of objective truth as every other religion in the world - ZERO.

This is literally how you come across. It's almost as if the atheist-fedora meme was based on your posts.

Oh, isn't that cute?
Unfortunately for your little meme, I am far from a basement dweller.
But hey, keep on home brewing that kool aid and enjoy your own special reality.
Pray to your sky wizard, make up your own medical science based on fringe websites that distort truth, cherry pick facts, do NOT follow any legitimate scientific process, and resort to outright fraud when convenient. By all means, if Jesus meant for you to get your medical knowledge from Jenny McCarthy and Alex Jones, go for it.
Incidentally, I don't hate religious people, they are often quite useful. They tend to be rather easy to manipulate for purposes of sex or business if you speak their language. When living in Spain I read the Christian fairy tales and pretended to be Catholic and banged several volunteers at this soup kitchen run by nuns. I also networked with some rich Andalusians who took me hunting the same way. Good times.

Post: #50

(01-25-2015 03:49 PM)VolandoVengoVolandoVoy Wrote:  Oh, isn't that cute?
Unfortunately for your little meme, I am far from a basement dweller.
But hey, keep on home brewing that kool aid and enjoy your own special reality.
Pray to your sky wizard, make up your own medical science based on fringe websites that distort truth, cherry pick facts, do NOT follow any legitimate scientific process, and resort to outright fraud when convenient. By all means, if Jesus meant for you to get your medical knowledge from Jenny McCarthy and Alex Jones, go for it.
Incidentally, I don't hate religious people, they are often quite useful. They tend to be rather easy to manipulate for purposes of sex or business if you speak their language. When living in Spain I read the Christian fairy tales and pretended to be Catholic and banged several volunteers at this soup kitchen run by nuns. I also networked with some rich Andalusians who took me hunting the same way. Good times.

I'm starting to wonder if you're a parody account.